Do Falcon Mainers Believe that Falcon is the worst in this game?

[gallax]

i dont main falcon but i if i had to say who was the worst i would have to say yoshi. it is really early to tell right now but falcon will prob move up from being the worst. his knee takes more precise aim now but it still has a good knockback if done right. zelda also has a smaller hitbox with her fair/bair but it is still a good move.

 

[A2ZOMG]

hey, why all the samus hate
I know she was nerfed big from melee especially in timing and ko moves, but I still think her zair and missile combos at least help her above falcon, ganon, yoshi, and sonic..... i mean judging by how many characters she has advantages over tournament-wise... is more than either of them...

Samus is indeed above bottom tier, I'll agree.

I dun really think she's any better than low tier though. Sure she can camp reasonably with her low priority missiles and Z-air. She has trouble grabbing and she doesn't have too many good kill options either, and if she's forced to approach, she's quite bad at doing that.

I hated Spamus n00bs back in Melee lol. Funny how Samus's projectile game is worse than it was in Melee. I mean in Brawl. The game that promotes camping. XD

Okay Falcon > Ivysaur at least srsly.

Neither has truly good kill options. Ivysaur has range and priority, but it's less safe on block anyway since it's a lot laggier and much worse at doing damage. Also, it dies if it goes 20 feet from the stage.

It's funny, IIRC I'm probably like one of the first persons on SWF to say Falcon was THE worst character, but now it's me who's most actively trying to say he isn't at the tier discussion. =)

 

[GotACoolName]

Sonic IS like Falcon though. Only a lighter, smaller, shorter-reaching, higher UpB-ing version. Both can chase like no one else. Both have a hard time killing (Falcon has an easier time now). Both rely on edgeguarding and both are good at it (Sonic may be a little better but he has to depend on it more than Falcon now). Both have multiple recovery options (Falcon SideB and UpB, Sonic B and UpB). Falcon has better smashes. Falcon has a more USEFUL UpB overall. Overall Falcon and Sonic have the same problems, but Falcon is a little bit better at a few things which puts him a slot above Sonic.

Yeah... except their moves are completely different.

What astounds me is how so many characters are so underestimated in their abilities. In my experience with the "worst of the worst" characters, none of them feel like the worst of the worst. To me, Peach, Sheik, Samus, Yoshi, Sonic, and Ganondorf all have a ton of potential. The only one whom I just cannot see any hope for is Captain Falcon. There's no doubt in my mind anymore that he's the worst character in the game. As much as I love him, he's just horrible. He has absolutely nothing going for him.

 

[Hive]

Samus is indeed above bottom tier, I'll agree.

I dun really think she's any better than low tier though. Sure she can camp reasonably with her low priority missiles and Z-air. She has trouble grabbing and she doesn't have too many good kill options either, and if she's forced to approach, she's quite bad at doing that.

I hated Spamus n00bs back in Melee lol. Funny how Samus's projectile game is worse than it was in Melee. I mean in Brawl. The game that promotes camping. XD

Oh no no.. I'm not saying she's above low tier... just not bottom.... she has a lot of trouble with kill moves, and her slow decent makes her vulnerable to juggling (she can still DI with bomb jumps... but still...)

I think its funny how many people bandwagoned her in melee ^^, and now basically she is one of the least used...

 

[SkaManifesto]

ARe you people stupid!??! Captain Falcon is the ****. I mean seriously, all you have to do is take the time to learn him and he is awsome. Get yo heads outta the gutter!

 

[talkingbeatles]

Okay Falcon > Ivysaur at least srsly.

Neither has truly good kill options. Ivysaur has range and priority, but it's less safe on block anyway since it's a lot laggier and much worse at doing damage. Also, it dies if it goes 20 feet from the stage.

Man, have you see Ivysaur's usmash? It's insane. It kills at crazy low percent. Ivysaur doesn't have good kill moves my ***. Don't get above that pokemon.

 

[gallax]

dont forget that when talking about the lowest tier charcter you have to take into effect how mony good matchups they have to how many bad matchups they have. overall, i think yoshi has the fewest good matchups( i heard he was a snake counter but i think this may have been a joke).

falcon is not going to be the worst. ivysaur is pretty bad and easy to kill, and he does have at least one priority move...but so does falcon. never heard of the falcon punch, or the sweet spotted knee? im sure the fsmash of falcon is pretty good too. overall, i think falcon>ivysaur. this is just my opinion though. i am not an expert on ivysaur though so this opinion is just from what i seen others do.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Man, have you see Ivysaur's usmash? It's insane. It kills at crazy low percent. Ivysaur doesn't have good kill moves my ***. Don't get above that pokemon.

