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**Diddy Kong [Old] General Match-Ups**

hippiedude92

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 23, 2008
Messages
5,981
Location
Wishing Apex 2012 happened again.
I don't see how Luigi owns Diddy. Luigi has a lot of quick aerials that are great for approaching, and he's annoying to combo, but your kill moves > his kill moves. Your recovery > his recovery. Your gimp game > his gimp game. Your range > his range. Sure, a good Luigi would be tough to fight, but it's far from a 70-30 matchup, I'd say it's probably in Diddy's favor.

I will accept that I could probably be wrong on a lot of these points, because I do not have a lot of experience playing exceptional players who use these characters. I am theorizing these points.
I maybe wrong interpreting this but unless your saying Diddy > Luigi then sir gg to you. As a Luigi main.. I'd give it more of a 50-50 neutral matchup but if I had a nifty chance, I'd hell sure give it to diddy's favor 60-40.


Edit: Nvm, dont both arguing with my post. just keep the discussion on GaW lol.,
Luigi can catch most of Diddy's banana's with ease due to his lagless aerials. Both are well rounded combo aerial demons, but if anything I'd give it to Luigi for this one. Luigi totally outpwns him in terms of kill power. Fsmash kills early 80%s or late 90%s and a shoryuken kills Diddy around the 50%s. About the range.. I'd say maybe Diddy rocks that category cept Luigi's bair is something to look out for. And with the gimp game, both are well rounded in those but it's not something to my knowledge of.. Also Luigi recovery > diddy's recovery.

Bleh I didn't even read the posts earlier because I'm so sleepy and lazy. So mind that if I intrepreted what you said was wrong or w/e
 

Advent Lee

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 13, 2005
Messages
938
Location
Sunshine State
Peanut gun is not the best thing ever. Its not that big a stun and being DK can space u easy he can just ftilt/dtilt ur dash attack and F-B. Do this with ur friend. Have DK spam up-b on the ledge and see if u can get past it with ur up-b..........have fun.
I totally agree to this. I cant really say anything about the other match ups because I might not have as much experience in them. However If you play Linguini or Bums DK they kill so early and make it very hard to kill them with just a lil DI. And DK's Up-B ***** Diddy's Recovery. I still do pretty good against DK but its not an easy match up. I give it 65:35 in DK favor.



-advent-
 

Mmac

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 8, 2008
Messages
1,967
Location
BC, Canada
Personally, I think Yoshi vs. Diddy is borderline even. I played against some good Diddy Kong's mains before, and I doubt either opponent has an advantage. They match really well in both the air and the ground. They both combo well (Diddy had mainly Banana's. Yoshi has Bair to Air/Tilt combos), and are both pretty hard to edgeguard eachother (Though I think Yoshi has a easier time intercepting Diddy. Still hard though) Yoshi has a Chaingrab and a better spammable Projectile, while Diddy has Banana's. Also Yoshi can't Guide Toss, so he can't Counter-Combo as good if he manages to get his hands on one.

I friggen hate Banana's!
 

Le_THieN

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 19, 2006
Messages
1,209
Location
Shine Blockaz Central
Re: Falco Match-Up

I realize this is pretty far removed from the original discussion from a few weeks ago, but I think it's worth mentioning that I was able to find out a potentially game-breaking advantage against Falcos who like to make our lives difficult with his range-whoring reflector.

My fooling around recently yielded the discovery that any character the with capacity to crawl is able to execute their D-tilts while simultaneously holding an item (in Diddy's case, this will most often be his bananas). This is done simply by grabbing an item, lowering into a crouch, and sliding your directional stick forward or backward to initiate crawling movement in either direction. Once you're in motion, simply hit the attack button, and Diddy will do his D-tilt clap with a banana still in hand. If you don't have your joystick pushed far enough either to the left or right, you will end up throwing your banana down instead.

Back in March when Brawl was released, I played a ton of Sheik (I was a Marth main Sheik secondary back in Melee). This is around the time I noticed that Sheik could get underneath the reflector, approach and D-tilt, but most Falco players' use of the reflector against Sheiks seem to be pretty sparing at best since the needle storm doesn't quite instill the same fear that bananas do. That, and following up after executing Sheik's D-tilt sweep was near impossible. I discarded this strategy and haven't thought of anything since.

