Character Idea Submission Thread

[geno]

I think it'd be cool if Yoshi could catch projectiles with neutral B, to give it some more versatility, then spit them back out as a fireball. Or lay an egg, but that'd be a whole other level of Yoshi.
Also, my biggest Yoshi concern, egg shield and up-b egg should match Yoshi's color

 

[The_NZA]

what if olimar had 3 pikmin and his recovery was that he would spin them over his head like a helicopter to get back on stage.
BOOM!

I think his recovery should involve him sort of footstooling one of his pikmin (sending it plumeting to its death).

 

[himemiya]

I think it'd be cool if Yoshi could catch projectiles with neutral B, to give it some more versatility, then spit them back out as a fireball. Or lay an egg, but that'd be a whole other level of Yoshi.
Also, my biggest Yoshi concern, egg shield and up-b egg should match Yoshi's color

I was to mention that but you beat me. I think the shooting fireballs would be an code disaster but just yoshi eating the projectile should be doable.

I think yoshi's down-b should be an spike. For starters yoshi can't reserve edge grab with down-b so it wouldn't be an op ledgeguard like bowsers (unless pmbr made it so). It'll make his down-b more diffrent then bowers and be original.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Yoshi's downb IS original though. Bowser is the one copying Yoshi, not the other way around. Yoshi has had that downb since 64.

 

[himemiya]

Yoshi's downb IS original though. Bowser is the one copying Yoshi, not the other way around. Yoshi has had that downb since 64.

Have you played super mario bros 3? Well Thats where bowser's down-b came from and it was on the nes. Yoshi wasn't even created/introduced till the Snes era which was after the nes era. So correct me if I wrong if somehow an snes game was released before an nes.

But nevermind that, what are your thoughts on it being an spike? (I now notice yoshi could turn around>jump>down-b but its still not as quick)

 

[9bit]

I think his recovery should involve him sort of footstooling one of his pikmin (sending it plumeting to its death).

That's actually really cool. He could up-b multiple times kinda like ROB, until he runs out of Pikmin. So it would behoove the Olimar player to keep enough Pikmin in stock to stay alive.

 

[| Kailex |]

Would be good with only 3 pikmin

 

[Nausicaa]

That's a cool idea. T-UP (I think that's what you do in this case)

Pikmin are selfless and beautiful made to be sacrificed and stepped on by small spacemen creatures.

Edit: He'll have 3 a lot of the time, especially after getting combo'd off-stage and needing to cover himself somehow on the way back as well.

I really like that idea.
Or just make his Up-Taunt do that, regardless of opponents around, he can footstool if he has Pikmin around.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Have you played super mario bros 3? Well Thats where bowser's down-b came from and it was on the nes. Yoshi wasn't even created/introduced till the Snes era which was after the nes era. So correct me if I wrong if somehow an snes game was released before an nes.

But nevermind that, what are your thoughts on it being an spike? (I now notice yoshi could turn around>jump>down-b but its still not as quick)

dunno why it would need to be a spike. It's already a powerful killing move, there's no reason to give it a different utility outside of that. I wouldn't change any of his moves that are already useful, really. I think making his sideb eggroll into something not completely useless, giving him the ability to jump out of his shield, and giving him a good set of egg tossing angles is all he'd truly need. Anything else would just be minor buffs to damage, knockback, and hitbox disjoints, to make him able to compete with the rest of the buffed cast. I see no reason to change the way yoshi plays, just make him not terrible. I love the way yoshi plays.

 

[Metmetm3t]

So, with the newest version of G&W the random craziness of Judgement is significantly easier to control. But after breaking down the move statistically in This post, I realized that he still struggles to control the outcome. But it was also easy to see that the system that has been built would synergize nearly perfectly if you reduced Judgement down to 6 numbers instead of 9.

Now I know I'm not the first person to say something like that, and there is a subset of players out there who like to believe that random bull**** hammers are some kind of pivotal part of G&W's character design, but that kind of mindset doesn't really matter when the game is supposed to be competitive.

