Everything we know about SSB4

[ScubaF_ingSteve]

http://nintendoenthusiast.com/super-smash-bros-wii-u-3ds/

A nice little article by Nintendo enthusiast about what we know about the game. If this is a repost, sorry, but interesting information none the less that I thought this board would enjoy.

 

[RomanceDawn]

I like what he has to say on the subject but he does word things in a way that are absolute. Yes Sakurai said he wants more people to help with balance, but the way he explains it is that they gotta be balanced for tournament use. Yes that's wonderful, but its stretching what we know just a bit.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Remember that Sakurai's idea of "balance" is "If it's hard to use but overly good, it's balanced by its difficulty."

 

[Carolus Rex]

It would be awesome if the game actually gets released in 2013, but I doubt it. Especially if it's for both Wii U and 3DS. Anyway the article remembered me how important it's going to be the connectivity between the systems so both the versions are going to be launched in the same day or at least the same window, right? Is that wise? Obviously I'll get them both, but isn't it going to cut in half the fans? Not everyone is going to pay 100 bucks in one moment, I think...
So, considering this time around we're talking about two games, I think that we're not getting anything before AT LEAST march 2014 (hoping it doesn't get the Mario Kart 7 treatment). Anyway the article reinforced me the believe that at this E3 we're going to get blown away, if not even before it. The hype is unbearable.

 

[Ove]

It would be awesome if the game actually gets released in 2013, but I doubt it. Especially if it's for both Wii U and 3DS. Anyway the article remembered me how important it's going to be the connectivity between the systems so both the versions are going to be launched in the same day or at least the same window, right? Is that wise? Obviously I'll get them both, but isn't it going to cut in half the fans? Not everyone is going to pay 100 bucks in one moment, I think...
So, considering this time around we're talking about two games, I think that we're not getting anything before AT LEAST march 2014 (hoping it doesn't get the Mario Kart 7 treatment). Anyway the article reinforced me the believe that at this E3 we're going to get blown away, if not even before it. The hype is unbearable.

Why are you in a hurry?

 

[Carolus Rex]

Why are you in a hurry?

Because it's Smash Bros. and especially the Wii U needs a strong game like it.

 

[volbound1700]

I don't want it rushed, I want it in 2014 or 2015 so that it has everything possible included.

I also hate the idea of splitting the game between two systems, it will cause people to have to buy two different consoles (which is business smart by Nintendo). I am wondering if you can only lock certain characters with 3DS which would stink. The 3DS involvement scares me with this game and I feel that we may not get the quality we want for this game or be shorted on characters, levels, etc.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

I also hate the idea of splitting the game between two systems, it will cause people to have to buy two different consoles (which is business smart by Nintendo). I am wondering if you can only lock certain characters with 3DS which would stink. The 3DS involvement scares me with this game and I feel that we may not get the quality we want for this game or be shorted on characters, levels, etc.

I'm hoping that the differences between the two versions are minimal and they just allow people to get the game on the platform of their choice(and allow cross-play between the two). I wouldn't mind SOME exclusive content, but I'd draw the line at having version exclusive characters.

 

[volbound1700]

shinpichu, I wouldn't mind that at all. 3DS doesn't need Smash right now, it is Wii U that needs the big titles.

 

[SubparSmashBrother]

I don't want it rushed, I want it in 2014 or 2015 so that it has everything possible included.

I also hate the idea of splitting the game between two systems, it will cause people to have to buy two different consoles (which is business smart by Nintendo). I am wondering if you can only lock certain characters with 3DS which would stink. The 3DS involvement scares me with this game and I feel that we may not get the quality we want for this game or be shorted on characters, levels, etc.

I like it. Now I don't have to buy a wii u. I can just get a 3ds to play smash by myself and probably find a friend or something who has a wii u if I want to play console.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

shinpichu, I wouldn't mind that at all. 3DS doesn't need Smash right now, it is Wii U that needs the big titles.

But I won't be able to play the Wii U version. I'd rather have it for the 3DS.

And by the time SSB comes out, there will probably be a lot more Wii U games released than there are now. Keep in mind, SSB4 probably won't come out until 2014

 

[volbound1700]

No I am afraid the 3DS will have Single Player mode and Wii U Multi, etc. I am afraid we won't get the full game. Also even if we do, the full game will be canned because they would have to split time between both systems and that will cut into getting a good game in the long run.

 

[Biz_R_0]

@volbound 2015? This is Nintendo, not Valve (although, they are kinda slipping with release dates).

@Shinpichu they said the two versions are basically going to be two different games.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

@Shinpichu they said the two versions are basically going to be two different games.