...until now. I never thought Diddy had the same ability to get underneath Falco's reflector (he doesn't get nearly as low to the ground as Sheik, Snake or ZSS do), but it never occurred to me that I should just try anyway. And try I did, and Diddy can indeed get underneath the reflector. Not only can you get underneath it, but you now have to distinct options for punishment: you can D-tilt repeatedly (since Diddy has arguably the most spammable D-tilt in the game) or, if you have a banana in hand, you can glide-toss out of the crawl and into or away from Falco without fear of the reflector. As long as the actual reflector hit-box is away from Falco, you can pound away at him all day with bananas. Wait too long though, and you'll end up eating a reflected banana - probably like we always do. =)

This eliminates one of Falco's two major advantages over Diddy in this match-up (the ranged reflector and the chain-throw). My roommate Max Power plays the best Falco in the state, and I just gave up on trying to win against him with Diddy for a stretch of two months until a couple of weeks ago; when I figured out that playing with no bananas actually yielded a lot more victories for me. This new tactic requires a bit more of experimenting, but that combined with my newfound lack of co-dependence on the banana rush has really opened up a slew of new possibilities for me in sidestepping Falco's ability to consistently shut down my offense.

Lemme know what you guys think.

EDIT: This isn't the greatest of news for victims of Falco's chain-throw, but I thought it was also worth mentioning. As we all know, it's pretty much impossible to DI or even smash DI (with C-stick assistance) out the chain-throw until around 40%, which is when Diddy starts to gain natural spacing due to increased knock-back anyway. However, it seems that starting around 20% (and possibly earlier), you can smash DI downward. The reason you would ever want to do this is because Falco players are often times not in position to reap the benefits of the maximum amount of D-throws they can execute, and often have to settle for an early D-air spike. So far, I've managed to avoid the spike almost every single time with a downward smash DI to grab the ledge and avoid the ever-******** gimp kill. Hope that helps out a bit.
 

Player-1

Smash Legend
Joined
Apr 27, 2008
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12,186
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Rainbow Cruise
Im not talking about azen. Every good lucario has that general approach. Also matchup matters when both players are equal skill and both knows the matchup.

I can admit the ZSS doesnt kno the matchup that way.

I fought a suckyass kirby and when he caught me with a swallowcide its basically ur stock. 2 sucky kirbys infact.

U can easily get past a shielding snake. If hes blocking or sidestepping its easier to punish. From ur sayin what for the tilt and throw a banana at him.

Yoshi's grab release CG is the same effect except ur stunned when off stage. Yoshi's pivot grab is about the same range as D3 and yoshi is fast not slow. Warios Fsmash isnt invincibiltity frames. Thats super armor. Something different. Warios fsmash isnt that big a hitbox. Yoshis is.

Ur fighting GW. When u throw it at him in the air, At times hes gonna catch it.

Peanut gun is not the best thing ever. Its not that big a stun and being DK can space u easy he can just ftilt/dtilt ur dash attack and F-B. Do this with ur friend. Have DK spam up-b on the ledge and see if u can get past it with ur up-b..........have fun.


Ur sayin all this like im playing stupid players. It can be average vs average. U have to consider every option both chars have in the matchup to see who has the advantage.

BIG EXAMPLE. Wolf vs olimar. Ok Wolf can do his bair WoP and whatever. Olimar can shieldgrab sometimes etc. But u kno why wolf counters olimar, probably the biggest counter in the game? Wolfs blaster. If u stand still and spam the gun, olimar cannot hit u with ANYTHING. Pikmin latch? Gun slashes it off. Olimar fsmash? Gun stops it. Olimar grabs? The second it grabs u the laser hits him and lets go. If wolf didnt have that gun the match would be totally different but since wolf has that one omve that stops EVERYTHING its a counter. See how that works? Thats why u have to consider everything.
Lucario: I've played few Lucarios, but the ones I have played are very good and still get shield grabbed.

