Is there a standardized Mii for competitive play?

[The_Altrox]

Looking to hold a tourney soon and I really want to allow Miis (idk how many people actually use them, but I want to keep the option open). But since Miis have varying stats based on height and weight, is this something that needs to be standardized for the sake of valid tourney results and the like? I was just going to say that people could use their own miis or premade ones on the Wii Us, so long as they meet size requirements. Considering how rare Mii players are, I can't imagine checking to make sure they're clean wouldn't be too much of a time suck at a small tourney.

Or, do TOs who allow Miis not give a damn about size?

Also, for non-customs tourneys, what's the typical rule about Mii custom moves? I've seen some say that players must rely on the 1s, others say that players must rely on "straight" numbers (all 1s, all 2s, or all 3s), or that they can optimize, given that these customs are unlocked, though this might not be considered fair in a non-custom tourney when other characters lack these options.

Sorry if this has already been discussed and documented somewhere.

 

[Jaxas]

Not sure if there's an overall "accepted" answer, but at least at my tournaments we allow all move combinations (because they can be used with Customs: OFF) but you have to use one of the guest Miis (because creating a specific Mii takes too much time, and requires you to exit Smash 4, go to the Mii Maker (on the gamepad!), create a Mii, boot up Sm4sh again, and return to the match).

Also, we don't allow it but some places let anyone with a 3DS transfer their Miis over (allowing custom Height/Weight values).

 

[Raijinken]

It's recently been mentioned in the Custom Moveset Discussions that a Mii with minimum width and 1/4th height is considered ideal across all three Mii types, best we know.

 

[The_Altrox]

I'd allow for 3DS transfer (with the option to check to see that the Mii is legal). Other than that, I'm going to encourage people who bring set-ups to have Miis with the correct dimension created on their Wii U (could be the standards or ones from their wii, so long as they are correct). You do one check at the beginning and everything is game. I wouldn't want to stop mid tourney to create Miis.

It's recently been mentioned in the Custom Moveset Discussions that a Mii with minimum width and 1/4th height is considered ideal across all three Mii types, best we know.

Any confirmation links for this? I was just going to take unedited height and weight for simplicity, but does that make a huge difference?

 

[san.]

Default tends to be much worse. Think Dr. Mario without the damage boost.

 

[The_Altrox]

Default tends to be much worse. Think Dr. Mario without the damage boost.

Okay. I myself use a short, thin Mii. So skinny, short Miis are preferred? I can make that happen, but if people bring their own Miis, should they be asked to fit those dimensions, or is it okay if they're just handicapping themselves?

 

[Raijinken]

I'd allow for 3DS transfer (with the option to check to see that the Mii is legal). Other than that, I'm going to encourage people who bring set-ups to have Miis with the correct dimension created on their Wii U (could be the standards or ones from their wii, so long as they are correct). You do one check at the beginning and everything is game. I wouldn't want to stop mid tourney to create Miis.




Any confirmation links for this? I was just going to take unedited height and weight for simplicity, but does that make a huge difference?

My source, courtesy of @ John12346
I currently just use my own Mii, and the Miis of my friends that I've made fighters of, so I can't personally attest to the effectiveness of changes.

 

[san.]

It is a good compromise to use the default when there is no other option. I don't think it's a good idea to enforce it when players have alternatives available that are just as quick. Those who use unpopular sizes would need to find a way to transfer or prepare the Mii on some Wii Us before the tournament bracket begins, but I think it's better to make a few unhappy than most.

 

[The_Altrox]

Thing is, it almost becomes "Pay to win" if the only people that can use custom sizes are the ones with 3DS's if I'm not going to allow for Mii creation in the middle of a tourney for anybody else. However, I'll have my 3DS, so I guess I could allow people to use it to create their mii of choice before a tourney begins. I figure it out soon... Either no adjustments or the "suggested" size.

