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Shadow Games Mafia Over: Dgames Doomed

FullMetalLynch

anomandaris_rake|orboknown
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Adumv: one line. Explain why karys scum
Kary: the same. Also.is maven piling on. Is he innocent and stupid or in the middle.
 

FullMetalLynch

anomandaris_rake|orboknown
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I mean is that part of a sentence really the only thing you took away from my post? Because what you commented on wasn't even a point I was making
But it was an inaccurate point within your argument none the less
 

FullMetalLynch

anomandaris_rake|orboknown
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Maven why did you ask about our flavour. How does that help you at this point in the game even slightly to read me
 

#HBC | Kary

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Following this line of thought, she'd have to think that acting pro-town is scummy, since clearly scum would act pro-town, yes? And anyone acting anti-town, well they're pro-town because scum don't want to act anti-town :rolleyes:
Congratulations, you clearly do not understand this at all.

Anti-town or pro-town, and being town or scum, are completely different scales that do not relate to one another. Adum points out a whole bunch of reasons why he thinks I am anti-town. He does not explain why they make me scum.

Again, what defense is that? If I look through your posting history will I find that you've never responded to two things at the same time? Did his questions drain you so much that you were incapable of posting these in that hour lull you commented on right afterwards?
No, you don't understand. I didn't come up with those points at the time, I came up with them after the fact of the Kantrip lynch. What I was saying, is that if adum had raised those points at the time, rather than zeroing in on the flavor, I would have happily talked about them. I specifically said that I did not want to talk about flavour.
 

#HBC | Kary

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Because doctors aren't a thing.

How many posts have you made talking about how I'm such an annoyance?


And don't cite the soup kill, he was viewed as quite suspicious, scum likely thought they could take a chance on him after bardull flipped and it was the opposite of his assertion.

If you were scum and I got lynched there would be no suspicion on you, you arrogantly chose to take a risk and it didn't pan out.
If I was scum, I could have lynched Gheb, shot you, and conveniently explained your death through your dislike of Gheb. There would still have been no suspicion on me.

Arguing that I convinced Kantrip to switch onto you because I am so arrogant I was sure I could lynch you, is an incredible and ridiculous stretch.

It is clear as day that if I am scum, I would have lynched town Gheb. I come off a hundred times worse the way I played it.

Pushing my lynch before Gheb's lynch, in your shoes, is complete insanity.
 

#HBC | Kary

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Adumv: one line. Explain why karys scum
Kary: the same. Also.is maven piling on. Is he innocent and stupid or in the middle.
I will assume you are asking me to explain why adum is scum.

I'm not arguing adum is scum. I'm arguing that I'm town, and his scumread on me is absurd. His blindness to this is weird and puts him at null for now.

Maven piling on? On the surface doesn't change my opinion on his slot. Doesn't feel like scum pile on.
 

adumbrodeus

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Again, docs exist.

Furthmore, it was likely kantrip's choice without consulting you while you were holding off your vote to make absolutely sure that you didn't get blamed for the gheb lynch and you were left in a position where you had to roll with it. Your other possibility was hardpushing gheb which would create a perception of responsibility on his flip. But you're arrogant so you ran the risk and tried to lynch the thorn in your side.
 

adumbrodeus

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I will assume you are asking me to explain why adum is scum.

I'm not arguing adum is scum. I'm arguing that I'm town, and his scumread on me is absurd. His blindness to this is weird and puts him at null for now.

Maven piling on? On the surface doesn't change my opinion on his slot. Doesn't feel like scum pile on.
Yet you already accounted for what you viewed as my stubbornness and you called me a town lean. Suddenly I start hardpushing your slot and I'm null? Imagine that.
 

adumbrodeus

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Adumv: one line. Explain why karys scum
Kary: the same. Also.is maven piling on. Is he innocent and stupid or in the middle.
Trying to push people to suspect one of her townreads (gheb), covering for kantrip's obvious fakeclaim, refusal to do a decent push on anything unsafe and generally trying to limit town information by distraction, trying to shut people up, and attempting to provoke a flamewar.
 

adumbrodeus

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The idea that anti-town and being scum are not related is ridiculous. Scum WANT to play anti-town but it usually exposes them. It is however, often played by mistake or arrogance and the more experienced a player is the more incriminating anti-town play is. You should know better.
 