Kirby: Swallowcide is still easily avoidable and you can still get out of it at 80% damage and still live with correct recovering skills, like you said some of the more advanced kirbys do it twice, but again this is average. We can't take every single characters playstyle and try to find a counter for it for ever diddy's playstyle

Snake: You throw a banana at Snake, they'll shield because thats what there usually doing any way. If you try to wait it out a mortar slide usually comes in fast. Like I said the best thing to is to side b grab the shield, or if he side steps turn it into the kick, but this gets countered with mortar slide.

Yoshi: Ok I got mixed up with invin frames and super armor there, my bad, but still thats 2 of the 16 moves that he has that get more priority and the invin frames don't last that long. Yes the pivot grab is fast, but easy to see coming unless they mindgame you in to that etc. The pivot is going to change the match into yoshi's favor alone. His CG doesn't do much damage, you just need to DI away from the spike that comes after it. Yoshi has grabs and good non-edgeguarble recovery, and Diddy has bananas and priority.

G&W: You're right there, but that isn't going to change the match up a lot. Maybe 5% more to G&W side? I forgot what you said, but about 5% more on G&W than what I said earlier.

DK: I never said it was the best thing ever...I'm just saying it's a good temporarily alternative for bananas. Once you bombard him with a few peanuts, dash attack him then combo, or dash shield grab, combo. It's just 50:50 depending on lvl.

I have thought of the other characters possibilities...I just don't feel the need to explain every single one because that leads into playstyle and there are an infinite amount of play styles and we're not writing a description for every one we encounter.

Edit: I also think you need to look at this from the basic diddy point of view. It might just be your playstyle that you can beat Snake users than Yoshi users, but I'm sure that most diddy's out there have a harder time fighting snake than Yoshi.
 

Vyse

Faith, Hope, Love, Luck
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 6, 2005
Messages
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Brisbane, Australia
Made a few changes.

The Diddy Kong Forums
Diddy Match up Chart

This is a list of Diddy Kong matchups comprising of evaluations of Diddy's advantages and disadvantages against each character. This is shown both as a hard, numerical ratio, and a small description.

Please note, this is a work in progress.
The majority of the descriptions are courtesy of Player-1 and his thread:
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=177870

Much of what you see description wise is Player-1's first descriptions edited over time with the input of the best Diddy Kong players on the boards.

This is Version 2 of the matchup list.

---

Mario : Diddy
40 : 60
Strong
I have never versed an experienced Mario so I can't label this as accurate. The only advantage I can see for Mario Vs Diddy is his fireballs and can mess up some of his banana game. All you really have to do is knock him off the cliff, get him to use his mid air jump, then do it again and you've pretty much got him.
Luigi : Diddy
70 : 30
Weak
I label Diddy Weak against Luigi because of Luigi's great aerial game. The Luigis I've seen stay in the air a lot and has better aerial game than Diddy with little lag. His slipperyness can also mess up glide tossing and combos. His fireballs can be very annoying if you he is prevent you from getting to your bananas, and his down b is fast and and effective move to get out of combos.
Peach : Diddy
60 : 40
Weak
Peach's mid air float jump thing is very annoying with your bananas. You can't just do a normal toss at that, it goes right under her. What you have to do is short hop and throw it, and Fair or something of the sort. This is still hard though if the Peach player keeps moving around and if you miss you'll get a face full of Fair, which is one of Peach's best kill moves. Her turnips will get annoying, and the Dairing to Fair as well.
Bowser : Diddy
20 : 80
Very Strong
Bowser is slow and has some of the laggiest moves. Getting him with your bananas is easier than throwing a banana at a wall. He can be easily edgeguarded and spiked if he is coming back from the top of the screen. What you really have to look out for is his Dsmash if you don't have any bananas out.
Diddy : Diddy
50 : 50
Neutral
Well it's diddy...so of course it's neutral. What I've noticed about Diddy dittos is that it is 90% banana control skill 10% any other skill that matters. Who ever has better banana control skill will most likely win. You don't even need to know how to combo with the bananas, because with four of them on the stage, it's extremely easy. I find that Diddy dittos is very unreliable when determining who is a better diddy.
Donkey Kong : Diddy
60 : 40
Weak
Just like Bowser has laggy attacks and is heavy. He has no range attacks. The main thing that separates DK from Bowser is the speed. Donkey Kong has a lot of more speed than Bowser and you have to watch out for that. You really just don't want to get caught in his Punch or Fsmash. DK on average is the heaviest char in the game. If you’re fighting someone who DIs ridiculously he’s never going to die. Have fun trying to gimp because if you miss he can easily gimp you back and it’s so easy how he can gimp you. On top of that, regardless of how good your DI is, you’re going to die early.
Yoshi : Diddy
55 : 45
Neutral
The main disadvantage for Diddy is that Yoshi=no edgeguarding. He is extremely hard to edgeguard which is where diddy excells. The bad thing for Yoshi is that most of Diddy's moves have more priority than Yoshis.

