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Official 4BR Tier List V3 - Competitive Insight & Analysis

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I do want to point out that Chavo, a CT-ranked Bayo player, did beat Sol at this past EVO.
So despite the recent losses, it might be a player problem than matchup problem.
 
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The-Technique

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Bayo players often have terrible disadvantage states and bad neutrals.
Mac blows them up for it.
Nothing out of the ordinary imo.
Nothing to do with Bayo, but I was wondering what you thought of the most recent set between MK Leo and Mr. R. What exactly does Mr. R do wrong that causes him to lose, as opposed to VoiD who has a much better record versus Leo's Marth?
 

FeelMeUp

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Nothing to do with Bayo, but I was wondering what you thought of the most recent set between MK Leo and Mr. R. What exactly does Mr. R do wrong that causes him to lose, as opposed to VoiD who has a much better record versus Leo's Marth?
Playing against Marth as if he doesn't have a sword.
Approaching too much and not using needle charges to make Marth come in.
Too much shield.
Not being spaced at a distance that allows you to outspace tipper fair, nair and jab while still giving you an opportunity to whiff punish with boost grab and rising fair.
Trying to go for fraudulent combos that don't actually work on Marth(can't ftilt>pp utilt or reliably double ftilt at a lot of percents, for example)
Not using crossup roll enough.
Overall mediocre to bad landing options.
Not very good at comboing Marth at all(his ledgetrapping slightly makes up for it, though).
Too much jumping.

Small changes like this go a long way in the Sheik vs Swordie matchups.
 

NairWizard

Somewhere
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Of course Bayos are losing to Little Mac. They're relying too hard on their advantage state.

Salem is the only Bayo who plays neutral like Bayo is supposed to play neutral.

If I see Salem lose to a Little Mac in best of 3 I'll eat my shoe. And a few buttons on my coat.
 

Minordeth

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So CaptainZack, Chag, and Pink Fresh have all lost to Little Mac now. Thoughts?
Bayo players often have terrible disadvantage states and bad neutrals.
Mac blows them up for it.
Nothing out of the ordinary imo.
This. I'll add a few things tho:

1.) Mac players, by necessity, are really good at anti-airing with Utilt, Usmash, and Up-B.

2.)Furthermore, all of Bayo's good approach or neutral tools are aerials, and none of them hit directly below her. Mac has the ground mobility to get under her and either power through whatever she throws with Usmash/Up-B, or stuff with Utilt.

3.)You see Bayo players counterpick Lylat to use the tilt to force approaches with her bullets. Mac has the ground mobility and burst damage to punish these attempts. You can see this in Chag vs Elvis, as Chag mistakenly thought he could camp out a bit. The other issue with Lylat is Mac can shark the platforms really well. It's not Battlefield.

4.) Mac can really, really punish Bayo's landing lag.
 

jet56

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Bayo's play the Mu wrong against mac. The character relies on the other player hitting buttons and duffing them for it.

When a bayo decides to land with an aerial against the rest of the roster, she trades or wins.

When a bayo decides to land with an aerial against little mac, she eats a smash.

Little mac straight up loses to defensive play and straight up beats offensive play. It's why he will always be relevant but not consistent.
 

Bowserboy3

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Question to all,

If Bayonetta were to Witch Time somebody who has their respawn invincibility, is that respawn invincibility time increased because of the slowdown or is it still the normal 2 seconds?

I have my weekly tonight, and there's a rather arrogant, aggressive player attending who really grinds my gears.

Let's just say I have some ideas with the top Battlefield platform :estatic:
 

Galaxeon

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The invicibility time is not slowed down, so you have a window of around 1 sec to hit them and start a combo. Zack used this pretty often at his beginings with Bayo at top level. But it usually won't work twice in a set.
 

Bowserboy3

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The invicibility time is not slowed down, so you have a window of around 1 sec to hit them and start a combo. Zack used this pretty often at his beginings with Bayo at top level. But it usually won't work twice in a set.
Good to note, thanks for that. I was unsure because I know that roll, spotdodge and airdodge intangibility time is increased to match where it should be in the animation. Wasn't sure whether this was the same for the respawn invincibility.

Yeah, I know for sure it's not something that can be abused, but it's something I'd love to get on this person in particular lol.
 

