Lucas Hitboxes and Frame Data 2.6

[Burnsy]

Start-Up: How long until hitboxes appear

Active: How long hitboxes last on the screen

Cool-down: How long until Lucas can begin another action after hitboxes disappear. For any moves that have IASA frames*, it's the time until IASA begins.

Air Cool-down: Cool-down for aerials. It is how long until you can preform another action while still in the air.

Land Lag: Specific to aerials, how long until Lucas can act after landing mid-aerial
*included numbers are with L-cancelling

Auto cancel: If you land before or after certain stages of a move (generally at the beginning or end, before hitboxes are out), you will have normal landing lag of 4 frames as if you had done no move at all.

Total: The number of frames where you are committed to the move (can't be cancelled/interrupted normally).

Animation Length: The full length of the moves animation. Useful for comparing the IASA timings of different moves.

*IASA: "Interruptable as soon as". The first frame where it is possible to interrupt the ending part of an animation with any action, rather than waiting for it to finish. Example: Marth d-tilt's IASA avoids a noticeable amount of the end of the animation, shortening the moves cool-down considerably.

[COLLAPSE="Jab 1"]Start-up: 1 | Active: 3 | Cool-Down: 11 | Total: 15 | Animation Length: 23
Frame Notes: IASA frame 16
Jab2 Interrupt: Frame 5

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Close and Far Hitboxes: 3 damage, 65 angle, 0 base knockback, 20 weight knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Jab 2"]Start-up: 7 | Active: 3 | Cool-down: 17 | Total: 27 | Animation Length: 31

Frame notes: IASA frame 28

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Both Hitboxes: 3 damage, 6 shield damage, 55 angle, 35 base knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Dash Attack"]Start-up: 5 | Active: 11 | Cool-Down: 22 | Total: 38 | Animation Length: 38
Frame Notes: IASA Frame 39
[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]


1st small hitbox: 10 damage, 83 angle, base knockback 60, knockback scales 68% with damage
1st large hitbox: 10 damage, 83 angle, base knockback 70, knockback scales 68% with damage

2nd small hitbox: 7 damage, Sakurai angle (361), base knockback 35, knockback scales 90% with damage
2nd large hitbox: 7 damage, Sakurai Angle (361), base knockback 45, knockback scales 90% with damage
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Forward Tilt"]Start-up: 5 | Active: 4 | Cool-down: 19 | Total: 28 | Animation Length: 39
Frame notes: IASA frame 29

[COLLAPSE="Normal Ftilt Hitoxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Angled Up Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Angled Down Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

2 close hitboxes: 9 damage, Sakurai angle (361), 20 base knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage
2 far hitboxes: 11 damage, Sakurai angle (361), 12 base knockback (16 on the tip), knockback scales 100% with damage[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Up Tilt"]Start-up: 6 | Active: 6| Cool-down: 18| Total: 30 | Animation Length: 35
Frame Notes. IASA frame 31

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Early hitboxes (frames 7-8): 10 damage, 90/93 angle, base kb 55, knockback grows 100% with damage
Late hitboxes (frames 9-12): 8 damage, 95 angle, base kb 55, knockback grows 100% with damage

[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Down Tilt"]Start-up: 2 | Active: 2| Cool-down: 19 | Total: 23 | Animation Length: 29
Frame Notes: IASA frame 24
[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Close hitbox: 7 damage, base kb 30
Far hitbox: 8 damage, base kb 30
KB growth for all hitboxes is varied between 72%-80%
Notes: Like most d-tilts, this move uses air only and ground only hitboxes. This is to ensure that the move behaves how it should (setting low % opponents in standing hitstun and popping them up at higher %s) [/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Forward Smash"]Start-up: 14 | Active: 3 | Cool-down: 30| Total: 47 | Animation Length: 60
Frame notes: IASA frame 40

