How do you deal with the campers?

[Lupo539]

Hey everyone, I have a question. I play a lot of ness and I would say I'm pretty average at the game. My for glory record says otherwise because a lot of my losses are due to people online playing heavy projectile characters. Most of the time they camp one side of the level and just endlessly spam their projectiles at me. Lately it has been a lot of link, toon link, megaman, and samus.

Long story short, How do you guys handle those kind of matches? Every time I play one of them I wanna just throw my controller through the wall because I don't really have an idea of how to counter that with Ness. I feel like dealing with the projectiles is my biggest weakness when playing online only because I really don't know how to attack the situation without getting angry for losing to someone who just does nothing but spam missiles, boomerangs, etc.

 

[Reila]

I play Villager and Pikmin & Olimar. You have to be good at camping to outcamp me!

Seriously though, you have to find their weakness/a way to deal with them with your character of choice. If I am playing Pikmin & Olimar and the opponent is camping, I will just let the Pikmin eat them alive until they decide to fight me directly (and then they will die with one uncharged smash attack, because their % will likely be really high by that point). If I am playing Villager, I can fight their projectile with Lloid Rocket and Pocket, then I will throw them offstage and gimp them, because most campers are so used to winning through camping and rolling, that they are terrible at every other aspect of the game.

I can't give specifics tips for Ness though, because I don't play him that often. In short, you will have to adapt when facing campers.

 

[Lupo539]

Yea that makes sense. Everyone plays their characters differently and I just need to play passively and just find a weak point in their game. As for the campers I really just need to find the right time to switch to aggressive and get them off their game.

 

[krosswerks]

You can camp back and force your opponent to approach, Link kind of gets around this with his arrows but most projectiles don't travel the entire stage. If you get good with PK Thunder you can really mess with your opponent at range, especially if they insist on just sitting in one spot. A Ness that I play with frequently uses PK Thunder on stage, and one of the nice things about it is that if you have a feeling your PK will miss the opponent, you can turn it around and use it to launch yourself into them.

 

[MacSmitty]

Depends on the character. If I'm playing someone like Spamus, I just walk up and perfect shield.

 

[Lupo539]

You can camp back and force your opponent to approach, Link kind of gets around this with his arrows but most projectiles don't travel the entire stage. If you get good with PK Thunder you can really mess with your opponent at range, especially if they insist on just sitting in one spot. A Ness that I play with frequently uses PK Thunder on stage, and one of the nice things about it is that if you have a feeling your PK will miss the opponent, you can turn it around and use it to launch yourself into them.

Yea I honestly have not tried to use my PKT on stage only because I know ill just end up missing or hitting myself the wrong way with it. I still need to practice that a lot more. I have been doing my recoveries a lot and working on the PKT bounces and slides but I never really thought of using it while on stage. I mean I try to hit my opponents while they are in the air with my PKT but I never really tried while we are both on stage.

 

[Lupo539]

Depends on the character. If I'm playing someone like Spamus, I just walk up and perfect shield.

I have tried to do the whole charge at them and shield at the same time but with samus and link I always misread the length of their grabs and they get me every time with it lol

 

[KirbCider]

I don't main Ness, so I'm not sure if I could help you there; however these are the ways I typically deal with Campers myself:

• If I'm not already, I'll switch to one of my Long-Distance Mains (ROB, Pac-Man, or Villager. Sometimes Zelda) and attempt to play them at their own game. I'm typically best with ROB as he's one of my best Mains aside from King Dedede, plus that Gyro really helps if you know how to use it correctly. It can cancel most projectiles and can be used for fun Mind Games.
  
  
• If I'm not one of my Long Distance Mains, such as King Dedede I'll attempt to bait them/mess with them enough until they decide to come to me. I'll jump over/shield projectiles or just sit there in my little corner. Sometimes I'll taunt or use his down pose in hopes of making them mad enough to approach. Either way, I don't mind it becoming Sudden Death. I'd probably look like an idiot if I lose Sudden Death, but hey at least I had fun toying with them. Simply annoy them enough to lure them to you.
  
  
• Sometimes if you ever get lucky enough to take a Stock off of them while still having both of yours in tact, just run. I know it can be considered "Cheap" but it forces them to approach, and normally most campers really suck at approaching because they've gotten so used to camping and spamming projectiles and the like. Sometimes they won't even approach you despite this fact. They'll keep camping even though you would win by default for having the most stocks. Seriously, it's funny really.

