Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[N3ON]

Like it's really weird we all singled out characters like Cloud back then when our first third party in Smash ever was Solid freaking Snake.

People really liked to invoke the "Kojima begged Sakurai" anecdote to stress how it was an exception, didn't they. Though also people would raise that Snake's presence on Nintendo systems was, granted, much better than Cloud's.

Also something which has been seemingly lost to time was just how polarizing Snake really was, and how many people thought he didn't fit, which didn't really go away until Cloud and Bayo showed up.

Something something "Cloud's a Sony character! Final Fantasy 7 was never on a Nintendo Console!"

And by now you'd think people would learn that anything was possible smh
Some may have. Especially with the monumental brick that hit us that is Sora. But some are still like "Nah fam ___ will still never happen lol"

Yeah but the fanbase still doesn't anticipate things for which there's little precedent. Look at Sephiroth. It's easy to look back and laugh but we still carry on the same principle, so...

This is the era where Megaman was too similar to Samus due to both having arm cannons, one can't expect competent thought.

Y'know that wasn't actually a point treated with a lot of credence though. Half the time it was said in jest. It's like when someone says Crash is too similar to [insert cartoony animal mascot]. It's just detraction fodder, not common so much as memorable.

For a third-party, most people did not see Mega Man having any major obstacles. If anything, Sakurai not being able to land Capcom (a funny thought in retrospect) was more common than a serious "Mega Man is too similar to Samus" post. Or the fact that Mega Man was being buried alive at the time Sakurai would approach them for his use.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

The interesting logic here is that you acknowledge the fact that we frankly don't know how well Geno did or didn't do in the ballot, yet I've been seeing tons of posts from you and others claiming that he straight-up did poorly. Do we have any actual evidence of a poor turnout or could his lack of inclusion have simply been a symptom of Nintendo/SE not seeing him as a strategic priority? I mean, the fact that he got a costume at all compared to a lot of other characters out there suggests he had to have had at least a noteworthy turnout. I feel that a lot of the "oh, guess nobody voted for him when it counted" statement is simply a biased assumption. That's not to say he was top 5 or anything, but my point is that if we don't know something, maybe it's better to simply acknowledge that fact instead of speculating about a fanbase's alleged shortcomings.

We don't know how well Geno did in the actual ballot, but fan polling from the time can tell you that Geno's performance at the time was...whelming.

• In this poll on opinions popular Ballot character requests from Source Gaming, Geno ranks an average 2.65 out of 5 in favorability, below characters such as Takamaru, Ray MK, and New Mii Class among other, more notable requests. That's certainly underwhelming.
• Geno is acknowledged as a popular Japanese fan pick circa 2015 in this Source Gaming article, yet in another article with collected data from the same year Geno barely makes the top 10 most popular Japanese picks, falling far behind the top 3 of K. Rool, Wolf, and Roy.
• Admittedly, Geno shows up on a popular image list of Ballot "frontrunners," (the Reddit post is from 2018, but I remember this going around in 2015) but this list covers such a broad amount of characters (Machamp, Hawlucha, Rundas, and Abraham Lincoln are also frontrunners, and no one talked about those characters) and doesn't have rankings within them, so we can't tell how the creator of this image measured popularity.
• A consolidation of individual character votes in a Smash 4 Ballot exit poll shows Geno just out of the Top 10 at number 13 total, and performing moderately well for a third party pick, being number 6 for third parties.

These two ballots come from 2018, but I think they show the variability of Geno's popularity well enough to possibly speak to his ballot performance.

• Geno does do well in this ballot, taking place in 2018, but from another 2018 Source Gaming Ballot (taken when Ultimate was just Smash for Switch), Geno doesn't even make Top 15, falling behind other third party picks like Shovel Knight, Bomberman, and Shantae.

So, overall Geno's popularity wasn't bad, though he fell behind other notable Ballot choices of the time such as veterans and third parties such as Shantae and Shovel Knight.

You'd think this is a "gotcha!" to those saying that Geno might've underperformed, but an important thing to consider is that all of the above polls inherently fall subject to sampling bias, as none of them broke out of core Nintendo communities. We know that Geno's popularity wasn't bad in core Nintendo communities, but:

• a) He was far from a top choice as compared to his performance in Smash Ultimate DLC ballots, and
• b) We have no way of gauging his popularity otherwise.