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]
Hitboxes for f-smash do not behave appropriately in brawlbox. Sorry about that.
[/COLLAPSE]
With OU: 24 damage, Sakurai angle (361), 17 shield damage, kb grows only 65% with damage
Without OU: 16 damage, Sakurai angle (361), 0 shield damage, kb grows 90% with damage
Notes: Base knockback increases from 45 to 60 from the base to the tip, for all versions. If you angle up: +1 damage (OU & non-OU), if you angle down: -1 damage, (OU & non-OU)
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Up Smash"]Start-up: 30 | Active: 12 | Cool-down: 40 | Total: 82 | Animation Length: 82

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Both initial hitboxes (OU): 32 damage, 15 shield damage, 95 angle, base knockback 50, knockback scales with damage 80%
Both initial hitboxes (normal): 21 damage, 95 angle, base knockback 50, knockback scales with damage 85%

Both late hitboxes (OU): 26 damage, 15 shield damage, 95 angle, base knockback 42 for top hitbox and 48 for bottom, knockback scales with damage 57%
Both late hitboxes (normal): 17 damage, 95 angle, base knockback 48 (top hitbox is 52), knockback scales with damage 57%
Notes: Head is intangible from frame 10 until the first active frame.[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Down Smash"]Start-up: 20 | Active: 6 |Cool-down: 11| Total: Varies
Frame notes: You can input for the 2nd hit after the first is out and before frame 30. IASA frame 33
[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Hit 1 With OU: 26 damage, 15 shield damage, Sakurai angle (361), 40 base knockback, knockback scales with damage 63%.
Hit 1 Without OU: 17 damage, Sakurai angle (361), 40 base knockback, knockback scales with damage 90%

Hit 2 With OU: 21 damage, 15 shield damage, Sakurai angle (361), 30 base knockback, knockback scales with damage 63%
Hit 2 Without OU: 14 damage, Sakurai angle (361), 30 base knockback, knockback scales with damage 90%[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Neutral Air"]
Start-up: 3 | Active: 16 [Loop pattern: (2)1(2)1(2)1(2)1(4)] | Air Cool-down: 24 | Total: 43 |
Landing Lag: 8 | Auto Cancel: <3, >26
Frame Notes: Hitboxes loop 4-16 (Loop: 2 frames active, 1 inactive) sweetspot (17-21). IASA frame 44

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Bottom repeating hitboxes: 2 damage, 110 angle, 20 weight knockback, knockback scales 130% with damage.
Top repeating hitboxes: 2 damage, 210 angle, 20 weight knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage.
N-air final hit : 6 damage, 35 angle, 10 base knockback, knockback scales 143% with damage.[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Neutral Air Landing Attack"]Start-up: N/A | Active: 2 | Landing Lag: 8

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

All hitboxes: 4 damage, Sakurai angle (361), base knockback 40, knockback scales 100% with damage
Note: This attack occurs when you land with a neutral air before the move has completed in the air.[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Forward Air"]Start-up: 4 | Active: 6 |Air Cool-down: 22 | Landing Lag: 7
Auto Cancel: <4, >32 | Total: 32 | Animation Length: 48
Frame notes: IASA frame 33

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Sour spots: 10 damage, 55 angle, base knockback 36, knockback scales 79% with damage.
Sweet Spot: 13 damage, 55 angle, base knockback 36, knockback scales 95% with damage

Late hit differences: Sweet spot damage is decreased to 10, sour spot to 9. Sweet spot knockback scales 79% with damage
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Back Air"]Start-up: 11 | Active: 5 |Air Cool-down: 22 | Total: 38 | Landing Lag: 10 | Autocancel: <2, >36 | Animation Length: 50
Frame Notes: IASA frame 39, spike is not actually out until frame 13.