Luco

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It's more likely than not a MU inexperience problem, but keeping in mind any MU to do with mac tends to focus *heavily* on stage you need to be observant of your ruleset when analysing a set outcome. Picking one incorrect stage or losing game 1 vs winning it could have gigantic consequences.

And in this MU I assume Mac really wants to avoid SV and BF in 5FLSS whilst Bayo only really wants to avoid FD? That means Mac *will* have to play on a very hard stage, so I feel like theoretically Bayo should be abusing that - I wonder what the bayos have been picking to in these sets?

Of course the game is more dynamic than this at the end of the day but it's definitely important to think about.
 
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|RK|

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Can I share random observations I just made, despite better players obviously being aware?

After seeing Kid Viper (top GG player) tell ANTi to walk as Bayonetta, I just realized that walking is good for the exact same reason I prefer Kirby's recovery to Lucarios (and why Fox's lightning quick movements get punished so often). Fine movement control is less predictable.

We talk pretty often about burst options and how good they are, but using Diddy's Monkey Flip as an example (for the 19th time this week), the reason it gets punished is because there's very little fine control of it. The moment some burst starts, you know exactly where it's going, so you learn to predict it.

Even if it's not an option as fast as, say, Falcon's dash grab, it still works out the same way. Slower moves though aren't just predictable - they also give opponents the option to react on autopilot.

I call the MK MU pivot grab practice for that purpose. He's all about burst movement, and gets little out of walking around.

Tl;dr - you all probably already know this, fine control of movement is godlike.
 

blackghost

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This. I'll add a few things tho:

1.) Mac players, by necessity, are really good at anti-airing with Utilt, Usmash, and Up-B.

2.)Furthermore, all of Bayo's good approach or neutral tools are aerials, and none of them hit directly below her. Mac has the ground mobility to get under her and either power through whatever she throws with Usmash/Up-B, or stuff with Utilt.

3.)You see Bayo players counterpick Lylat to use the tilt to force approaches with her bullets. Mac has the ground mobility and burst damage to punish these attempts. You can see this in Chag vs Elvis, as Chag mistakenly thought he could camp out a bit. The other issue with Lylat is Mac can shark the platforms really well. It's not Battlefield.

4.) Mac can really, really punish Bayo's landing lag.
To add that, is it fair to say that mac most of Mac's mu he operates like he's fighting bayo? Most players hate the bayo mu because they have to slow down and be more patient and be defensive . For mac that requirement is virtually universal.
I will say if mac takes the first stock vs a bayo it's REALLY bad for the bayo player.
 

|RK|

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To add that, is it fair to say that mac most of Mac's mu he operates like he's fighting bayo? Most players hate the bayo mu because they have to slow down and be more patient and be defensive . For mac that requirement is virtually universal.
I will say if mac takes the first stock vs a bayo it's REALLY bad for the bayo player.
At minimum, I'd have to argue Mac doesn't lose as hard to Bayo as previously thought. Thing is, if the opponent has to play in a certain way to beat you, you have limited their options in some way.

Doesn't mean you win, but you can't be completely free.
 

blackghost

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At minimum, I'd have to argue Mac doesn't lose as hard to Bayo as previously thought. Thing is, if the opponent has to play in a certain way to beat you, you have limited their options in some way.

Doesn't mean you win, but you can't be completely free.
Guys like ninjalink have been saying mac beats bayo for ages. Characters win or lose mu based on available options vs a specific character. Bayo does lose a few options which isn't normal for her. But it's too early to say it's a losing mu but it feels like it could become very close like the fox mu has very somewhat similar reasons
 

jet56

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Bayo still wins the mu against mac. She does have a win condition against him.

It's called camping with her ridiculous mobility and bullets in the air.

Also keep in mind a smash attack can be baited out and then punished by bayo.

From my experience, people on some level refuse to camp or play beyond passively against mac for a number of reasons but the biggest one seems to be this:

On some level, they think they are submitting to a easy tactic and are admitting to themselves that they cannot beat a low tier character unless they camp, and that they can't beat mac straight up.

This actually bothers people, cause it would wound their pride I guess to have to resort to super defensive play to beat a low tier. It's a mentality a lot of people have, having witnessed it myself in my own matches and the matches I have seen from others.

Little mac honestly counters players, not characters.
 

