Is This Cheap?

[Texfone]

When I never let my friend back on the stage, he said edge-guarding was cheap, he said not letting him touch the ground was cheap, he also didn't like my counter move but i don't think he called it cheap, i was playing shulk by the way. I don't think these are cheap, i just think he was a sore loser, opinions on this?

 

[Ze Diglett]

Don't worry, edgeguarding, juggling, and counters are all extremely basic parts of Smash gameplay. Your friend seems like he's just a bit of a scrub to me.

 

[ahannoush4]

the point of the game is to knock and keep your opponent off of the platform... Basic rule. If I were you I'd keep doing what you're doing. He'll learn to get around it eventually

 

[Texfone]

Don't worry, edgeguarding, juggling, and counters are all extremely basic parts of Smash gameplay. Your friend seems like he's just a bit of a scrub to me.

What WOULD you consider to be cheap, whether it be a move or strategy or character or what?

 

[Ze Diglett]

What WOULD you consider to be cheap, whether it be a move or strategy or character or what?

Well, intentionally lagging the game in online is one thing, but only the most despicable of FG scum would do such a thing. Constantly running away and intentionally running down the clock is pretty obnoxious, so as far as gameplay goes, I guess it's really the closest to "cheap" this game gets.

 

[Texfone]

Well, intentionally lagging the game in online is one thing, but only the most despicable of FG scum would do such a thing. Constantly running away and intentionally running down the clock is pretty obnoxious, so as far as gameplay goes, I guess it's really the closest to "cheap" this game gets.

What is FG?

 

[Ze Diglett]

For Glory, the online mode. The joke is that it's generally a super laggy place with super laggy people.

 

[pershona]

It's not cheap, your friend is acting like a scrub.

 

[prfarb]

I applaud your bravery. When I try to chase off stage I feel like there is a wall put up that keeps me from going.

 

[Tino]

Sounds like your friend didn't have any idea what he's doing.

 

[MarioMeteor]

No offense, but your friend sounds like a scrub. Or just salty. Keep doing what you're doing.

 

[Purin a.k.a. José]

He is just salty/a scrub. Keep edgeguarding him, and show him that this is the way to play Smash; knocking your opponent off the stage and, if possible, don't letting him come back. Even throw him with Inhale (or Swallowcide) if you want

 

[Turrin]

What WOULD you consider to be cheap, whether it be a move or strategy or character or what?

Cheap is an illusion. Anything that wins you the game is viable(...Except unplugging the other guy's controller). Sounds like your buddy doesn't play competitively - maybe try to teach him how to fight off stage, air dodge, read counters and stuff like that.

Running down the clock is usually hated by spectators, but even that's not cheap or unfair, just boring.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

The only thing that I really consider "cheap" in Smash is circle camping. That's not okay, in my book. Other than that? Zoning, projectile camping, edgeguarding, juggling, combos, gimping… if they exist, they're fair game. But stalling simply for the sake of making the match drag on indefinitely is rude and simply unfun.

Edit: As an extension to that, in Brawl a problem I sometimes had was infinite wall combos that are continued well beyond any reasonable limit simply for the sake of dragging the match on. Yes, Dedede, I get that you have me pinned in the corner with your jab. 300% was enough. When you continue to hit me for another 350%, you're just being a jerk to the other players who got knocked out of the match earlier. Hurry up and KO me so they can get back to the game!

 

[WinterShorts]

You know, my older brother, while greatly improving in Sm4sh and almost matching my talents, has said that Melee's wavedashing and L-canceling are exploits and sholdn't be in the game, and thinks Project M is bad because it's a combo game and also uses the ladder reasons.

I am not a Melee player myself (at least until I get a laptop for Netplay), but I and probably many, many other competitive smashers would disagee with that statement. same concept here.

For f**ks sake guys, I don't care if it's an exploit or not. Edge-guarding, not letting you touch the ground (which I'll call that juggling), Melee's wavedashing and L-canceling take quite the skill to get down with and master. Now see, spamming rolling? that's the definition of cheap. Something simple and helps on the defensive side, yet predictable, which was why I played back in the day. In the end of the day, they're complaints about you being better than them. period, nothing else.

 

[Paxadin]

You should tell him, "Welcome to the entire game play of smash, we could always play with items on instead if you really want".

