How can I beat a Zelda spamming >b?

[Kninja]

But here's the catch... in a 4p match...
Zelda hides by an edge spamming Din's fire. If anyone gets too close she teleports away.

If I try to approach quickly then I get Cstick punished or occasionally grabbed, if I try to approach carefully then another player gets me. If I switch to someone who can absorb it (G&W, Ness ect) they switch to a different character -.-.

Also, sometimes there's TWO OF THEM!

 

[superyoshi888]

The only thing I can tell you is not to play Wi-Fi if you come across one. If they play like that, then it kinda takes the fun outta Wi-fi.

Maybe use DeDeDe. His Waddle Dees should be able to do the trick.

 

[BurningCrusader777]

Teleport is really punishable on cooldown provided that you guess where she goes. Bait her into using teleport, guess her direction, and hit her before she can get out again. IIRC, Zelda's teleport isn't invincible except when she's invisible, so if she tries to teleport twice and you're close to her, it leaves you with a huge window of opportunity to punish.

 

[DemonFart]

I saw the title and was thinking you meant singles so I clicked it to see the flames. Wifi is uber lame when you have characters like Zelda doing stuff that won't work offline. Wolf and Ike also come into mind.

I don't really play with 4 people so I won't be much help but this sounds like basic brawl.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Just predict Farore's wind, as you already mentioned it's not that hard. Just shield, airdodge, or roll dodge the din's fire. It can be a pain at first but, overtime, it becomes a fairly easy tactic to get around especially if you use someone with a decent amount of range or projectiles. Also, don't play Anyone battles; they're a waste of time. May I suggest checking out the online tournament board instead? Wifi is a lot more fun if you play against people who actually know what they're doing and don't revert to doing the same thing over and over again even if it does work for them.

 

[TheSMASHtyke]

I would recommend R.O.B. for the potency of the laser in that situation. You can hit them with it before they strike you with din's fire. Just wait for them to use the attack and then wap 'em. The best part is, it will go through everyone else in the match in the process!

 

[Ochobobo]

Teleport is really punishable on cooldown provided that you guess where she goes. Bait her into using teleport, guess her direction, and hit her before she can get out again. IIRC, Zelda's teleport isn't invincible except when she's invisible, so if she tries to teleport twice and you're close to her, it leaves you with a huge window of opportunity to punish.

Not only in the cooldown, but also in the starting frames. If you do bait it then you should be able to punish it before she can even complete the teleport.

 

[uhmuzing]

You counter by spamming Fox's lazors...

 

[MrEh]

It's Zelda dude. She sucks.

 

[Insetick]

I'm not going to tell you to stop playing Vs. Anyone- if you like it, then go on.
I will say that you answered your own question- pick up an absorber character! They are great counters for a >B spammer, and if they switch, then your problem is gone!

However, if you're looking more for general matchup tips, put a lot of pressure on zelda. Chase her and keep her in the air.

 

[demonictoonlink]

wow...no one flamed him...Great show of maturity ^^
Regardless, this is one of the kinds of threads that should go in general discussion. I would recommend to GD of your characters forum

 

[orange/xd]

Pick Falco and BBBBBBBBBBBBB

 

[Martel Hammer]

SHAD, No items, Fox only. Final destination.
In all seriousness, short hop air dodges are your friend. Try to dodge those fires and bait the Zelda into doing something stupid so you can punish. Or, projectile spam them too.

 

[Crow!]

If it's a real free for all and the Zelda's not getting support, she should be hit hard every time she teleports. The lag is long, and with 3 enemies on the board there should be someone near her teleportation destination.

It's a bit harder if we're talking about wifi (spot dodging up-b's emerging hitbox is harder to time, for example), but it's still doable if each of the players is of a decent skill level and none of them are going to pass on a free hit on the Zelda.

If the Zelda's got an effective teammate, follow suit by convincing the last remaining player to effectively team with you, too. 2v1v1's going to be in the 2's favor, obviously, but side-B isn't good enough to dominate 2v2. For example, you could have one person rush the Zelda while the other covers the teleportation.

If both the other players refuse to attack the Zelda, you've basically got a 3v1 and you're kinda done for anyway. Go in defensive mode and hope the other players decide you're not enough of a threat to attack, and defend against the fireballs as they come. If the fireballs are directed at you, they incidentally protect you from the other two players' approaches because of the huge blast!

 

[Mocha]

The closer you are to her when she's using Din's, the better chance you'll have at punishing her. Most Zelda players won't use Din's when you get too close, though some might do a short Din's and catch you off guard. What I suggest is to slowly start approaching her, shielding when Din's hits. Din's is good, but it does have a drawback. It leaves Zelda vulnerable for a brief moment while she's charging it. If you can get close enough to her while she's charging, then that's definitely a start.

