Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer Thread

[Lightning Tiger]

Marth is just like a character who covers all of Gaw's bad match ups.
And I don't want to pick up MK. Its not right.

 

[Rajam]

Marth does not cover MK and Snake...

A good secondary could be Olimar, Dedede or Snake... it really depends on your bad matchups. Personally I use Dedede as a secondary for Snake and some other heavy characters (Ike, DK)

 

[Gifts]

Marth does not cover MK and Snake...

A good secondary could be Olimar, Dedede or Snake... it really depends on your bad matchups. Personally I use Dedede as a secondary for Snake and some other heavy characters (Ike, DK)

Eh, I used to main Oli. I switched to G&W because getting gimped was almost making me quit the game. My suggestion is find a secondary who fits your playing style. Although the only time I bring out Oli is for the Marth matchup, unless I am just playing for fun.

 

[A2ZOMG]

That makes sense. How well has that helped you with the match-up? I wouldn't mind picking up Marth, but I don't like playing characters I don't enjoy... and I just learnt to have a strong dislike for Marth. Darn fairs.

What I learned is if the Marth isn't a top player...the matchup is actually pretty easy, since chances are they're going to do a lot of predictable things that you can really heavily punish. And he is very easy to edgeguard most of the time especially if he doesn't DI perfectly. And anyhow, experiencing how this character's zoning works kinda helps when you're trying to figure out how to break it.

Like you may as well powershield his F-airs if you know they are coming. It's something that Pierce7d told me that I should try to do in the Marth matchup anyhow. When Marth jumps, you should initially expect him to do SH double F-airs or SHFF F-air, since those are pretty much the standard. Yeah obviously the better ones try to mix it up a little more.

For the record I HATE Marth. He's a dumb character that is undeserving of his tier position and popularity. I've played every Fire Emblem game by the way, and Marth is just a ****ing pansy lol.

By the way, if he D-tilts your shield, it's a guessing game, but what you can do is D-tilt out of shield to punish him if he commits to another D-tilt. DB well, you either shield and punish it, or you SDI out (towards him can work).

Marth I feel in general demands experience. Experience to use effectively and experience to counter him.

 

[Today]

Marth does not cover MK and Snake...

A good secondary could be Olimar, Dedede or Snake... it really depends on your bad matchups. Personally I use Dedede as a secondary for Snake and some other heavy characters (Ike, DK)

I can agree with this. I suppose Marth could help you with some of your bad matchups. But he wouldn't help against Snake, Dedede, etc.

I actually use Olimar like a secondary. He helps me for Snake and D3. And some of my worse personal matchups like DK. Although Olimar doesn't help against Marth or MK. At least I can switch back between him and Game and Watch.

@A2, Yeah. Anyone that doesn't know the matchup can help a lot. I honestly suggest knowing the Marth matchup and playing it a lot. So when you do come against a Marth it'll be an easier time. Because honestly, what Marths play Game and Watch? Fortunately for me all the Marths I do end up coming to at a tournament don't know the matchup so it's a lot easier. And there are players here that do, so I get the Marth practice I need.

I never SDI out of his dtilt, but I'll see how that works. I'm hoping I can play a handful of Marths before MLG Columbus.
I can say a lot of us don't like Marths. I know people who dropped their mains because of GnW and picked up Marth around here. At least I get the practice I guess.

 

[A2ZOMG]

lolwut SDI his D-tilt? I hope you mean Dancing Blade, because that is what I was talking about.

 

[Today]

Err. Yeah, I meant to type DB. Sorries! My fingers are sometimes faster than my brain.
But you get what I mean.

 

[Lightning Tiger]

Marth definitely does better against Snake than Gaw.
And in general Marth is a much better char.
I don't know about MK. But it would seem marth has better tools to stop MK than Gaw.

 

[Today]

Why not pick up Olimar or King Dedede? Marth has a slight disadvantage against Snake.
And you'll also being playing Marth dittos as well. King Dcubed sounds like the best choice as a secondary for GnW. I actually was thinking about secondaring him myself.

 

[Lightning Tiger]

I can't play someone so slow. Iono why.
Also not very good at set ups. (U-Tilt)

Marth is a lot more simple.

 

[Today]

Well if you feel that way. But King Dedede would probably be your best bet next to Metaknight.
I would say try Olimar but then you'd have trouble with MK and Marth still. But he covers a lot of other things and minor things.
Good luck on the Marth then! You're still going to have Snake and MK trouble, though. And you'll going to have to practice a bit on the ditto.

 

[revengeska]

I learned Fox, even if he doesn't have amazing matchups against some of those characters I feel like he's fast enough and has enough options where you could outplay someone. In the case of Snake and Marth it's probably going to be camping with lasers and trying to get in shots with plenty of spot dodging and air dodging. Not great matchups, but they can feel better than using G&W at least.

 

[Today]

Welp, according to the fox boards it's not as bad as Game and Watch against those characters. So it's better in some way.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Marth gets his **** utterly wrecked against MK. Unless you're Mikehaze.

Not much unlike how G&W gets screwed a ton by MK unless you're Zac.

But lolsrsly, MK is such a dumb terrible matchup.