Compared to other characters who garnered significant support both within core Nintendo communities and within established fanbases outside of those (e.g. Sora, Shantae, K. Rool, the Belmonts, etc.), I don't think it's an unreasonable claim to say that Geno underperformed in the Ballot and was unable to break through to Nintendo executives in the same way that major Ballot picks did.

 

[Opossum]

I think a big part of why K. Rool gets associated with the Brawl era so much is because while he wasn't a big request until Diddy got in, he became one immediately afterwards. Like by 2009 or so he was already a mainstay on damn near every Smash 4 prediction or wishlist roster. So it was like...missing the bus and then hopping into a space shuttle to make up for lost time. Like, nyoooom. Immediately having a built in support base.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Ultimates Stages are probably one of the best represented aspects, yet there are still a few I’d like to see.

1. Courtroom - Ace Attorney
If we can’t get Nick as a fighter, I’d like a stage. Just a simple layout where each side of the stage randomly chooses a Prosecutor or Attorney to battle it out in the background. Also AA music would absolutely be banger in Smash.

2. The Underground -Undertale
Imagine a traveling stage going through Snowdin, Waterfall, Hotland, and ending in the Judgement Hall. Imagine that music as well. I just want more Undertale content.

This one is weird, but hear me out.

3. LSD Dream Emulator
Would probably be the most unique stage in the game. So many strange locals to fight through it’d be like Electroplankton on roids.

LSD Dream Emulator

CULTURE

and inb4 Sora’s code name really is Sky

though Dream fits too

 

[Opossum]

CULTURE

and inb4 Sora’s code name really is Sky

though Dream fits too

Dream can't be the codename because if it was, it would've been used for Steve, clearly.

 

[N3ON]

I think a big part of why K. Rool gets associated with the Brawl era so much is because while he wasn't a big request until Diddy got in, he became one immediately afterwards. Like by 2009 or so he was already a mainstay on damn near every Smash 4 prediction or wishlist roster. So it was like...missing the bus and then hopping into a space shuttle to make up for lost time. Like, nyoooom. Immediately having a built in support base.

This makes me think of getting a new Star Fox game w/ Krystal, a new FE game with Lyn, or a new Golden Sun announced, and just instantly watching those respective characters be treated as "the last big Brawl request" lmao.

 

[Shroob]

Dream can't be the codename because if it was, it would've been used for Steve, clearly.

This dlc cycle sure doesn't feel like a speedrun, I'll tell you that much.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Dream can't be the codename because if it was, it would've been used for Steve, clearly.

Oh God

****ing Dream

his fans aren’t much better

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

This dlc cycle sure doesn't feel like a speedrun, I'll tell you that much.

But surely we can all agree that the odds of getting Joker, Hero, Banjo, Terry, Steve, Sephiroth, Kazuya, and Sora are 1 in 7.5 trillion

 

[Shroob]

But can we agree that the odds of getting Joker, Hero, Banjo, Terry, Steve, Sephiroth, Kazuya, and Sora are 1 in 7.5 trillion?

Something something

Joker

Something something

Masks

 

[Dinoman96]

This makes me think of getting a new Star Fox game w/ Krystal, a new FE game with Lyn, or a new Golden Sun announced, and just instantly watching those respective characters be treated as "the last big Brawl request" lmao.

I said this once and I'll say it again: most Smash fanbases really are just the result of bandwagoning.

Popular third party characters gets a new game on Switch? Gotta support them (Crash, Dante, Doomguy, etc)
Character appears in new game/games? Gotta support them (Krystal back in Brawl, Ashley in Ultimate, Palutena in Smash 4, etc)
Character has had backing from an official spokesperson from their shareholder or well, Sakurai himself? Gotta support them (Geno, Banjo, etc)

The truth is that more often than not, people aren't really gonna be pushing for characters unless they have an actual reason to believe that they're likely or at least possible.

 

[PeridotGX]

Here's a link to the brawl speculation area

Brawl Character Discussion

This is the place for all discussion concerning the various characters in Super Smash Brothers Brawl.

smashboards.com

some very interesting things here... the Masked Man was big back then.

 

[Opossum]

Here's a link to the brawl speculation area

Brawl Character Discussion

This is the place for all discussion concerning the various characters in Super Smash Brothers Brawl.

smashboards.com

some very interesting things here... the Masked Man was big back then.