It’s kind of like why luigi’s matchup is bad. When yoshi gets hit by a banana he slides farther than most chars which is makes it hard to follow up. Also Yoshi can chain grab diddy across the stage. YOSHI IS HEAVY. He prioritizes your attacks as well. So it’s more in Yoshi’s favor.

Wario : Diddy
55 : 45
Neutral
Wario is a different character, in that his bite attack can remove your bananas from the equation. This is obviously not a great thing, but is also something you can capitalize on. There is not a lot of lag involved in eating the bananas, but that doesn’t mean Diddy can’t use that small window of lag to glide toss towards a bite attack, and smash him while he’s eating it. His mean aerial game keeps Wario going over the bananas, but like all 2 jump characters, he has to come down eventually, and once you’ve got him in a combo, you’ve got all of your usual options. Smart edgeguarding can work, but you’ve really got to be on the timing for it to work. Wario can edgeguard you as well, but not as well as you are able to.
Link : Diddy
35 : 65
Strong
This isn't accurate because I've only versed 1 good Link in the past. I find that his projectiles can get annoying but once you hit him with on bananas he is doomed for major punishment. Watch out for his smashs as well and any boost smashing.
Zelda : Diddy
50 : 50
Neutral
Zelda is very annoying when trying to get your bananas. Her side b *****. Just make sure that you're prepared to shield or air dodge any time you see her about to use that thing. Most Zeldas will try to reflect your bananas back but if they mess up and you get her with bananas, she is easy to combo. Make sure you know where she'll land when she recovers with her up special.
Sheik : Diddy
30 : 70
Strong
The only advantage I can see for Sheik, is her speed. She has more speed than diddy and if he knows how to use bananas against you thats bad. But most of the time you should be able to edgeguard them easily and banana combo them into something.
Gannondorf : Diddy
20 : 80
Very Strong
Gannondorf is heavy, laggy moves, and slow. Easy target for Diddy. Combo them into anything you like, edgeguard them, anything basically works. You really just have to watch out for his side B. If you got that down your good to go.
Toon Link : Diddy
60 : 40
Weak
Toon Link's projectiles are really annoying. His speed is good and he has pretty decent power and great recovery. Watch out for his smashs. Try to stay away from him until you get him slipped up on some bananas.
Samus : Diddy
40 : 60
Neutral
I've only versed 1 good Samus as well. A lot of Samus's moves have little lag, but on the other hand a lot of her moves have great lag. Watch out for her Dtilt and Dsmash. Her Dsmash has little lag and comes out fast. Her Dtilt can kill and comes out fast. She is pretty easy to get into combos though.
Zamus : Diddy
60 : 40
Weak
If you mess up prepared to be stunned to death. You WILL be punished if you have approach her poorly. I find that Diddy's side b is the best, but too easy to sheild grab if you use a kick and with no kick you have to be closer to grab her, which can be troubling if she gets her stun gun out.
Pit : Diddy
60 : 40
Neutral
Pit's Nair and Bair and especially his arrows, can get annoying. Make sure you crouch if he fires arrows at you, until they realize what you are doing you should be in rage of a side b kick. He is hard to edgeguard but if you get him even once, it can be troubling for Pit. Remember, once he uses his up b, even if you attack him out of it, he can't use it again.
Ice Climbers : Diddy
65 : 35
Weak
Ice Climbers isn't as hard to approach as it is to approach Zamus, but with Diddy's poor approaching skills it can still be hard. If you fail at approaching them prepare for the most annoying grabs in the game to come into affect. Try to desynch them ONLY when they're at high damage percentage or when you're ready to get them off the cliff. If you do it'll be incredibly easy to edgeguard them.
ROB : Diddy
55 : 45
Neutral
ROB is an easy target, but he’s also heavy. He is pretty easy to banana combo, but watch out for a counter Nair. He has a lagless Fair, strong spike, amazing Nair, and Bair. Edgeguarding from the side isn’t TOO hard, but from below is what requires creativity. Remember, he can’t airdodge while he’s up-b’ing. Throw a banana downwards and spike at the same time, you CAN make it back. Barrel spike is also an option here.