#HBC | Kary

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Again, docs exist.

Furthmore, it was likely kantrip's choice without consulting you while you were holding off your vote to make absolutely sure that you didn't get blamed for the gheb lynch and you were left in a position where you had to roll with it. Your other possibility was hardpushing gheb which would create a perception of responsibility on his flip. But you're arrogant so you ran the risk and tried to lynch the thorn in your side.
Sorry, Kantrip switched onto you, because you're a threat to me, without talking to me even though I'm super active?

I'm sad I used that Reach video already now. You're reaching.

It is clear as day that if I am scum, I would have lynched town Gheb. I come off a hundred times worse the way I played it.

Pushing my lynch before Gheb's lynch, in your shoes, is complete insanity.



Yet you already accounted for what you viewed as my stubbornness and you called me a town lean. Suddenly I start hardpushing your slot and I'm null? Imagine that.
Oh, reads aren't allowed to change in mafia? You're not being stubborn, you're being insane.
 

adumbrodeus

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Actually he most likely did it for his own reasons, I've seen town kantrip do 180s on slots he was sure was scum til moments before a few times. I've also seen town kantrip go hyperaggressive out of the blue on a brand new scumread (I was actually the victim of a quicklynch as the result of that type of play). He was most likely to to imitate his townplay.

You just played off that.
 

#HBC | Kary

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Actually he most likely did it for his own reasons, I've seen town kantrip do 180s on slots he was sure was scum til moments before a few times. I've also seen town kantrip go hyperaggressive out of the blue on a brand new scumread (I was actually the victim of a quicklynch as the result of that type of play). He was most likely to to imitate his townplay.

You just played off that.
Kantrip puts his neck on the line, AND gives up a guaranteed mislynch, just to try and gain townpoints? Not likely.
I stand by and let him wrap the noose around his neck, not even bothering to bus him as he goes down? Very not likely.

Isn't this the opposite of your previous theory? First I was desperate to lynch you, now I'm desperate to save Kantrip.
 

Maven89

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But it was an inaccurate point within your argument none the less
No, it wasn't even a point I made

Maven why did you ask about our flavour. How does that help you at this point in the game even slightly to read me
I don't remember asking you about flavor, only about your role, because claiming vig, then saying your paranoid cop, is odd. It's beneficial to read you because you're playing the game. Are you suggesting you're somehow that pro-townie based on a claim with, so far, nothing to back it up? Because right now that's null


Man maven you need to stop riding adumb **** down karys throat oh my fu k
My argument isn't even the same as his. He's doing his own thing, my entire argument is that Kary's defenses is horrendously scummy, just a combination of lies and insults. That has no bearing on what Adumb is trying to get at.

Anti-town or pro-town, and being town or scum, are completely different scales that do not relate to one another. Adum points out a whole bunch of reasons why he thinks I am anti-town. He does not explain why they make me scum.
Hmmmmm

I admit I didn't understand what you were getting at,

That is a good point.

I'm re-reading the game right now (well, select parts). If I don't see something very scummy from you I'll unvote.
 

#HBC | Kary

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So care to explain why you've been playing anti-town this entire game? It's sort of on the label that it doesn't benefit town when townies play like that.
Well, in my opinion I am playing pro-town, but for some reason you find it disagreeable. I mean, you acknowledge that my play seems to be pro-town, but claim that by some dark magic it is actually anti-town. Whether or not it is anti-town, though, is kinda irrelevant.

The point is that my being 'anti-town' doesn't make me scum, you need to actually explain that ****.
 

