Charge beam stun factor

[Phazon_Dude]

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=6SbU8wTTzMU

watch this video at 3:10-3:12...


You see how Dedede got stunned by a simple shot and was open to a charge

I asked Silven this before:

"Hey... heres a possible new idea i thought of. Since now Samus' charge beam sorta stuns the enemy momentarily and also if it hits it produces little knock back, especially if the opponent has low percentages. Is it possible to then do a running tackle or nair right after the opponent gets hit by the charge beam so its like 35% damage plus good knock back depending on the attack you use? Or is there to much lag on Samus?"


And he replied with this

"Tried it. It seems the amount of time the opponent is stunned is just as long as Samus takes to brush herself off after the charge shot recoil. In other words... theres too much lag. Even at point blank range I couldn't follow up with a ftilt during stun. By the time the ftilt came out the opponent was blasted away. I found that at zero percent you can follow up with something because the opponent barely moves away from you, but only at point blank range of course. Charge shot to grapple works perfectly. So if your opponent just came out and they have it in for you you can just "b" then grapple. Not sure if they can escape or not though since I was trying this in training mode."

Can a simple charge beam lead to combos?

 

[Paradigm]

I think Silven's problem is the fact that he is trying this from point blank. This seems more feasible to me if the projectile hits the opponent well away from where the projectile was originally shot. If the projectile has to travel for a certain amount of time, so long as Samus can go faster than it can, she has time to recover and chase it to follow it up. Mind you this gives the opponent more time to see it coming, but it may be useful coupled with successful predictions and mindgames, or perhaps used to follow up on the lag from a MC'd homing missile. See if Silven can try this again without being right up next to the opponent.

This also has potential in teams, where Samus can stun the opponent for her teammate to do something too, even if she can't herself. Could be useful teamed with someone along the lines of Ike.

 

[Phazon_Dude]

Yeah thats what I was thinking too.

-Maybe less power (not fully charged charge beam),
-More distance (giving Samus time to run and loose lag)
-and good aim ( fire at the right timing so the enemy will get hit)

 

[Dew Rag]

not a fully charged beam works okay, the problem is that even though though there is stun, the enemy can get away fairly easily

i like the aerial grapple a lot better cuz there is no lag from it, and it stuns and u can get close enough to do combos

but in all seriousness, what silven said is right

 

[Phazon_Dude]

Wow, grapple stuns?

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=Qm2AUUCeAIc

It looks like HUGS is trying to add in some stunning to his game himself, don't you think? He is not very successful so far though. =(

 

[Gerbality]

wow, charge beam stun, zair, samus has some new tricks up her sleeve this time round. Plus homing missle spam is too good :D

 

[Phazon_Dude]

Ok, watching and studying that video I think I found the source of the small charge beam stun combo, which I renamed.. phazon combo... what?! Ok, anyway I don't have the game so my plan might be very flawed but based on what I saw from the video I think this shall work.

This is an example of how charge can go into a combo. (its still under construction).

Phase 1: As Dedede is falling out of the stage Samus is slightly in the air doing a short hop (which samus can do in this game right?) and she fires a shot.

Phase 2: Dedede is jumping back onto the stage with his B^. Samus has fired the shot and recovering from her lag.

Phase 3: Samus is done recovering and has started sprinting. Dedede is free from his lag but gets hit by the shot shortly after.

Phase 4: dedede is paralyzed from the shot. Samus is drawing near to ddd. (around the orange level)

Phase 5: Dedede is free from his lag, but has limited places (the red circle around him) to run due to the small time left before he gets hit by samus' tackle. Since the tackle seems to get a lot of range and auto move forward the attack will hit and send dedede flying... or thats what i think.

 

[Hylian]

I have been talking about this with Rohnins for awhile now .


Look at this video at 1:39:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uMv_ctQuz4


I have been testing a lot of stuff with it . It's all about the distance you shoot the chargeshot from.

 

[Phazon_Dude]

Ah, the fully charged beam to grapple. I think Silven mentioned it too.

 

[Gerbality]

Ok, watching and studying that video I think I found the source of the small charge beam stun combo, which I renamed.. phazon combo... what?! Ok, anyway I don't have the game so my plan might be very flawed but based on what I saw from the video I think this shall work.

This is an example of how charge can go into a combo. (its still under construction).

Phase 1: As Dedede is falling out of the stage Samus is slightly in the air doing a short hop (which samus can do in this game right?) and she fires a shot.

Phase 2: Dedede is jumping back onto the stage with his B^. Samus has fired the shot and recovering from her lag.

Phase 3: Samus is done recovering and has started sprinting. Dedede is free from his lag but gets hit by the shot shortly after.

Phase 4: dedede is paralyzed from the shot. Samus is drawing near to ddd. (around the orange level)

Phase 5: Dedede is free from his lag, but has limited places (the red circle around him) to run due to the small time left before he gets hit by samus' tackle. Since the tackle seems to get a lot of range and auto move forward the attack will hit and send dedede flying... or thats what i think.

What about lighter characters, or people with high percent? Would the knockback of the neutral b be increased? If the person is near the edge, would it knock them right off? There are many questions that need answering before we can come to a full conculusion about the combo. At least it looks like it would work on dedede! We can confirm that the neutaral B has a fair amount of stun lag, something that will give make opponents focus on dodging your projectiles a little more, this in itself is a plus >: ) mind games d00d!@

Anyway, by watching the video, this combo seems very feasible, phazon combo ftw! I like your samus drawings btw

 

[Metroid_01]

It looks pretty nice. Theres alot of potential to work things into the charge beam it seems. Without a cc though, you might end up limited to grapple, dash, etc. Does the knockback from the charge get totally canceled if you connect with a different attack before the hit lag ends? If so, you might be able to nair-ground attacks, if not, b-air might prove pretty useful. Assuming you can land an aerial in time .

 

[Phazon_Dude]

Thanks guys, I can't answer any questions yet because I don't have the game so, so far all my techniques are based on Melee's Samus, assumption and videos. Also, I think I though of another way to use the charge shot. I haven't made a picture yet, but here is the basic theory.


Lets say Marth is running on a platform and samus is in the air. She fires a shot and it paralyzes marth but samus is falling down from lag. Now mid way from the ground and from where the platform is samus fires a homing missile, possibly even two. This could be a good way to rack up damage and possibly after the missile(s) hit marth. samus can run then jump directly into a neutral air which I think still has great knock back, so samus gets the kill. I know this is small but it is just an example.

Watch this video at 00:35

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw1ixmmlcAA

Its something like what I was thinking of.