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Sourspot and Sweetspot (non-spike): 15 damage, Sakurai angle, 20 base knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage.
Spike Sweetspot: 15 damage, 300 angle, 20 base knockback, knockback scales 80% with damage.
Spike Sourspot: 15 damage, 310 angle, 10 base knockback, knockback scales 80% with damage.
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Up Air"]Start-up: 4 | Active: 5 | Air Cool-down: 18 | Land Lag: 7
Total: 27 | Autocancel: <4, >27 | Animation Length: 45
Frame notes: IASA frame 28

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Small (sweetspot) : 11 damage, 4 shield damage, 70 angle, 26 base knockback, knockback scales 92% with damage
Large (sourspot) : 9 damage, 4 shield damage, 70 angle, 26 base knockback, knockback scales 92% with damage[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Down Air"]
Start-up: 3 | Active: 18 [Loop pattern: (3)4(3)5(3)] | Cool-down: 24| Total: 41| Landing Lag: 9 | Autocancel: <3, >29
Frame notes: IASA on frame 37

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Hits 1 and 2:
Against Grounded opponents: 5 damage, autolink angle, 0 base knockback, 30 weight knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage
Against Aerial opponents: 5 damage, 270 angle, 50 base knockback, 0 weight knockback, knockback scales 35% with damage

Hit 3:
Both hitboxes: 5 damage, 270 angle, 35 base knockback, 0 weight knockback, knockback scales 150% with damage

[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Rope Snake (Z-air)"]
Start-up: 7 | Active: 6 | Air Cool-down: [Will not end in the air, you must land]| Land Lag: 10
Frame notes: "uncovered" area of the arc is actually covered on frame 9 due to interpolation. Lucas' hand is intangible starting when hitboxes come out.
[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Snake head hitbox: 8 damage, 1 shield damage, 30 base knockback, knockback scales 70% with damage.

[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Offense Up Burst (Neutral-B)"]Start-up: 2 | Active: 2 | Cool-down: 33 | Total: 37
[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Hitbox: 10 damage, 60 angle, 50 base knockback, 20 weight knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage

Notes: The blue denotes intangibility, frames 2-3. You must have neutral B charged to use OU burst. Aerial version has the same frame data. On paper, this move seems to have qualities that would make it a decent "combo breaker".[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Windbox on Neutral-B"]
Start-up: 13 | Active (release hitbox): 3 | Cool-down: 40

Windbox: 10 angle, 65 bkb againt aerial, 55 bkb against grounded. Knockback does not scale with damage.
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="PK Thunder (Up-B)"]Start-up: 10 (20 if grounded)| Active: Maximum?= Unknown | Cool-down: 30| Total: N/A
Ledge grab allowed during cool-down. No other useful info in BrawlBox (PKT 1 is an article)[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="PK Thunder 2 (Up-B Self Hit)"]
Start-up: N/A | Active: 36 [ | Cool-down: N/A| Total: 38
Move Progression:
Initial strong (active 1 frame, invincible frame 1 and 2)
Autolink hitboxes (active 31 frames)
Final hit (active 2 frames)
[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Both initial hitboxes: 8 damage, autolink angle, 60 base knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage.

Repeating hitbox on head: 3 damage, autolink angle, 0 base knockback, 20 weight knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage
Repeating hitbox on waist: 3 damage, autolink angle, 30 base knockback, 0 weight knockback, knockback scales 50% with damage

Both final hitboxes: 8 damage, Sakurai angle (361), 40 base knockback, knockback scales 135% with damage.
Notes: Lucas is intangible on frames 1 and 2 after hitting himself with PKT.[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="PK Freeze (Side-B Grounded)"]Start-up: 25 | Active: ???? | Cool-down: 17
Total: 42 | Animation length: 70
IASA on frame 43
Articles do not display in BB
Notes: Stops Lucas momentum. If you get hit in a way that makes you slide while standing (Wolf and Lucario Up-b come to mind), you can use this to stop yourself. I guess.