[citation needed]

All I've heard is that there's going to be two versions.

 

[Gene]

No I am afraid the 3DS will have Single Player mode and Wii U Multi, etc. I am afraid we won't get the full game. Also even if we do, the full game will be canned because they would have to split time between both systems and that will cut into getting a good game in the long run.

The 3ds smash resulting in having a single player mode could just be if you're not playing wirelessly with other people. I think Sakurai said something about Smash 3ds being more "personal" to the player. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Because it's Smash Bros. and especially the Wii U needs a strong game like it.

Pikmin 3 is not a strong and anticipated game?

I would not want to Smash before Q3 2014 honestly, especially if it means a better gameplay experience and meaningful content.

 

[Yobolight]

This split between 3DS and WiiU could be horrible.

 

[Ove]

Pikmin 3 is not a strong and anticipated game?

I would not want to Smash before Q3 2014 honestly, especially if it means a better gameplay experience and meaningful content.

I think so too. I don't mind waiting a bit longer. That means that the developers have more time to polish the game.

 

[volbound1700]

I am just scared by the fact they are making two seperate Smash games for two seperate systems in less time than they made Brawl. Brawl was a great game but it did dissappoint or appeared rushed in areas (SSE for example). This makes me wonder if Smash 4 will be even more rushed and in the end fall short of our expectations because they are trying to stick it on two systems. I feel like we will be leaving wanting for Smash 5.

 

[Nasty_Nate]

Remember that Sakurai's idea of "balance" is "If it's hard to use but overly good, it's balanced by its difficulty."

Please explain metaknights B move to me

 

[Jonn]

I think that prediction of the game releasing this year is laughable. There are two versions on very different consoles, a 3D handheld and an HD console. These are far different from previous installments. I hope the earliest the game is released is 2015.

 

[The Real Gamer]

I am just scared by the fact they are making two seperate Smash games for two seperate systems in less time than they made Brawl. Brawl was a great game but it did dissappoint or appeared rushed in areas (SSE for example). This makes me wonder if Smash 4 will be even more rushed and in the end fall short of our expectations because they are trying to stick it on two systems. I feel like we will be leaving wanting for Smash 5.

I'm not worried. The development team this time around is much more experienced with the fighting genre so I'm sure they can get a lot more done in a faster amount of time. There's probably a segment of the team dedicated to the 3DS version and one dedicated to the Wii U version. Sakurai made 3 very great Smash games (no matter how many melee-enthusiasts complain about Brawl), so I see no reason why he'd fall short on the 4th go around with a superior development team.

I do have to say though that I am very, very curious as to how different the 3DS version will be from the Wii U version.

 

[Hypercat-Z]

I am just scared by the fact they are making two seperate Smash games for two seperate systems in less time than they made Brawl. Brawl was a great game but it did dissappoint or appeared rushed in areas (SSE for example). This makes me wonder if Smash 4 will be even more rushed and in the end fall short of our expectations because they are trying to stick it on two systems. I feel like we will be leaving wanting for Smash 5.

You know? I think it's a vantage instead.
I have the feeling Sakurai was unsatisfied with Brawl because the game could not have all the thing he wanted.
Looking at some AT I have the suspect they were going to be playable char but they went declassified because of room space.
This time Sakurai has the double of space to put all the characters he want.
Still, the "who goes in which version?" problem remain, but I thrust Sakurai.
Maybe this time the two versions of Link will stay in different machines.

 

[GetBentSaggy]

Hopefully this relieves people from their pessimistic views towards the game. There's no actual insight to the game (i.e. mechanics, characters, etc) but it seems like they want to make it more like Melee and have a wider appeal.

What was great about Melee was it was playable by both casual and hardcore gamers. Games like Tekken, for example, don't accurately do that.

 

[Norm]

It's a decent article worth the read if for no other reason than to get your brain thinking about possibilities. Though I think his prediction that it'll be a holiday release this year is out to lunch lol mid to late 2014 is more likely.

 

[volbound1700]

I would just rather wait and get a complete finished product. I loved Brawl, my favorite Smash yet but there are some major issues with the game that I annoyed me and some of it was due to rushes:

1. Cutting characters (Roy, Mewtwo, Dr. Mario)
2. No Megaman
3. Sonic being broken and feeling rushed
4. Landmaster x3
5. SSE being rushed at end and feeling repetitive at times
6. Several stages felt rushed
7. Final Smashes varying in strength: Jigglypuff and DK's FS vs. Sonic or Pikachus FS for example
8. Ganondorf and Captain Falcon nerfed and broken
9. Jigglypuff nerfed and broken
10. Metaknight tier
11. High tier characters with high tier FS (Diddy and Snake for example) and also Low Tier characters with low tier FS (Jigglypuff and DK). The FS for Sonic did make him more competitive in item based games.
12. Online blew, it was bad. I do suspect this game will have major improvements in this area, hard not to.


