Change or Die

[xS A M U R A Ix]

While that title is a little harsh, this stuff is video game darwinism at it's best. I'm really, really, really, really tired of people making posts about how they think the game won't be competitive and all that and their opinions are almost entirely based off of other people's conjecture. This stuff is like a steam roller. One person gets pessimistic about things, then that gives other people ideas and they start posting what they're worried about and soon they have everyone thinking this game isn't worth being played when it's NOT EVEN OUT YET.

Just because a couple of gameplay elements have been removed doesn't mean the game won't be deep or that it won't have mind games. They will just be different. You'll have to learn a new style of play. One focused much more so on fundamentals than tech heavy esoteric knowledge. I myself love this and I know most people from outside fighting game communities find it appealing too. I'm glad it levels the playing field. So what if you can't L cancel everything you do to make it safe. There's something called taking risks and mind games. If suddenly, people realize that they can shield grab most aerial attempts, guess what people will be doing more of when you jump at them? SHIELDING! And guess what beats shields? THROWS!

Maybe you'll have to think about things a little more than shuffling around like some crack addict spamming the same move over and over again. Sorry if that "degenerates" your game play. Personally as an avid 2D fighting game player, I see this as more enriching.

So do us all a favor. If you don't want to play brawl and you're too stuck on Melee, then go play melee and quit crying. It's obvious some people just can't handle change. It's not the end of the Smash Brothers series unless you let it be. Brawl is a new and bright future, with more than a couple of playable characters sitting at the top, unlike the old game. And lots of potential to be something great. All it needs is your support.

 

[StealthFighterX]

Yea i agree with you im tired of it also it makes no sence really. But i know its not going to stop also..

 

[Pharma]

So, so true, this place has become very pessimistic about Brawl's ability to be played competitively. Whilst the game gives less options than melee it is still competitivein the sense that the better player will still win, the playing field is even so there should be no doubt of that fact.

The competitive scene will explode in popularity, with online clans and competition and the necessary knowledge being easily accessible to almost anyone. Another point is that a lot of casuals never got into melee because they thought Brawl was around the corner (how many delays should we give them today?) , and now that it really is just around the corner they can finally concentrate on becoming competitive.

Brawl is not going to kill the smash scene, it is going to evolve it. Mark my words, by the end of Brawl's lifespan we will see tournaments with numbers over 1000.

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

So, so true, this place has become very pessimistic about Brawl's ability to be played competitively. Whilst the game gives less options than melee it is still competitivein the sense that the better player will still win, the playing field is even so there should be no doubt of that fact.

The competitive scene will explode in popularity, with online clans and competition and the necessary knowledge being easily accessible to almost anyone. Another point is that a lot of casuals never got into melee because they thought Brawl was around the corner (how many delays should we give them today?) , and now that it really is just around the corner they can finally concentrate on becoming competitive.

Brawl is not going to kill the smash scene, it is going to evolve it. Mark my words, by the end of Brawl's lifespan we will see tournaments with numbers over 1000.

I completely agree. I'm one of those people that were waiting for Brawl to get into the competitive scene. I had played Melee in it's early days, got out, and when I came back in suddenly it was a different game that what I had originally played and I was too far behind to really bother learning the new way to play the game. Now that Brawl's out, I have a fresh start. I bet it's like that for a lot of people.

 

[burnthepriest6]

Agreed, threads complaining about that are really old and stupid.

BUT!

Threads complaining about people complaining about it are even dumber.

 

[errtu]

totally agree man. playing field has been leveled with a whole lot of characters that seem playable. online play will streamline the brawl knowledge. fresh new start for me too

 

[Kruton]

Thanks for this.

 

[OrlanduEX]

You know

Threads that are focused on whining about Brawl are annoying, but whining about other people whining doesn't help the problem. Oh wait...

 

[bluekitsune13]

Did we really need another topic? :D

 

[NES n00b]

I'm glad it levels the playing field.