Personal note: Every time I see him hunker down to do this laggy move, I expect a much bigger ice ball to come out. He flings aerial freezes like they're snowballs, why is his ground version so slow?
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Air PK Freeze (Aerial Side-B)"]Start-up: 13 | Projectile active: ???? | Air Cool-down: 20 | Auto Cancel: ???? | Landing Lag: ???? | Total: 37 | Animation Length: 47
Hitbox data not available, PK freeze is an article.
Notes: IASA frame 34.
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="PK Magnet (Down-B)"]
Start-up: 4 | Active (release hitbox): 1 | Cool-down: 20*
Hold hitboxes loop pattern: (2)6(2)6(2)6....repeating
Must hit with at least 1 hold hitbox before release will activate.
[COLLAPSE="Hold Hitboxes (looped)"]

[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Aerial Hold Hitboxes (looped)"]

[/COLLAPSE]
Repeat hitboxes: 2 damage, 5 shield damage, 80 angle, 0 base knockback, 30 weight knockback, knockback scales 80% with damage, low hitlag and there is a 1.25 SDI multiplier.



[COLLAPSE="Release Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Release hitbox: 6 damage, 127 angle, 80 base knockback, knockback scales 60% with damage, low hitlag.
Notes: Release hit is jump cancel-able starting frame 1 after release hitboxes disappear. Has strong momentum modifiers. [/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Ledge options"]

[COLLAPSE="Climb <100%"]
Invincibility: 1-30 | Vulnerable: 31-35

[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Ledge attack <100%"]
Invincibility: 1-21 | Hitbox: 24-26 | Interrupt-able frame 43

[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Ledge attack >100%"]
Invincibility: 1-36 | Hitbox: 40-44 | Interrupt-able frame 51

[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Ledge Roll <100%"]
Invincibility: 1-26 | Interrupt-able frame 41
[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Ledge Roll >100%"]
Invincibility: 1-57 | Interrupt-able frame 81
[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Ledge Jump <100%"]
Invincibility: 1-15 | Interrupt-able frame 16
[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Ledge Jump >100%"]
Invincibility: 1-19 | Interrupt-able frame 20
[/COLLAPSE]
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Knocked Down Options"]

[COLLAPSE="Stand Up"]
Invincibility: 1-22 | Interrupt-able frame 31
[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Roll"]
Invincibility: 1-22 | Interrupt-able frame 37
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Face Down Get-up"]
Invincibility: 1-26 | Active: 19-20, 25-26 | Interrupt-able frame 51

[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Face Up Get-up"]
Invincibility: 1-25 | Hitbox: 20-21, 24-25| Interrupt-able frame 51

[/COLLAPSE]
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Standing Grab"]Start-up: 10 | Active: 6 | Cool-down: 39

[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]

[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Dash Grab"]Start-up: 14 | Active: 14 | Cool-down: 51
[COLLAPSE="Grab Collision"]

[/COLLAPSE]
Note: While a running JC grab covers about the same distance and is faster in every way, the long lasting grab boxes on this can be useful against spot dodging and in fast faller chaingrabs.
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Pivot Grab"]
Start-up: 13 | Active: 5 | Cool-down: 30
[COLLAPSE="Grab Collision"]

[/COLLAPSE]
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Grab Pummel"]
Start-up: 9 | Active: 1 | Cool-down: 14
[COLLAPSE="Hitboxes"]

[/COLLAPSE]
Pummel hitbox: 3 damage, 40 weight knockback, knockback scales 100% with damage
[/COLLAPSE]
[COLLAPSE="Throw Damage and Knockback Values"]
Back Throw: 10 damage, 135 degree angle (same as 45 degree, but behind), base knockback 70, knockback scales 75% with damage, 52 frames

Forward Throw: 10 damage, 45 degree angle, 65 base knockback, knockback scales 50% with damage, 52 frames

Up Throw: 12 damage (total), 90 degree angle, 75 base knockback, knockback scales 120% with damage, 63 frames

Down Throw: 7 damage, 75 degree angle, 82 base knockback, knockback scales 47% with damage, 42 frames

Notes:
On Uthrow, there are 4 small hitboxes that appear above his head active for 1 frame each when holding his opponent up. Not really worthy of an image, only situationally useful in doubles really.
On Dthrow, with the high knockback but easily comboability of this move, I assume there is a low release point.
[/COLLAPSE]

Note that some moves involve frame speed modifiers. The frame data on these should be very close to accurate, but could be off give or take a frame or two due to me being unsure how I should be rounding my calculations. If you have any corrections you would like me to make then by all means let me know what I need to fix.