But why now and why six? Because with the new even/odd hints are only part of the way judgement works. The other part is that the last two numbers swung are not possible for the next hammer. So if you read my post from the G&W boards you can figure that it's all about the statistics. A 2 hammer followed by a 4 hammer with two dots, means the next swing would be a guaranteed 6, but you are still at the mercy of the Random Number Generator. You see, there are 30 different 2 number combinations in this system. And in a round of melee there is no time to randomly swing Judgement 30 times hoping for a 6 setup, but you can still create something with a 1/5 chance of guaranteeing some number and a 3/5 chance of getting a 50/50 guess.

Of coarse, one more blow to the casual player is that reducing the variance would require that you reduce the amount of crazy powerful attacks that come out of Judgment, but that's a small price to pay to remove Smash's biggest slot machine and turn it into a scientific, understandable system. An alternative you could also consider is keeping in 7 options instead. It ups the random factor significantly, but would maintain the current imbalance between even and odd numbers and give a maximum of a 50/50 chance at the highest number. And who doesn't love a LUCKY SEVEN?

 

[geno]

I think yoshi's down-b should be an spike. For starters yoshi can't reserve edge grab with down-b so it wouldn't be an op ledgeguard like bowsers (unless pmbr made it so). It'll make his down-b more diffrent then bowers and be original.

I'm not sure how well a spike would work with yoshi's down-B, but what do you think about it having a knockdown component like it did in Yoshi's story (like wario's D-smash)? That'd make it more different from Bowser's. Plus, it'd give you inventive to actually use it more. Down-B to D-smash would be awesome

Also, loving the Olimar up-b idea! Best I've heard in a good long while. It would be a bit sad to have to kill Pikmin every time you need to get back on stage, but it could be the best option if they're going to lower Pikmin count. Maybe the further along in the flowering process the Pikmin are, ther higher they'd send you too

 

[DrinkingFood]

So, with the newest version of G&W the random craziness of Judgement is significantly easier to control. But after breaking down the move statistically in This post, I realized that he still struggles to control the outcome. But it was also easy to see that the system that has been built would synergize nearly perfectly if you reduced Judgement down to 6 numbers instead of 9.

Now I know I'm not the first person to say something like that, and there is a subset of players out there who like to believe that random bull**** hammers are some kind of pivotal part of G&W's character design, but that kind of mindset doesn't really matter when the game is supposed to be competitive.

But why now and why six? Because with the new even/odd hints are only part of the way judgement works. The other part is that the last two numbers swung are not possible for the next hammer. So if you read my post from the G&W boards you can figure that it's all about the statistics. A 2 hammer followed by a 4 hammer with two dots, means the next swing would be a guaranteed 6, but you are still at the mercy of the Random Number Generator. You see, there are 30 different 2 number combinations in this system. And in a round of melee there is no time to randomly swing Judgement 30 times hoping for a 6 setup, but you can still create something with a 1/5 chance of guaranteeing some number and a 3/5 chance of getting a 50/50 guess.

Of coarse, one more blow to the casual player is that reducing the variance would require that you reduce the amount of crazy powerful attacks that come out of Judgment, but that's a small price to pay to remove Smash's biggest slot machine and turn it into a scientific, understandable system. An alternative you could also consider is keeping in 7 options instead. It ups the random factor significantly, but would maintain the current imbalance between even and odd numbers and give a maximum of a 50/50 chance at the highest number. And who doesn't love a LUCKY SEVEN?

... wouldn't it be brilliant to just make it based on the clock? the seconds number is the number you get, 0 giving a random number. No idea if that's possible but it would be remarkably useful for GnW players while requiring some conscious management of timing. Worth reaching for a level nine before they escape hitstun? Depends on the situation. This would be especially nice now that every number appears to have a use.

 

[Metmetm3t]

... wouldn't it be brilliant to just make it based on the clock? the seconds number is the number you get, 0 giving a random number. No idea if that's possible but it would be remarkably useful for GnW players while requiring some conscious management of timing. Worth reaching for a level nine before they escape hitstun? Depends on the situation. This would be especially nice now that every number appears to have a use.

That idea leads to easy prediction, but absolutely no control. At low percents G&W can combo Up-Throw to Judgement with Up-Throw taking enough time that you can check the clock and predict exactly what time the Judgement will hit. So both players are completely at the mercy of what time G&W got that grab. There's no risk to the G&W for trying the Up-Throw because he can always bail out and do a different combo, but if the time is right he is guaranteed a free stock.