Maven89

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Talking about FML's claim

I don't see the point of this as a scum gambit.
If it was Rake's idea, yes. It's stupid and a terrible idea, but he would do it to see if they react poorly to the accusation and town rake wouldn't care that it looks scummy as hell. It's either a legit claim and Rake's dumb, or its a town gambit and Rake's dumb
@ #HBC | Kary #HBC | Kary while there are reasons for scum FML to gambit like this, they're generally outweighed by the gambit putting the spotlight on FML and risking blowing up in their face when they can't back it up. The benefit of possibly outing a protective role or some other PR is overshadowed by the potential of making FML look scummy. As town they wouldn't give a **** about looking scummy if it meant pinning ghebscum which I have to assume would be their goal if it's a town gambit. Also possible is that they're telling the truth but being too dense to think of alternate reasons their kill might have been blocked. If that's the case then I feel really sorry for the, so I can only hope it's a bad town gambit for their sake.
Well, if Orbo's confirming the shot was legit then Rake either made a phenomenal jump in logic (even for Rake) to conclude that a failed shot = his target must be scum, or Orbo's covering for Rake and they are scum.

It's possible that FML and Gheb are scum mates and FML intended to get others to follow his logic to lynch Gheb and get him major towncred. This theory seems more plausible considering he claimed that they are a one-shot vig, meaning we will have no way in the future to verify their claim now that their shot has been used, and the fact that Gheb was already a slot that was being heavily looked at. It's possible Rake decided Gheb was likely to get lynched and wanted to try to distance and take credit for the lynch so they would look better on Gheb's scumflip.

I can't see why Rake would pull this as scum on town Gheb, especially considering FML wasn't in any danger and Gheb was already on the chopping block. If the goal was to get a mislynch on town Gheb, there was no reason to go out into the spotlight with a fake vig claim because a lynch on Gheb was probably already attainable.

No matter what the case is, we will never be able to verify FML's claim because, whether it's true or not, they are not going to be able to take any more shots since they claimed to be a one-shot vig.

So it's either they're town and Rake went actually full raketard, or FML and Gheb are scum mates. Even if it's the former, Gheb can still easily be scum (but not because he survived the shot, lol), so IMO we should still be lynching Gheb. Then if he flips scum we can look at FML.

Vote: Gheb
I can't see a world where FML is scum and Gheb isn't. I can see a world where Gheb is scum and FML isn't. Therefore, statistically, we should be lynching Gheb. Do you think there's a way for FML to be scum and Gheb to be town?
See one and two are solid and I have no problems with them, but you have yet to convince me that your logic leap on your vig action is in any way justifiable.
I'm frustrated with his inability to just say "I was wrong." This doesn't even have a bearing on his alignment it's just frustrating how stubborn he's being when he's made it clear he doesn't have an answer here.
Yeah that's my issue, that claiming when you did was not smart and didn't help towards the goal of lynching Gheb at all. On the contrary, it actually distracted from it.
Walk me through the motivation of this as a scum gambit. Is it to get Gheb mislynched? Is it to distance from Gheb as scum mates? Why do it?
So you're worried about scum potentially having people buy a claim of

"I'm a one-shot vig but my shot failed."

Seriously? That is not an issue if the move was a scum gambit, lol
I stand by my belief that the only scum gambit that would make sense to me is if Gheb and FML are mates and FML wants to look good on Gheb's scumflip. If you can't think of one that makes more sense, you should probably vote Gheb.


Holy **** is that a lot of posts of Potato defending FML, like wow. I haven't even finished re-reading, I just felt like those needed to be brought up again immediately.

Unvote: Kary, it looks like my main argument against her was based off bad communication on our part. Looking through the thread I see Kary asking great questions and going against Kantrip plenty, I honestly don't think she's scum anymore.
 

adumbrodeus

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Kantrip puts his neck on the line, AND gives up a guaranteed mislynch, just to try and gain townpoints? Not likely.
Well unless you've somehow decided decided that gheb is scum, that's precisely what happened.

I stand by and let him wrap the noose around his neck, not even bothering to bus him as he goes down? Very not likely.
Yes I'm sure you were quite capable of a last minute switch to kantrip to try to gain townie points when you were asleep.