Pick Falco or Diddy imo if you want a secondary that is not named MK or Snake.

 

[Today]

Diddy is a good choice, too.
But it's hard to secondary Diddy without practically maining him.

He requires a lot of work. And eventually when he is really good you'll realize he's much easier to use in general than GnW.
Some people I know who tried to secondary Diddy and worked really hard with him got scared and dropped him because they were considering dropping their mains for him.

 

[MX778]

Hey, does anyone know when the next tournament in Columbus, Ohio is?
I REALLY need to get back into the tourney scene. It's been like 6 months. >.>

 

[Today]

XD; You may have been better off posting in the Midwest section to see.

However, to my knowledge there aren't any Columbus tournaments out there until MLG Columbus which is the beginning of June. It's a huge national. I suggest checking it out!

 

[Lightning Tiger]

How does Zac do it!!? :/

 

[Today]

Do what? o-o?

 

[PentaSalia]

Get girls!!! of course

 

[Lightning Tiger]

Beat all those MK's.

 

[Cinnanmonny]

The MKs don't know the MU well enough and Zac is really good
X_X
combination of both...

 

[Grinpis]

how i do the d air falling slowly? yes like in the 3:20 in this vid http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9i1Z0pDqDQ&feature=related

yeah is utdzac combo video.

 

[Today]

Hit dair twice and you'll fall slowly.

@Cinnanmonny, I think the MKs there know the matchup quite well. So I bet it's pretty hard now.

Find the ones that don't! Lol. About 6-7/10 MKs don't really know the matchup. Can't say I'm surprised since there aren't that many GnWs to learn from.

 

[UTDZac]

To "slow-fall" a dair you simply input a "fast-fall" at any time during a dair's animation.

1) Do a DAIR.
2) Tap DOWN on the CONTROL STICK or tap DOWN on the C-STICK.

 

[Lightning Tiger]

Teach us Zac

 

[Yung Mei]

question on matchup with Falcon

What's the matchup ratio :D
and
what should a falcon do (apart from spacing) when playing against Game & Watch? i imagine a place with platforms, uTilt, and uAir would be pretty good against G&W, idk

 

[SFA Smiley]

It's like 80:20. And I'm pretty sure Platforms would probably hurt falcon. GW has better air game and is better both above and below Falcon. I did get utilted from a badly spaced slowfall dair the other day though, but I'm pretty sure that was just my mistake I can't imagine Utilt would have actually beat it. I even beat way better Falcons than me, the only way they even ever touch me is by capitalizing on my mistakes. Yoshi's island might work since the big awkward platform in the middle screws up our approaches and the support ghosts can save you. If GW shorthop bairs you can shield all 5 hits and grab him and might be able to get some uairs off but i'm pretty sure dair beats everything Falcon has so be careful of that. If he dairs shield BOTH hits and punish be careful though he may jab or Dtilt to avoid punishment if you're not fast enough.

Don't let him Uair you all day it refreshes his moves and pay attention to him when you're above because he'll try to screw your timing with Uairs and punish you when you hit the ground.

 

[Yung Mei]

It's like 80:20. And I'm pretty sure Platforms would probably hurt falcon. GW has better air game and is better both above and below Falcon. I did get utilted from a badly spaced slowfall dair the other day though, but I'm pretty sure that was just my mistake I can't imagine Utilt would have actually beat it. I even beat way better Falcons than me, the only way they even ever touch me is by capitalizing on my mistakes. Yoshi's island might work since the big awkward platform in the middle screws up our approaches and the support ghosts can save you. If GW shorthop bairs you can shield all 5 hits and grab him and might be able to get some uairs off but i'm pretty sure dair beats everything Falcon has so be careful of that. If he dairs shield BOTH hits and punish be careful though he may jab or Dtilt to avoid punishment if you're not fast enough.

Don't let him Uair you all day it refreshes his moves and pay attention to him when you're above because he'll try to screw your timing with Uairs and punish you when you hit the ground.

great, now i can use my 20% advantage against pentasalia tomorrow, thanks :D


seriously speaking now, thanks for the help i appreciate it :D

 

[BSP]

GaW's, I'm starting to use GaW a bit, and I'm learning a few things, but what would you guys recommend against MK? Any MU advice? Should I change characters (seriously, MK doesn't follow priority rules, and he outspeeds Gdubs in pretty much every situation)? Any advice would be appreciated.

And finally, do you guys play with TJ on or off?

 

[saqer]

Are there optimal times to use the down b? Does it collect against Zelda, Pikachu, Ness, etc non special energy moves? It just seems that move brings you down because you have to concentrate on using it and it only works in very narrow windows.

 

[SFA Smiley]

Are there optimal times to use the down b? Does it collect against Zelda, Pikachu, Ness, etc non special energy moves? It just seems that move brings you down because you have to concentrate on using it and it only works in very narrow windows.

Nah dude that's not true at all. It's extremely fast first of all, comes out on frame 2 IIRC. It also has HUGE range (It basically catches anything about GW's height above and below him.)