Overall Brawl gave us A LOT but it also left a lot of fans wanting, particularly with the characters were some major adds were left out (Ridley or Megaman for example) and some popular characters cut (Mewtwo and Roy). I would rather have the complete package in the next game.

 

[GetBentSaggy]

I would just rather wait and get a complete finished product. I loved Brawl, my favorite Smash yet but there are some major issues with the game that I annoyed me and some of it was due to rushes:

1. Cutting characters (Roy, Mewtwo, Dr. Mario)
2. No Megaman
3. Sonic being broken and feeling rushed
4. Landmaster x3
5. SSE being rushed at end and feeling repetitive at times
6. Several stages felt rushed
7. Final Smashes varying in strength: Jigglypuff and DK's FS vs. Sonic or Pikachus FS for example
8. Ganondorf and Captain Falcon nerfed and broken
9. Jigglypuff nerfed and broken
10. Metaknight tier
11. High tier characters with high tier FS (Diddy and Snake for example) and also Low Tier characters with low tier FS (Jigglypuff and DK). The FS for Sonic did make him more competitive in item based games.
12. Online blew, it was bad. I do suspect this game will have major improvements in this area, hard not to.
.

1) Ike was more relevant at the time. The SSB games were a representation of both relevance, popularity and importance to Nintendo. I'm not saying Ike is better than Roy (because I prefer Roy), I'm just saying that Roy was not worth putting in over Ike, especially if they were going to be clones. Mewtwo became Lucario because they needed/wanted a newer Pokemon from the recent generation (whichever he's from, I think it's 4 but I have no clue, I'm not a Pokemon fan).

2)
Considering how they still have a problem with clones, Megaman would likely be a male and blue version of Samus. It would've been best to make Megaman an assist trophy or a boss in SSE; Megaman as a non-playable character, yet a character that has moves, means that they have a rough idea of what they can do with him if they include him in a later game (e.g. Petey Piranha or Ridley). Dr Mario was the essence of a clone... except he was better than his original. Shadow Mario would be a way better option since they can give him Sunshine attributes (organic water attacks, paintbrush, etc).

3) Sonic wasn't rushed. He was hugely cheap and all his B moves looked the same, but he wasn't rushed.

4) Agreed. Absolutely. There's no excuse here. Falco's final smash should've been, or should be if FS's return, the gun that you pilot and shoot in the game credits. Give it the same FPS view (maybe some blue feathers around the edges to immerse you, and the edge of a beak so it's as if you're looking through him) and you have not only a completely new and innovative Final Smash, but a non-clone Smash. Regardless of its use in the credits, it's innovative because it's a new method and function when you're shooting at actual players.

5) Yeah. SSE wasn't really anything. It just... happened. It didn't feel like a crossover due to the lack of series-themed levels, areas or references. And then characters appeared spontaneously and often out of context - why the Hell did Sonic just happen to be at the huge battleground before fighting Taboo? Ugh. I hope they give us an Adventure Mode again/as well.

6) They relied on a few of these stages because of their nostalgia or prominence. Some were all about visuals (which ironically killed the level and caused distractions, like New Pork) and others were about the map interfering. Granted, map interference is good because it creates insane havoc, but they ruined some great maps with map interference. Off the top of my head, that blue/purple Pokemon map. That is an AWESOME map - or it would be if the map wasn't gamebreaking. I don't want the map to 1HKO me, I want it to do small damage or hinder my tactics (like PictoChat, great use of it in there), not to wipe out each character.

7) Agreed. FS's made the game so hugely broken. I think if they return, it should be called a "(Name of the game) Smash", not 'Final'. We don't want anymore 1HKO moves. We want moves to work to our advantage, moves that are tactical. Or at least make all Final Smashes watered down. Just do something to fix the power imbalance, the cheapness, the brokenness, the spam, the overpower, the lack of skill required to use or obtain; everything.

8) Yeah, spot on. As a Ganon main for Melee and Brawl, with secondary as C. Falcon for Melee and Wolf for Brawl (with Falcon as a third ballot), this pissed me off to no end.

9) What pissed me off about Jigglypuff being nerfed and broken was that they did it so unnecessarily. It took skill, patience, timing and tactics to play as Jigglypuff. They nerfed her because, as Sakurai said, SSB is (apparently) "a family game, not a serious fighting game".