What? I don't even know what that means. If it is new players have a better chance against a veteran player, than how is this better? In Guilty Gear and 3rd Strike, you have to play for years before you get close to the top. In Melee, people who have been playing for a year and a half sometimes not only get really good, but are in the upper echelon of playing. I don't think that is too bad right?

So what if you can't L cancel everything you do to make it safe. There's something called taking risks and mind games.

Make everything safe? You can't just shffl like an idiot and expect to actually win. You actually have to know when to use it. This is one of those skills that actually made Melee be playable since if there wasn't that, there wouldn't be enough options for the attackers.

You can't just shffl around like you are on crack

That would never work ever over the whole tourney. You are welcome to try at even a regional Melee tourney.

As an avid 2D fighter fan

Are you really sure you are that avid? I mean, you probably played Street Fighter 2 or 3 with your friends or something. ;_; It is obvious you know not alot about Melee metagame. The optimism is fine, but the attitude and wrong assumptions about competitive Melee make the thread hard to stomach.

 

[Indignant]

I believe the point he is trying to make is to see Brawl unclouded from our preconceptions from Melee. New techs will be discovered, but not as easily if we are stuck with our old mindset. It may take some time to develop, but did not Melee, our darling title? Look at Brawl as if Melee never existed! Then the path will open up.

I have confidence that Brawl will be highly competitive if and only if we allow it to be. Throw your prejudices and your notions out the window! This is a new dawn! Treat it as such.

 

[Brawler1432]

You sir, make a great a thread.

 

[p00pd0g]

What you have said is very true...but there's no point of making a new thread feeding the fire of the two camps (competitive v. non-competitve) to hate one another more.

 

[SaxyPlayah]

Eh, let them be pessimistic. Thats what im doing. I will accept that it wont be competitive, not like i really used competitive techniques so i cant really feel the loss that competitive players have. Im more of a casual/pro. Yeah, i play with no items and only on final destination but i dont really use any competitive techniques besides teching and L-cancelling on occasion. Though id give the game more time, people will fall in love. You dont fall in love at first sight, sorry....got to get some time to work things through.

I personally think brawl will last as long if not longer than melee. Will i still play melee? Heck yeah! I still play SSB64 on an occassional basis. I believe that all three have depth somewhere in them and thats what makes each of them unique. I think just the collaboration of these three games will make the smash series last for the next decade or century.

So yeah, dont get your hopes up, cause they may just crash and youll be depressed for a while. But hey, if some techniques return or even some newer techniques show up, then surprise! I still believe that we need to wait for brawl to come out in the americas before making so many assumptions. There are more than likely new techniques that havent been discovered that will still give brawl a competitive edge.

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

Are you really sure you are that avid? I mean, you probably played Street Fighter 2 or 3 with your friends or something. ;_; It is obvious you know not alot about Melee metagame. The optimism is fine, but the attitude and wrong assumptions about competitive Melee make the thread hard to stomach.

Actually I play a lot of stuff competitively. I've won a couple of Guilty Gear tournaments, placed high in bigger tournaments out of state, won Arcana Heart tournaments, I'm the best Melty Blood player in my state and I do very well vs. people in Cali in online play. I used to play SC2 and SC3 a lot back in the day, placed 9th at a regionals out of a buttload of people (not that exciting but not that bad either >_<), and I used to play melee competitively before all the advanced stuff was discovered.

So I guess that's where a lot of this comes from. I know what the tech is and I know that I may be over simplifying it by saying you can shuffle all day safely, but still, you have to admit that the risk is greatly reduced because of that. Most of the gameplay was about spacing and movement (which is strange because most fighting games are more about the attacking and mix ups, although spacing is still very important).

But anyway, Melee was really fun and still competitive before the advanced stuff was discovered. If you take out wave dashing and L canceling from Melee, it's a very similar game mostly with non-universal fall speed being the only difference. So, I don't think the game will be bad competitively. As said before, there's also chance for new, gameplay changing tech, so I don't think people should jump the gun so quickly.