Aaron1997

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If you don't have the balls to camp because "lol pride" or people don't like it, don't ever come over here and cry about characters you can't beat for some reason. Play to win. If people don't like you for it, that's good because that means your doing something right. There's a reason why Salem is s best Bayo and not Zack or Mistake.

I'm probably 1 of the more aggro Pac's and even I know when its time to start running down the clock.

People can't be Scared to play the match-up correctly

Edit:
 
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Jaguar360

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Gonna do a brief overview of the notable players Super Smash Con pools now that they're finalized. There's a lot more going on than there was in EVO round 1 pools, though there are still a good amount that aren't really interesting:

Salem :4bayonetta:, ADHD :4diddy:, Squerk :4yoshi:, Pipp :4metaknight::4dk::4sheik:
Volatility: low
Dath :4robinf:, Black Yoshi :4bayonetta:, Nom :4sheik:, Bryce :4dedede::4luigi:, Naranja :4corrinf:
Volatility: High
Shoyo James :4diddy::4luigi:, Blank :4sheik:, Rython :4littlemac:
Volatility: Medium
ESAM :4pikachu::4samus:, Doraz :4yoshi::4diddy:, AceStarThe3rd :4bayonetta2::rosalina:
Volatility: Low
VoiD :4sheik::4fox:, MrRyanNess :4kirby::4megaman::4lucina:, Pootietang :4falcon::4diddy:
Volatility: Low
6WX :4sonic:, Kiki :4diddy:, JeBB :4bayonetta::4lucas:, Nicklecat :4greninja:, Winks :4zss:
Volatility: Medium
Vinnie :4sheik::rosalina:, JILL :4fox:, Z8 :4luigi:, Wawa Peach :4cloud2::4marth:, Meekspeedy :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
NAKAT :4fox::4ness::4lucina::4dk::4pikachu:, Red Berpo :4bayonetta:, Gains :4diddy::4luigi:
Volatility: Low
Komorikiri :4cloud2::4marth::4sonic:, Ralphie :4cloud2::4fox:, Ferf :4sonic:, Poyo :4kirby::4luigi:
Volatility: Medium
SuperGirlKels :4sonic:, RiotLettuce :4bayonetta::4dk:, BONK! :4metaknight:, Khat :4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Ryuga :4corrinf::4bowser:, Max Ketchum :4lucina::4cloud2:, TruBlu :4lucas::4mewtwo:, DanTheMan :4charizard:
Volatiliy: Low
CaptainZack :4bayonetta:, Juice :4lucas::4fox:, Xerom :4ness:
Volatility: Low
ZeRo :4diddy:, Stretch :4marth:, Ketsen :rosalina:, Upchuckle :4greninja:, Cowhunter :4cloud2::4marth:
Volatility: Low
Cashmere :4falcon:, JJROCKETS :4diddy:, Zebra :4mewtwo:, Slayonetta :4bayonetta:, JetKick :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium
8BitMan :4rob::4diddy:, Tension :4fox:, Rishi :4kirby::substitute:, BugCatcherWill :4lucario:
Volatility: Medium
Sonido :4sonic:, Dandy Penguin :4duckhunt:, Lightshad :4fox:
Volatility: Medium