Otherwise it’s vital that you keep your smashes fresh for the KO.
Kirby : Diddy
60 : 40
Weak
Kirby isnt easy to approach. He’s not a big target to hit with the bananas. His attacks have more priority then yours. Players don’t notice kirby’s feet are disjointed hitboxes so you can’t clash with it. Also the stupid swallowcide. Always remember to have a banana in hand when edgeguarding cause the second u see him swallow throw it and hit him. He on the other hand, will have no reservations edgeguarding you.
Meta Knight : Diddy
50 : 50
Neutral
Meta Knight is pretty easy to kill around 100% damage. Just takes a Forward glide toss to a forward smash. His attacks have A LOT of priority this is where bananas come in to play. Use bananas more than you normally would to take out some of those moves that have a lot of priority. I fine glide tossing backwards more useful against him, to avoid tornado or side b or up b. He is hard to edgeguard, and I don't reccomend it either because you might end up being stage spiked by his up special.
King Dedede : Diddy
35 : 65
Strong
He is heavy, slow, and laggy attacks. The one thing that seperates Dedede from the heavier characters is his recovery. Unlike a lot of the other ones, he can survive most of diddy's edguarding. His waddledees are also annoying because they can block the bananas sometime.
Captain Olimar : Diddy
70 : 30
Very Weak
Again is really really really really...well I'm not going to do that again but you know what I mean. He is one of the hardest characters to approach and if you fail prepared to be punished. He can easily sheild grab your side b kick. Your side b grab is usually not long enough to reach him unless he has a purple pikmin. I find that you just can't keep throwing bananas at him like any other character, but you have to look for an opening then strike.
Fox : Diddy
45 : 55
Neutral
Fox isn't that hard for me. His reflector can get annoying but I can usually get my bananas back easily. His speed is your main problem. Watch out for any of his smashs. He is easily edgeguarded though and if you get him low then you pretty much have him.
Falco : Diddy
70 : 30
Very Weak
Make sure you watch out for Falco's chaingrab. It can be instant 50% damage and sometimes even a spike. His smashs aren't as dangerous as Fox's, but watch out for his annoying blaster. You don't want to give him a long distance range or he'll start blasting. He is also easy to edgeguard, and once you get him low enough you've got him.
Wolf : Diddy
45 : 55
Neutral
Now normally you want to make a wall between you and your opponent with bananas, but in this case throw them opposite of that or else the Wolf can start using his blaster to seperate you between you and your bananas. He is easily gimped and edguarded, but most of the time you won't have time to because he'll side b back before you can get close, so most of the time you need to stay on stage. Easy gimps=peanut gun. use the peanut gun whenever you can when he is off the edge.
Captain Falcon : Diddy
20 : 80
Strong
Captain Falcon has no ranged attacks which should mean easy banana comboing. You want to edgeguard him as much as possible. The only problem you should have is his speed, just don't underestimate it and you should be fine.
Pikachu : Diddy
30 : 70
Strong
Pikachu shouldn't be hard if you get your bananas out. Remember that little trick we call side stepping? Forget it, you need to shield any attacks instead of dodging them. Most of his attacks will last a while (Dsmash, thunder, sometimes Fsmash if he times it right). Don't underestimate his QACing either and be ready to get out of the way of any thundering he does at you. Pikachu has one of the longest tripping animations in the game, hitting him with a banana usually spells a lot of free damage. We all remember NinjaLink’s Pikachu ownage.
Charizard : Diddy
35 : 65
Strong
He is like a faster bowser almost. Lacks range in his attacks but they're fast (for a heavy char). Easy edgeguarding and banana target. Watch out for his tilts and Rock Smash.
Ivysaur : Diddy
35 : 65
Strong
