I need serious help dealing with Kirby's Dash Attack

[D-idara]

So I play with friends a lot and we're all getting much better at Project M, although we still don't play with Advanced Techniques and probably won't do it since we're kinda preparing and warming up for Smash4. I've learned how to read people when they decide to start spamming annoying attacks over and over, and I've slowly destroyed spammers and cleared them out from my friends' playstyles, but there's this friend who's a Kirby main, and I swear to god it doesn't matter how hard I try or how much I try to mix things up, I can't find a good, consistent method to deal with Kirby's dash attack.

It overrides Captain Falcon's Side+B, Marth, Ike or Roy can only counter it at the end of the animation, it's extremely difficult to grab Kirby mid-attack, it has this weird knockback properties that seem to always lift you from the ground, has ridiculous range, whenever I roll backwards he just hits me anyway and when I roll forward I end up too far to do anything and he ends up doing it again, and I'm pretty sure the hitbox shouldn't be that big.

So I need some tips or advice, what's a reliable way to deal with Kirby's annoying-ass dash attack?

 

[Synth177]

I'm a Kirby main who's somewhat of a dash attack spammer. When you're playing the neutral game with a kirby he'll most likely try to approach with a dash attack so always be aware of it. People usually counter it by grabbing me at the end of it or wavedashing back and attacking. Spend some time playing as kirby in the training room and learn the distance of the attack, it will help a lot.

 

[Phan7om]

Any move with disjoints can beat it out at any time. Marth/Roy/Ike/GnW/Metaknight/more, can beat it out with most of their moveset. Otherwise you can trade with it by using most peoples smash attacks. Other than that, just wait for the animation to end and grab them, if they like to roll afterwards read the roll next time since they'll probably do it again. Once you learn to counter this move, its no better than Falcon Kick lol. DA is an overrated move unless its land cancelled, then you'll have a much bigger problem.

It can be crouch cancelled at low %s too which can lead to deadly follow ups. It can also just plain be jumped over. The move is way too telegraphed to be spammed imo. Just go into training room with whatever character and see what move beats it. I know how bad it is, and if a Kirby spams this move on a regular basis which can easily be punished, they'll more than likely be afraid to do anything else with Kirby since they rely too much on the move. Fair/Nair approaches are a lot better imo.

 

[TGAP37]

I used to spam dash attack a lot but once you learn the distance of it it's really easy to punish, if you have a disjointed move just time it right and you'll be fine, if not just back up and punish during the end lag

 

[FreeGamer]

>uses Marth/Ike/Roy
>has trouble with Kirby's Fireball

It would help you most to learn the timing of Fireball, then you can smack him with a F-Tilt or a N-Air or something.

 

[Jethroo]

Use disjointed hit boxes or you can learn the spacing and dash dance which will bait out a dash attack you just out distance it and punish.

 

[EmptySky00]

That move is completely ******** and there's no reason to even think you can punish it consistently.

True story.
Opponent: -dash attack-
Me(Marth): -wavedash back perfectly so he stops in front of me-
-grab-
Opponent: -spot dodge-


I ****ing gave up on everything after that. So glad he can be safe even after a good read and perfect spacing because the punish window is like 7 damn frames.

Here's another for lulz since people say disjointed attacks.

Me(Link): -reads dash attack and Dsmashes to hit him out of it-

*clank*


Me(Link): -reads it and throws a bomb right at him-

Bomb: -bounces away-

It's absurd how many fail safes that move has.
The only reason why it's not broken is because he can't really convert super hard off of it, but the sheer amount of safety on it is idiotic for a move that moves half screen. Readable or otherwise, there's no reason it should be that safe.

 

[FreeGamer]

Have you tried using Link's grounded Spin Attack, perhaps a short hop N-Air or D-Air? I know for a fact that short hop D-Air works beautifully against it if you can get the read.

Also, Fireball has grab invincibility for some reason. Expect it to be removed in the next build.

 

[Jethroo]

I know martha's fsmash hits kirby in his dash attack. Thinking his ftilt, dair, fair, bair, dtilt, and neutral B hits kirby out of it as well. Martha's jab will clank with it. Also, why not try martha's counter which lasts like 2 seconds?