APPROXIMATE FRAME ADVANTAGE 3.0

These can help in determining how safe certain moves are on a sheil.
At zero, the attacker recovers from his lag and the defender is free of sheild stun on the same frame.
Negative numbers mean the defender recovers first and positive numbers mean the attacker recovers first.
Therefore, larger numbers generally mean a safer move, although your spacing and your opponents options also come into play when determining how safe something is on shield.

Attack Frame (Dis)advantage Total sheild damage
Jab 1 -9 3
Jab 2 -16 9
Dash Attack -27 10
Dash Attack (late) -18 7
Ftilt (Tipper) -15 11
Ftilt -16 9
Utilt -16 10
Dtilt (Tipper) -15 8
Fsmash -23 16
OU Fsmash -25 41
Usmash -40 21
OU Usmash -42 47
Dsmash (1st hit) -7 17
OU Dsmash (1st hit) -9 41
Dsmash (2nd hit) -9 14
OU Dsmash (2nd hit) -11 36
Nair (last hit+ instant landing) -5 6
Nair landing attack -5 4
Fair -1 10
Fair sweetspot 0 13
Fair (late) -1 9
Fair sweetspot (late) -1 10
Bair -2 15
Uair -1 13
Dair (hit 1+2) -4 5
Dair (hit 3) -5 5
Zair -5 9
OU Neutral B -28 10
Aerial OU Neutral B (land cancel spacing) -4 10
Magnet Release (grounded+jumpsquat) 2 6
Magnet Release (aerial+jc) 6 6

Feel free to request anything you'd like to see.

 

[Master WGS]

Boy Upsmash is silly.

 

[MVP]

this thread WILL be sticked nice thread bro

 

[Dron]

great job with this

 

[standardtoaster]

here's the landing lag

Nair 8/16
Fair 7/15
Bair 10/20
Uair 7/15
Dair 9/18

 

[Burnsy]

Oh that's perfect, thanks standardtoaster! Could I also trouble you for a few other things?

1. What is the landing lag on a z-air?
2. Where would I find autocancel timings?
3. Can you confirm the endlag/recovery on down smash? The number I pulled from Brawlbox doesn't feel right.

 

[DrinkingFood]

Landing lag on zair should be 10 frames like an airdodge landing.

 

[standardtoaster]

landing lag on zair is 10 frames. AC timing is based on when rabit30 is set/cleared in the aerial. it should be pretty obvious when looking at it

 

[Burnsy]

What about down smash? Is the ending lag/recovery supposed to be different depending on if you do 1 or 2 hits? Since the move is split into two parts this was a bit confusing for me... it looks to me as though the recovery is 25 frames for the single hit and 16 frames after both hits.

 

[standardtoaster]

sounds about right I think

 

[SpiderMad]

Great job on this, with Nair though I think re-using the frames don't do a justice for them actually rotating a little along with his body

Here's some of 2.1's hitboxes (you can see Nair)
http://www.smashmods.com/forum/thread-4809.html

I think now you only need to get his grabs, because I'm pretty sure they were changed from 2.1 (you said it's a work in progress, but I'm just saying)

 

[JediKnightTemplar]

EDIT: Nevermind, found it.

 

[Burnsy]

Added grabs!

Great job on this, with Nair though I think re-using the frames don't do a justice for them actually rotating a little along with his body

Here's some of 2.1's hitboxes (you can see Nair)
http://www.smashmods.com/forum/thread-4809.html

Thanks . Would you mind if I borrowed that nair gif of yours? That really shows it better than any static image can.

 

[Burnsy]

I did some general clean up, borrowed SpiderMad's Nair gif, and added data for Zair, pummel and throws.

I'm a bit disappointed about the data I found on throws, since I was able to get everything except for Uthrow's true knockback values. They're listed as "0" for base KB, weight KB, and KB growth. Obviously something is not right here.