Masked Man's popularity continued well after Brawl, and to my recollection didn't begin to peter out until around 2012-ish.

 

[PeridotGX]

Masked Man's popularity continued well after Brawl, and to my recollection didn't begin to peter out until around 2012-ish.

the mayans were right - the end of masked man support is almost as bad as the end of the world, i can see how they mixed the two up.

 

[DarthEnderX]

What stages would you all want the most in the game if you could add some?

Bring back any still missing stages. I want Everywhere Is Here!

But top 3? Poke Floats, Pac-Maze, Rainbow Road.

-Homecoming Hijinx from DKC: Tropical Freeze.

-Grassland Groove from DKC Tropical Freeze

Windmill Hills you goddamn philistines!!

Well, now that Krud's in (that's the prototype name of K. Rool), does that mean we should expect a big heap of Dixie hype next game?

I feel like that already happened THIS game, due to the existence of DLC.

Whereas, by they time people knew Diddy was in Brawl, Brawl was already over, so there's no point in pining over K. Rool till next time. But as soon as K. Rool got into Ultimate, the DK krew immediately shifted gears to "Okay, but Dixie for DLC right?"

 

[Firox]

We don't know how well Geno did in the actual ballot, but fan polling from the time can tell you that Geno's performance at the time was...whelming.

• In this poll on opinions popular Ballot character requests from Source Gaming, Geno ranks an average 2.65 out of 5 in favorability, below characters such as Takamaru, Ray MK, and New Mii Class among other, more notable requests. That's certainly underwhelming.
• Geno is acknowledged as a popular Japanese fan pick circa 2015 in this Source Gaming article, yet in another article with collected data from the same year Geno barely makes the top 10 most popular Japanese picks, falling far behind the top 3 of K. Rool, Wolf, and Roy.
• Admittedly, Geno shows up on a popular image list of Ballot "frontrunners," (the Reddit post is from 2018, but I remember this going around in 2015) but this list covers such a broad amount of characters (Machamp, Hawlucha, Rundas, and Abraham Lincoln are also frontrunners, and no one talked about those characters) and doesn't have rankings within them, so we can't tell how the creator of this image measured popularity.
• A consolidation of individual character votes in a Smash 4 Ballot exit poll shows Geno just out of the Top 10 at number 13 total, and performing moderately well for a third party pick, being number 6 for third parties.

These two ballots come from 2018, but I think they show the variability of Geno's popularity well enough to possibly speak to his ballot performance.

• Geno does do well in this ballot, taking place in 2018, but from another 2018 Source Gaming Ballot (taken when Ultimate was just Smash for Switch), Geno doesn't even make Top 15, falling behind other third party picks like Shovel Knight, Bomberman, and Shantae.

So, overall Geno's popularity wasn't bad, though he fell behind other notable Ballot choices of the time such as veterans and third parties such as Shantae and Shovel Knight.

You'd think this is a "gotcha!" to those saying that Geno might've underperformed, but an important thing to consider is that all of the above polls inherently fall subject to sampling bias, as none of them broke out of core Nintendo communities. We know that Geno's popularity wasn't bad in core Nintendo communities, but:

• a) He was far from a top choice as compared to his performance in Smash Ultimate DLC ballots, and
• b) We have no way of gauging his popularity otherwise.

Compared to other characters who garnered significant support both within core Nintendo communities and within established fanbases outside of those (e.g. Sora, Shantae, K. Rool, the Belmonts, etc.), I don't think it's an unreasonable claim to say that Geno underperformed in the Ballot and was unable to break through to Nintendo executives in the same way that major Ballot picks did.

Thanks for the links. This seems like a fairly honest and comprehensive analysis. Now that Sora has been outed as the #1 pick of the official ballot, I wonder if Sakurai/Nintendo will ever show us the remaining character stats. I'd be interested to know where some of the other notable frontrunners ended up like Krystal, Bomberman and Isaac.

 

[MarioRaccoon]

One character that was popular back in japanese polls and likely disappeared was Jinabyan from Yokai Watch. It makes sense as YW popularity peak there was around 2014/15 and the IP is dead by now.

He really got his “now or never” moment in smash 4 dlc but Nintendo wasn’t really interested.