Ivysaur's U-smash is one of those attacks that you will almost never land. It's slow and laggy, and Ivysaur isn't very good at setting up into that. I mean if Ivysaur had very good techchase setups, maybe it would be really cool.

The F-smash IIRC might be Ivysaur's best kill move, but if it misses then Ivysaur gets punished a lot. The U-air and D-air both are laggy and easy to see coming. Vine Whip needs to be sweetspotted to kill.

Falcon is in a similar boat since he has some attacks that have very good KO power, but that are extremely difficult to land. Falcon however survives much longer than Ivysaur.

 

[illinialex24]

Jigglypuff actually had some stuff improved from melee to brawl. Rollout, drill resting, and pound have all become amazing now. Sure, rest is much weaker and the hit stun sucks, but she still can dominate Falcon

 

[ROOOOY!]

I play both Sonic and Falcon, but Sonic is leagues better, at least he can approach people. He also has a better aerial and edgeguarding game, better 'comboing' game, better recovery, better attack speed, and I've probably missed stuff out. People do understimate Captain Falcon's recovery though, but his killing moves are just so hard to land it's not funny.
I couldn't place Jiggz below him, or Sonic, or Sheik. Could be above Ganon for (on the whole) less laggier moves, but that's debatable.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

People do understimate Captain Falcon's recovery though, but his killing moves are just so hard to land it's not funny.

They aren't that hard to land if you know where to look.

 

[ROOOOY!]

Man, have you see Ivysaur's usmash? It's insane. It kills at crazy low percent. Ivysaur doesn't have good kill moves my ***. Don't get above that pokemon.

And that happening would be like someone standing still for three whole seconds so you can Falcon Punch them.

And I don't so much mean 'killing moves', I mean attacks that'll actually do decent damage and knockback. F-smash has a fair amount of starting lag, Falcon Punching isn't really that useful in many situations, and little old me is still trying to get used to the new F-air sweetspot.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Try Bairing and Spikes.

 

[_Xanatos_]

I don't know who's worse than he is, but I do know that Falcon can be pretty good if used well.

 

[KeyKid19]

Anyone who thinks Jiggs is worst in the game needs to stop posting.

Yoshi is bad. Ganondorf is bad. Samus is bad. Sonic is bad. Falcon is bad. Jigglypuff is not as bad as any of the aforementioned in my opinion.

BTW Kid that argued that Sonic's mindgames make him a better character than Falcon needs that mindgames do NOT fall under character ability. At all. That's like a Melee Pichu player who can wavedash telling a Melee Fox player who can't wavedash that his character is better because his can wavedash. Breaking news, every character in Melee can wavedash and every character in any fighting game ever can "mindgame."

Also, at the random Yoshi homeboy, just because a character is a counter to a few good characters doesn't make him good. Besides, all I have to do is footstool Yoshi and he's dead at 0%. His recovery is almost as bad as that of Ivysaur and Olimar. I don't even have to attack him to edgeguard him, all I have to do is jump off the stage towards him and mash the jump buttons.

The point is that all of the bad characters ARE bad for whatever reasons apply to them. No argument is going to change that even though some of the posters in here feel they can do so.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I play both Sonic and Falcon, but Sonic is leagues better, at least he can approach people.

His approaches as far as I'm concerned rely on the mistakes of his opponents. That's pretty terrible. Unless you can tell me that Sonic's grab range is significantly better than Falcon's (and lol, Falcon will beat that with an Up-B out of shield), I really don't think he's better at approaching.

Sonic uses spin dashes and fakes people out with run speed, Up-B and stuff. Falcon actually can spam D-airs to pressure shields or hurt people, and his Falcon kick actually has GOOD priority (beats MK's Tornado).

He also has a better aerial and edgeguarding game

Not really since Falcon's U-air is better than ANY of Sonic's aerials. B-airs I'd say are about the same. Sonic's F-air is less situational, but doesn't really kill so much. Falcon's D-air is slightly better since he can autocancel it. Both have bad N-airs. Ledgeguarding is debatable, but Falcon can ledgeguard really well with U-air semispiking and his Up-B can strongly deter recovering opponents so he's not really losing that much if at all.

better 'comboing' game, better recovery, better attack speed, and I've probably missed stuff out.

