ItsRainingGravy
Smash Ace
So I have seen this issue debated a couple of times, but never directly tackled. So I decided to test these two moves myself.
One problem some people have had with High Pressure FLUDD in comparison to the normal FLUDD is that it pushes Mario back by a good distance. However, I think we overlooked a small detail in High Pressure FLUDD: It still has a powerful pushing effect even when it isn't fully charged.
High Pressure FLUDD has roughly 6 levels of charge. You can indicate these levels of charge each time Mario flashes blue. The first flash happens almost immediately happens right after you use the move, and the last flash happens right before the "Ding!" signifying that the FLUDD is fully charged. So lets go quickly go over the details of these charges:
Stage: FD Mushroomy Kingdom
Opponent: Mario
Special: High Pressure FLUDD
Test: Use High Pressure FLUDD to push opposing Mario to the left, using blocks to indicate pushing distance.
Standing location: Rolling to the very edge of the stage/at the edge of the far right block.
Block: Pretty much equates to a single character distance in length.
Close Range:
Charge 1: Pushes opponent 4 blocks away (Increases to 6 at point blank). Doesn't push you back. Water range is 5 blocks.
Charge 2: Pushes opponent 6 blocks away (Increases to 7.5 at point blank). Recoil is 1 block. Range is 6 blocks.
Charge 3: Pushes opponent 9 blocks away (Still 9 blocks at point blank). Recoil is 2 blocks. Range is 7 blocks.
Charge 4: Pushes opponent 10.5 blocks away (Increases to 11 at point blank). Recoil is 4 blocks. Range is 8 blocks.
Charge 5: Pushes opponent 13 blocks away (Increases to 14 at point blank). Recoil is 6 blocks. Range is 9 blocks.
Charge 6: Pushes opponent 16 blocks away (Increases to 17 at point blank). Recoil is 6 blocks. Range is 10 blocks.
At a distance (furthest possible range for the move):
Charge 1: 2 blocks. (Range is 5)
Charge 2: 4 blocks. (Range is 6)
Charge 3: 5 blocks. (Range is 7)
Charge 4: 6 blocks. (Range is 8)
Charge 5: 8 blocks. (Range is 9)
Charge 6: 9.5 blocks. (Range is 10)
Against an aerial opponent:
Charge 1: Barely any pushback. (No aerial recoil)
Charge 2: Good pushback. (Slight aerial recoil)
Charge 3: Great pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
Charge 4: Great pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
Charge 5: Amazing pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
Charge 6: Incredible pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
So, what we have learned from the following is this:
- Charge 1 is pretty much outclassed by Charge 2, and should never be used really. In a situation where you wish to quickfire an uncharged FLUDD, you might as well be using Cape/Gust Cape instead, as it has barely any pushback in the air.
- Charge 2 is solid for both ground and air use due to how quickly you can get it, making it effective for quickfiring the FLUDD. It also has less recoil than the later Charges, both on the ground and in the air.
- Charge 3 is when we start to see diminishing returns. If you include the recoil and the range for both Charge 2 and Charge 3, both of them will equal 5 blocks in distance as the "maximum effective range" for the move. Charge 3 still pushes the opponent back 3 spaces further, but it also doesn't increase the distance it pushes when you use it at point blank/when you are closer to the opponent like Charge 2 does. It also takes a bit longer to acquire a Charge 3 as opposed to a Charge 2, naturally. On the plus side though, it does push an aerial opponent back further, which is the most important use for FLUDD anyways.
- Charge 4 is mostly pointless. You get 1.5-2 blocks additional pushing distance...which is lost and can even be worse due to how it pushes you twice the distance of Charge 3. This means that, if you include the recoil and range of the move, it actually has 1 less block (4 blocks) as the maximum effective range for the move. AND it doesn't push aerial opponents back further. All it does is make you wait more precious time for Charges 5 and 6. Yuck. The only time that it is better than Charge 3 is if you use it in the air, because they have the same aerial recoil. But you would much rather wait to get a Charge 5/6 anyways.
- Charge 5 is even worse on the ground (3 Blocks maximum effective range), but it is noticeably better in the air. You get a negative payout for grounded use because it pushes you back 6 blocks now, though there is no additional recoil in the air. So this makes Charge 5 the second best one to use while jumping, after Charge 6. Charge 5 is still somewhat situational as it is pretty much outclassed by Charge 6, though.
- Charge 6 is very similar in function to Charge 5, but with slightly more range and aerial pushback added to it. You could go for a Charge 5 if you REALLY want to shave some time charging the FLUDD, but you should always try to go for a Charge 6 instead. Especially after KOing the opponent. The additional range and aerial pushback are worth it.
High Pressure FLUDD
+ Much more effective when quickfiring the water.