You don't have to concentrate on using it at all, especially if you main GW it's part of his character so you'll know when to use it and not. It doesn't catch non B special attacks but it does catch all those character's projectiles for very strong buckets and particularly with ness we can edgeguard him really well by holding out our bucket as he tried to Up-B and watch him fall to his doom. The scary part is making sure you're safe before using it. many people will wait for you to bucket and then smash you while you're still in lag and those same characters will try to catch you off guard and be unpredictable with their projectiles but if you study them you will be able to see "tells" they have sometimes.

Down B has helped me win a lot of matches I would have lost because it can instantly take a stock if your opponent underestimates it.

 

[SFA Smiley]

GaW's, I'm starting to use GaW a bit, and I'm learning a few things, but what would you guys recommend against MK? Any MU advice? Should I change characters (seriously, MK doesn't follow priority rules, and he outspeeds Gdubs in pretty much every situation)? Any advice would be appreciated.

And finally, do you guys play with TJ on or off?

I honestly play with Tap Jump off but it might be beneficial for Up-Bing outta shield (maybe for doubles?). As far as GW vs MK, it's your call but GW vs MK isn't all that bad. MK definitely has the advantage but everybody loses to MK anyway. It's really up to you, you're probably better off just using whoever your best with against MK as long as they don't get ***** by him.

 

[Today]

GaW's, I'm starting to use GaW a bit, and I'm learning a few things, but what would you guys recommend against MK? Any MU advice? Should I change characters (seriously, MK doesn't follow priority rules, and he outspeeds Gdubs in pretty much every situation)? Any advice would be appreciated.

And finally, do you guys play with TJ on or off?

Uh. Most GnWers play with TJ on. Which is a good idea. Personally I have it off because I play three other characters that benefits off more so than on. And I've learnt playing GnW with it off. So it works really well for me.

As for the MK matchup U-B when you're in tornado and he'll be left in helpless stage for a free smash/grab/whatever. Not many MKs do but they can utilt dair, and Shuttle Loop Bair/nair. So space those currectly and watch out from dairing a lot.

@Saqer, I know down-B will be your most helpful move. Why? Dundada! Bucket Breaking. If you don't know about it I'll explain it to you. Pretty much if you are getting hit across the screen and if you nair to down-B, you'll use the Bucket. Bucket stops all momentum and thus you live when at times you probably would die. It's very very useful for living a lot longer. I've lived up to the high 100's-low 200's in many of my matches. Especially against characters that have a hard time killing.

Other than that as for projectiles. If you can do it without getting punished I say go for it. If you're right in front of them taking up some lasers they have a chance to hit you, grab you, etc. All in all you just have to know when you can do it without getting punished.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I play with Tap Jump on to Up-B out of shield, the main argument for having it off is easier SDI.

And believe it or not, I do actually Up-smash out of shield. It's not for everyone, especially not for every G&W user, but I can confidently say that it is occasionally useful. Like for example, if you read that Snake is doing a ledge getup attack, you can Up-smash that **** out of shield with Tap Jump on. You probably can do that to many more getup attacks, iirc every ledge getup attack is like -28 on shield or something lol.

And every so often against dumb spacing mistakes, I'll surprise someone with it.

 

[NoBio]

Can't you UpB OoS without TJ on? If you can't explains why my upB OoS(Or what I thought was it) was slower in start up.

I main G&W, while using him, should I use Nair alot? currently I use more Bair than Nair and i'm better at spacing Bair. Should I use it more in general? In certain match ups? I tried using more Nairs the other day but I felt I played worse, should I just stick to my original playstyle instead?

~NoTrace

 

[A2ZOMG]

You can Up-B OOS with TJ off, but it requires an extra input, since you have to hit a jump button while doing Up-B.

It is VERY difficult to Up-B out of shield with standard controls frame perfectly. You would probably have to turn a trigger button into a jump button to be able to buffer it correctly, or you could do what I do and set X to specials and always jump with Y.

N-air vs B-air, honestly it isn't a fair comparison. The moves are useful in different situations, but as for N-air, it's important to learn how to space it so that you can combo into D-smash. If you can space the 3rd hit of N-air really consistently, it combos into D-smash on everyone. There's some posts in the GD thread that cover that, but you can either buffer fullhop B-air -> N-air or use N-air at the apex of short hop to get that perfect spacing that combos into D-smash.

 

[NoBio]

Hmm, ok, I'll have to try that. Thanks.

~NoTrace

 

[Cinnanmonny]

I know I've asked this question a billion times >_>

How am I supposed to kill?

it doesn't matter which character I choose

ALWAYS, if I get them to like 120% and I'm 30%, they ALWAYS kill me before I kill them
I'm not even exaggerating, pretty much every time I've had a huge percent lead they've made some sort of comeback...

How do I fix my problem? I feel like I've tried everything, and I even asked this board before.

 

[Today]

Uh.. Prediction and patience. Just think honestly. I never had a problem with killing because I never focused on killing and losing my concentration. If I know someone is going to land in a certain spot use a smash there. A lot of times people run into dsmash. People land into upsmashes and land next to forward smashes. Sometimes you can try and go for a dthrow to dsmash or a dthrow to a tech fsmash/usmash. Or maybe jabs to fsmash. After awhile it's just natural.