 

[DrinkingFood]

... Not if you can delay the judgement by extending the combo with another move. The GnW player gets some control in that regard. Not to mention that GnW players are still at mercy of the RNG as the move works currently.

 

[himemiya]

So is judgement is the only reason why gnw is low tier? Seriously does judgement need more buffs then it always has? And why would you want it to be too easy to pull out 9's? Now if he where to have his up-b parasuit and fishbowl again (parasuit being an ab input command) then he might not be so low-tier so lets discuss things beside side-b that needs work.

 

[JOE!]

Every time Yoshi comes up I'll requote this

Egg Throw:
Keep the hop from brawl, and buff the explosion radius by a bit when it goes off. The explosion itself should act more like tink's bombs and hit 2x for 5%, with the second hit having some KB.

Egg Lay:
Increase range on the tounge to like, 1.5x its current length/length of his grab. On top of this, when he poops out an egg it should be at a diagonally downward angle so its always on the ground, and alternatively makes it a little scary if you catch somebody offstage. Lastly, when the egg breaks, give it the same hitbox as his egg toss to allow him to keep up the damage. This is his signature move, it should be Damn good lol.

Egg Roll:
Side B should be altered a good deal, but keep one aspect of it's melee self: the hop. In melee, when done in the air he boosted forward slightly. Expanding on that, how about making the roll similar to Sonic's side b in that it is a "hop" forward while in a rolling egg, but the move now ends after touching ground or jumping instead of continually rolling. On top of that, the initial hop should have super/heavy armor due to him essentially shielding himself, and allowing Yoshi to use the move to plow through basic attacks with the burst. Otherwise the move should remain the same in terms of %/KB, but add the ability to jump out of it at some point.

If Yoshi does not jump out, he will be stuck in the egg roll till he hits ground, allowing him to perform a recovery tactic of side b-jump-(eggthrows)-side b again instead of just relying on his double jump.

Yoshi Bomb:
I have a few thoughts on this move, bit in general I feel as though it should keep the brawl "launch" hitbox from the ground that combos to the drop, as well as maybe increased power.

1) When Yoshi uses this from the ground, give the leap the same heavy armor he has on his double jump. This will turn the move into a pseudo-counter at lower%, allowing Yoshi to punish poor spacing against him by trucking through a move and bombing the for thanks to the launcher hitbox.

2) When Yoshi spins before slamming down, give it a hitbox similar to say, kirbys brawl Nair. This could allow aerial down b to become a sort of anti-combo tool as he knocks people away, then plummets to the relative safety of the ground.

3) When Yoshi lands, buff the stars that POP out in some manner. Probably the weirdest of the options, but turning those into something useful could give use to doing a SH bomb, lol. Or, just make being near Yoshi when he drops a bit riskier.

4) Give Yoshi his DJ armor while dropping down. Straightforward, allows it to just be more threatening.

Any one of these would be cool imo.

General:
Make Yoshi's head intangible/invincible during the start up of his shield animation. He can't shield projectiles because of that, and its dumb. Speaking of shield, is it possible to give Yoshi much more shield HP? That could make his normally "bad" shield worthwhile as it not only prevents pokes, but can take more abuse in general in exchange for its normal drawbacks.

 

[Metmetm3t]

... Not if you can delay the judgement by extending the combo with another move. The GnW player gets some control in that regard. Not to mention that GnW players are still at mercy of the RNG as the move works currently.

So what you're saying is you want every Up-Throw to be guaranteed to end in a high number because G&W can easily string UAir's and Up-B's for 6 seconds, and he gets several opportunities to swap one of these for a judgement. With that much damage potential, what's to keep G&W from centralizing his gameplay around these strings that would likely either kill or do 80+ damage?

So is judgement is the only reason why gnw is low tier? Seriously does judgement need more buffs then it always has? And why would you want it to be too easy to pull out 9's? Now if he where to have his up-b parasuit and fishbowl again (parasuit being an ab input command) then he might not be so low-tier so lets discuss things beside side-b that needs work.

