How to beat an advanced Snake

[theUndead_feature]

This is going to be a work in progress, as soon as I figure out how to beat my friends Snake. He's **** near rediculous with him. Recently I've gotten close to beating him, but still no luck. I'm just going to add notes up and people can say yay or nay to what I'm thinking.

I figure that when it comes to Snake, you have to worry about three aspects. The first, are the advanced tactics that have been laid out across the net. It's gotten to the point to where everyone and their mother can do the Snake slide. To counter act this, we have two options that I can think of offensively, the first being a downsmash, the second being a PK Fire.

The Pro's to the downsmash:
A lot of knockback, considerable damage.
Con's of the downsmash:
It's slow, and Snakes slide is really fast.

Pro's of the PK Fire
Don't have to worry about Snakes transitional invincibilty frames.
Con's of the PK Fire
God forbid there be a god **** proximity mine between you and Snake, after you blow up the mine, Snake is able to slide right in, ensuing severe punishment via combos.

Taking advantage of the cypher. This is common knowledge, use your up-b over and over again, you probably wont get any luck knocking him out of the boundries, but you can always use the extra percentages when it comes down to the wire. When Snake starts getting close, use your PKT2 to cross to the other side of the stage. Watch out for falling C4, advanced Snakes love to try and catch their prey with it.

Another option may be to use your back-air to spike him off the cypher. Do not approach from above, as the cypher may hit you before you land the fatal blow.

Things to look at for cypher.
-Possible PSI Magnet pull attack.


I'll finish this guide tomorrow, if a mod or someone thinks its rubbish, or its already been looked at in-depth around here somewhere, PM me, and delete it. (PM because I don't want to spend an hour looking for something that isn't there.)

 

[Levitas]

If some solid advice comes out of this, I may want it in the matchup discussion.

Is it ok w/ you if I pick through and take what I feel like from this thread (I'll credit whoever contributes, of course)?

 

[theUndead_feature]

Oh yeah, of course. I've been having a helluva time trying to beat an ungodly Snake, I just posted some of what I've learned recently to shut Snake down. I'll finish this beast tomorrow when I'm not typing on the Wii's crappy browser.

 

[ChaosTheoryX]

some tactics I have used against the 2 snake mains in my crew. almost never approach snake. he can out range everything you can approach with by either using ftilt or utilt. so instead you should lure him to approaching you. the most effective way i do this is to jump halfway between him and you and do a retreating neutral/down air. neutral air beats his morter slide and, at certain areas, his dash attack. Also know that your jab clashes with snakes jab. thats really all i can think of off the top of my head. really just stay as far away from him as possible and punish him when he approches you.

 

[Levitas]

You can detonate thrown grenades w/ pk fire, but it's only situationally useful. Particularly if you can catch the grenade at the beginning of the throw when he shield-drops it, picks it up, and chucks it.

 

[theUndead_feature]

You can PSI magnet him off his cypher, useful with the Magnet Pull.

 

[ChaosTheoryX]

You can PSI magnet him off his cypher, useful with the Magnet Pull.

quite dangerous and can be easily missed or punished. I'd say forward air, back air, or pk thunder him while hes on his cypher

 

[Blackbelt]

Norfair. Snake cannot function on Norfair very well, meanwhile Lucas is a little *** kicker on Norfair.


And remember, he hates Nair, and our jab combo is faster than everything he has.

 

[Tyr_03]

^^^
I disagree. I use Snake as a secondary every once in a while and find Norfair to be a really easy stage to use grenades and C4 on. I find any stage with a non solid bottom to be great against Snake because if he tries to cypher from underneath the stage you can Bair spike him really easily. This tends to happen more often on Delfino and Brinstar because of the way the stage works. Brinstar is great for Lucas's aerial game which is where he can really hurt Snake whereas Snake will always destroy you when it comes to ground combat. And yeah avoid approaching Snake. He can Utilt your full hop Dair and well pretty much anything else you use. Don't try to Dair on him to avoid juggling either, just go for an airdodge or better yet find a ledge to fast fall to. Repeated Uairs can be used to juggle Snake effectively. PK Fire, Dash attack and Dsmash can be used when he's trying to land (since Snakes almost always try to land by airdodging.) Properly timed and spaced Usmashes can work for this too but missing really sucks. I almost always go for a Bair spike over using PKT1 to edgeguard.

 

[HiddenBowser]

You beat a good snake by switching toons.

 

[SaltyKracka]

You can't. A good Snake will outcamp you, outmaneuver you, outdamage you, outrange you, and outspeed you everywhere but in the air. Your only hope is to get him into the air and then juggle him and hope to God you can gimp him.

So yeah.

 

[Muh]

Responding to the Snakedash all depends on how much time you have.

If you have lots of time:
-downsmash
-pk fire

If you have some time:
-retreating pk fire

If you have little time:
-grab(yes, you can grab Snake out of a snakedash)

If you have even less time:
-sidestep

If you have no time:
-death

 

[Blackbelt]

You can't. A good Snake will outcamp you, outmaneuver you, outdamage you, outrange you, and outspeed you everywhere but in the air. Your only hope is to get him into the air and then juggle him and hope to God you can gimp him.

So yeah.

That is honestly the best advice.


A Snake, deadly on the ground, but near powerless in the air.


And remember, your Nair is the aerial of choice when racking up damage.

 

[theUndead_feature]

I didn't think of nair. I'll try that tomorrow. What's the best way to finish him you think? Psi Mag? We usually play on Final destination...a spike really wont help matters much, just put him back on the ground, and the usmash takes too long. I b-stick so the Psi-Mag is nice and quick. If that doesnt do it, PKT stage smash or push him out of the boundaries.

Yay or Nay?

 

[ChaosTheoryX]

i wouldnt rely on psi magnet as a ko at all against snake as it leaves lucas extremely vulnerable....while snakes air game is worse than his ground game...it is by no means powerless. in order to ko a snake. get him off the edge to force him to use cypher then jump out and kick the **** out of him with forward air. and of course forward smash is one of your best ko options (dsash if the snake is in love with spot dodges)

 

[Steeler]

as soon as i read the title, i was like, "yup, chaos is in here teaching all of the little boys the secrets he's learned by fighting karma". lol

 

[Lizard]

psi magnet is a good edge guard for snake, just have to be careful you don't get hit by the cypher. in a very situational sense however, if snake is recovering on final D from below, a Fair stage spike works wonders!

 

[Trozz]

If he is ever close, jab like your life depends on it. The jab comes out faster than his attacks.

D-tilt, trip, in to f-smash might be viable if Snake uses the jab a lot (I think you can duck the jab while crouching/d-tilting).

If Snake fires a mortar up, watch out that you don't get yourself combo'd in to it.

I use PK Fire more than anything. Try to keep the spacing sweetspot (so you can avoid his attacks while in range of fire). Use PK Fire in the air (grounded PK Fires are way too static and don't help your spacing game).

Beware the u-tilt. It's broken.