Light :4fox:, Promaelia :4corrin:, Lunchables :4feroy:, G-Rain :4lucas:
Volatility: Medium
Fatality :4falcon:, Vivid :4lucario: (Supposedly officially dropped Corrin), Hammer :4bowser:, Tony Guava :4mewtwo::4metaknight:, Duffy :4yoshi::4mewtwo::4marth:, Van :4ganondorf:
Volatility: Medium
Rich Brown :4mewtwo:, Dill :4diddy::4mewtwo::4sheik:, Aiba :4yoshi:, Miloni :4cloud2::4marth:, Elu :4greninja:, Wolf :4sheik:
Volatility: High
DSS :4metaknight::4gaw:, Zoan :4mewtwo:, Kresent :4megaman::4ryu:, Bloodcross :4charizard::4fox:, Colinies :4fox:
Volatility: High
RFang :4mario::4cloud2:, DJ Jack :4ryu:, Darkblues :4cloud2:, Edwin :4megaman::4pacman::4sonic:, Horse :4ness::4zss:, Kasper :4littlemac:
Volatility: High
Cosmos :4corrinf:, Sol :4littlemac:, Jams :4rob:, Nature :4mewtwo:, Cinnpie :4zss:
Volatility: Medium
ZD :4fox:, Rideae :4pikachu:, Jimmy :4cloud2:, Suar :4sheik:
Volatility: Medium
Peabnut :4megaman:, Rags :4metaknight:, Aceto :4metaknight:, Port :4pacman:
Volatility: Medium
Remzi :4zss::4corrinf:, Wonderbread :4littlemac:, Deven3000 :4kirby:, bsquared :4tlink:, Crazycolorz5 :rosalina:, Midnight :rosalina:
Volatility: High
Locus :4ryu:, Hackoru :4mario::4diddy:, Freelancer Leo :4mewtwo:, CC :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
Mr. E :4marth::4lucina:, Mav :4cloud2:, Hart :4sheik:, Twox :4miisword:
Volatility: Low
saj. :4bayonetta::4peach:, Lycan :4diddy:, Infinity :4cloud2:, GwJ :4rob::rosalina:
Volatility: Medium
Xaltis :rosalina::4lucina:, Oatmeal :4metaknight:, Puppeh :4sheik:, Mystearica :4bayonetta:, Diamond :4zelda:
Volatility: Medium
MVD :4diddy:, Archy :4sheik::4diddy:, Osiris197 :4falco:
Volatility: Low
Abadango :4mewtwo::4bayonetta::4metaknight:, Sync :4cloud2:, F.O.E. :4greninja::4tlink:, Moser :4villager:
Volatility: Low
Tweek :4cloud2::4dk:, Gen :4ryu:, Mugi :4corrinf:, Shadow :4sheik:, Dingus Joe :4gaw:, PHaZeX3R0 :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium

Ned :4cloud2:, Querty :4lucario:, Hungrybox :4jigglypuff::4mario::4ness:, Roxas :4feroy:
Volatility: Low
Kameme :4megaman::4sheik::4wario:, Redeemer Z :4mario::4rob:, Coldweatherr :4marth:, Thunderz :4fox:
Volatility: Low
Craftis :4sonic:, Zephyr :4cloud2:, Ke-ya :4robinf:
Volatility: Medium
The Great Gonzales :4ness:, Seth :4yoshi:, Manzano :4peach::4jigglypuff:, Karinole :rosalina::4greninja:, Skance :4fox::4ryu:
Volatility: High
JK :4bayonetta:, MattyG :4cloud2::4megaman:, Saber :4metaknight:, Hiro :4diddy::4bowserjr:, Anima :4peach::4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Ally :4mario:, Squidboy :4metaknight::4lucario:, Aqua :4luigi:, Draxsel :4falcon::4cloud2:, Disgaea :4gaw:
Volatility: Low
Nairo :4zss::substitute:, SETHsational :4falcon:, Fahrenheit :4bowser:, Lv^Ludo :4diddy::4fox:
Volatility: Low
Mr. R :4sheik::4cloud2:, Ten :4fox:, Iota :4wario2:, Son :4lucas:, The Real Mr. M :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Ryo :4myfriends::4feroy::4corrinf:, Smasher1001 :4megaman::4mario:, Vash :4marth:, BlaiseAgain :4yoshi:, Literal Bacon :4littlemac:
Volatility: Medium
Frozen :4corrinf:, Parappa :4larry:, Kam Steele :4fox:, Xion :4cloud2:, VikkiKitty :4corrin:
Volatility: Medium
Dabuz :rosalina:, Lee :4bowser:, Cagt :4littlemac:, Muj :4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Mute Ace :4peach:, Biddy :4tlink:, LeeT :4jigglypuff::4miibrawl::4miisword:, Jdawg :4dedede:, StylesX2 :4megaman:
Volatility: Medium
tyroy :4bayonetta:, Donquavious :4greninja::4zss:, Pelca :4diddy:, Sparky #25 :4pikachu:
Volatility: Medium
Nicko :4shulk:, Raptor :4yoshi:, Riz :4metaknight:, Arch :4palutena:, ChuDat :4zss:
Zinoto :4diddy:, iModerz :4fox:, Kiwi :4pacman::4mewtwo:, Bloodynite :4ganondorf:, Pazda :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Manny :4sonic:, THUNDER :4ryu:, Spirunk :4yoshi::4bowser:, Minix :4bayonetta:, Ninja :4mario:
Volatility: Low