I kinda agree for the most part. But Falcon does have good combos from autocanceled D-airs, techchase setups AND combos from F-air sourspot, he's a lot heavier so he lives longer, and his attacks have slightly more priority, and signficantly more range.

People do understimate Captain Falcon's recovery though, but his killing moves are just so hard to land it's not funny.

True, but Sonic's kill moves are not really easier to land since he has less range, and they are weaker. Falcon in fact pretty much kills with the same attacks Sonic does (U-air, B-air, F-smash, D-smash) and a little more (D-air to F-air combo, Up-B, sometimes U-smash, yeah).

That's my take on Falcon vs Sonic.

 

[Tenki]

A2ZOMG is too good

._.; I don't know if you've ever actually played Sonic (as / against), or if you're just going to go off on what other people say all the time lol.

His approaches as far as I'm concerned rely on the mistakes of his opponents. That's pretty terrible. Unless you can tell me that Sonic's grab range is significantly better than Falcon's (and lol, Falcon will beat that with an Up-B out of shield), I really don't think he's better at approaching.

----------
Just to add some variety to your idea of Sonic's approach game. Sonic's B-air has IASA frames, longer reach/priority than most of Sonic's moves. I'll discuss that in the next point.

I personally prefer SH f-air, spinshot, spring, or spindash based entries though. But that's just me.

I tested in training mode, and Sonic's grab outranges Falcon's. Combine that with his faster running speed and I think it's safe to effectively say that Sonic has better grab range overall. You know, kinda like a tether grab when the opponent has landing lag >_>
----------

Sonic uses spin dashes and fakes people out with run speed, Up-B and stuff. Falcon actually can spam D-airs to pressure shields or hurt people, and his Falcon kick actually has GOOD priority (beats MK's Tornado).

Things like SH B-air>Fsmash can pressure shields or provide something along the lines of a "2 hit" KO move (er... something that kinda works like a Sheik Fsmash)

Aerial down-B does shield pressure as well, since it does multiple hits.

Falcon kick leaves you in stun so you can't do anything if you hit or miss. But it is a nice retaliation attack, when opponents are running at you or somethin

Not really since Falcon's U-air is better than ANY of Sonic's aerials. B-airs I'd say are about the same. Sonic's F-air is less situational, but doesn't really kill so much. Falcon's D-air is slightly better since he can autocancel it. Both have bad N-airs. Ledgeguarding is debatable, but Falcon can ledgeguard really well with U-air semispiking and his Up-B can strongly deter recovering opponents so he's not really losing that much if at all.

...

I kinda agree for the most part. But Falcon does have good combos from autocanceled D-airs, techchase setups AND combos from F-air sourspot, he's a lot heavier so he lives longer, and his attacks have slightly more priority, and signficantly more range.

Spring projectile (fall can be tech'd) > D-air autocancel > jab lock
Spring projectile > d-air autocancel > f-tilt (true combo)
Spring projectile > D-air (hit) - true combo that sets up for juggles.

Techchase : D-throw

They do NOT play similarly, so their moves have different uses >_> If you can tell, Sonic's D-air is used less often as an attack and more as a movement tool. Off-stage, it's an amazing gimp tool though. It's got a low trajectory/"semi-spike" as well, except it can go either toward the stage (enemy behind you) or away from stage (enemy in front of you), so it can be used to stage spike or gimp.

I'm not sure why you make the weight comment, since Falcon is considerably easier to hit than Sonic, size and escape moves taken into account. Anyway, here is how they deal with a Sonic Fsmash from the center of FD:

Sonic dies at 113%
Falcon dies at 121%

Big difference.

Priority/range is obviously something that Falcon has more of.

True, but Sonic's kill moves are not really easier to land since he has less range, and they are weaker. Falcon in fact pretty much kills with the same attacks Sonic does (U-air, B-air, F-smash, D-smash) and a little more (D-air to F-air combo, Up-B, sometimes U-smash, yeah).

That's my take on Falcon vs Sonic.

True Combo B-air finisher moves (not all are listed here >_>):
Spindash > jump+ B-air
U-throw > spring + B-air

One is an "inescapable" combo, and one can be DI'd. I personally like the 2nd one, since it's just too cool- kills off the ceiling OR the sides.

