Dreamland is glitchy for Zelda

[firewingpegasus]

I've been messing around in dreamland and at first I thought something had been changed about Zelda's up-b mechanic. One thing was good and one thing was horrible. But then I realized that it's only this one stage. No other one does this. My capture card broke so I can't really post a video or gif of it, but we need to get this out there so it can be fixed XD

If Zelda does a grounded Up-B and travels the full length sideways, she reappears as if she'd been in the air. She should normally appear standing up, which happens with any shortened distance side travel. This seems like it adds a bit more lag, especially if she hits a shield upon reappearing. This whole thing is made worse by the fact that.. since she doesn't reappear on the ground, I can't seem to be able to do a ledge cancel when I reappear. It breaks the whole Zelda ledgeplay thing unless you're going for the platforms. Besides, Her ending and landing lag were bad enough as it was, so this isn't something I hope stays in.

The other thing is that when you're on a platform facing outwards from the stage, if you Up-B and hold down, Zelda travels down and then behind her. In any other stage she would travel down and outwards, which would effectively kill her since it leaves her offstage in special fall. It would come in handy to do an OOS Up-B and cancel it if it whifs, rather than going straight up or leaving yourself entirely open trying to go to the other platform.

I'd like the latter change to stay in, but only if it happens in every stage. There's no reason why it should only do it in some of them if it's something about the ledge that is pushing her backwards.

 

[BJN39]

Wait, so (By holding straight sideways.) Zelda reappears and does her landing animation instead of her grounded reappear, but like, right next to the ground?

That actually should be a really good glitch omg.

Iirc Zelda's landing animation is 29 frames long, which her grounded reappear is 39. If you don't immediately see it that means she would suffer less end lag upon doing that than normal.

Along with this an aerial FW reappear does 2% more damage, AND has higher KB. Meaning if you really are just doing an aggressive FW2, you'll get better reward if actually landed landed.

@ SBphiloz4 did you say you got this stage? If so could you look into this? This is an amusing glitch. Even though it'll most likely be fixed later on.

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

Zelda actually does do her landing animation...that's so weird but really interesting and actually kinda helpful since like BJN said aerial FW does more damage and knockback. Sniping with Farore's will cause salty kills even earlier than normal on Dreamland :^)

 

[ZombieBran]

I gotta get this stage now omg

 

[SBphiloz4]

Remember tinkering it around with the stage this morning on the 3DS version of Dreamland and this has indeed happened to me as Zelda but I thought it was just my 3DS being stupid so I ignored it lol

So it is a glitch, huh?

 

[firewingpegasus]

LESS lag??!

Omg... I seem to have gotten confused, then. I thought it was the other way around. Wow... then I guess this could work to my advantage because of the knockback, like you said.

 

[Zylach]

Now I know what stage I'm picking first in every set ever.

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

I wonder if this could make Dreamland a good stage for Zelda against mid/long range characters? She can punish from far away much harder and Dreamland has a lower vertical blast zone than Battlefield so the elevator and usmash will kill earlier

 

[BJN39]

Just don't get too excited gorls, this type of FW will still have roughly 30 frames of end lag, (While less, it's still a lot.) so if it gets blocked... X_X

 

[ZombieBran]

Just don't get too excited gorls, this type of FW will still have roughly 30 frames of end lag, (While less, it's still a lot.) so if it gets blocked... X_X

Let us have this moment

 

[Rickster]

I think picking Dreamland against projectile spammers will really help. You just need to make sure you know their pattern! Then...snipe em'.

 

[TheDarkKnightNoivern]

Does this still apply to the omega version of Dreamland?

 

[firewingpegasus]

It's not a glitch in the Omega version.

I'd like to point out that the original reason I thought this was a bad thing, however, was because the ledge cancelling (which is my main method of ledge guarding) doesn't seem to work, since Zelda just falls.. Has anyone been able to FW ledge cancel there? I mean, it works on the platforms but that's not as useful...

 

[AncientCode42]

This sounds interesting, although I don't have this stage yet. I'm not sure if it helps her or hinders her though.

 

[Rickster]

I'd like to add that if you ledge cancel by running off a platform and teleporting before you hit the main platform, ledge cancelling still works. But the standard grounded ledge cancel doesn't.