Ivysaur is strongly affected by bananas. Easy edgeguarding, and once he uses his midair jump he is pretty much doomed if he doesn't make it and youu're edgehogging. Just watch out for his bullet seed.
Squirtle : Diddy
45 : 55
Neutral
I find squirtle hard to banana combo off of because of his speed and lightness. Watch out for his tilts, aerials, and Hydroplaning
Lucario : Diddy
55 : 45
Neutral
Fight a defensive lucario on a stage with platforms. It’s hard. On flat stages you can win with patience but on platforms it’s hard to have banana placements. And once again LUCARIO IS pretty hefty and gets stronger with damage. He has bigger hitboxes so you have to link it with a banana first to actually hit him. His so called laggy moves are hard to punish. Don't forget to edgehog him, his up special has no hitbox, but watch for the wall cling if it's available and turn it into a stage spike.
Jigglypuff : Diddy
65 : 35
Weak
The reason i say week is because of her aerials. I've versed 1 good jiggly and i either did really good or really bad. Her aerials beat diddys bananas. Her floatiness messes with your banana game. You have to be carefull when recovering with rockets because her Dair>rockets
Marth : Diddy
50 : 50
Neutral
Marth has great speed and range and power. Don't get midrange from him, make sure you're either far, or short range or you'll get that tip of his sword. He is pretty hard to edgeguard some of the time, because they like to come from below the stage and if you follow them it can turn to a stage spike. When getting up from the stage's edge, don't just get up normally, jump, side b, or attack back up.
Ike : Diddy
35 : 65
Strong
Ike has decent speed considering his power. My biggest problem when versing Ikes is making a mistake. If you make a mistake, you're going to feel it hard with an Fsmash. Take adavantage oh his speed and use bananas. Also remember that his side b can be countered with a Fair when recovering.
Ness : Diddy
40 : 60
Neutral
Stay a good bit back from Ness, at least out of range from his PK fire. That can turn into an instant 50% damage. Also, try not to fall into their mindgames with PK thunder, that will kill you. Ness has a quick spike and you need to watch out for it. His Back throw is insane. He is most vulnerable when he uses his up b to recover. Peanut popgun him to death.
Lucas : Diddy
40 : 60
Neutral
You need to watch out for his Nair and Dair into Fsmash or anything of the sort. Don't get caught into it or you can be finished. His Usmas is strongest in the game, don't make any mistakes when messing with that. Remember that his PK thunder will go through you so don't try blocking it. He is a lot harder to edgeguard than Ness, because of his tether. Just look for that opening where he doesn't use it.
G&W : Diddy
60 : 40
Weak
Game & Watch has insane aerials and his whole entire move set has 0-little lag. Get him with some bananas when he is Dairing. Don't get caught in his Down throw, he can hit you no matter road you take when getting back up. He is hard to edgeguard because most of them will recover from below. G&W doesn’t have a long trip animation even though bananas are probably your only approach. Of course we know about his aerials and priority so no point into going into that. He also has a wicked glide toss which he’ll link into smashes if he is smart.
Snake : Diddy
50 : 50
Neutral
Use bananas, A LOT of bananas. His tilts are deadly but most of the time they won't be able to get them out on you if you use bananas. His recovery is so easy to spike you should be spiking him every time he is recovering from the botttom/midpoint of the stage. His grenades shouldn't be a problem if you don't attack a whole near them or shield.
Sonic : Diddy
40 : 60
Strong
Remember Spiking? Diddy humping? Forget it all when versing this guy. Diddy humps will usually end up in me dieing and, he'll recover from spikes 75% of the time. Glide tossing backwards helps a lot when versing him. Remember his Spin Dash isn't affected by bananas on the ground, you have to throw them at him for him to be affected.
 

