Gimping with DK

[Tujex]

Okay so my ground game is pretty good with DK, but thanks to these new dodge roll mechanics, and imo...how difficult it is to get a solid ko in this game compared to it's predecessors, the need to gimp has increased drastically.

My problem comes in the form of characters like Lucina, Shulk, Lucario, etc who can fall to magnifying levels towards the bottom blast zone and recover thanks to great vertical reach on their Upb.

With the new ledge mechanics, DK's horrible vertical recovery, and a few other factors...I find it almost impossible to gimp most people I play. So, tips for dealing with recovering opponents with dk anyone?

 

[Yong Dekonk]

In my mind there are basically five tools at your disposal for off stage control. I have not had good luck with them at low percents though.

1. Dair- a short hop off the stage followed by the dair can work on rare occasions.

2. Fair- the obvious disadvantage with this move is it's slowness. Good opponents will read it all day.

3. Bair- Run off stage and do an immediate bair. I haven't been able to pull this one off yet but I watched DKWill do it in a tournament.

4. Aerial down b- I feel this one isn't as useful as it should be. Often the second slap doesn't land for me but I've had some luck jumping off stage or short hopping at the edge of the stage and using this move.

5. Up B- this is currently an underused DK tool IMO. Try running or jumping way off stage (just don't allow yourself to drop too low) and using this move to hit your opponent way before they're expecting offstage pressure. It has tremendous horizontal recovery so use it to its full potential!

I'm sure others will have some great input but hopefully this helps a little.

 

[RomanceDawn]

Aerial downB can be useful but you have to be very careful. This can only be used far out and not under the stage. Catching Lucario, Fox, Falco and few others right at the start up of their recoveries can be very satisfying. With the spacies it works well against a charging Fox Fire and the illusion though with Falco it's much more risky since he'll spike you. The benefit compared to Fair is that it doesn't have such an obvious start up animation and it's pretty unexpected. I was in a tournament 2 weeks ago against a Shulk who got spiked by it. His only words were "that spikes?!"

When Diddy is right below the edge, rushing off the stage with a back air can be very useful trying to get him off of his jets. It will give him another chance I believe but sometimes it's not enough for him to make it back.

Also dropping from the ledge while hanging and immediately doing upB can disrupt people under you as well.

 

[Brickbox]

Air down-b wont work in the situations the OP is describing. Although I am starting to see uses for it now and then.

If you are going to go really deep with dk I recommend run off nair, or backwards falling nair(this way it can set you up for double jump back air). It has a ton of active frames while still allowing for a good recovery.

Also instead of just trying to gimp those characters try to incorporate ledge trumping into drop down double jump back air.
Character that have a good vertical recovery are almost always going to be snapping to the ledge, this leaves the perfect chance for ledge trumping.

Also don't count on gimping a good lucario, his recovery is beyond amazing in this game.

 

[Jay-kun]

Air down-b wont work in the situations the OP is describing. Although I am starting to see uses for it now and then.

If you are going to go really deep with dk I recommend run off nair, or backwards falling nair(this way it can set you up for double jump back air). It has a ton of active frames while still allowing for a good recovery.

Also instead of just trying to gimp those characters try to incorporate ledge trumping into drop down double jump back air.
Character that have a good vertical recovery are almost always going to be snapping to the ledge, this leaves the perfect chance for ledge trumping.

Also don't count on gimping a good lucario, his recovery is beyond amazing in this game.

Eh? What is this? You claim Lucario's recovery is overpowered especially in a matchup against DK? I think not.

 

[Brickbox]

Eh? What is this? You claim Lucario's recovery is overpowered especially in a matchup against DK? I think not.

I am saying his recovery is extremely hard to gimp if the lucario is experienced. As long as the lucario is able to use his up b anywhere he should be making it back. I call that a good recovery.

 

[Metalbro]

Yeah Lucario's recovery is really good. Not sure if you can throw out a bair or nair to intercept it though.

 

[Tujex]

After some research, I'm thinking Luc's UpB can't be punished until it's finished. It's too fast to properly punish...and had invincibility on it

 

[SilverBacKong]

Dont understimate the speed at which Dair comes out.

If you hold, bluff a grounded edge guard or bait smtg from him, short hop Dair comes out in half a second.

Just make sure you rele jump at last second.

Dk actually has (IMO) an amazing edge game, cos he has so many spikes with different timing :

Dair, Fair, side B and down B all spike, and none comes out at the same speed.

There is good bluff and mind game in that

 

[TastyCarcass]

Just keep going for bairs. They're easy to land, huge knockback and they come out fast with quick recovery, meaning you can spam them faster than your opponent can air dodge.
If they get too close to the ledge, get them with an up b for a gimp or stagespike.
If that's not possible, go for the trump, drop down from the ledge, double jump bair.
I think DK has godly edgeguarding, but you're always going to struggle against Sheik and Pikachu

 

[Roager]

Just keep going for bairs. They're easy to land, huge knockback and they come out fast with quick recovery, meaning you can spam them faster than your opponent can air dodge.
If they get too close to the ledge, get them with an up b for a gimp or stagespike.

If you are going to go really deep with dk I recommend run off nair, or backwards falling nair(this way it can set you up for double jump back air). It has a ton of active frames while still allowing for a good recovery.

Dair, Fair, side B and down B all spike, and none comes out at the same speed.

There is good bluff and mind game in that

These. Dk's got a flexible edge game; all his aerials and specials are well suited to it, or at least applicable. The spikes and giant punch are for punishing predictable recoveries. Nair and Bair are general use. They come out quick and allow for easy up B, both for offense and recovery. Up B is a fun toy since it lasts so long and covers so much horizontal space. If they come in high, Uair is a decent hitbox with good damage. Comes out quick too.