Darkshad :4ryu:, Dark Wizzy :4mario:, BC Luck :4lucina::4luigi:, Shadow_PR :4bayonetta:, Mega :4myfriends:
Volatility: High
Seagull Joe :4sonic::4diddy:, dekillsage :4fox::4mewtwo:, Unknown :4sheik:, Rickles :4cloud2::4ganondorf:, ARS3 :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
Larry Lurr :4fox::4dk::4metaknight:, Bankai :4zss:, Ak8s :4zss:, Hex :4sonic:, MS. SAYIAN :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Mistake :4bayonetta::4zss:, Ash23 :4bowser:, Winds :4tlink:, Sect :4metaknight:, The Cheese :4littlemac:
Volatility: Low
Pink Fresh :4bayonetta:, LazyBoredom :4littlemac:, Onpu :4zelda:, Player-1 :4diddy:, BOW :4mario:
Volatility: High
Aarvark :4villager::4villagerf:, Dexter :4marth::4corrinf::4feroy:, cFive :4fox:, Dapuffster :4miibrawl:
Volatility: Medium
Sinji :4pacman:, Zeta :4zss:, Jayy :4sheik:, DK DAN :4dk:, El Chapo :4mewtwo:, poKevSim :4mewtwo:
Volatility: Medium
IcyMist :4samus:, pu55yk1ng :4littlemac:, Mlarcin :4lucas::4mewtwo:, Dante :4zelda:, Suzu :4ness:
Volatility: Low
falln :rosalina:, P2P w/ Gibus :4greninja::4lucario:, BB :4mewtwo:, King James :4diddy:, Midas :4marth::4lucina::4corrinf::4dk::substitute:, boosk :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium
MKLeo :4marth::4cloud2::4corrinf::4metaknight:, Viceroy :rosalina:, Nurse :4dk:, Dainosuke :4diddy:, Law :4sheik:
Volatility: Low
Luhtie :4zss:, Legit :4diddy:, Quilly :4falco::4bowser:, Brand :4rob::4cloud2:, CORONA17 :4diddy:, Fos Prophit :4wario:
Volatility: High
WaDi :4mewtwo::4rob:, RoguePenguin :4mario:, Zage :4pacman:, Nova :rosalina::4corrinf::4ness::4lucas:, Jerm :4robinm:
Volatility: Medium
Xzax :4fox:, BlazingPasta :4peach::4ness:, Arhungry :4corrinf:, vyQ :4mario:
Volatility: High
Samsora :4peach:, JaKaL :4sonic:, Sova Unknown :4link:, Dr. Copter :4greninja:, Waldo :4myfriends:, Daybreak :4falco::4cloud2:, Sheen :4falcon:
Volatility: High
dyr :4diddy:, Blacktwins :4cloud2::4mario::4diddy:, Snakeee :rosalina::4corrinf:, McDareth :4falco:
Volatility: Low
Konga :4dk:, DKWill :4dk:, Nameless :4diddy:, Scorch :4sonic:, Serynder :4jigglypuff:, Zucchini :4corrinf:
Volatility: High
 
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TDK

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 11, 2015
Messages
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British Columbia
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GrayCN
Gonna do a brief overview of the notable players Super Smash Con pools now that they're finalized. There's a lot more going on than there was in EVO round 1 pools, though there are still a good amount that aren't really interesting:

Wave B:
Salem :4bayonetta:, ADHD :4diddy:, Squerk :4yoshi:, Pipp :4metaknight::4dk::4sheik:
Volatility: low
Dath :4robinf:, Black Yoshi :4bayonetta:, Nom :4sheik:, Bryce :4dedede::4luigi:, Naranja :4corrinf:
Volatility: High
Shoyo James :4diddy::4luigi:, Blank :4sheik:, Rython :4littlemac:
Volatility: Medium
ESAM :4pikachu::4samus:, Doraz :4yoshi::4diddy:, AceStarThe3rd :4bayonetta2::rosalina:
Volatility: Low
VoiD :4sheik::4fox:, MrRyanNess :4kirby::4megaman::4lucina:, Pootietang :4falcon::4diddy:
Volatility: Low
6WX :4sonic:, Kiki :4diddy:, JeBB :4bayonetta::4lucas:, Nicklecat :4greninja:, Winks :4zss:
Volatility: Medium
Vinnie :4sheik::rosalina:, JILL :4fox:, Z8 :4luigi:, Wawa Peach :4cloud2::4marth:, Meekspeedy :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
NAKAT :4fox::4ness::4lucina::4dk::4pikachu:, Red Berpo :4bayonetta:, Gains :4diddy::4luigi:
Volatility: Low
Komorikiri :4cloud2::4marth::4sonic:, Ralphie :4cloud2::4fox:, Ferf :4sonic:, Poyo :4kirby::4luigi:
Volatility: Medium
SuperGirlKels :4sonic:, RiotLettuce :4bayonetta::4dk:, BONK! :4metaknight:, Khat :4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Ryuga :4corrinf::4bowser:, Max Ketchum :4lucina::4cloud2:, TruBlu :4lucas::4mewtwo:, DanTheMan :4charizard:
Volatiliy: Low
CaptainZack :4bayonetta:, Juice :4lucas::4fox:, Xerom :4ness:
Volatility: Low
ZeRo :4diddy:, Stretch :4marth:, Ketsen :rosalina:, Upchuckle :4greninja:, Cowhunter :4cloud2::4marth:
Volatility: Low
Cashmere :4falcon:, JJROCKETS :4diddy:, Zebra :4mewtwo:, Slayonetta :4bayonetta:, JetKick :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium
8BitMan :4rob::4diddy:, Tension :4fox:, Rishi :4kirby::substitute:, BugCatcherWill :4lucario:
Volatility: Medium
Sonido :4sonic:, Dandy Penguin :4duckhunt:, Lightshad :4fox:
Volatility: Medium

Wave C:
Light :4fox:, Promaelia :4corrin:, Lunchables :4feroy:, G-Rain :4lucas:
Volatility: Medium
Fatality :4falcon:, Vivid :4lucario: (Supposedly officially dropped Corrin), Hammer :4bowser:, Tony Guava :4mewtwo::4metaknight:, Duffy :4yoshi::4mewtwo::4marth:, Van :4ganondorf:
Volatility: Medium
Rich Brown :4mewtwo:, Dill :4diddy::4mewtwo::4sheik:, Aiba :4yoshi:, Miloni :4cloud2::4marth:, Elu :4greninja:, Wolf :4sheik:
Volatility: High
DSS :4metaknight::4gaw:, Zoan :4mewtwo:, Kresent :4megaman::4ryu:, Bloodcross :4charizard::4fox:, Colinies :4fox:
Volatility: High
RFang :4mario::4cloud2:, DJ Jack :4ryu:, Darkblues :4cloud2:, Edwin :4megaman::4pacman::4sonic:, Horse :4ness::4zss:, Kasper :4littlemac:
Volatility: High
Cosmos :4corrinf:, Sol :4littlemac:, Jams :4rob:, Nature :4mewtwo:, Cinnpie :4zss:
Volatility: Medium
ZD :4fox:, Rideae :4pikachu:, Jimmy :4cloud2:, Suar :4sheik:
Volatility: Medium
Peabnut :4megaman:, Rags :4metaknight:, Aceto :4metaknight:, Port :4pacman:
Volatility: Medium
Remzi :4zss::4corrinf:, Wonderbread :4littlemac:, Deven3000 :4kirby:, bsquared :4tlink:, Crazycolorz5 :rosalina:, Midnight :rosalina:
Volatility: High
Locus :4ryu:, Hackoru :4mario::4diddy:, Freelancer Leo :4mewtwo:, CC :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
Mr. E :4marth::4lucina:, Mav :4cloud2:, Hart :4sheik:, Twox :4miisword:
Volatility: Low
saj. :4bayonetta::4peach:, Lycan :4diddy:, Infinity :4cloud2:, GwJ :4rob::rosalina:
Volatility: Medium
Xaltis :rosalina::4lucina:, Oatmeal :4metaknight:, Puppeh :4sheik:, Mystearica :4bayonetta:
Volatility: Medium
MVD :4diddy:, Archy :4sheik::4diddy:, Osiris197 :4falco:
Volatility: Low
Abadango :4mewtwo::4bayonetta::4metaknight:, Sync :4cloud2:, F.O.E. :4greninja::4tlink:, Moser :4villager:
Volatility: Low
Tweek :4cloud2::4dk:, Gen :4ryu:, Mugi :4corrinf:, Shadow :4sheik:, Dingus Joe :4gaw:, PHaZeX3R0 :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium

