Marth Q&A-Ask your questions here!!

[Emblem Lord]

lol. When I play Marth I only do 4 things to approach usually. D-tilts, JC grabs, SHFFLED Fairs and Nairs, and short hop double aerials, but I only do those occasionally. Mostly just shuffles and D-tilts. If I whiff I dash away and go into dash dancing. Why? Because it's very safe and very effective. Seriously, whenever I want to play it safe I will only d-tilt and shffl fairs and nairs. It might seem boring or ineffective, but it works and keeps Marth very safe and lets him pressure his opponents while weaving in and out of his opponents "zone."

That said, there isn't anything wrong with getting into habits IMO. As long as those habits aren't extremely dangerous or noobish, and you do mix it up every once and awhile.

Bad habits you will just have to break. A good thing to do is play someone better then you. They will punish those bad habits and you will drop them quickly, because you are being punished for it.

 

[Sensei]

Play m2k, he will break your bad habits, rofl.

 

[UMBC Super Smasher]

Play m2k, he will break your bad habits, rofl.

I agree full heartedly. Play someone pro level; for me it's Husband and occasionally M2K.

 

[knightpraetor]

i still want an answer to my question...can opponents counterattack by CC after the first aerial of a short hop double aerial before the second hits him..particularly if the second aerial will be a dair to destroy his CC

also, i'm assuming the fsmash would be too slow to get out in time before the second hit?

and finally, some people have told me to double jump to dair to cancel CC, while others have said to just dair on the second aerial of a double aerial with marth...which is more effective and why?

 

[Emblem Lord]

I'm going to say yes they can. When that starts happening you need to switch tactics. To stop CCing I would just space my d-tilts, JC grab more or just do a shuffled dair. Why even do a double jump or start a short hop double aerial and make yourself more vulnerable?

Shuffled dair crushes CCers. You don't need much else besides that.

You could do a double jump after your first aerial, but that only works on a few characters like Samus or Peach. That's because when they CC they will usually follow up with a d-smash. Anyone else could jump right into the air with Marth and start comboing him.

It really depends on who you are fighting.

But either way, shuffled dair ftw.

 

[FrostByte]

Do you have any recent vids of your Marth vs Shiek, Peach or Samus? Seems like I'm having girl problems.

 

[JesiahTEG]

Ok, I have a question regarding my overall gameplay, but I dont want to make a new thread for it, even though it's not a simple question to answer.

I realized yesterday, my gameplay is actually kinda slow. I didnt realize it until I played a good sheik yesterday and got murdered pretty bad. I also think I realize the reason my gameplay is slow. I take a ton of time setting up my fairs so that they are perfectly spaced. Also, the sheik I played was constantly doing something. Needles, grabs, tilts, dash attacks, it was never just doing nothing. My marth does that though. The only thing I do when I am not attacking is DD'ing looking for grabs, which didnt work too well against this sheik. I think of other things to do to fill in the gaps of my gameplay so I'm not just standing there or DD'ing, just something to keep the pressure on...But I can't. I can't keep the pressure on with Fairs, because it takes me a while to get them perfectly spaced, and the Sheik can move in and out of my range fairly well, attacking me in between fairs or after I land. I dont even have time to dash away when I landed from a fair or a double fair. I have more questions, but they don't relate to the speed of my gameplay, so I'll ask later. But I guess my question is...How do I make my gameplay faster, so I'm always doing something useful and keeping the pressure on sheik, without sheik dd'ing/wd'ing in and out of my range and ****ing me up?

 

[Cactuar]

Do you have any recent vids of your Marth vs Shiek, Peach or Samus? Seems like I'm having girl problems.

There are a bunch of vids of me vs Ryoko's Peach and Sheik up.

 

[Emblem Lord]

JesiahTEG: You want to Dashdance close enough to Shiek so she feels pressure, but not far away enough that she feels like she can safely spam needles.

To speed up your game play in general you should just dash or roll when you land from a shuffle or throw out a d-tilt and it whiffs. This way you are always moving and you stay very slippery. Obviously if your attack hits you wouldn't dash away, you would follow through with a grab or a combo. It will take a little time to get used to dashing or rolling when you whiff and recognizing when you get the hit to keep going with your offense.

 

[JesiahTEG]

Ok, thanks EL. Any more suggestions from anybody?

I have another question too, If you hit with the inside of your fair on accident, can you utilt fast enough afterwords to hit with the utilt? this is, of course, assuming that the fair is shffld and the opponent doesnt cc.