G&W has never been a low tier in Project:M. A lot of players have confused "not broken" with terrible and that's a shame. What I proposed was less of a buff to Judgement and more of a shift away from being a slot machine into being a predictable move. As a matter of fact, my system would all but require the move to be significantly nerfed as far as the average result for landing the move is concerned.

Now your buff on the other hand, comes completely blind to the way a multi-hit move with upward knockback would work in a game with hitstun. For starters, the move would easily combo into itself multiple time making for boring combo's that did ridiculous damage and could end in a parachute Nair for tremendous knockback. Another thing the move would do is cover every option that an opponent had from below. A snake recovering high on the stage would be forced to eat Nair after Nair or blow himself up to find a safe spot to land. There is a difference between competitively balancing a moveset, and playing Brawl Minus.

 

[Generically Epic]

I think pikachu needs a metal texture on his tail when his does his Uair or upsmash.

 

[Phaiyte]

My Yoshi suggestions that I haven't seen anyone come up with yet:

General tweaks
*Can move around with opponent in mouth upon grabbing them like the Kong carry
*Increased running speed/general agility (he's usually a speed type character in the Mario sports games, this needs to be acknowledged by more people. And Brawl Yoshi often has trouble approaching)
*Shield has less startup/ending lag

Moves
*Faster Melee Ftilt, can be angled
*64 Bair possibly, Brawl Bair's fine as it is though
*Melee Dtilt (set knockback)
*Shorten his Uair's range a little, used as a juggling tool instead? (If DJC'ing is in this)

Yoshi's treated as a heavy in mario kart.

 

[Phaiyte]

Explain to me how carrot-men could support that sort of weight for an extended period of time. Besides, that just seems way too weird and clunky to be implemented.

because it's ****ing pixels and not real life.

 

[Metmetm3t]

Yoshi's treated as a heavy in mario kart.

Yoshi's weight is different depending on which MK game you are playing, but he is always either medium or light.
source:
http://www.mariowiki.com/Mario_Kart_(series)#Weight.2FSize_and_Effects

 

[DrinkingFood]

So is judgement is the only reason why gnw is low tier? Seriously does judgement need more buffs then it always has? And why would you want it to be too easy to pull out 9's? Now if he where to have his up-b parasuit and fishbowl again (parasuit being an ab input command) then he might not be so low-tier so lets discuss things beside side-b that needs work.

Who said GnW was low tier, or that judgement was the reason? I just said it would be an interesting change to give players more control of what number they pull. Please read posts before you respond to them, thanks.

Honestly I think judgement is a silly move and the whole concept of GnW is several degrees more ridiculous than any other character, but this isn't the place to discuss why I think he should never have been in the games.

About SDR kirby, I wouldn't mind most of what he's got, except maybe aerial side-b, which lingers for hours and sends at an angle comparable to fox's shine while covering much more space. Pretty much the most broken edgeguarding tool there could be. Of course, PMBR has a lot more freedom in terms of modding capability than what was available for SDR, so I'd like to see them be a little more daring than just copying SDR. Making all his copy abilities really good would be a nice start.

 

[Nikes]

Yoshi's treated as a heavy in mario kart.

I didn't say anything about his weight, though he's never been a heavy weight in any Mario Kart game. Not sure where you got that from.

 

[| Kailex |]

Got an idea for yoshi, JOE! just quoted that good yoshi idea list, so im just thinking of adding something; after laying an opponent on the ground as an egg, yoshi would have some time to pick up the opponent and throw them away (while they are still eggs), and maybe charge it up or angle it (idea inspired from yoshi's island)

 

[0RLY]

I greatly dislike tossing eggs with Yoshi to recover. It makes no sense and forces you to play with tap jump off if you want to throw eggs before you dj (which is all the time). I propose moving Yoshi's specials around to buff his recovery.

Up-b: Egg toss -> Yoshi bomb
Si-b: Egg roll -> Egg toss
Do-b: Yoshi bomb -> Egg roll

Yoshi bomb should retain its hop from the grounded version in the air. This allows Yoshi to perform uair, dj, yoshi bomb at higher percents for a star ko. Or even uair, dj uair, yoshi bomb. As a recovery, it will function similarly to Ike and Kirby's up-b. With an initial launching hitbox, up-b out of shield (if Yoshi can jump oos) will also become an option.