 

[Theguy123]

Here's a link to the brawl speculation area

Brawl Character Discussion

This is the place for all discussion concerning the various characters in Super Smash Brothers Brawl.

smashboards.com

some very interesting things here... the Masked Man was big back then.

swear that Geno talk is practically everywhere I look these days. Even Scrolling through the brawl era of speculation and you’ll see a Geno support thread

Swear geno’s just that one character from the DC universe that grows stronger the more it dies until it gets to a point where it can’t be killed and kills the universe

In geno’s case he’s that 1 irrelevant puppet that the more you try and kill, the more popular he somehow becomes. It’s funny and sad.

 

[Momotsuki]

I think we all have those characters that we'd love to see but are well aware are "yeah... not happening" sorts of picks?
It's a shame. Madotsuki could have a really neat moveset! She'd be the installment's bottom-tier "joke character."

A slow, small, and light character with a poor jump, and even a fast fall-speed, but with some pretty weird but cool moves. Her up special for example would be interesting. Medamaude - It teleports her to the center of the stage (or the closest solid ground to it), no matter where she uses it from. It has really long startup though and she can be easily knocked out of it, but at least drastically slows her falling.

Her neutral special would be playing her flute. She has a small windbox around her while doing this and anyone blown back by said windbox has their controls inverted for a few seconds. It has a lot of lag - both startup and endlag. It does no damage or hitstun, mind you. The tune she plays and thus how long the move lasts varies (the latter only a little bit) as it can be one of many Yume Nikki lietmotifs, chosen randomly.

Her side-special has her ride her bicycle. It's basically Wario's side-B, except the bicycle does not remain as an item.

And her down-special... she gains the cat effect and raises a paw. This has a fairly large suction effect. If you're within Simon-whip range of her when she does this, you'll get drawn into her. She then scratches the opponent twice in rapid succession (doing about 10% or so) before basically down-throwing them with a pounce. This can be a combo starter. It has a lot of startup - enough for her to meow, but almost no endlag.

Her normals are actually very quick compared to her awful mobility, but with a literal kitchen knife, even Meta Knight is laughing when it comes to range. They do an average amount of damage, but in a weird way. Instead of dealing all the damage at once, when Madotsuki hits an opponent with the knife, the amount of damage dealt gets queued and is applied over the course of about a second or so. Essentially, her jab and tilts are diet Eiha with abysmal range.


I'd love to program this someday, does anyone have feedback with regards to how she sounds to fight against? Considering her attributes and specials. Aerials, Smashes, and throws are still being brainstormed. All in all, she's extremely unintuitive by design.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

swear that Geno talk is practically everywhere I look these days. Even Scrolling through the brawl era of speculation and you’ll see a Geno support thread

Swear geno’s just that one character from the DC universe that grows stronger the more it dies until it gets to a point where it can’t be killed and kills the universe

In geno’s case he’s that 1 irrelevant puppet that the more you try and kill, the more popular he somehow becomes. It’s funny and sad.

Man my editing skills really are top notch huh?

 

[SharkLord]

I know I've said "Hey let's wait a couple years before we think about Smash 6" but Burenia from Metroid Dread for Super Smash Bros. 6, please and thank you

Coral caves and undersea alien wildlife is my aesthetic now. For some godforsaken reason the wiki doesn't have any good pictures of it and all the videos either don't focus on it or show all the hidden powerups which probably counts as spoilers so you'll just have to take my word for it unless you're fine with potential spoilers.

But yeah. Burenia next game, please and thank you. I need more stages like this in general.

 

[SKX31]

I would say this was also a big factor, and something that's gone understated in part due to the recent revisionist history we've been seeing with Smash 4 Speculation and early Ultimate Speculation.

The fact is that Geno had little to no fan support during Smash 4 Speculation and didn't really rise to prominence until after Ridley and K. Rool were already revealed, when people realized that 2/3s of Brawl's "Holy Trinity" had gotten in and started clamoring for the third. This was likely far too late for them to make any significant impact in regard to the roster, given that Pass 1 had already been decided and Pass 2 was pulled together from previous concepts and negotiations.

We know now that Ballot turnout was a huge consideration for characters in Ultimate, so Geno's relatively weak Ballot turnout probably hurt him far more than people say.

King K. Rool as a part of the holy trinity itself was a huge revision of Brawl speculation too. Geno just went out of style at the wrong time and the fans didn't pick back up until they got a bone thrown at them in Smash 4's end, but by then they also had the ballot and bigger plans for the future. It's just the worst case scenario of awful timing.