10) Absolutely. Meta Knight was so cheap. His moves were just spamming combos or rapid attacks.

11) Yeah, agreed. Again, FS's are awful and gamebreaking. I just turn them off at all times on the chance that I do play with items. It's usually Items:Off.

12) Yeah, I don't even know how it was possible to make such awful WiFi for Brawl considering the game would've been top priority at Nintendo. It definitely ruined replay value. There's a huge difference in beating level 9s over and over than there is to be real human players. Considering Nintendo have the ability to have great online (Mario Kart, although it was usually about 1 second delayed, and many 3DS games) I wouldn't worry about it for upcoming Wii U games. Wii U online is really stable and fast. Other than that, they have the best console web browser there is.


Since SSB has a more dedicated and involved fanbase than most other Nintendo games, I assume Nintendo will be putting on their radar for ongoing support in the forms of DLC, patches, challenges, etc. SSB4 and Mario Kart U, since they benefit the most from online play.

 

[DarkShadow20]

2)
Considering how they still have a problem with clones, Megaman would likely be a male and blue version of Samus. It would've been best to make Megaman an assist trophy or a boss in SSE; Megaman as a non-playable character, yet a character that has moves, means that they have a rough idea of what they can do with him if they include him in a later game (e.g. Petey Piranha or Ridley). Dr Mario was the essence of a clone... except he was better than his original. Shadow Mario would be a way better option since they can give him Sunshine attributes (organic water attacks, paintbrush, etc).

Uh, no. They would both have a chargeable blast, and that's where the similarities would end. His other moves would draw from the vast assortment of Robot Masters, Rush, and maybe he could even copy an enemy's move if he KO'd them.

 

[Ove]

Everyone knows that Megaman would be a clone with morph ball, grapple beam, screw attack and drill kicks.

No but seriously, I can see Megaman with a similar Fsmash as Samus and maybe som missiles. But Megaman has potential for a great and unique moveset with diferent abilities from his games.

 

[Hypercat-Z]

Everyone knows that Megaman would be a clone with morph ball, grapple beam, screw attack and drill kicks.

No but seriously, I can see Megaman with a similar Fsmash as Samus and maybe som missiles. But Megaman has potential for a great and unique moveset with diferent abilities from his games.

IF megaman is in the game I think he needs a move like a punch or a kick that makes his opponents spit out their power in the form of a capsule Megaman can take and that gives him the color and B move of his opponents.

 

[volbound1700]

Megaman would have a variety of move options. He is like Kirby in that he could get a ton of moves that he assemblies throughout the game (in this case almost 10-12 games).

 

[Kink-Link5]

I like how everything we know discussion includes talk of Megaman's moveset.

 

[El Duderino]

Or for that matter fan predictions in general.

 

[El Duderino]

So back on topic, lets further separate the fact from fiction by clearing up the misguided interpretations. Feel free to add to it:


1. "Melee is the sharpest game in the series"
In Sakurai's opinion, Melee has a satisfying feel to it. Does this indicate Smash 4 is going to play closer to Melee? Perhaps, but it is hardly evidence.


2. "Fans of the first Smash Bros got into (Melee) quickly" and "Melee was just too difficult"
Two statements at odds with each other if you take the second verbatim, rather than just in reference to series newcomers. The second quote out of context has contributed to unfounded conclusions about SSB4's direction.


3. "I doubt we'll ever see one that's as geared toward hardcore gamers as Melee was."
Commonly misinterpreted as a guarantee that Smash 4 will not cater to the competitive audience. All this suggests is they are not Sakuari's only concern and speaks nothing to SSB4's level of commitment.


4. Namco's Involvement
They make a lot of competitive fighting games. Their history will play into the development, but there's no telling what the end result will be or if improving on high level play was part of Sakuari's motivation.


5. “The game system itself is complete, so we don’t want to make it 3D or introduce complicated controls just for the sake of it”
Taken literally, sometimes assumed little will change and no new complexities will be added. Considered reasonably, the fundamentals of Smash will remain intact with careful consideration for anything new.

 

[Hypercat-Z]

To the fourth point: Namco actually created a game like Super Smash Bros. BEFORE Super Smash Bros:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSjsBPivFpw

So I have positive expectations by Namco involvement. Including the game being no less PG than their average ones.

 

[El Duderino]

To the fourth point: Namco actually created a game like Super Smash Bros. BEFORE Super Smash Bros.

1995 Namco did, 17 years ago. I'd be surprised if any developers on the tittle still work there, let alone influenced Sakuari's decision.