I don't know if you main just Ness, but you may want to try to have at least one Long Distance character for people like this.

Sometimes though it usually involves finding some sort of pattern. I've won against some really great campers as King Dedede simply because I noticed the little things they do that leave them open. It was a lot harder and more annoying, but I managed either way. Camper/Passive players can be annoying, but once you take notice to their little method it falls apart quite easily at times.

I still like to play them at their own game though, simply because a lot of them can't handle it themselves.

 

[Lupo539]

I don't main Ness, so I'm not sure if I could help you there; however these are the ways I typically deal with Campers myself:

• If I'm not already, I'll switch to one of my Long-Distance Mains (ROB, Pac-Man, or Villager. Sometimes Zelda) and attempt to play them at their own game. I'm typically best with ROB as he's one of my best Mains aside from King Dedede, plus that Gyro really helps if you know how to use it correctly. It can cancel most projectiles and can be used for fun Mind Games.
  
  
• If I'm not one of my Long Distance Mains, such as King Dedede I'll attempt to bait them/mess with them enough until they decide to come to me. I'll jump over/shield projectiles or just sit there in my little corner. Sometimes I'll taunt or use his down pose in hopes of making them mad enough to approach. Either way, I don't mind it becoming Sudden Death. I'd probably look like an idiot if I lose Sudden Death, but hey at least I had fun toying with them. Simply annoy them enough to lure them to you.
  
  
• Sometimes if you ever get lucky enough to take a Stock off of them while still having both of yours in tact, just run. I know it can be considered "Cheap" but it forces them to approach, and normally most campers really suck at approaching because they've gotten so used to camping and spamming projectiles and the like. Sometimes they won't even approach you despite this fact. They'll keep camping even though you would win by default for having the most stocks. Seriously, it's funny really.

I don't know if you main just Ness, but you may want to try to have at least one Long Distance character for people like this.

Sometimes though it usually involves finding some sort of pattern. I've won against some really great campers as King Dedede simply because I noticed the little things they do that leave them open. It was a lot harder and more annoying, but I managed either way. Camper/Passive players can be annoying, but once you take notice to their little method it falls apart quite easily at times.

I still like to play them at their own game though, simply because a lot of them can't handle it themselves.

Ok I completely understand where your coming from. Unfortunately I haven't really tried to play any long range characters. I main ness, my secondary would be Pikachu since I have played him from smash64 til mid project M then I basically swapped with ness from secondary to primary. But I have not used or tried to use any long range characters.

 

[Rinku リンク]

Look for patterns in their projectile spam and adapt to it. Find openings to weave and dodge yourself in.

I'll tell you now that most "campers" online don't know what do once you close in on them. Usually campers will roll away or retaliate with an attack once you get within range. Take notes and punish them accordingly to how they handle every situation.

 

[ArcanaXIII]

I can't really help with Ness since I don't really play him, but to deal with campers in general, you definitely wanna be in their face and start figuring out their habits once you are up close because they LOVE the keep away game. Regarding habits, do they like to roll? Do they like to shield? Do they like to air dodge when in the air? Do they just throw out attacks hoping to get you off? It's really important to pick up on habits once you get in on them so you can keep exploiting it to make up for the damage you took trying to get up close and because getting up close is probably the only time you can do significant damage to campy players with a better projectile game than you.

As for getting past the projectiles, definitely look for patterns and find an opening to get in, just remember not to get impatient and rush the process because you'll just end up taking unnecessary damage, especially if your opponent has a way to keep you out after getting past the projectiles. It'd also help to start perfect shielding projectiles while walking up if you can, but since it's online, it's pretty understandable if you can't do it consistently.

 

[Lupo539]

I can't really help with Ness since I don't really play him, but to deal with campers in general, you definitely wanna be in their face and start figuring out their habits once you are up close because they LOVE the keep away game. Regarding habits, do they like to roll? Do they like to shield? Do they like to air dodge when in the air? Do they just throw out attacks hoping to get you off? It's really important to pick up on habits once you get in on them so you can keep exploiting it to make up for the damage you took trying to get up close and because getting up close is probably the only time you can do significant damage to campy players with a better projectile game than you.