Egg toss on side-b makes sense as a lot of projectiles are already on side-b. Do what you will with the properties of the move. The most important part is that Yoshi will be able to use this move without consuming his jump during recovery.

Egg roll is pretty bad, but I assume you guys will know what to do with it. Since it's on down-b now, it will have to be reversal'd to roll in a different direction. Not a problem seeing as Sonic and Puff have similar rolling moves.

These changes, primarily focusing on recovery should relieve Yoshi of one of his biggest drawbacks since 64.

 

[BTmoney]

does any of this get implemented? I don't keep up with this thread

 

[Generically Epic]

iron tail.just saying.

 

[Generically Epic]

awesome uair

 

[Emg3]

i think yoshi should be able to grab the edge with his tongue then spring back up. kinda like what he does in yoshi story n64

 

[Generically Epic]

I also think some aspects of pichu could be put on pikachu, like pichu's better recovery.
walljumping, pichu's upsmash, and his speed.

 

[JOE!]

Seems like a good idea, I mean they did the same with doc to mario.

 

[Deleted member]

i think yoshi should be able to grab the edge with his tongue then spring back up. kinda like what he does in yoshi story n64

Just an fyi, but a lot of people have had this idea before and it simply isn't possible.

As for Pikachu...well, I think he needs a lot of help.

 

[ItsRainingGravy]

I would like to see Luigi be able to aim his fireballs at a 25-35 degree angle, diagonally upwards (but not down), while he is on the ground. This would allow him to put pressure on aerial opponents, so that he has more chances to open them up to his ground/wavedash game.

I dont want them to be aimable downwards, as that would be too useful as a gimping move against certain characters. Nor do I want Luigi to have the ability to aim his fireballs while in the air (it would look silly). Being able to angle them up while is on the ground would be nice, though.

 

[Deleted member]

Samus Ideas

-Crouch goes into morphball - moves around like Zss, Snake, and Sheik's crouch (down-b still bomb)

- Power bomb: hold downb

- Dash-attack: Looks like speedboost (perhaps even lets you crouch in the middle of it, and can launch yourself a certain distance, keeping the same effects the non-crouched dashattack has - percent, hitstun, knockback, etc).

- Different beams: change them with the taunts (or, even while charging)

- Charging mid-air

- Zair (like Brawl)

- Super missiles: hold sideb

- Moonwalk: since moonwalk is so cool in Super Metroid, Samus being able to moonwalk (like Falcon can) would be really cool.


That's all I've got for now.

YES, So much this^^^

I literally came in here to see what people were saying could be done for Samus, and I dig your style my man.

I think Samus should be totally redone, there's so much that could be done with her that could make her awesome that just isn't being tapped in Smash.

Making her a stance character that can seamlessly flow from Morphball to Normal would be awesome. Though, I think instead of crouch is Morphball, DownB should be Morphball, and thus she can have modified neutrals and specials in Morphball mode, though, I dunno how tough that'd be to program. So the crouch idea works. I'd like to give her the Boostball somehow though, I think I'd be a great approach option for her (maybe a quarter circle motion - you know crouch and then SideB?). Having two Bomb Types is also a great idea.

Her rolls should be changed from Morphball to the strafe from the Prime games, it's much quicker and pretty much eliminates her biggest problem, which is the delay after a roll.

Charging Mid-air is a must for her, and the speed of her beams needs some speeding up, I like the idea of her having 4 beams as well, however, I'm afraid the Ice Beam might be OP, but the speed of the beams could vary to balance it. The Charge Beam could be like the one we have, cept a little faster. Plasma Beam could be the fastest, with the least range (good for opening combos), Wave Beam longest Range, medium speed, but weak in power (great for ranged pokes and harassment), and the Ice Beam like an inbetween wave and charge with the best power.

I also like your idea for the Dash Attack, it certainly needs some buffs, giving it a little more punch as well as making the animation more reminiscent of the Speed Booster is a good idea as well I think.

Other than that, her Grapple Beam could be made a little more dynamic, she could use a little more maneuverablity in Mid-Air, and outside of that, I'd say give her SideA a little more power, kinda like what we see in the Smash 4.