Links UpB stops it easily. Also, ever try link's grab? I know yoshi's grab stops it for free grab. Pretty sure my martha playing friend has grabbed me in it before with his absurd grab range.

 

[D-idara]

Marth's F+Smash hits Kirby's Fireball? Last time I checked that stuff clanks and my opponent grabs me, throws me backwards and starts spamming Fireball again. I've tried to hookshot him but it doesn't work either, the hookshot seems to go past him and he just hits me...although I haven't tried Link's Up+B. Also, Marth's counter can only effectively counter the move on the last few frames and if I misspace it even slightly, I'm pretty much screwed, so it's not really a safe option, I don't mind the knockback or the range, I just think the move is WAY too safe for how good it is.

And god, a shorthop D-Air with Link seems like hell to space properly with how fast Kirby goes and how slowly Link does the move. So overall I should just try to hit that **** with disjointed hitboxes that don't clank? (Even though the move seems to clank with nearly everything I throw at it?) I'm just glad it's getting axed on Smash4 over the more manageable YoYo Break.

PD: Oh, and calling Marth Martha stopped being funny since the beggining of time.

PD2: Oh, and techless methods work better, since I can't use Wavedash or Dashdancing proficiently yet (Probably never).

 

[EmptySky00]

Have you tried using Link's grounded Spin Attack, perhaps a short hop N-Air or D-Air? I know for a fact that short hop D-Air works beautifully against it if you can get the read.

Also, Fireball has grab invincibility for some reason. Expect it to be removed in the next build.

Yes because I'm going to throw out a spin attack grounded on a guess that he might dash attack. That sounds absolutely terrible and having to take that large a risk to beat out a goddamn dash attack is absurd in its own way. I don't even benefit that much if I do hit him unless he's at kill percents/dash attacking towards me and away from the ledge because I can't convert on it and it just resets the match to neutral. I'm not saying it's unbeatable, but the risk of the move is so minimal and you have to put in so much unnecessary effort to MAYBE punish it if your opponent uses it poorly/is asleep that it's stupid.

Short hop Dair is equally as absurd since the move moves so damn fast and I'm guessing yet again with a move that will put me into a bad position if I miss. If you're putting yourself in an unnecessarily risky position on a mere chance that they'll do the move you expect exactly when you'll expect it then the punish is probably not good or realistic.


Lmfao I just thought about it and I think if I don't hit the strong shot of spin I might actually clank with that damn move. I'm going to laugh so damn hard if that's the case. Testing.

 

[Jethroo]

Marth's F+Smash hits Kirby's Fireball? Last time I checked that stuff clanks and my opponent grabs me, throws me backwards and starts spamming Fireball again. I've tried to hookshot him but it doesn't work either, the hookshot seems to go past him and he just hits me...although I haven't tried Link's Up+B. Also, Marth's counter can only effectively counter the move on the last few frames and if I misspace it even slightly, I'm pretty much screwed, so it's not really a safe option, I don't mind the knockback or the range, I just think the move is WAY too safe for how good it is.

And god, a shorthop D-Air with Link seems like hell to space properly with how fast Kirby goes and how slowly Link does the move. So overall I should just try to hit that **** with disjointed hitboxes that don't clank? (Even though the move seems to clank with nearly everything I throw at it?) I'm just glad it's getting axed on Smash4 over the more manageable YoYo Break.

PD: Oh, and calling Marth Martha stopped being funny since the beggining of time.

PD2: Oh, and techless methods work better, since I can't use Wavedash or Dashdancing proficiently yet (Probably never).

Before i continue with my reply MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA MARTHA. I don't care if it isn't funny to you it is funny to me...

Okay, final wasn't busy with work to test this stuff out finally for martha and respond.