As for getting past the projectiles, definitely look for patterns and find an opening to get in, just remember not to get impatient and rush the process because you'll just end up taking unnecessary damage, especially if your opponent has a way to keep you out after getting past the projectiles. It'd also help to start perfect shielding projectiles while walking up if you can, but since it's online, it's pretty understandable if you can't do it consistently.

ok so I pretty much need to play passive and not rush in. Try to read and understand how they play, more so read if they dodge a lot or shield a lot and then just react on how they play. I'm usually the more aggressive role when it comes to things like this but I guess I need to learn to let them come to me or even more so try and figure them out before they figure me out.

 

[SteadyDisciple]

Also, never forget that Ness's F-smash is also an epic reflector. It hits projectiles back faster, and with more knockback (not sure about damage). It isn't so helpful against Link or other characters with a fast, hard to read projectile, but against characters with slower projectiles and especially charged projectiles (Samus's Charge Shot or Megaman's F-smash) this can kill enemies ridiculously early, and is much easier if the person is spamming projectiles because it's easy to predict.

 

[Lupo539]

Also, never forget that Ness's F-smash is also an epic reflector. It hits projectiles back faster, and with more knockback (not sure about damage). It isn't so helpful against Link or other characters with a fast, hard to read projectile, but against characters with slower projectiles and especially charged projectiles (Samus's Charge Shot or Megaman's F-smash) this can kill enemies ridiculously early, and is much easier if the person is spamming projectiles because it's easy to predict.

woah really? i had no idea. dam i need to try that more often then. i knew he had his down b absorb shield but i didnt know the bat reflected it back

 

[SteadyDisciple]

woah really? i had no idea. dam i need to try that more often then. i knew he had his down b absorb shield but i didnt know the bat reflected it back

Yup. Also, unlike the absorber, the bat works for all projectiles, not just energy ones. Just remember that you can only use it on the ground and it comes out slower.

 

[Lupo539]

Yup. Also, unlike the absorber, the bat works for all projectiles, not just energy ones. Just remember that you can only use it on the ground and it comes out slower.

oh wow awesome. So I can use it for all samus energy projectiles too? That's pretty sweet. I definitely need to practice that more.

 

[VPTurnip]

Yeah, just don't stand too far away if you're trying to reflect Villager's tree. Hahaha.
Also I'm a little surprised you didn't know that considering you've played Ness in so many games.. most of the Ness's on FG seem to know it (sometimes too well! I gotta time right! Sigh, lol.)
But I guess it IS a little obscure, being an F-smash and all.

The way I deal with campy players is to either out-space them, dodge/jump/roll and get close or both.
Falco and Fox are easy to out-space compared to characters like Link, Duck Hunt, Villager and Yoshi.
Another thing that's nice is that if they're the spammy campers, then they usually don't dodge well, so it's even easier to out space them, like with a nicely thrown bomb from Link, or a slingshot bait into a turnip dair as Villager. etc.
I also find ditto Link spacing wars more difficult than my Link vs a Toon Link, for some reason.

Also Arcana's post covers it really well.

 

[Metal Fish]

If your opponent is camping you, it's on you to find an opening and snowball as much advantage off the opening as possible. For that you need stage control and adequate positioning. You want to have control of center stage and push them toward the edges. Try to position yourself far enough away from the opponent you can defend their attacks, but close enough to punish them when they make a mistake. Don't get greedy; pay attention and wait for the opportunities to come to you. It takes a lot of experience to find the appropriate spacing and learn what moves you can and can't punish. Practice, practice, practice.

 

[Frizz]

I usually blast them with a cast of Thoron, which pretty much eats through any other projectile. I know it takes quite a while to charge, but it should provide me with a good enough opportunity to exploit their openings.

 

[Lupo539]

Yeah, just don't stand too far away if you're trying to reflect Villager's tree. Hahaha.
Also I'm a little surprised you didn't know that considering you've played Ness in so many games.. most of the Ness's on FG seem to know it (sometimes too well! I gotta time right! Sigh, lol.)
But I guess it IS a little obscure, being an F-smash and all.

The way I deal with campy players is to either out-space them, dodge/jump/roll and get close or both.
Falco and Fox are easy to out-space compared to characters like Link, Duck Hunt, Villager and Yoshi.
Another thing that's nice is that if they're the spammy campers, then they usually don't dodge well, so it's even easier to out space them, like with a nicely thrown bomb from Link, or a slingshot bait into a turnip dair as Villager. etc.
I also find ditto Link spacing wars more difficult than my Link vs a Toon Link, for some reason.