 

[NNOOOBB]

You may want to skip miis for this event. Nobody has come up with a good idea for a consistent ruleset yet.

 

[The_Altrox]

I've been thinking that, but I've been pretty vocal among my own community about how I really want to see more Miis... I'm not too proud to admit that we're not ready, but I really don't want them to be left out, especially since Brawler is one of my favorite characters.

 

[NNOOOBB]

I can see what ya mean, don't wanna leave out a character. Sakurai sure makes it hard not to though

 

[Raijinken]

It's not pay to win if the Miis aren't stronger than the strongest free options (Diddy and Sheik), so get that thought out of your head.

Either run defaults, or some pre-defined setups, or leave them out altogether, if you're concerned about the logistics of uplodables.

 

[TheASDF]

In a ruleset that allows customs, I'd say that there's not a great argument to not allowing different sizes; there were a lot of arguments in the beginning that you'd have to know a lot of different combo/kill percents, but now I think we know that between rage and staling that kind of thing isn't exact by any stretch of the imagination, and you should be able to get a general sense of the Mii's weight pretty early on by seeing its movement speed and how your early attacks effect it.

For customs off ruleset, I think it depends on how you're already handling Miis - if you're limiting them to 1111, then having them all at a fixed height/weight is probably best. I don't think default height/weight is best for the Miis, but it still works. If you're allowing custom sets, then it doesn't change much from allowing customs on the whole, at least not in any sense that doesn't get into the argument of how to handle Miis in a non-custom ruleset in general. (Which I'm not gonna get into mostly because I'm not sure of my opinion on that matter, and I don't really know that there's a right answer. Whatever, I'd rather customs on, anyway.)

 

[John12346]

It's already been touched on, but the Standard Moveset Project intends on releasing QR codes for Miis with optimized heights and weights, based on how the discussion of the Mii characters turn out. You can import these Miis to Mii Maker, and then to Smash 3DS. As it stands, all three Mii characters seem to agree that 1/4 height and absolute thinnest is the way to go so that will probably end up being the "standard" if there ever is one, but...

Again, I fully intend to lobby to allow people to perform imports during not-national-sized tournaments anyway but at least this way most people will have what they need right out of the starting gate.

 

[Probalo]

At the tournaments I've been to, Mii characters have to be at least 1/4 height and must have either a 1111, 2222 or 3333 moveset.

 

[Jigglymaster]

If customs are ON, let people upload their MIi's from the 3DS

If customs are OFF, restrict mii's to being guest miis, and make them play with 1111, 2222, or 3333.

 

[The_Altrox]

If customs are ON, let people upload their MIi's from the 3DS

If customs are OFF, restrict mii's to being guest miis, and make them play with 1111, 2222, or 3333.

They're not on yet. I'd like to do a custom tourney in the future though.

Are guest miis of standard size? Like no size alterations? At this point, I'll stick with standards. Maybe someday, we'll get to use optimal sizes if a standard is agreed upon.

 

[Jigglymaster]

They're not on yet. I'd like to do a custom tourney in the future though.

Are guest miis of standard size? Like no size alterations? At this point, I'll stick with standards. Maybe someday, we'll get to use optimal sizes if a standard is agreed upon.

Guest Miis are in fact standard size. Changing the size can add a bit of unbalance though, as making smaller characters allows them to run faster, jump higher, and attack quicker, trading off for non-existent range that they don't already have.

 

[The_Altrox]

Yeah, I'm going to do that for now and tell the other set-up providers to have miis ready (either the guests or self-made if appropriate size). it's not going to be a big tourney, so I can check at the beginning if they are using their own.

 

[T0MMY]

Looking to hold a tourney soon and I really want to allow Miis (idk how many people actually use them, but I want to keep the option open). But since Miis have varying stats based on height and weight, is this something that needs to be standardized for the sake of valid tourney results and the like? I was just going to say that people could use their own miis or premade ones on the Wii Us, so long as they meet size requirements. Considering how rare Mii players are, I can't imagine checking to make sure they're clean wouldn't be too much of a time suck at a small tourney.