Kinda like Ganon's F-air, B-air has good knockback either way, but it also has a 'sweetspot' (timing-based, beginning of move/closer to Sonic) that has stronger knockback.

He's got alot of variety in how he moves or sets up for moves like that.

~.~; Whether Sonic is worse than Falcon, I don't care, since winning is generally down to how good the players are, but I'm starting to see why ShadowLink sounds pissed off at you all the time... lol.

May this post shine in infamy:

Uh no. I don't think Sonic has real combos unless I missed something. The combos I've been telling you actually raise the combo counter in training mode. Those are the ones you need to keep track of.

lololol

-----------
PS.
vvv "i can't use sonic so he must suck" lololol

 

[Astinos]

For some reason I can compete with good Metaknights/Marths with Ganon/Falcon, but I can't with any of the "decent" characters. Sonic is worse than Falcon IMO, he's just too awkward.

 

[ROOOOY!]

His approaches as far as I'm concerned rely on the mistakes of his opponents. That's pretty terrible. Unless you can tell me that Sonic's grab range is significantly better than Falcon's (and lol, Falcon will beat that with an Up-B out of shield), I really don't think he's better at approaching.

This makes Baby Jesus cry. Side B, SH Fair and Bair and Spinshots say hi at the very least and they're not really dependant on your opponent screwing up.
And on testing today, Sonic's grab range IS better than Falcon's.

So...yeah...

Edit : Just read Tenki's post, bigfatlol. I was going to update this post later with arguments when I could be arsed, but he's got that down to a T.
Congrats.

 

[Kitamerby]

Ivysaur's U-smash is one of those attacks that you will almost never land. It's slow and laggy, and Ivysaur isn't very good at setting up into that. I mean if Ivysaur had very good techchase setups, maybe it would be really cool.

The F-smash IIRC might be Ivysaur's best kill move, but if it misses then Ivysaur gets punished a lot. The U-air and D-air both are laggy and easy to see coming. Vine Whip needs to be sweetspotted to kill.

Falcon is in a similar boat since he has some attacks that have very good KO power, but that are extremely difficult to land. Falcon however survives much longer than Ivysaur.

;-;

Ivysaur at least has Bullet Seed, range, good grabs, and Bullet Seed. Did I mention Ivysaur has Bullet Seed yet?

 

[Someone7]

Sonic can go halfway across Final D with a smash-boost. This alone makes his approach way, way better than anything Craptain Falcon can do.

None of the characters mentioned as bad seem anywhere close to the level of crapticality as Craptain Falcon has. He is definitely much worse than anyone else, as he has basically nothing at all going for him. He is just god awful.

 

[Iwan]

I've actually been using Ganondorf a lot lately, and I've gotten pretty **** good with him (he really does combo...really really well), but it's still too hard to say who's "better".

I've gotten used to switching from Ganon to falcon, and back to Ganon then back to falcon, and they're really different. I love Ganondorf because you can literally kill someone in 5-6 hits. And it isn't hard at all to chain attacks together...leading it all into a satisfying KO.

Captain Falcon has way more speed, i love his dash grab so much, and Dthrow>>whatever move you want is awesome. Really...I'm still a captain main, for sure, but my "Captain is definitely better than ganondorf" stance has changed.

I can't say which ones better...how the hell do the official tiers ever come to completion? In the case of Ganon VS Falcon, there's things that make them good, and things that make them bad....but I honestly couldn't put one ahead of the other in terms of "Falcon is better than Ganon"...or vice versa.

As for sonic...lol don't care. I've seen people be great with him. Like really really good. Good to the point of me saying to myself "Oh ****, I'm definitely gona pick up Sonic."

Then i pick him up, and i just absolutely hate him. I'll always think he sucks, not because people can't be successful competitively with him, but because he just really doesn't fit my play sytle. I suck so bad with sonice....sooooo bad.

/rant

 

[A2ZOMG]

._.; I don't know if you've ever actually played Sonic (as / against), or if you're just going to go off on what other people say all the time lol.

Actually I'm going by what I've heard from other people who I know play competitively (like Inui), so let's see what you say. I've not attended any tourneys yet so anything I say is based on what I see from matchups on youtube or from what SWF has to offer.