+ More pushback on the opponent, both when they are actively trying to recover and when they are in the helpless falling state.
+ Doesn't take as long to reach optimal pushback potency, if you are using Charge 2 or 3. Meaning that it theoretically charges faster than normal FLUDD.
+/- Overcharging the FLUDD to Charges 5 and 6 is the strongest pushback potential the FLUDD can ever reach, though this takes longer to get to as opposed to the normal FLUDD. This nerf isn't too much of a setback as Charges 2 and 3 are still good, however.
+/- Recoil effect on yourself can both be a hindrance to you trying to egdeguard the opponent, or used in creative ways to dodge attacks depending on the situation.
- Less initial range than the default FLUDD. (Though at max charge it has the same range as Default FLUDD)
- Weakened ability to angle the High Pressure FLUDD in comparison to the normal FLUDD. It takes longer to make it shoot more upwards or downwards.
Default FLUDD
+ More intial range than HP FLUDD. (At max charge both of them have the same range however)
+ More fluid control on how you angle the FLUDD up and down while spraying water.
+ Charges more quickly to get to maximum charge. By the time this FLUDD fully charges, High Pressure FLUDD will only be on approximately Charge 4...I think.
+/- Almost no recoil on yourself whatsoever. Which is good for ease of use, but it also means that you can't surprise opponents with recoil like you can in some situations with High Pressure FLUDD.
- You can't really quickfire this FLUDD, as it barely has any pushback at all.
- Maximum charge is only about as effective as High Pressure FLUDD's Charge 3, which charges faster than the Default FLUDD.
- Opponents are much more resistant to Default FLUDD's water while they are not in the helpless falling state.
- Pushback on Default FLUDD requires you to have the water constantly hitting the opponent, while High Pressure FLUDD doesn't have to worry about this as much.
- The above weakness is further exploited because it seems to be easier to escape the water blasts from the Default FLUDD in comparison to the High Pressure FLUDD.
Overall, I would say that the High Pressure FLUDD wins in overall usefulness. If there is anything I missed though, please let me know. Anyways, discuss your thoughts on which version of the FLUDD you think is better. The more effective Mario's edgeguarding is, the more tournament wins he is going to see. So it would be ideal to try to figure out which of these two variants is more effective overall to help our favorite plumber out.
One problem some people have had with High Pressure FLUDD in comparison to the normal FLUDD is that it pushes Mario back by a good distance. However, I think we overlooked a small detail in High Pressure FLUDD: It still has a powerful pushing effect even when it isn't fully charged.
High Pressure FLUDD has roughly 6 levels of charge. You can indicate these levels of charge each time Mario flashes blue. The first flash happens almost immediately happens right after you use the move, and the last flash happens right before the "Ding!" signifying that the FLUDD is fully charged. So lets go quickly go over the details of these charges:
Stage: FD Mushroomy Kingdom
Opponent: Mario
Special: High Pressure FLUDD
Test: Use High Pressure FLUDD to push opposing Mario to the left, using blocks to indicate pushing distance.
Standing location: Rolling to the very edge of the stage/at the edge of the far right block.
Block: Pretty much equates to a single character distance in length.
Close Range:
Charge 1: Pushes opponent 4 blocks away (Increases to 6 at point blank). Doesn't push you back. Water range is 5 blocks.
Charge 2: Pushes opponent 6 blocks away (Increases to 7.5 at point blank). Recoil is 1 block. Range is 6 blocks.
Charge 3: Pushes opponent 9 blocks away (Still 9 blocks at point blank). Recoil is 2 blocks. Range is 7 blocks.
Charge 4: Pushes opponent 10.5 blocks away (Increases to 11 at point blank). Recoil is 4 blocks. Range is 8 blocks.
Charge 5: Pushes opponent 13 blocks away (Increases to 14 at point blank). Recoil is 6 blocks. Range is 9 blocks.
Charge 6: Pushes opponent 16 blocks away (Increases to 17 at point blank). Recoil is 6 blocks. Range is 10 blocks.
At a distance (furthest possible range for the move):
Charge 1: 2 blocks. (Range is 5)
Charge 2: 4 blocks. (Range is 6)
Charge 3: 5 blocks. (Range is 7)
Charge 4: 6 blocks. (Range is 8)
Charge 5: 8 blocks. (Range is 9)
Charge 6: 9.5 blocks. (Range is 10)
Against an aerial opponent:
Charge 1: Barely any pushback. (No aerial recoil)
Charge 2: Good pushback. (Slight aerial recoil)
Charge 3: Great pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
Charge 4: Great pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
Charge 5: Amazing pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
Charge 6: Incredible pushback. (Mild aerial recoil)
So, what we have learned from the following is this:
- Charge 1 is pretty much outclassed by Charge 2, and should never be used really. In a situation where you wish to quickfire an uncharged FLUDD, you might as well be using Cape/Gust Cape instead, as it has barely any pushback in the air.