As for everyone else saying I'm complaining about complainers, I'm more trying to talk some sense into people than complaining.

 

[AznHalfCaucasian]

All I can say is that the game is done and there nothing you can do about it.

 

[billywill]

I agree with you, this is how i felt since the first day people started complaining about brawl

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

All I can say is that the game is done and there nothing you can do about it.

There's plenty I can do about it.

Such as.....play it!

 

[Magnacor]

I completely agree. I'm one of those people that were waiting for Brawl to get into the competitive scene. I had played Melee in it's early days, got out, and when I came back in suddenly it was a different game that what I had originally played and I was too far behind to really bother learning the new way to play the game. Now that Brawl's out, I have a fresh start. I bet it's like that for a lot of people.

Agreed. I only got back into Melee maybe six months before Brawl came out and it was pointless for me to try to go pro then.

You know

Threads that are focused on whining about Brawl are annoying, but whining about other people whining doesn't help the problem. Oh wait...

I'm pretty sure whining about whining about whining doesn't help either. Of course, I suppose I just whined about whining about whining about whining.

 

[Bullet]

Heres something to cheer you all up.

If you play World of Warcraft or did and did its PVP, just imagine how much better everything else is competitively without such BS in it. Meaning yeah......... Smash Bros Brawl when competing might can be taken serious now.

 

[ArgentStew]

Even though I have to agree with you on most points, we really didn't need another post about this... However, Samurai, it wasn't just a couple things that were changed... The whole game plays differently from Melee... It wasn't just the removal of advanced techs...

 

[Mule50]

The only reason that I even have a slight doubt about Brawl is because I came to the melee scene very late- after all the advanced techniques were discovered. I instantly fell in love with the depth that I could immediately see in the game. Now that I am seeing this game before any techniques have been discovered it seems that it won't be as deep because I was used to melee always being deep; however, I realize that many of these fears are irrational because I understand that it took quite a while for melee to get to the level it is now. I merely wanted to chronicle what I and maybe some others are feeling witnessing the birth of a game upon which we rest such high expectations.

 

[Dark Aether]

I don't really see why this is such a big deal... If you want the old advance techs back you could just continue to play melee.... But Brawl WILL need a different approach to be played competitively.

 

[RedMage8BT]

I can't wait to start off fresh. My Melee strategy was becoming stale and boring, with no room for improvement (not that it was the best strategy, far from it, I just don't know where it can go from here). I'm sick of the same old 25 character roster. These characters ar God Tier, these are Garbage Tier... okay I know that, I want to be rid of it!

 

[Nasanieru]

Nice thread, good points.
The resistance of change is a major flaw in our society, we just need to suck it up and ADAPT.
Those who do live. Those who don't die. Easy as that.
Thanks

 

[shadydentist]

The tone may be a little harsh, but hes right. Its far too early to start complaining, and its honestly not going to matter if Brawl is a good competitive game or not for months or potentially years after its release. If it is, it will thrive like Melee has. If it isn't it won't.

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

I'm pretty sure whining about whining about whining doesn't help either. Of course, I suppose I just whined about whining about whining about whining.

omg....TIME PARADOX

Ok so I just kind of whined about whining about whining about whining about whining. How long can this go on?

I'm glad people agree with me though. I should be nicer in my posts in the future, I'm just sort of irritated I guess, what with being really excited about the game, and then coming back to the smash boards and looking for info / hype about the game and seeing that everyone's all QQ about Brawl. People can just be so pessimistic about stuff without giving it a real shot sometimes.

 

[Garuda]

Nice thread, good points.
The resistance of change is a major flaw in our society, we just need to suck it up and ADAPT.
Those who do live. Those who don't die. Easy as that.
Thanks

Q. F. FREAKING. T.