I kinda wonder if the revision happened not only because was a very popular request for a stretch just after Brawl until Ultimate, but also proved to be both very simple to play (in fact, one of the easiest to pick up and as such racked up a very big casual playerbase) and he was one of the most talked about characters when Ultimate launched - right as FP1 speculation started and the "Holy Trinity" came more or less to be used as a term. That might've fed into the whole "K. Rool as part of a Holy Trinity" thing.

also racked up a big casual playerbase, - not just because he was heavily requested but also since he's also a very straightforward character. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that contributed too for similar reasons.

the mayans were right - the end of masked man support is almost as bad as the end of the world, i can see how they mixed the two up.

Do I see an excuse to post Civ VI music? After so long?

Well, here goes (one of the songs included - Xtoles - is coincidentally about a parent calling her two kids in for the night because it's getting dark):

I know I've said "Hey let's wait a couple years before we think about Smash 6" but Burenia from Metroid Dread for Super Smash Bros. 6, please and thank you
View attachment 334041
Coral caves and undersea alien wildlife is my aesthetic now. For some godforsaken reason the wiki doesn't have any good pictures of it and all the videos either don't focus on it or show all the hidden powerups which probably counts as spoilers so you'll just have to take my word for it unless you're fine with potential spoilers.

But yeah. Burenia next game, please and thank you. I need more stages like this in general.

Huh. Come to think of it, we don't have any underwater stages in the game, do we? Or am I completely blanking out here?

 

[TriggerX]

Geno seems mainly popular with the older crowd, and even then I still find him to be a niche character among Nintendo's overall audience. Very cool character, and its unfortunate Nintendo hasnt done more with him. Like any other character, I do feel like the spot on smash's roster is well deserved, however I feel like that particular community should be less focused on the character coming to smash, and more on SMRPG being revived as a series. Now seems like the perfect time considering Square and Nintendo are obviously working closely with eachother. That playable smash cameo will come naturally if revitalizing the series is successful.

While I don't 100% believe every character needs to be from an active franchise to make playable status in the game, I do believe its a big factor. If not an active series, then surely there must be plans or potential to move forward with that series. Even Banjo is at least getting some love with the VC console. I wouldnt doubt if his series sees a remake of some kind down the road.

 

[Theguy123]

One character that was popular back in japanese polls and likely disappeared was Jinabyan from Yokai Watch. It makes sense as YW popularity peak there was around 2014/15 and the IP is dead by now.

He really got his “now or never” moment in smash 4 dlc but Nintendo wasn’t really interested.

it didn’t help that yo Kai watch was deemed the Pokémon killer and that the franchise was up against Layton who if we ever get content form level 5, it’ll probably come from the Layton franchise first unless they build up an IP that overtakes the Layton franchises sales and is extremely popular outside Japan.

That’s not me being bias by the way.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

it didn’t help that yo Kai watch was deemed the Pokémon killer and that the franchise was up against Layton who if we ever get content form level 5, it’ll probably come from the Layton franchise first unless they build up an IP that overtakes the Layton franchises sales and is extremely popular outside Japan.

That’s not me being bias by the way.

Level 5 always seems to make unfortunate marketing choices

remember when they claimed their dungeon crawling rpg Dark Cloud was a Zelda killer? Shame since the sequel was one of my favorite games in high school

 

[Shroob]

Bottom text.

 

[SharkLord]

I kinda wonder if the revision happened not only because was a very popular request for a stretch just after Brawl until Ultimate, but also proved to be both very simple to play (in fact, one of the easiest to pick up and as such racked up a very big casual playerbase) and he was one of the most talked about characters when Ultimate launched - right as FP1 speculation started and the "Holy Trinity" came more or less to be used as a term. That might've fed into the whole "K. Rool as part of a Holy Trinity" thing.

also racked up a big casual playerbase, - not just because he was heavily requested but also since he's also a very straightforward character. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that contributed too for similar reasons.



Do I see an excuse to post Civ VI music? After so long?

Well, here goes (one of the songs included - Xtoles - is coincidentally about a parent calling her two kids in for the night because it's getting dark):

Huh. Come to think of it, we don't have any underwater stages in the game, do we? Or am I completely blanking out here?