Also Arcana's post covers it really well.

yea I mean I have played a lot of ness but in really not that amazing at everything just yet. I really didn't know that his bat can reflect projectiles lol I know it sounds dumb but its like common sense. He swings a bat, like a baseball and just hits it back to them. idk how I didn't know that. But as for spacing goes I just need to learn the range of ness's moves and more so learn the character matchup. I feel like if I get my shorthops right and just maneuver my way in using fairs and old pk fires I should be ok. Its just a matter of practicing a lot and putting the time and effort in

 

[Cseymour117]

Hey everyone, I have a question. I play a lot of ness and I would say I'm pretty average at the game. My for glory record says otherwise because a lot of my losses are due to people online playing heavy projectile characters. Most of the time they camp one side of the level and just endlessly spam their projectiles at me. Lately it has been a lot of link, toon link, megaman, and samus.

Long story short, How do you guys handle those kind of matches? Every time I play one of them I wanna just throw my controller through the wall because I don't really have an idea of how to counter that with Ness. I feel like dealing with the projectiles is my biggest weakness when playing online only because I really don't know how to attack the situation without getting angry for losing to someone who just does nothing but spam missiles, boomerangs, etc.

To deal with anyone on Ness from what I've noticed you need to just use pk fire anytime you can grab them in the fire toss them and forward A spam off the edge. Just like how you feel the range from the projectiles is annoying, when you tilt spam there is no counter play. smash to me seems like you find the easiest mechanic to abuse and you abuse it as much as possible to win.

 

[DragonBlade64]

I normally play Shulk and a few other characters. When I'm up against a camper, I've found that Shulk's speed and jump art work pretty well for me in attempting to dodge their attacks and get in close. I think the same could be said for the majority of speedy characters. You basically want to get in their space and see how they react. Once you know what they do, it'll become a lot easier to punish them.

Other than that, I find it effective to simply beat them at their own game. In fact, campers are part of the reason I decided to pick up Fox. Reflectors work wonders against them.

So, yeah. Others have already stated some pretty good tips for dealing with these types of players, such as perfect shielding your opponent's attacks. And with a reflector on the bat and the PSI-Magnet, I think Ness has a pretty good arsenal of tools to deal with those kind of players. It just requires a bit more patience.

 

[Conn1496]

Swap to Ganondorf.

Nah, I kid. I don't really have a strategy against spammers. I just try to up my game or hop between characters a little to see what works (So... Yeah, sometimes Ganon.). I'm so used to most spam though that I tend to just powershield or dodge most things that get spammed at me. I think the strategies are to varied from match-up to match-up, but you just generally want to keep out of the spam zones and try and scare them into making basic mistakes, like rolling when you're completely expecting it, or firing a projectile without checking their defences.

One of my better tactics is to generally just make my movements hard to read. Backing up is a surprisingly better option than you'd imagine. -obviously you'll still have to keep advancing, but there's no rush to do so. Infact, the reason most spam works so well is because it forces you to take action and make mistakes doing so, so even if you get close, watch your opponents reaction before you close in for real. I don't know Ness very well, but I know his air control is pretty good for a character with such a floaty second jump. Make the most of it and make sure your hits are going to knock them back without doubt.

 

[HIMA14]

I don't know how to play Ness but as a Rockman main I will help you How to deal with Rockmen.

First you have great advantages against Rockmen because Ness can absorb/Reflect most of Rockman's weapons,most of us will play a mid range style,If you see a Rockman spamming lemons while jumping just to get away of you you can use Psi Magnet to recover a bit or when they are charging Rock Buster(Side Smash),you can reflect it (Ground) or absorb it (Air),try to make Air attacks under Rocman,it's very easy for Ness to airdodge Rockman's Uair and Dair.

If you see a Rockman using Leaf Shield watch out because if you get near the leaf's they will hit you flinching you and you will be open for a grab.

You can only absorb Lemons,Rock Buster(Side Smash) and Crash Bomber explosion(Side B)

PD:Don't make the mistake every Ness's or Lucas's make while fighting Rockman,don't you ever reflect Lemons,Leaf Shield o Metal Blade,trust me you will get punished really BAD!!!