What it sounds to me like you are asking is if there is a "mandate" on Mii fighters in order to be "validated" by some kind of committee.
The simple answer to that is: No

If you are asking this question then you are probably new to hosting tournaments. Welcome to the Smash Community, and thanks for being a gracious host. If you are new to this then chances are you are running what is called a "Local" - that is a tournament that is intended for a city-wide player base. In this type of tournament there's really no need to worry about validation or mandates, just one thing is important:
Make sure your attendees have fun, enjoy the competition, and the event runs as outlined/promised on your event postings.

So, as advice from both a longtime Tournament Organizer and a Mii player, I would say look at two options:

1. No additional rulings
   • Feel free to play the default Mii on the system, any Mii made and saved on any system, or upload your own personalized Mii from your 3DS - but please do not turn off the game to access the Mii maker, taking the game offline is not allowed.
2. Default Mii only
   • There will be a default Mii of average height/weight with the 1,1,1,1 moveset on each console to be used. No other Mii may be used for competition at this tournament as a way to look into how Mii are used.
3. Mii ban
   • These characters are not allowed to be used due to specific logistics they bring to the tournament that the organizer has not yet addressed.

If you are familiar with Miis (as it looks like you are) then Option 1 will be best to get your tournament running smoothly and without any complaints (no complaints from the Mii players who cannot compete due to a ban or limit).

Also, for non-customs tourneys, what's the typical rule about Mii custom moves?

Nothing is typical.
Decide if you want "Custom Fighters" setting to be ON or OFF and have that posted along with all other game settings so your attendees know what to expect in competition. This setting does not affect the Mii - any equipment that is on them cannot be used/is not activated when Custom Fighters is OFF, so no need to worry about this.

I guarantee you if you simply give a number of stocks and a time limit (if any) with Items set to OFF and a simple stage list then that's about all you have to worry about with rules.
An example of a simple ruleset that would work just fine for you is as follows (in spoiler below):

Spoiler

Stock: 3
Time: 8
Stages allowed: Final Destination (or Omega Form of any Normal Stage), Battlefield, Smashville, Town & City, and Lylatt Cruise.
Players strike two stages and play on the final one each round or choose Random (Omega/Normal).
Brackets: Double-elimination
Seeding: Random by Location (entrants are shuffled randomly and do not play their "crew/buddy/sibling" first round)
Sets: 2 wins out of 3 rounds play determine a winner who advances in brackets
Grand Final Set: 3 wins out of 5 rounds play determine winner of the tournament (note the winner's side of bracket will drop into elimination round if first 3 out of 5 set is lost and a final elimination round is played out in what is called a bracket "reset").

Note: The game determines every circumstance of winning/losing rounds/sets unless a game-breaking glitch occurs (like a freeze glitch) which renders a round unplayable for competition in which case the round will be replayed. Players who purposely abuse a glitch/oversight in the game in order to stall out a game indefinitely will be given a warning/disqualification at the referee's or TO's discretion.

 

[digiholic]

The best way to handle the Miis, IMO, is to pre-make a thinnest-1/4 height mii, a minimum both mii, a maximum both mii, and a default mii, and give them unique appearance and indicative names (if you have multiple setups, you can use QR codes to load them on all of them). Let the players make their mii fighters in-game before the set (Takes about as long as setting up a name and controller) with whatever move set, and name it after their moves (2332, 1131, etc.)

This means that there's not much tournament day time setup, Mii players are rare and will likely only need one fighter set up, and if there are multiple, or if you re-use the setups, there's a chance that players will find that their build is already on-system. (This will be more likely as people refine their move sets to a standard)

Alternatively, you can use the Standard Customs Project move loadouts with a min weight, 1/4 height instead of the sizes listed (they're out of date, Mii fighter players have since reached a general consensus on the sizing) and leave it at that. There's no limit to Mii fighter slots, so you can have all of these options pre-loaded.