Isn't this the opposite of your previous theory? First I was desperate to lynch you, now I'm desperate to save Kantrip.
More like kantrip went off on his own but it gave you an opportunity because I was an annoyance.
 

adumbrodeus

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To be clear what I'm saying with my first point is that kantrip had to have some reason to leave the gheb lynch, given that we both doubt gheb is scum with kantrip now, he had to have some reason for trying to torpedo the lynch and an independent action that was trying to play up his town meta sounds like a strong reason to do it.

Unless you're suggesting some other possibility?
 

adumbrodeus

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Talking about FML's claim

























Holy **** is that a lot of posts of Potato defending FML, like wow. I haven't even finished re-reading, I just felt like those needed to be brought up again immediately.

Unvote: Kary, it looks like my main argument against her was based off bad communication on our part. Looking through the thread I see Kary asking great questions and going against Kantrip plenty, I honestly don't think she's scum anymore.
Hmmmm you're right that's a lot of defensive play towards FML.

I need to chew on the slot and possibly reconsider some assumptions about the game.
 

Maven89

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I did once see Kantrip as scum hold off on hammering someone to win the game before, I forgot his exact reasons it was in Gheb's Mafia 3 or...something. I was gunsmith.
 

Maven89

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I disagree. But whatever.

I'll still go Gheb, but if he flips town there better be vigs ALL over adum.
And I think this explains Kantrip's thought process. He assumed Gheb would still be lynched, and he'd look town and Adumb would look scum from it.
 

JeXs

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Also fml can you please post in a way that's possible for me to read
 

Zalak

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IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS, I AM WILLING TO ANSWER THEM, BUT PLEASE ANSWER MINE. If you think I'm scummy, I'd like to know why.
 

FullMetalLynch

anomandaris_rake|orboknown
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No, it wasn't even a point I made



I don't remember asking you about flavor, only about your role, because claiming vig, then saying your paranoid cop, is odd. It's beneficial to read you because you're playing the game. Are you suggesting you're somehow that pro-townie based on a claim with, so far, nothing to back it up? Because right now that's null.
What rake was asking was how does that aspect of what we've done help ypu to read us at this point when that info has been out since day 1 and you just got to it.
Guys we should really lynch Zalak though
true
Also fml can you please post in a way that's possible for me to read
no guarentees
 

~ Gheb ~

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I've been at a tournament yesterday so I didn't get to make any input.

Time to read up.

:059:
 

#HBC | Kary

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Well unless you've somehow decided decided that gheb is scum, that's precisely what happened.
adum, adum...

It is obvious at this point that you are not looking at the evidence, and using it to find who's scum - you are assuming that I am scum, and scraping around for whatever evidence there is that might support your theory. You need to stop tunneling on my slot and actually reconsider.

It is significantly more likely that Kantrip switched off of Gheb when he did not have a scummate waiting in the wings to hammer. Trying to make his slot seem more townie is just not worth giving up a mislynch- it is mislynches, not townpoints, that win games.

Kantrip could just as easily made his case against you after the lynch was secured, and try and push the blowback from the Gheb lynch onto you the following Day. The way he did it seems absurdly risky if the lynch was already in the bag.

At this point your theory has devolved to where Kantrip just does things, and I have to work with them, with no sort of coordination or teamwork between us. I shouldn't have to point out that, if it seems like Kantrip and I are working independently, it's probably because we're not aligned.
 

~ Gheb ~

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Reading through Kary vs adum has to be one of the biggest wastes of time I've ever gone through. You guys seriously need to take a chill pill or something because you're just derailing the thread with your bickering and not contributing anything constructive towards finding scum.

Why did nobody seem to take note of Maven's post where he pointed out all the connetions between FML and Kantrip? That's the kind of stuff we should be talking about ... nobody gives a **** about your clash of egos.

:059:
 

~ Gheb ~

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I can't confidently call one slot scummier than the other. I think more hints have been dropped that FML are scum but at the same time I find it harder to justify Jexs' play from the angle of a townie. For that reason I'm leaning towards lynching Jexs.

:059:
 
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