What I used to do when my friends complained was bring a few packets of salt from a fast food and throw it at them when they started complaining.

 

[Untamed]

Does your friend know he's playing smash.... or?

 

[Ninj4pikachu]

"Ain't no rest for the wicked"-caged elephant

This roughly translates to do whatever it takes to win. If you don't, somone else will. Donkey kong has 4 spikes and I use them frivolously throughout a match. Sometimes I kill my opponent at less than 50%. It's not cheap it's called a gimp, and it means you got outplayed.

 

[WalrusBiscuit]

That is not cheap. They are extremely usefull.

 

[Ryan.]

It isn't cheap. Edge-guarding is extremely useful as is Shulk's counter. It sounds like you were just playing with more skill and your friend doesn't know too much about the game.

 

[Scootch]

He is a total sore loser! All of those things you said are a big part of the game and are not at all cheap.

 

[CrazyPerson]

The word cheap is thrown around to much. I have yet to see anything in smash that I would consider cheap from a players perspective. EDIT: Intentional online lag... I can't be sure when I am seeing it but if people do that it is taking an advantage that was never intended to be available. I

have called certain items cheap... but when they drop I am using them and I am agreeing with the complaints that come in... which works because my group is civil enough where complaints are aimed at design of game and not each other.

To me the word cheap usually means abusing a glitch in an uncounterable way. At this point I am taking in general, not about smash specifically. IE a strange series of jumps to get to access to an intended inaccessible area and racking up kills that were never supposed to be possible.

Sometimes though... a tactic becomes cheap not by glitch but by developer oversight. I remember playing battlefield bad company 2 rush mode. Attackers usually won PUG games(at least in 24 man games which I preferred because 32 just had to many sights pointed the same direction.) but defenders could do something spectacular. Unfortunately, certain players devised certain seemingly unbeatable tactics. Tanks could be fired from well inside the off limits to defenders area, and could hit the target, damage, and destroy it... form a place attackers couldn't set foot in. I don't know how they figured out the exact spot and trajectory... but I found that tactic cheap... be it a demonstration of major skill and understanding of the game Still, I quit playing shortly after this was discovered and became common. Just wasn't fun anymore.

The object of smash is to knock players off the edge and keep them from returning. Keeping them air bound without that 2nd jump to escape is a valid, and key part of the game for some characters. Flinging yourself off the edge to knock them further away is not only valid, but a skill that every player should seek to develop. (unless your a little mac main... though I don't play him much so I could be way off here.)

Sounds like your friend didn't have any idea what he's doing.

To often cheap means "I can't beat it." Two reasons for this: Bad match ups or lack of skill.

If it is a match up issue, then there isn't much that can be done. If a Ness calls my Rosalina cheap for gravitational pulling his recovery PK Thunder in and forcing him to fall to his death I am goin to shrug my shoulders and say I am using what the game gave me... and tell him I am not doing anything very different from when he uses my floatyness against me.

It sounds to me like your friend isn't particularly good at this game. I mean this as a statement not a criticism... So my suggestion is to help him. Don't be (I am not saying you are) that person who wins a lot by refusing to share knowledge that would allow your friends to become better, and then push you to be better. Show him what he is doing to make it possible, how you set it up, how he can DI out of it, what moves he can break the combo with, etc etc.

Funny thing about cheap tactics... is often once someone figures out how to use them they no longer see them as cheap.

 

[Danny of AD 1]

Well if you are using an advanced technique such as wavedashing l canceling grabbing or cheesy glitches it can be considered cheap but counters and edgeguarding is not because that is the base game I find certain techs too slow maybe that's why I lose so often in for glory in smash 4

 

[Scootch]

For Glory also is not the best anyway. A lot of people on it are noobs and spam and the lag can mess things up sometimes. So it might not be you.

 

[Danny of AD 1]

I rarely touch the shield and grab buttons well that and I play as mr game and watch

 

[1FC0]

Your friend is a scrub. If you take his opinion seriously then you will probably become a worse player because of it because it may prevent you from learning how to edgeguard and from learning how to defend against edgeguards.
Edgegaurding requires skill both to do and to get in a position where you can edgeguard. There is nothing cheap or degenerate about it.

 

[Still~Wolf]

It is not cheap at all, it is an essential element of Smash 4.
Keep doin' it. Just because he has difficulty countering it doesn't mean it's cheap. He just needs to git gud.