 

[Emblem Lord]

No you can't. The u-tilt isn't fast enough. A jab is, but Marth's jabs suck. You are better off rolling away, dashing through them or dashing away.

 

[JesiahTEG]

Ok then, what are some good ways to set up utilts. I want to incorporate them into my game, but I can never seem to set them up. Any ideas?

 

[Emblem Lord]

Besides up throw on fast fallers and floaties at low percents there isn't really a reliable way to set it up IMO. Maybe another Marth player has another opinion.

 

[JesiahTEG]

After a dash attack maybe? I know dash attack->utilt works on marth, but maybe on other characters too?

 

[Kefka]

dash attack -> utilt will work on (doc)mar at little or no percent dmg. there's also shffl fair -> utilt which is great against alot of characters, usually at lower percents. I find myself doing that all the time against falcon.

 

[Heart Break Kid]

How do i become good with marth? like i can barely shffl, n i sux against like the first 10 characters on the tier list. I can wavedash 75 percent of the time. any tips on effective ways to play against fox falco marth sheik peach falcon jiggs samus climbers n doc. i also dont have anyone to play with either so its just computers all the time. HELP!!!!

 

[Emblem Lord]

Help yourself by ending your life. lmao.

<3 HBK

 

[JesiahTEG]

Emblem lord, thats not nice! lol For fox and falco, learn to chaingrab. Look up vids of Ken vs bombsoldier on youtube. For marth, Fthrow them and then Fsmash, same with peach. I'm too tired for the rest. But remember, computers are stupid. Everytime you get near them they will jab. If you wanna just wreck the comp, you should DD into their range, out and back in. They will attack when you DD in, and then just go back out and then back in for a grab or something. Don't think your bad if you can't beat a lv 9 tho, you probably just dont know their flaws and you will get jabbed everytime you get close. BTW, DD means Dash Dance, if you dont know what it means you can look it up somewhere on these forums. God I'm tired.

 

[Emblem Lord]

lol. HBK is one of the better players in Jersey. He knows how to play Marth. That's why I was messing with him. Because he was messing with me.

 

[UMBC Super Smasher]

hahahaha funny

I was going to say, if all you have to play are computers then you shouldn't have much of a problem against any character...

 

[Emblem Lord]

On a side note: What was up with the wave of threads yesterday? They were all simple questions too. I loled when I saw them.

 

[JesiahTEG]

dang I got punk'd. Ya in one of the threads I was like" you better help EL doesnt see these" LOL

 

[Kefka]

I tend to get shield grabbed alot as marth when i do double fairs. I know this is a problem with my spacing, but heres what i wanted to ask:

I do single shffl fairs and sh double fairs both with the A button...should I try to get used to doing the double fair (the second fair) with the C-stick so I can hold back on the AS and space myself betteR? Or should i switch to using the c-stick for fair entirely, including single shffl fairs? The problem with the latter is that I dont use c-stick for fair for any of the other characters I play, so it might mess with my head. At any rate, im going to start trying to c-stick the second fair in a short hop to space myself from getting shield grabbed.

What do you guys use?

 

[Emblem Lord]

Use C-stick for second fair for better spacing.

 

[Kefka]

Ok, thanks. Do you use A or c-stick if you're doing a single fair?

 

[xeonoex]

For double fairs i use X (jump) Z (first slash) A(second) Z(cancel)
I substitute a A or Z with the C stick if I get to close, so I can hold back on the control.
Single fairs I almost always use C stick, unless im doing it immediately out of a shield or something.

 

[Kefka]

Thanks guys. I got another question, this is mostly directed towards Cactuar as i just thought about it after watching his matches vs Reik.

Falco gives me more trouble than any other character, even sheik. I feel more comfortable predicting sheik and comboing her than i do falco, almost entirely do to the existance of SHL. I notice that one thing you (Cactuar) do is full hop fair instead of short hop...is this to avoid lasers? I am aware of the various approaches to falco, i read that thread, but you seem to do this ALOT and it seems to usually work too. Im just wondering if the reason you full jump is to avoid lasers, or something else, or if its total accident.

 

[PurpsTheTurtle]

When sh double fairing with marth do you need to use the c-stick for the second hit? it seems like you would because then you can control your d.i. better but i've been told that its not necessary. Any input?

 

[Kefka]

When sh double fairing with marth do you need to use the c-stick for the second hit? it seems like you would because then you can control your d.i. better but i've been told that its not necessary. Any input?