 

[The_Altrox]

If you are asking this question then you are probably new to hosting tournaments.

Yes, but not new to the community. My issue is that I wanted to keep the process of using Miis as clean as possible. And while I appreciate the rule set addition, I already have one ready.

 

[kewl]

Well in Panama and most of Central America I believe we have a pretty standard ruleset about Miis.

Basically they are restricted to Guest Miis (which are the default height/weight) and allowed to use eitehr 1111, 2222, or 3333 loadouts.

Honestly to me, in a "Customs: OFF" setting, this is the best ruling about Miis since it really makes the Miis into a default character that comes along with the game and everyone can practice MUs or anything vs these Guest Miis and the standard 1111, 2222, or 3333 loadouts (No one can john about not knowing the B moves since they are set to something standard instead of being all mixed up).

These are the rules I've been using here in Panama and no one has complained so far and we have tournaments almost every 2 weeks. If what you want is something more default, I think this would be the best route. - Either way you have to think about the fact that not many people use Miis, which is why I think alot of people don't really mind this because they're not OP either.

 

[digiholic]

Well in Panama and most of Central America I believe we have a pretty standard ruleset about Miis.

Basically they are restricted to Guest Miis (which are the default height/weight) and allowed to use eitehr 1111, 2222, or 3333 loadouts.

Honestly to me, in a "Customs: OFF" setting, this is the best ruling about Miis since it really makes the Miis into a default character that comes along with the game and everyone can practice MUs or anything vs these Guest Miis and the standard 1111, 2222, or 3333 loadouts (No one can john about not knowing the B moves since they are set to something standard instead of being all mixed up).

These are the rules I've been using here in Panama and no one has complained so far and we have tournaments almost every 2 weeks. If what you want is something more default, I think this would be the best route. - Either way you have to think about the fact that not many people use Miis, which is why I think alot of people don't really mind this because they're not OP either.

I don't really see how knowing 1111,2222, and 3333 is less knowledge required than knowing 1232, for example. If you allow the straight ticket loadouts, you're already expecting everyone to know what all of the moves do, there's not any new information required if someone mixes and matches. The Grenade doesn't change if you have Gunner Missile instead of Stealth Burst, if you know it from the 3333 set, you know it from the 3232 set.

 

[kewl]

I don't really see how knowing 1111,2222, and 3333 is less knowledge required than knowing 1232, for example. If you allow the straight ticket loadouts, you're already expecting everyone to know what all of the moves do, there's not any new information required if someone mixes and matches. The Grenade doesn't change if you have Gunner Missile instead of Stealth Burst, if you know it from the 3333 set, you know it from the 3232 set.

Completely agree, but having been a TO for the past 6-7 years here, people complain about the stupidest things and this is one of them. So in order to have everything be standard, it's better to just have 1111, 2222, or 3333.

 

[digiholic]

Completely agree, but having been a TO for the past 6-7 years here, people complain about the stupidest things and this is one of them. So in order to have everything be standard, it's better to just have 1111, 2222, or 3333.

If you cave to Johns, the Johns have won. If someone complains about their own lack of knowledge, tell them to "Git Gud".

 

[T0MMY]

There's absolutely nothing beneficial for having a 1111/2222/3333 ruling on either side. It's going to limit the Mii players to the point they don't enjoy playing and/or won't come to the tournament, yet it won't make it "fair" to the people who don't want to make an effort to familiarize themselves with the game outside of one of the online game modes only.

Either complete ban or no rulings is always the best way to go.
As a TO who would want more people to attend my tournament I'd rather not exclude certain players by banning their character for no other reason than johnnies not wanting to "get gud" and just go for no additional rulings.
The people complaining who get their way more likely just find the next thing to complain about until they realize they are not going to be able to complain their way to victory and (sooner rather than later) do everyone else a favor and stop coming to the events.