Just to add some variety to your idea of Sonic's approach game. Sonic's B-air has IASA frames, longer reach/priority than most of Sonic's moves. I'll discuss that in the next point.

I personally prefer SH f-air, spinshot, spring, or spindash based entries though. But that's just me.

I tested in training mode, and Sonic's grab outranges Falcon's. Combine that with his faster running speed and I think it's safe to effectively say that Sonic has better grab range overall. You know, kinda like a tether grab when the opponent has landing lag >_>

Oh, well I guess you got me on grab range. Grab range is in fact a big deal which is why I brought that up. <<

Things like SH B-air>Fsmash can pressure shields or provide something along the lines of a "2 hit" KO move (er... something that kinda works like a Sheik Fsmash)

Aerial down-B does shield pressure as well, since it does multiple hits.

Falcon kick leaves you in stun so you can't do anything if you hit or miss. But it is a nice retaliation attack, when opponents are running at you or somethin

Huh, I also like the way Falcon can pressure shields with autocanceled D-airs. But I guess what Sonic has there isn't too bad...

Didn't know about the Down B

Well the key about the Falcon kick is to use it when you are close enough to them since generally it will pull you far behind the opponent where it is difficult to be punished. It probably isn't getting shieldgrabbed since it's not telegraphed to that point. Also it's a 1 hit 14% attack which is good.

Spring projectile (fall can be tech'd) > D-air autocancel > jab lock
Spring projectile > d-air autocancel > f-tilt (true combo)
Spring projectile > D-air (hit) - true combo that sets up for juggles.

Oh yeah, I forgot, Sonic can jab lock.

When does the D-air autocancel? O_o

They do NOT play similarly, so their moves have different uses >_> If you can tell, Sonic's D-air is used less often as an attack and more as a movement tool. Off-stage, it's an amazing gimp tool though. It's got a low trajectory/"semi-spike" as well, except it can go either toward the stage (enemy behind you) or away from stage (enemy in front of you), so it can be used to stage spike or gimp.

Movement tool yeah I've seen that. Actually I have not seen anyone use Sonic's D-air to gimp. <<

I'm not sure why you make the weight comment, since Falcon is considerably easier to hit than Sonic, size and escape moves taken into account. Anyway, here is how they deal with a Sonic Fsmash from the center of FD:

Sonic dies at 113%
Falcon dies at 121%

Big difference.

oic.

*shrug* thought Falcon survived longer. Guess not.

~.~; Whether Sonic is worse than Falcon, I don't care, since winning is generally down to how good the players are, but I'm starting to see why ShadowLink sounds pissed off at you all the time... lol.

May this post shine in infamy:

lololol

-----------
PS.
vvv "i can't use sonic so he must suck" lololol

Well thanks for not being so pissed off and telling me the way you think it is. =P

 

[IcantWin]

Not the worst in the game, but yes, very bad as much as I hate saying it.

Thats why I play Snake at tournaments /lawlerz

 

[Ayaz18]

wayyyyyyy bad, no denying he's bottom tier, worst of the worst....................

But boy does it feel good to beat a top tier with him lol

 

[ptown]

if you guys think falcon sucks, then you're dumb.

 

[Tenki]

forgiven xd

Actually I'm going by what I've heard from other people who I know play competitively (like Inui), so let's see what you say. I've not attended any tourneys yet so anything I say is based on what I see from matchups on youtube or from what SWF has to offer.

I actually haven't gone to any tourneys yet either, and atm I'm more of a move/matchup analyst (generally, for Sonic and sometimes my other characters of interest). I'm slowly trying to find mainers for each character on wifi (hopefully with little-no lag, and I've been quite successful so far) to get exposure to peoples' playstyles and actual matchup info myself while developing my own playstyle. Many youtube videos are kinda... outdated.

Didn't know about the Down B

If you've ever heard a Sonic player refer to ASC, that's Aerial Spin Charge (Air Down-B). It's too good - can be shield cancelled on landing, do 18 damage if you can get 2+ aerial hits to connect, then add more for a combo aerial... yeah. It's also the starting move for the combos that I've been featuring in those pictures lol.

When does the D-air autocancel? O_o

Movement tool yeah I've seen that. Actually I have not seen anyone use Sonic's D-air to gimp. <<

A simple way to auto cancel D-air is to use spring, delay a bit until Sonic gets near the top of the jump (he gains control before the top), then use D-air. Another way is to jump first then spring+d-air ASAP.