If you're using a character like Ness or Lucas you can always just sit there with your absorber and force her to approach.

 

[-Ran]

Spot dodge / Shield the moment you see her hand swipe forwards into a fist. I posted this... a loooong time ago. =v [05-01-2008]

The most annoying thing about fighting Zelda is her incredible spacing tool of the ->B. The timing is often hard for someone to anticipate if you go off of the incoming Din's Fire. This causes perhaps the first few hits to be blocked, but eventually a failure occurs within the first five attacks which is viewed as a successful spacer for Zelda. Most importantly, most Marth players remove their eyes from Zelda in order to avoid the incoming Fire Ball of d00m. They'll jump and charge frantically...

In actuality, the timing for the move is irrelevant. You don't even have to take your eyes off of Zelda. In order to turn the move into a lethal force, Zelda -must- activate an animation which involves her hands from her back, to snapping forwards. This snapping motion is the instant that the attack has become a damaging force, and the moment that it needs to be dodged. If you're standing, this means simply doing a Down+Shield to avoid all chip damage vs your shield.

All you simply need to do is watch her hands, and they'll tell you exactly when to do your side step or air dodge. No more second guessing or mind games with Zelda. After you perfectly dodge around five, a Zelda player will -give- up the strategy of spamming. Once a strategy has been ruled ineffective, anyone with common sense will give up. Sure, they can use it as a spacing tool, but it won't advance their battle plan.

Once the 'tell' has been mastered, you can go onto the offensive. =D

 

[Ochobobo]

Aaand Zelda's mindgames just got even worse against some people, lol

 

[Beta Knight]

You could just pick Pit and arrow spam her till she stops.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

I'd kill my self.

 

[Kewkky]

Like they said: Fox, Falco, Pit, ROB... And add in Snake, his grenades camp Zelda way better than she can camp you. Just walk towards her while throwing grenades, and attack anyone who comes close with tilts... Until you're right next to Zelda, then you can tilt her.


Or learn how to mortar slide, then throw a grenade or two and mortar slide over to her.

 

[Sukai]

Pick Falco and spam short hop lasers while gradually getting close to her, she'll start to use Naryu's love, then you can spike her and try for a forward smash, repeat, or pick Ike and start forward smashing around the place.


--That is if you're doing this on wifail.

 

[smashkng]

Din Fire is predictable, it's easy to dodge it

 

[Kewkky]

Din Fire is predictable, it's easy to dodge it

... And that's how we contribute to the thread. We could really learn a lot from this guy.

 

[hichez50]

Well on wifi I would run to about mid-rand and see the zelda's reaction. If shee runs/rolls back the player knows that the spamming is working and is just having fun and laughing his/her mouth off. In that case try shield grabing.

 

[Mocha]

Pick Falco and spam short hop lasers while gradually getting close to her, she'll start to use Naryu's love, then you can spike her and try for a forward smash, repeat, or pick Ike and start forward smashing around the place.


--That is if you're doing this on wifail.

Come to think of it...

When it gets laggy on wifi (and by laggy I mean laggier than usual), Zelda is going to have a hard time aiming those Din's. That's why I don't see many Ness and Lucas players on wifi, because the lag probably fluffs up their recovery so much. When I do see a Lucas though, it's usually lots of smash spamming xD

But anyway back to Din's. Yeah, lag can really mess Zelda's side B up. Something you might also be interested to know is that she free falls after usng it, so if she's using it in air and somehow gets knocked off the level (Link's boomerang is a good example. Heck, even Squirtle's water gun) then Zelda is in for some trouble.

 

[cheesdog]

All three star fox characters can completely ignore Zelda's >B. Just reflect before they blow up and they don't do damage. Fox and Falco can also pursue quickly with their own >B, and Falco can stay out of range of her tilts by throwing the reflector out.

Ness and Lucas can both absorb those blasts to regain health.

Pit can spam arrows.

Use someone with a counter and just keep countering whenever it hits. Wont work great against two.

Team up and kill them first. That is the usual strategy my friends and I use when someone is spamming.

For WiFi I have nothing to offer. I absolutely hate the lagginess and I have given up on it. Hal should have talked to the mario kart guys to see how its done...

 

[superyoshi888]

Wi-fi isn't laggy until someone with bad internet joins. I have had quite a few lag free matches cept for the occasional pause. The only thing wrong with Wi-Fi is that your timing is thrown slightly off, but that is just the nature of online matches.

 

[LuVr]

game and watch's bucket can catch them with their deceptive range, then just tempt her into an up + b and punish by throwing the bucket... a spamming zelda will fill the bucket quickly

 

[cheesdog]

O the bucket! Yes! Best suggestion so far. And I think it may be a 1 hit kill....