Yeah, there aren't any fully underwater stages. If there was, we'd probably remember it because of how it tacked the water physics when most character can't even stay afloat for too long.

But hey, I wouldn't even be moving in that stage. Just sitting back and admiring the alien squid-whales in the background.

 

[ForsakenM]

We don't know how well Geno did in the actual ballot, but fan polling from the time can tell you that Geno's performance at the time was...whelming.

• In this poll on opinions popular Ballot character requests from Source Gaming, Geno ranks an average 2.65 out of 5 in favorability, below characters such as Takamaru, Ray MK, and New Mii Class among other, more notable requests. That's certainly underwhelming.
• Geno is acknowledged as a popular Japanese fan pick circa 2015 in this Source Gaming article, yet in another article with collected data from the same year Geno barely makes the top 10 most popular Japanese picks, falling far behind the top 3 of K. Rool, Wolf, and Roy.
• Admittedly, Geno shows up on a popular image list of Ballot "frontrunners," (the Reddit post is from 2018, but I remember this going around in 2015) but this list covers such a broad amount of characters (Machamp, Hawlucha, Rundas, and Abraham Lincoln are also frontrunners, and no one talked about those characters) and doesn't have rankings within them, so we can't tell how the creator of this image measured popularity.
• A consolidation of individual character votes in a Smash 4 Ballot exit poll shows Geno just out of the Top 10 at number 13 total, and performing moderately well for a third party pick, being number 6 for third parties.

These two ballots come from 2018, but I think they show the variability of Geno's popularity well enough to possibly speak to his ballot performance.

• Geno does do well in this ballot, taking place in 2018, but from another 2018 Source Gaming Ballot (taken when Ultimate was just Smash for Switch), Geno doesn't even make Top 15, falling behind other third party picks like Shovel Knight, Bomberman, and Shantae.

So, overall Geno's popularity wasn't bad, though he fell behind other notable Ballot choices of the time such as veterans and third parties such as Shantae and Shovel Knight.

You'd think this is a "gotcha!" to those saying that Geno might've underperformed, but an important thing to consider is that all of the above polls inherently fall subject to sampling bias, as none of them broke out of core Nintendo communities. We know that Geno's popularity wasn't bad in core Nintendo communities, but:

• a) He was far from a top choice as compared to his performance in Smash Ultimate DLC ballots, and
• b) We have no way of gauging his popularity otherwise.

Compared to other characters who garnered significant support both within core Nintendo communities and within established fanbases outside of those (e.g. Sora, Shantae, K. Rool, the Belmonts, etc.), I don't think it's an unreasonable claim to say that Geno underperformed in the Ballot and was unable to break through to Nintendo executives in the same way that major Ballot picks did.

Man, it feels like I already said that the character is niche in that his votes wouldn't compare to bigger names at the time for Smash 4, and yet he still got mentioned by Sakurai to have a lot of support and got a costume when that didn't have to happen. He was also acknowledge by Sakurai as a desire to include him since Brawl where the talks of him getting in started to actually become more mainstream.

So, I'm not sure what this argument is about. I'm not arguing that his votes were likely lower than others because I know that they probably were just based on who got crazy support back then: I'm saying that it doesn't matter because he clearly did well enough to get recognition, because if he didn't, we probably wouldn't have gotten said recognition.

All the polls you posted actually discredit your argument, and I think you have a different set of standards for what is considered 'doing well'. I mean, if Geno hit Top Tens off and on while placing within Top 30s and Top 50s consistently as a character who had one game an a removed cameo from a dead franchise that died back in 1996...I say we are doing EXTREMELY well! Dude, we were competing with names like Sora, Cloud, Sephiroth, Shovel Knight, Ridley, K. Rool, Banjo, Isaac, Waluigi, Castlevania, Rayman, Daisy...and all the veterans who hadn't returned yet! The fact that he hit Top 10 more than once in mock polls during that time is INSANE! If anything, that shows Geno support was much higher at the time that I myself and a lot of other Geno fans thought. It explains even better why we got the costume.

Even so, think of it this way: if a character got a lot of requests in Brawl but was completely dead silent in support for Smash 4 even when you put out a ballot to vote for your favorite character, why would you then make a costume of that character? Why would you then say they still get a lot of requests? Wouldn't you just make a different costume entirely? Wouldn't you just say nothing about the support for the character if it didn't exist?