 

[Deleted member]

Okay seriously, I really think the arm cannon suggestions will ultimately lead to a broken character, or at the very least, an unbelievably polarizing playstyle more obnoxious than Zelda's, that doesn't at all reflect her Melee one. Also, what is this about Samus being a "hard-to-kill-with" character? Super missiles, Charge shot, Nair, Bair, D-smash, F-smash, and Up-tilt (gimp) ALL kill in Melee, which were all heavily nerfed in Brawl. We're not gonna use Brawl Samus as the foundation for P:M Samus. I'd rather have Melee Samus with slight buffs than being totally revamped into a drastically different character.

Well, I think that what they did with Zelda was phenomenal, and I think many would like to see more characters like that. Samus is the other character that I think needs and deserves such attention as she's just wasted potential to many. Some of the ideas are neat. I like the long range UpSmash and Fair, it's certainly unique and fitting, and it can be made balanced, after all, Snake can do it pretty well, Samus could use some Aerial buffs.

The varied beam, while a cool idea, is a bit excessive. The Morphball as crouch and Strifes as the rolls need to happen though. As does the Charge while in Mid-air and charge while moving. Also, having Power Bombs as the Smash DownB, like the Super Missile as her Smash SideB is a cool idea. I'd also say her UpB could use something similar, with a Smash UpB as a buffed version of her Melee UpB, and a tilt UpB which is lacking in power and range, but can be done multiple times like in her actual games (I'd limit it to three).

 

[Vashimus]

Well, I think that what they did with Zelda was phenomenal, and I think many would like to see more characters like that. Samus is the other character that I think needs and deserves such attention as she's just wasted potential to many. Some of the ideas are neat. I like the long range UpSmash and Fair, it's certainly unique and fitting, and it can be made balanced, after all, Snake can do it pretty well, Samus could use some Aerial buffs.

The varied beam, while a cool idea, is a bit excessive. The Morphball as crouch and Strifes as the rolls need to happen though. As does the Charge while in Mid-air and charge while moving. Also, having Power Bombs as the Smash DownB, like the Super Missile as her Smash SideB is a cool idea. I'd also say her UpB could use something similar, with a Smash UpB as a buffed version of her Melee UpB, and a tilt UpB which is lacking in power and range, but can be done multiple times like in her actual games (I'd limit it to three).

In terms of the Melee vets and suggesting changed for them, less is more. Surely I don't want to play exact replica of Samus with no changes whatsoever (I could just play Melee), but we're not exactly trying to reinvent the wheel here. But it's whatever. I stopped reading this thread simply because there's a lot of garbage in here. No offense to anyone else, I just I cringe too much reading some the suggestions I see.

 

[Generically Epic]

I still think they should fuse sonic's B down and forward B (or have one do one in the air and the other on the ground) and replace of them with the Sonic Boost.

 

[yahyakun]

i would love kirby's 64 Nair, Fair(or melee fair, either is good), and long foot Dtilt.
ive always disliked 64 uair or melees nair (same).
for samus, i would rly like 64's Bair.

 

[Generically Epic]

I think when diddy does his hat flip taunt, you should press B right at the right time and he turns his hat around and puts on sunglasses (his victory taunt from dkc2) like squirtle.
like these texture hacks:

oh if you liked them, they are here:
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?vk7fh07h2k741nu

 

[TreK]

ICs :
-Put Nana's IA on par with that of P:M's bots.
-Replace one of the taunts with a 'desynch' button. As long as it's pressed, only Popo responds to the inputs.
-All of Nana's throws, and her grab release, result in an uthrow.
-Popo's fair spikes too.
-Buff Solo Popo's recovery, somehow.
-Make sure none of Solo Popo's or Solo Nana's moves are punishable on hit.
-Take out wobbling (confirmed already, right ?)

The rest is fine. Take Brawl's ICs, and just make those tweaks. It makes everything that is good about them a feature instead of a glitch, and keeps the 'keep 'em separated' flow about them, because they still have a ridiculous damage output and mindblowing setups when there's two of them. It just ever so slightly buffs solo popo to make up for the loss of the infinites.