I use D-air pretty often often. Personally, I still gotta work on accuracy, because stage spiking is so much cooler than semispike gimping XD

@.@;

Back on topic, Falcon's jab combo racks up damage at a surprising rate for... jabs... lol.
I'm not a Falcon main, but I think a little more move variety and you guys just might find some good points to him x]

I've found good points (offstage game, spiking, pun(ch)isment), but I'm not familiar enough with Falcon's metagame to see just how important it is to that.

 

[vills]

............

 

[Sh1n0b1]

if you guys think falcon sucks, then you're dumb.

How many times have you played as Falcon? Once? Twice?

 

[BEES]

I see potential in Falcon's metagame but yeah, at the moment, things look pretty bad.

And no, Sonic is not the worst character in the game. He moves around and kills unconventionally, but once you figure out how to do those, he is relatively average.

 

[Magus-Cie]

if you guys think falcon sucks, then you're dumb.

The eloquence of your agruement....amazing. Falcon is truly a bad character, just as in GDorf, but they are still fun to play. And it takes a superior player to beat other characters using GDorf or CFalcon.

 

[Airwalkerr]

It may not always come down to higher skill level, but I like to believe so. Snake may always win tourneys, but its just so much more fun to enter as Jigglypuff or Falcon, and kill as many Snakes, Wolfs and MK's as you can, going out in a blaze of glory.

 

[Tonyman]

Landing a sweetspotted knee is not as satisfying as it was in Melee, but he sure is still fun to play as, i used to main him in Melee, this time i started wiht him, but quickly changed him. But tbh, i have no idea about the tiers and where he could be at, since i almost never use the chars that i dont 'main', so i couldnt judge for him being the lowest or anyone else.

 

[FAILchion-]

Sad to say, Capt. Falcon took a heavy dive into Bottom/Low Tier. But I definitely don't think he's THE worst. I might be wrong, but I say Capt. Falcon is slightly better than Ganondorf. Capt. Falcon is also better than Jigglypuff, no matter what perspective seen through. I don't say this like the common "omg jiggly sucks lol" person; she really isn't as good in this game. In Melee, Jigglypff was secks. In Brawl, she can get by, but Capt. Falcon is better.

I definitely find Capt. Falcon fun to use and everything, but it saddens me deeply to see him crash and burn like this. By some miracle, I hope someone finds a hidden technique that can boost him out of the position he is now. x.x

 

[Y34HDUD3!!!]

Nope. Ganondorf's the worst imo. What a shame. I hope Sakurai, Metaknight, and Snake die.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Ganondorf isn't worse than Falcon, at least for now. I'd say at this point he and Falcon are about even in terms of usability. BUT:

Ganondorf's autocanceling D-airs BREAKS SHIELDS (broken shield = free Warlock Punch). A D-air to U-smash does over 40%, and even if the person DIs away from the U-smash, it has such good IASA frames you can cancel it into anything to make it unpunishable.

Ganondorf also gets to approach with a grab that gets guaranteed combos into jabs, F-tilts, and D-tilts, OR techchases. Two of those attacks can kill easily at the right percents.

Plus Ganondorf can kill with everything else, even his super fast Dash attack which has amazing priority over so many projectiles.

 

[FAILchion-]

Ganondorf's Thunder Storm (or Stomp/D-Air), and the reverse Warlock Punch, imo, are his only trump cards of winning, contrasted to Melee, where he was an overall great character, despite being a clone. Capt. Falcon got madly nerfed, but I still think Capt. Falcon is better than Ganondorf. You have to have crazy accuracy, timing, and spacing if you want everything to go as planned with Ganondorf. Plus, Capt. Falcon's grabs and throws are nothing to laugh at, especially the D-Throw. Your choices are freely expanded if you perform that move.

 

[eMORAY21]

I wouldn't say worst, but yeah he does suck.

 

[Mr. Spam & Death]

Nah I don't think he's the worst, I don't think he sux that bad either, I think the only thing he lacks is priority.

 

[BUNI]

Oooh, I don't think he's the worst.
People are silly. I think Sonic, Sheik, Samus, and maybe Link, are all worse.

but again, I main him. He is not the worst. Or if he is, I'm **** good with him.

wow you put samus in there, i dont know about the others but Samus is far from low tier, go Zair!