 

[Akenero]

Nvm, false data from repeated hits in training mode, it was strange how the character looked like they touched the ground, guess not

 

[Sartron]

Here some of 2.6's new hitboxes. http://imgur.com/a/ZtWr7 This album is poorly done, disregard pls.

 

[Burnsy]

Oh shoot. I already started doing this. I also am using .gifs this time. I was planning to have it updated sometime very soon after LTC, which is next weekend.

 

[Burnsy]

Finished the 2.6 update!

If there's anything that doesn't look right, or anything you want to see that isn't there, don't hesitate to ask.

I'll need to contact a PMBR member to make sure landing lag timings didn't change. This includes PK Freeze -- the way it's auto cancel was coded has changed. I also never had any information on the land lag for a normal pkf (no land cancel).

 

[Sartron]

You should probably add CliffCatch as it now has full intangibility. It's pretty important to note this comparison since before Lucas was pretty vulnerable to many edgeguards on his tether.

 

[Burnsy]

I added 3.0 frame (dis)advantage on block for many moves, this data is an approximation and could be off by a frame or two in a few places.

Keep in mind that aerials are assumed to hit shields 1 frame before landing in these calculations. You would subtract each additional frame spent in the air between hitting the shield and landing to get the true (dis)advantage. However, it is very useful to write them in this way, since perfect DJCs will have you landing immediately.

Once the bugfix comes out, I plan to update the frame data/hitbox section.

*edit*

And now... the nice tables I had before are broken, somehow. Hang in there guys.

 

[Badge]

Thought I could bump this thread and add a bit of data:

• Grounded magnet shield advantage should be +3 (+7 into jump, 4 frames jumpsquat [jump startup in attributes says 5 frames, but it's actually 4 - maybe because the animation only has 4 frames due to frame speed modifiers])
• PKF (both): projectile is out for 20 frames; projectile hitbox: 5 damage, 70 angle, 45 base knockback, 29 knockback growth, 3.25 hitlag multiplier, 0.5 SDI multiplier; projectile speed is higher for grounded version
• PKF (air): Startup is 14 frames, ACs into normal landing (4 frames) until after the projectile has come out (i.e. currently frame 1-15), landing lag is 13 frames
• PK-Thunder: projectile is out up to 98 frames, head hitbox: 10 damage, 75 angle, 70 base knockback, 45 knockback growth, 0.25 hitlag multiplier, 1.5 SDI multiplier, rehit rate 48 (i.e. the soonest rehit is after 49 frames); tail hitboxes: 1 damage, 80 angle, 4 base knockback, 40 knockback growth, 0.5 hitlag multiplier, 1.5 SDI multiplier, rehit rate 48; I counted 6 tail hitboxes (this number is from frame advancing)
• Magnet repeating hit now loops (2)8(2)8(2)8... instead of (2)6(2)6(2)6... and deals no shield damage anymore (instead of 5)
• Misc data you could add: Jumpsquat: 4 frames, DACUS window: 2 frames (afaik only character with technical DACUS-window not equal to effective jumpsquat -3), dash can transition into run on frames 12-17

The only thing that changed from 2.6->3.0 is the repeating portion of magnet.

Edit:
And here are gifs for FSmash and non-OU UpSmash:

Spoiler

FSmash

Up-Angled FSmash

Down-Angled FSmash

OU FSmash (neutral angle - Note: The body-hitbox is slightly larger - feels almost like an oversight)

UpSmash

 

[Burnsy]

Thanks you so much for this stuff 8adge. I'll try to remember to update it later when I'm on my laptop. Are you sure about PKT's projectile can only being active for up to 97 frames? That's hardly more than 1.5 seconds, and it can defintely last longer than that. That sounds more like the value for minimum recovery if you cancel the hitbox right away.

 

[Badge]

I didn't find the data in BB, so I counted the frames in frame advance. I'm sure this is the time it was active, but it may be longer in the air or dependent on how many turns you take. I'll go check and correct it in the post above should there be more to it.
That and the hitbox count are the only stuff that's not directly out of BB btw. I also didn't find the scripting that creates the tail-projectiles, but I'm pretty sure about the hitboxes still because that was the only offensive collision on a projectile that matched what I knew about the hitbox.