 

[Cap'n Lucario]

If she teleports,Don't attack but instead turn and use your strongest,reaching move. (ie lucario F-smash,Sheild Breaker).

 

[Cap'n Lucario]

You will want to trick her by getting attack range then feinting, then act accoringly

 

[Apollo$]

Depends on who you play as or just spot dodge and get within attack distance and wait and see what she does. I don't really have a problem with that anymore but getting close to Zelda is really dangerous so it's a double edged sword.

 

[Helkulkhamen]

Spot dodge / Shield the moment you see her hand swipe forwards into a fist. I posted this... a loooong time ago. =v [05-01-2008]

Just wondering, what sort of time frame do you have to do this in? Maybe I'm just really slow, but it seems that the hand motion and explosion are near instantaneous. I don't have a truly accurate way of measuring my reaction time, but using stopwatches I have a crude estimate of about 0.2 seconds at best, which is about 7~9 frames. Anyone have solid frame data on the time between her hand first starts moving to detonation?

 

[Kewkky]

I don't have a truly accurate way of measuring my reaction time, but using stopwatches I have a crude estimate of about 0.2 seconds at best, which is about 7~9 frames.

0.2 seconds is 12 frames, the average human can react to things in .210 seconds, meaning close to 12 frames. And there are people who can react to things in lower than .2 seconds, meaning they can react to her hand swipe... weeeee i trolled someone

 

[Heartz♥]

But here's the catch... in a 4p match...
Zelda hides by an edge spamming Din's fire. If anyone gets too close she teleports away.

If I try to approach quickly then I get Cstick punished or occasionally grabbed, if I try to approach carefully then another player gets me. If I switch to someone who can absorb it (G&W, Ness ect) they switch to a different character -.-.

Also, sometimes there's TWO OF THEM!

I love free-for-alls more than 1v1s. That's me. I'm not competitive at all, yet I like to win, because winning means I am doing something right, and I like to do much more gooder in video games. Needless to say, of course.

4-player matches are completely random no matter who is being used. Zelda has an attack radius that makes her very good in free-for-alls. But she is also in much greater danger, considering her light frame. I get smacked around a LOT with her, but her prowess makes up for it.

You just need to learn how to defeat her one on one first.

 

[Volts]

Well you could try being Marth and just counter it, or be Rob, you will figure it out.

 

[cheesdog]

Something else you might try. If you face this a lot you will get used to the timing of the blasts. When you are within one blast of closing on zelda run up and jump/dodge the last blast. Depending on the character, it will carry you to zeld, or dang close, in the air.

There is also a split second when she is telleporting that she is vulnerable to anything. Cancel the telleportation with a quick attack, and then follow up with whatever you got.

Who do you normally play with? Might help with the advice...

 

[BSP]

if it's a non-walk off stage, pick mario or squirtle, charge their water moves(down-b and neutral-b respectively), predict the fire, and push them off the edge. Since they'll be in helpless, edgehog or cape 'em. Or pick falco, fox, pit, snake, or gnw, but the water deaths are fun to pull off.

 

[adumbrodeus]

The only thing I can tell you is not to play Wi-Fi if you come across one. If they play like that, then it kinda takes the fun outta Wi-fi.

Maybe use DeDeDe. His Waddle Dees should be able to do the trick.

...

No, Waddle Dees are useless against Dins. It goes right through them, Waddle Dees are actually one of the few projectiles Zelda can outcamp.

Teleport is really punishable on cooldown provided that you guess where she goes. Bait her into using teleport, guess her direction, and hit her before she can get out again. IIRC, Zelda's teleport isn't invincible except when she's invisible, so if she tries to teleport twice and you're close to her, it leaves you with a huge window of opportunity to punish.

Not even Rest is punishable on Wifi...

Wi-fi isn't laggy until someone with bad internet joins. I have had quite a few lag free matches cept for the occasional pause. The only thing wrong with Wi-Fi is that your timing is thrown slightly off, but that is just the nature of online matches.

even on Green you're getting at least 3 frames of latency, that means tons of moves suddenly become impossible to dodge on reaction or punish.

0.2 seconds is 12 frames, the average human can react to things in .210 seconds, meaning close to 12 frames. And there are people who can react to things in lower than .2 seconds, meaning they can react to her hand swipe... weeeee i trolled someone

The average smasher seems to do slightly better however, the last time people took the reaction tests and posted results, it tended to however around 10 frames.

Which makes sense, continuous training tends to improve reaction, and games like this are based on twich reflex.

 

[Elder Sister]

dins are actually easily to deal with, might not be true for 4-player matches
youll find your way
sry that im no help XD