1. When i was testing fsmash it was about 50/50 clank probably tipper always hits kirby out of dash attack. (martha sword attack are effected by what part of his sword hits.)
2. I was able to EASILY counter kirby's dash attack (did it like 30 times in a row) and it is INCREDIBLE EASY to time it right. Martha's counter lasted for like a second and half, so that is a VERY reliable way to stop it. I even started the counter both right before dash attack hit me and right as the kirby was starting to use dash attack while he was about 3-4 kirby's away from me.
3. Martha's Dair is easy and safe to stop it (with Lcancel) it work very well and is easy to do. Just short hop and dair.
4. Short hop fair is also INCREDIBLE safe and easy to do and this is one of martha's best moves that every martha player should know how to use and space.
5. Martha players all have to learn to space. Dash dancing is also very important and mainly take experience to use well. Just start using it more and you will eventually start using it effectively. If you want to progress to the next level (tournament level) with martha you have to be able to wavedash and dash dance.

 

[FreeGamer]

^ This. Martha is easily one of Kirby's hardest matchups if both people know what they're doing.

 

[chrisall76]

Dash dancing should be fine since it looks like (probably) it'll return in someway in Sm4sh.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZflqX7IuqU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_5D8mmjX98&app=desktop (At 7:48)

 

[Phan7om]

Dash dancing should be fine since it looks like (probably) it'll return in someway in Sm4sh.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZflqX7IuqU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_5D8mmjX98&app=desktop (At 7:48)

Ok two things.

1: This isnt the sm4sh thread. This isnt even the PM social thread. This is about Kirby's PM Dash Attack lol, your post is completely irrelevant.

2: That video doesnt even show Dash Dancing, they are short dash fox trots which could be done in Brawl easily. Brawl's "real" dash dance comes from doing 2 consecutive fox trots in a row while cancelling the 2nd one with a pivot dash to repeat the process. The only problem is to do a single "dash dance" you would need to input at least 5 dashes each with a chance to trip. With tripping gone that strat will be somewhat viable with the faster characters. The technique was dubbed the "flash step"

 

[chrisall76]

Ok two things.

1: This isnt the sm4sh thread. This isnt even the PM social thread. This is about Kirby's PM Dash Attack lol, your post is completely irrelevant.

2: That video doesnt even show Dash Dancing, they are short dash fox trots which could be done in Brawl easily. Brawl's "real" dash dance comes from doing 2 consecutive fox trots in a row while cancelling the 2nd one with a pivot dash to repeat the process. The only problem is to do a single "dash dance" you would need to input at least 5 dashes each with a chance to trip. With tripping gone that strat will be somewhat viable with the faster characters. The technique was dubbed the "flash step"

So I play with friends a lot and we're all getting much better at Project M, although we still don't play with Advanced Techniques and probably won't do it since we're kinda preparing and warming up for Smash4.

I didn't notice it was dubbed anything, but I was commenting on it due to this comment.
Also, the first video looks likes a dash dance to me, unlike the flash step which seems to take a run twice and that's it. Can't find the comment but in the first video the player commented (maybe on a different match with dash dancing, but the same player) something like "I used this match to test dash dancing."
I should have probably quoted the OP's post first though, sorry about that.

 

[Phan7om]

I didn't notice it was dubbed anything, but I was commenting on it due to this comment.
Also, the first video looks likes a dash dance to me, unlike the flash step which seems to take a run twice and that's it. Can't find the comment but in the first video the player commented (maybe on a different match with dash dancing, but the same player) something like "I used this match to test dash dancing."
I should have probably quoted the OP's post first though, sorry about that.

Ah okay, sorry about that.

 

[ZIO]

I play as Kirby and I find that the dash attack is not often a good choice.

You have to anticipate the attack. For example, if there's distance between you two, there's a strong possibility the Kirby is going to try and close that gap with said attack. Not always the case, but if the player spams it, it's terribly punishable.

 

[B00nes]

Well with 3.5 here now the best way to deal with Kirby's dash is to shield and then IMMEDIATELY grab as it hits you. There is a small frame window between each of the three hit boxes, and if you grab in that window, you can grab Kirby out of the animation. It makes them think twice about it.

 

[dg-pilz-e]

My friend plays against me all the time, He just spaces it out well and baits it. Dash dance and try to bait it then when you see him committing to it just trot away till the animation is over then punish. It can also be grabbed if you time it right so that in itself pretty much stops it.