Hopefully that made some sort of sense...think back to how D3RK ledge cancelled in his ledge cancel video on Battlefield. That's what I mean.

 

[firewingpegasus]

@ Rickster I guess it works with the aerial one because you're not using a full distance straight one.

Either way, FW is a crazy, crazy move lol. Its properties were already a bit wacky, now in Dreamland it's just all over the place as for how it works and... doesn't.

I wonder how long we'll have to put up with this , or what direction they'll take when thee correct this in a patch. I would love to keep the aerial hitbox since it's supposed to be better, as well as the anti-falling-off thing when you teleport downwards from a platform... On the other hand, I think I'd give those up if it meant being able to do a normal FW ledge cancel on it.

I don't think I'd wanna choose this stage in a tournament because it takes away something I'm able to use everywhere else.The bonus you get (sniping) isn't enough of a recompense in my opinion, since at high level play it wouldn't connect too often. Most people see the port coming.. Also, getting used to not SD'ing from platforms would be dangerous when going back to battlefield or something..

 

[Rickster]

It's likely not widely known that this happens because
1. lolzelda
2. It might actually be missed by spectators in a match since it's kinda subtle and no one knows Zelda's animations except those who actually use her (read:barely anyone)

I find this useful since aerial FW is so powerful. Good for MUs like Link and Samus. That's just me though. I don't ledge cancel often since I'm afraid of messing it up.

 

[firewingpegasus]

Even the friends I normally play with all the time didn't notice it. I had to stop a match and explain to them very slowly why I was freaking out. So yeah... no one would notice it >_<

hmm... maybe we should keep it a secret? lol. On a match up per match up basis, you're right. It'd be a lot better to attack a projectile user with a higher reward than normal in this stage. Basically giving up one thing for the other in a stage. That's not too different from counter-picking other stages. It's just a hidden advantage in this one that's Zelda-specific. Which is like... a shiny unicorn

 

[evmaxy54]

I can definitely see this getting patched eventually :/

 

[Rickster]

Maybe it was just a super secret buff

 

[Kyogokudo]

http://gfycat.com/RegalIckyArctichare
Side by side comparison I made. I'm not a pro at that kind of stuff so it's not perfect.
Looking at this I doubt there's any changes to the number of lag frames.

 

[BJN39]

http://gfycat.com/RegalIckyArctichare
Side by side comparison I made. I'm not a pro at that kind of stuff so it's not perfect.
Looking at this I doubt there's any changes to the number of lag frames.

Oh, I guess you're right! The amount of time she spends airborne BEFORE activating her landind lag is long enough to make it roughly the same as a grounded reappear. I was just using the direct data of landing frames vs ground reappear without any possible delayed landing so I guess I'm not surprised.

That said, at least the aerial version IS more powerful :D and people might mess up their DI (IF you actually manage to land this.) due to ground and aerial reappear having slightly differing survival DI angles. If you DI correctly to survive grounded reappear you can die earlier from the aerial one.

 

[Zylach]

She also moves forward more due to the momentum carrying her as she "falls." I guess that means we won't get insta-shield grabbed since it ought to go behind the opponent? Just trying to be positive here...

 

[Rickster]

Aw, that's a little disappointing.

Also I figured out that if you hold diagonally towards the stage (like you want to shorten the grounded teleport distance) she'll do the regular grounded reappear animation.

 

[Tino]

Interesting find right there. Although you can bet your ass Nintendo will patch that up if they see it.

 

[Genuine_Angus_B33F]

Want me to make this LESS exciting?
You can't edge cancel Up-B on dreamland because of this very bug.

 

[BJN39]

Want me to make this LESS exciting?
You can't edge cancel Up-B on dreamland because of this very bug.

Of course. I think it was even mentioned here...?

It's a double edged sword. Your reappear will do more damage and require different DI than the ground version, but you cannot ledge cancel. It's honestly w/e and we're pretty much waiting for it to be bugfixed in a patch. It's only one stage at least. All the others can still be ledge cancelled on.

 

[Rickster]

You can ledge cancel but you have to start the teleport in the air rather than on the ground. For some reason the aerial version doesn't have that "reappear slightly above the ground" thing.

Well, unless they patched it out or something.