When you combine that with how big the wave was during Ultimate and how the support for him hasn't completely died out yet, and now we have DQ, FF7 (and by extension FF as a whole) and KH all represented in Smash...I fail to see much else that could stand in Geno's way for a Deluxe, and you know Nintendo won't want to make cuts if they don't have to. At this point it's just 2B who got big after the ballot and maybe Crono or Neku, but Geno pulled ahead of all of them in more recent polls so I suppose we will just have to see about how Square feels about Geno and how big these franchises get by the next Smash title.

 

[Theguy123]

Level 5 always seems to make unfortunate marketing choices

remember when they claimed their dungeon crawling rpg Dark Cloud was a Zelda killer? Shame since the sequel was one of my favorite games in high school

yup. They’ve never been good at marketing their games or treating their series with respect. I’m surprised they’re still alive in Japan. That’ll change though if they keep calling out Nintendo franchises lol

 

[chocolatejr9]

Level 5 always seems to make unfortunate marketing choices

remember when they claimed their dungeon crawling rpg Dark Cloud was a Zelda killer? Shame since the sequel was one of my favorite games in high school

yup. They’ve never been good at marketing their games or treating their series with respect. I’m surprised they’re still alive in Japan. That’ll change though if they keep calling out Nintendo franchises lol

This might sound weird, but this is actually part of the reason why I wouldn't mind if Nintendo bought out Level-5: imagine the irony...

That, and they have enough history together for it to actually make sense. That's always a plus in my eyes.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This might sound weird, but this is actually part of the reason why I wouldn't mind if Nintendo bought out Level-5: imagine the irony...

That, and they have enough history together for it to actually make sense. That's always a plus in my eyes.

As long as I get that Dark Cloud 2 switch port I guess

 

[N3ON]

I haven't followed the whole conversation about Geno on the ballot but my belief is he probably did... ok. The character was experiencing the nadir of his popularity since it kicked off in the first place at that time, and that didn't leave him with a complete absence of popularity, so he probably did, again, ok, but compared both to how he could've done at another point in time and compared to how other characters who actually were quite popular at the time, it probably wasn't anything remarkable.

Getting the costume was probably because with Square finally on board, Sakurai was appeasing the fact that Geno had been very requested the time before, rather than at that time. So it probably wasn't ballot related, it was probably Brawl-era related.

 

[Sucumbio]

Bu who bah haven't got that far yet imma have to quick scan dread posts to avoid stuff

 

[chocolatejr9]

As long as I get that Dark Cloud 2 switch port I guess

Wait, does Level-5 own Dark Cloud? I always thought that was Sony's IP...

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Wait, does Level-5 own Dark Cloud? I always thought that was Sony's IP...

“Developed by Level 5 and published by Sony Entertainment”

both games were before Level 5 published their own games

soooo… idk really

in my heart it’s a L5 IP tho heck it

 

[N3ON]

Wait, does Level-5 own Dark Cloud? I always thought that was Sony's IP...

“Developed by Level 5 and published by Sony Entertainment”

both games were before Level 5 published their own games

soooo… idk really

in my heart it’s a L5 IP tho heck it

Dark Cloud™

Experience Dark Cloud™ originally released on the PS2™ system with up-rendering and Trophies. Two great continents, one an advanced civilization driven by progress and technology the other, where nature is the center of all existence and everyone lives harmoniously side by side. Two cultures...

store.playstation.com

© 2001 Sony Computer Entertainment Inc. Dark Cloud is a trademark of Sony Computer Entertainment Inc.

Yup, Sony property.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Dark Cloud™

Experience Dark Cloud™ originally released on the PS2™ system with up-rendering and Trophies. Two great continents, one an advanced civilization driven by progress and technology the other, where nature is the center of all existence and everyone lives harmoniously side by side. Two cultures...

store.playstation.com

Yup, Sony property.

Welp, that's another dream dead...

 

[PeridotGX]

these requests are pissing me off

I'm the original.................Starwalker

 

[Dan Quixote]

I'm liking all the responses to my stage question. Honestly stages are so fun to think about because I feel like you can almost go in even wilder directions than fighters. Since this place is closing down soon, is there any thread anywhere else on this site dedicate to discussing stages like this? Would be interested in putting some ideas down.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

Welp, that's another dream dead...

How?