ADHD

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 18, 2008
Messages
7,194
Location
New Jersey
Some foxes and wolfs think they have the advantage over us just because of the reflector... so :laugh:
 

bludhoundz

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 2, 2007
Messages
525
Location
New York, NY
Instead of arguing about all the matchups we disagree with, regard the list as the second draft and let's just go by what the current matchup is. Eventually we will get them all right.
 

~ Gheb ~

Life is just a party
Joined
Jun 27, 2008
Messages
16,916
Location
Europe
I don't know about fox but I sure know, that Diddy vs Wolf is never a 55:45 for Diddy.
Wolf has a lot more than Shine against Diddy. His 0 lag fair picks up bananas and outranges diddys moves. Blaster + Reflector beats any banana spam not to mention the fact, that Diddy lacks good finshers, which makes it hard to kill somebody, who weighs as much as Wolf does. Wolf can force Diddy to approach, since fair + shine destroys Diddys banana spam and destroy it with bair Wall of pain. And his epic dsamsh finishes Diddy with ease. And just in case Wolf gets pressured too much, he just counters Diddy with Shine, who lacks disjointed hitboxes.

Diddy can combo Wolf pretty well but he has a hard time to beat his bair.

And about the gimping: Wolf won't get in a dangerous situation too often so it's only a minor issue.

60:40 for Wolf
 

psike

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 8, 2008
Messages
175
Location
Blacksburg, VA
Snake should be at a disadvantage to Diddy. He is unable to use his DACUS because of banana peels, and he is easily one of the most spikable characters in the game, a field in which Diddy excels.

Also, Zelda has a very slight advantage against Diddy, as she has a killer glide toss that usually leads to an automatic upsmash, as well as a reflector which makes his bananas practically useless (even though it is slow).

Last, I don't think Peach has an advantage on Diddy. His peanut gun easily takes out her float, as well as his glide toss to upsmash. Also, his f-tilt outranges most of her ground moves and he can definitely match her in the air with his fair and bair, and his uair can kill if shes not looking for it.
 

Player-1

Smash Legend
Joined
Apr 27, 2008
Messages
12,186
Location
Rainbow Cruise
I don't know about fox but I sure know, that Diddy vs Wolf is never a 55:45 for Diddy.
Wolf has a lot more than Shine against Diddy. His 0 lag fair picks up bananas and outranges diddys moves. Blaster + Reflector beats any banana spam not to mention the fact, that Diddy lacks good finshers, which makes it hard to kill somebody, who weighs as much as Wolf does. Wolf can force Diddy to approach, since fair + shine destroys Diddys banana spam and destroy it with bair Wall of pain. And his epic dsamsh finishes Diddy with ease. And just in case Wolf gets pressured too much, he just counters Diddy with Shine, who lacks disjointed hitboxes.

Diddy can combo Wolf pretty well but he has a hard time to beat his bair.

And about the gimping: Wolf won't get in a dangerous situation too often so it's only a minor issue.

60:40 for Wolf
This won't work well against smart diddy players. I agree with the current matchup, if anything else it would be 50:50.
 

ADHD

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Cant you DI out of falco's chaingrab at twenty? Does it say his chaingrab is an instant 50 damage bc of the gatling combo?
 

DanGR

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"Captain Olimar : Diddy
70 : 30
Very Weak

Quote:
Again is really really really really...well I'm not going to do that again but you know what I mean. He is one of the hardest characters to approach and if you fail prepared to be punished. He can easily sheild grab your side b kick. Your side b grab is usually not long enough to reach him unless he has a purple pikmin. I find that you just can't keep throwing bananas at him like any other character, but you have to look for an opening then strike. "

Lol. Olimar does not have it that well on Diddy. It's more neutral or advantaged diddy than anything else. Banana's screw over Olimar's ground game. It's hard to rack and when I'm tripping on nanerz everywhere.
 

NinjaLink

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"Captain Olimar : Diddy
70 : 30
Very Weak

Quote:
Again is really really really really...well I'm not going to do that again but you know what I mean. He is one of the hardest characters to approach and if you fail prepared to be punished. He can easily sheild grab your side b kick. Your side b grab is usually not long enough to reach him unless he has a purple pikmin. I find that you just can't keep throwing bananas at him like any other character, but you have to look for an opening then strike. "

Lol. Olimar does not have it that well on Diddy. It's more neutral or advantaged diddy than anything else. Banana's screw over Olimar's ground game. It's hard to rack and when I'm tripping on nanerz everywhere.
Maybe u havent noticed but ur PIKMIN stops the bananas thrown at u. U kno oilmar doesnt have to move much but he can if he wanted.
 