- Charge 2 is solid for both ground and air use due to how quickly you can get it, making it effective for quickfiring the FLUDD. It also has less recoil than the later Charges, both on the ground and in the air.
- Charge 3 is when we start to see diminishing returns. If you include the recoil and the range for both Charge 2 and Charge 3, both of them will equal 5 blocks in distance as the "maximum effective range" for the move. Charge 3 still pushes the opponent back 3 spaces further, but it also doesn't increase the distance it pushes when you use it at point blank/when you are closer to the opponent like Charge 2 does. It also takes a bit longer to acquire a Charge 3 as opposed to a Charge 2, naturally. On the plus side though, it does push an aerial opponent back further, which is the most important use for FLUDD anyways.
- Charge 4 is mostly pointless. You get 1.5-2 blocks additional pushing distance...which is lost and can even be worse due to how it pushes you twice the distance of Charge 3. This means that, if you include the recoil and range of the move, it actually has 1 less block (4 blocks) as the maximum effective range for the move. AND it doesn't push aerial opponents back further. All it does is make you wait more precious time for Charges 5 and 6. Yuck. The only time that it is better than Charge 3 is if you use it in the air, because they have the same aerial recoil. But you would much rather wait to get a Charge 5/6 anyways.
- Charge 5 is even worse on the ground (3 Blocks maximum effective range), but it is noticeably better in the air. You get a negative payout for grounded use because it pushes you back 6 blocks now, though there is no additional recoil in the air. So this makes Charge 5 the second best one to use while jumping, after Charge 6. Charge 5 is still somewhat situational as it is pretty much outclassed by Charge 6, though.
- Charge 6 is very similar in function to Charge 5, but with slightly more range and aerial pushback added to it. You could go for a Charge 5 if you REALLY want to shave some time charging the FLUDD, but you should always try to go for a Charge 6 instead. Especially after KOing the opponent. The additional range and aerial pushback are worth it.
Now then, that's all fine and dandy, but how does this all compare to the normal FLUDD? Well, I am not going to go nearly as in-depth with the normal FLUDD as I was with the High Pressure one, but here are my overall results/comparison from testing the two:tl;dr version for High Pressure FLUDD said:
High Pressure FLUDD
+ Much more effective when quickfiring the water.
+ More pushback on the opponent, both when they are actively trying to recover and when they are in the helpless falling state.
+ Doesn't take as long to reach optimal pushback potency, if you are using Charge 2 or 3. Meaning that it theoretically charges faster than normal FLUDD.
+/- Overcharging the FLUDD to Charges 5 and 6 is the strongest pushback potential the FLUDD can ever reach, though this takes longer to get to as opposed to the normal FLUDD. This nerf isn't too much of a setback as Charges 2 and 3 are still good, however.
+/- Recoil effect on yourself can both be a hindrance to you trying to egdeguard the opponent, or used in creative ways to dodge attacks depending on the situation.
- Less initial range than the default FLUDD. (Though at max charge it has the same range as Default FLUDD)
- Weakened ability to angle the High Pressure FLUDD in comparison to the normal FLUDD. It takes longer to make it shoot more upwards or downwards.
Default FLUDD
+ More intial range than HP FLUDD. (At max charge both of them have the same range however)
+ More fluid control on how you angle the FLUDD up and down while spraying water.
+ Charges more quickly to get to maximum charge. By the time this FLUDD fully charges, High Pressure FLUDD will only be on approximately Charge 4...I think.
+/- Almost no recoil on yourself whatsoever. Which is good for ease of use, but it also means that you can't surprise opponents with recoil like you can in some situations with High Pressure FLUDD.
- You can't really quickfire this FLUDD, as it barely has any pushback at all.
- Maximum charge is only about as effective as High Pressure FLUDD's Charge 3, which charges faster than the Default FLUDD.
- Opponents are much more resistant to Default FLUDD's water while they are not in the helpless falling state.
- Pushback on Default FLUDD requires you to have the water constantly hitting the opponent, while High Pressure FLUDD doesn't have to worry about this as much.
- The above weakness is further exploited because it seems to be easier to escape the water blasts from the Default FLUDD in comparison to the High Pressure FLUDD.
Overall, I would say that the High Pressure FLUDD wins in overall usefulness. If there is anything I missed though, please let me know. Anyways, discuss your thoughts on which version of the FLUDD you think is better. The more effective Mario's edgeguarding is, the more tournament wins he is going to see. So it would be ideal to try to figure out which of these two variants is more effective overall to help our favorite plumber out.
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