Use C-stick for second fair for better spacing.

lawl10char

 

[Dark Sonic]

I use the C-stick for everything because it's easier to DI when you don't have to tilt the control stick to do the move you want. You could use the C-stick on both fairs for the most options for DI, but it's not really harmful to only use it on the second. And it feels kinda weird to SHDF to the right with the C-stick. It'l like learning a different hand motion for each direction.

Now if only I could use the C-stick for Nairs.

 

[Perfect Hero]

Should I start incorporating Spotdodging into my game? And what should I do after a spotdodge.

 

[Brightside6382]

Falco gives me more trouble than any other character, even sheik. I feel more comfortable predicting sheik and comboing her than i do falco, almost entirely do to the existance of SHL. I notice that one thing you (Cactuar) do is full hop fair instead of short hop...is this to avoid lasers? I am aware of the various approaches to falco, i read that thread, but you seem to do this ALOT and it seems to usually work too. Im just wondering if the reason you full jump is to avoid lasers, or something else, or if its total accident.

Full jumps give a better approach against Falco. It allows you to cover the gap between you and Falco quickly and if spaced well give a good angle of attack. The reason short hopping in isn't as good is because you pretty much eat a laser -> combo.

 

[Baha]

okay i have a question regarding the famous 'ken combo' i need help! i try and try and try but i can't pull it off

I do most of it. A tipped Fair on the ground that sends them flying up then I jump and fair then I jump and Dair but i cant' get it to hit usually they go too far out idk what im doing wrong.
Any advices?

Oh and a second question. What should I do versus an annoying sheik that is just Dash dancing and pissing me off with needles?

 

[flipkid]

i think this has been asked before but i dont think it was really answered.. i like pulling out the dolphin slash as a finisher every now and then.. but im not sure as to whether the knockback on the backside is greater than the front side... meaning will a reverse dolphin slash have more horizontal knockback than a non reverse? and if so how much and how does it decline with distance away

 

[UMBC Super Smasher]

Should I start incorporating Spotdodging into my game? And what should I do after a spotdodge.

Avoid spot dodging a lot because higher level opponents can really punish it. You should definitely use it some, but not a lot.

okay i have a question regarding the famous 'ken combo' i need help! i try and try and try but i can't pull it off

I do most of it. A tipped Fair on the ground that sends them flying up then I jump and fair then I jump and Dair but i cant' get it to hit usually they go too far out idk what im doing wrong.
Any advices?

Oh and a second question. What should I do versus an annoying sheik that is just Dash dancing and pissing me off with needles?

It depends on the opponent and the character. If the opponent DIs away, then you can't get off the Ken combo; instead, just fair them and edgeguard. Some characters are easier to Ken combo than others, though it is possible against all of them.

Can you at least Ken combo lvl1 cpus? Practice Ken comboing cpus, I prefer marth dittos.

If the opponent gets too far away from you, try dashing before the last fair to build momentum. Also, maybe you aren't hitting with the tip of the fair? You should time your fair with a short hop or a full hop depending on the opponent's height.

i think this has been asked before but i dont think it was really answered.. i like pulling out the dolphin slash as a finisher every now and then.. but im not sure as to whether the knockback on the backside is greater than the front side... meaning will a reverse dolphin slash have more horizontal knockback than a non reverse? and if so how much and how does it decline with distance away

I believe the reverse dolphin slash has greater knockback by 1.39467 times that of a forward dolphin slash.

Just kidding, but I know that a sweet spotted reverse dolphin slash has greater horizontal knockback than a non-sweet spotted one, and I'm pretty sure the reverse has more knockback than the normal dolphin slash.

 

[JesiahTEG]

I thought they both had the same knockback, but the reverse dolphin slash is much easier to sweetspot with.

 

[UMBC Super Smasher]

I thought they both had the same knockback, but the reverse dolphin slash is much easier to sweetspot with.

Yeah, that sounds better. Look at the time I made my post =)

 

[JesiahTEG]

Lol, Tired I take it?

 

[Baha]

Can you at least Ken combo lvl1 cpus? Practice Ken comboing cpus, I prefer marth dittos.

If the opponent gets too far away from you, try dashing before the last fair to build momentum. Also, maybe you aren't hitting with the tip of the fair? You should time your fair with a short hop or a full hop depending on the opponent's height.

So i have to hit with the tip of the fair then jump dair ? that's probably it because im jumping or short hoping (depending on %) and then i Fair but probably I dont hit with the tip. I will practice that today

Its soooo weird to change from Fox and Falco to Marth, everything is just so different.

 

[JesiahTEG]

Just to let everyone know...Ken combo was the reason I started playing this game. I saw it on youtube and was like... I'm playing smash, and maining Marth.