Mmac

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There's some debate on the Yoshi Boards about Diddy, that you might want to see...

For diddy it should be 6:4 not 4.5:5.5 I play diddys at tournaments all the time and I win easily all you have to do is grab/CG diddy and you will have control of the match. Also now you can do a DJCT its like a glide toss except it is better. After you hit diddy with his own banana it is a auto grab which means a auto CG. Also off the edge diddy is is easy to edge guard and gimp. Yoshi aerials beat out all of diddys aerials and Yoshi can out spam diddy easily. All yoshi has to do is control the bananas and CG him the whole match and you should have no problem beating a Diddy.

Match up is a 6:4 in favor of yoshi.
:yoshi: Also for Diddy, don't forget that you can catch bananas risk free with DR.
What do you guys think?
 

Player-1

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There's some debate on the Yoshi Boards about Diddy, that you might want to see...



What do you guys think?

That guy is completely wrong...

Diddy is one of the hardest characters to edgeguard if your using his recovery properly, same thing for gimping. Grabbing is probably the strongest thing Yoshi has on diddy, and it's not saying much because you won't get a lot of damage CGing you have to mind game diddy into your combos from your grab attacks. Yoshi's aerials beat diddy's when it comes to combing, but for power diddy's are better
 

DanGR

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Maybe u havent noticed but ur PIKMIN stops the bananas thrown at u. U kno oilmar doesnt have to move much but he can if he wanted.
so? You don't have to throw them at Olimar. You just have to place them nearby so none of his cgs or grabs will work. You've got enough approaching options to keep Olimar guessing when you're forced to approach. Here's a thread from a while back about Diddy. Some dude had trouble with him. A couple other people did as well.

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=178946
 

Mmac

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That guy is completely wrong...

Diddy is one of the hardest characters to edgeguard if your using his recovery properly, same thing for gimping. Grabbing is probably the strongest thing Yoshi has on diddy, and it's not saying much because you won't get a lot of damage CGing you have to mind game diddy into your combos from your grab attacks. Yoshi's aerials beat diddy's when it comes to combing, but for power diddy's are better
I went over this already. Chaingrabbing isn't about Damage, but rather gaining control of the match, and putting Diddy into a vulnerable position.

And his aerials are more powerful. So? They rack up more damage better, and outranges yours
 

Player-1

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I went over this already. Chaingrabbing isn't about Damage, but rather gaining control of the match, and putting Diddy into a vulnerable position.

And his aerials are more powerful. So? They rack up more damage better, and outranges yours
Grabbing is probably the strongest thing Yoshi has on diddy

Yoshi's aerials beat diddy's when it comes to combing


I'm agreeing with you...I'm just saying that bananas do the exact same thing as grabbing, according to you, and it does it better.
 

ADHD

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so? You don't have to throw them at Olimar. You just have to place them nearby so none of his cgs or grabs will work. You've got enough approaching options to keep Olimar guessing when you're forced to approach. Here's a thread from a while back about Diddy. Some dude had trouble with him. A couple other people did as well.

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=178946
Olimar totally ***** diddy--its almost as bad as sheik vs the ice climbers. Theres really no reason to move if you're olimar lol.
 

Nicktendo

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You can get all pikmin instantly off you. And when you hit olimar with a bannana from far he slips and has to stop throwing pikmin... rush after him.

I've played the matchup
 

Player-1

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You can get all pikmin instantly off you. And when you hit olimar with a bannana from far he slips and has to stop throwing pikmin... rush after him.

I've played the matchup
1. That diminishes your attacks.
2. It's called a shield...Olimar users use it from time to time last time i checked.
3. It's not all throwing pikmin, smashes and grabs. Plus if you try to approach him with normal side b, you can't get close enough to him to grab him if he's tether grabbing unless it's purple, if you try the kick to get more range it turns in to a shield grab, if you throw a banana then the pikmin will get in the way from what ever attack he's doing, throwing them, smashing them, grabbing with them and then if you get past that then most of the time he'll shield it and bounce in front of him and you have 1 less banana to use until it disappears.
 
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