Edit: Okay, aside from me miscouting by one frame the projectile stayed active for 98 frames both in the air and on the ground and also whether I hit an opponent with it or not and whether I curved it heavily or only minimally. 98 should be the right number.

 

[Burnsy]

Okay, thanks again.

 

[G13_Flux]

quick question, does the start up indicate what frame the hitbox comes out on, or how many frame pass with no hitbox. like, magnet has 4 frames of start up, will the hitbox come out on frame 4 or 5?

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

quick question, does the start up indicate what frame the hitbox comes out on, or how many frame pass with no hitbox. like, magnet has 4 frames of start up, will the hitbox come out on frame 4 or 5?

Frame 5.

 

[Darb Vader]

Does anyone know what 3.0 magnet's shield damage and repeat rate are?

EDIT: Just tested the repeat rate -- 10 frames. Have no idea how to test shield damage though.

 

[NeonApophis]

Shield damage is normal, i.e. 8 damage total for the shortest possible non-stale magnet (2 damage for the repeating hitbox, and 6 for the release hitbox). The extra shield damage from 2.6 was removed.

 

[Darb Vader]

Cool, thanks Neon.

 

[210stuna]

Thank you for everything

 

[Zoma]

In reference to the back air, which hitboxes are which? i.e. spike vs. regular and sweetspot vs. sourspot.

 

[Jamwa]

In reference to the back air, which hitboxes are which? i.e. spike vs. regular and sweetspot vs. sourspot.

In brawl it was the foot spiked and the hexagons would send people away.
in p:m it is either the opposite of that (foot is regular and hexagons are spike) or that it spikes when he is moving his foot down

 

[Zoma]

By taking a screenshot of the gif, it is clear that two of the hitboxes have spike angles (the top of his foot and the large yellow hitbox on his body), and two have Sakurai angles (the bottom of his foot and the small purple hitbox on his body). The large yellow hitbox that encompasses Lucas's body has the more extreme downward angle, suggesting that his body is the sweetspot and his foot is the sourspot.

That... Seems weird to me? Just logically (you would think his foot would be the sweetspot, and you would think it would spike on the bottom) and from experience -- it seems like the move spikes when it's coming down and Sakurais when the target sort of lands on it, but the hitboxes suggest the opposite.

If someone could say definitively, that would be awesome.

 

[Burnsy]

The reason for that is that some attacks, like bair, have a set of hitboxes that collide with aerial enemies, and a set for grounded enemies. Look towards the end of the animation when he is about 3/4 done with the "flip". Lucas' foot has 2 overlapping hitboxes, one with Sakurai angle and one with a downward spiking angle. The spiking hitbox is the one versus air. You can sweetspot with a non-spiking hitbox if you hit with the feet earlier in the move. This is why bair doesn't pop straight up when you hit someone with it when grounded like other spiking/meteor moves.

If you look at the data I gathered in the bair section, you will notice I already had data on the vs air hitboxes, and that the spike within Lucas' body is a sourspot spike, although they actually aren't that different in terms of knockback.

 

[Zoma]

The frame data says that the strong spike has an angle of 300° (more vertical) and the weak spike has an angle of 310°(more horizontal). This is where my confusion stems from, because the animation shows that the hitbox in Lucas's body has the more vertical angle.

Am I wrong about that, and what it means?

Edit: Looking at other moves, such as uair, it looks like I am. I guess this can be disregarded.

 

[Burnsy]

No, you're actually right. The sourspot does have a lower angle. Can someone confirm whether 310 is a spiking or meteoring angle?

 

[Zoma]

Interesting.

Aren't the Melee angles (260° to 280° meteors) retained?

 

[Burnsy]

Yea, that isn't changed. Guess they both spike and are slightly different

 

[Zoma]

So where does this leave us?

Is Lucas's body actually the sweetspot? Or does the sourspot inexplicably have a better angle, and the frame data needs to be updated?

 

[Burnsy]

better angle but its weaker.