Wave D:
Ned :4cloud2:, Querty :4lucario:, Hungrybox :4jigglypuff::4mario::4ness:, Roxas :4feroy:
Volatility: Low
Kameme :4megaman::4sheik::4wario:, Redeemer Z :4mario::4rob:, Coldweatherr :4marth:, Thunderz :4fox:
Volatility: Low
Craftis :4sonic:, Zephyr :4cloud2:, Ke-ya :4robinf:
Volatility: Medium
The Great Gonzales :4ness:, Seth :4yoshi:, Manzano :4peach::4jigglypuff:, Karinole :rosalina::4greninja:, Skance :4fox::4ryu:
Volatility: High
JK :4bayonetta:, MattyG :4cloud2::4megaman:, Saber :4metaknight:, Hiro :4diddy::4bowserjr:, Anima :4peach::4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Ally :4mario:, Squidboy :4metaknight::4lucario:, Aqua :4luigi:, Draxsel :4falcon::4cloud2:, Disgaea :4gaw:
Volatility: Low
Nairo :4zss::substitute:, SETHsational :4falcon:, Fahrenheit :4bowser:, Lv^Ludo :4diddy::4fox:
Volatility: Low
Mr. R :4sheik::4cloud2:, Ten :4fox:, Iota :4wario2:, Son :4lucas:, The Real Mr. M :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Ryo :4myfriends::4feroy::4corrinf:, Smasher1001 :4megaman::4mario:, Vash :4marth:, BlaiseAgain :4yoshi:, Literal Bacon :4littlemac:
Volatility: Medium
Frozen :4corrinf:, Parappa :4larry:, Kam Steele :4fox:, Xion :4cloud2:, VikkiKitty :4corrin:
Volatility: Medium
Dabuz :rosalina:, Lee :4bowser:, Cagt :4littlemac:, Muj :4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Mute Ace :4peach:, Biddy :4tlink:, LeeT :4jigglypuff::4miibrawl::4miisword:, Jdawg :4dedede:, StylesX2 :4megaman:
Volatility: Medium
tyroy :4bayonetta:, Donquavious :4greninja::4zss:, Pelca :4diddy:, Sparky #25 :4pikachu:
Volatility: Medium
Nicko :4shulk:, Raptor :4yoshi:, Riz :4metaknight:, Arch :4palutena:, ChuDat :4zss:
Zinoto :4diddy:, iModerz :4fox:, Kiwi :4pacman::4mewtwo:, Bloodynite :4ganondorf:
Volatility: Low
Manny :4sonic:, THUNDER :4ryu:, Spirunk :4yoshi::4bowser:, Minix :4bayonetta:, Ninja :4mario:
Volatility: Low

Wave E:
Darkshad :4ryu:, Dark Wizzy :4mario:, BC Luck :4lucina::4luigi:, Shadow_PR :4bayonetta:, Mega :4myfriends:
Volatility: High
Seagull Joe :4sonic::4diddy:, dekillsage :4fox::4mewtwo:, Unknown :4sheik:, Rickles :4cloud2::4ganondorf:, ARS3 :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
Larry Lurr :4fox::4dk::4metaknight:, Bankai :4zss:, Ak8s :4zss:, Hex :4sonic:, MS. SAYIAN :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Mistake :4bayonetta::4zss:, Ash23 :4bowser:, Winds :4tlink:, Sect :4metaknight:
Volatility: Low
Pink Fresh :4bayonetta:, LazyBoredom :4littlemac:, Player-1 :4diddy:, BOW :4mario:
Volatility: Medium
Aarvark :4villager::4villagerf:, Dexter :4marth::4corrinf::4feroy:, cFive :4fox:, Dapuffster :4miibrawl:
Volatility: Medium
Sinji :4pacman:, Zeta :4zss:, Jayy :4sheik:, DK DAN :4dk:, El Chapo :4mewtwo:
Volatility: Medium
IcyMist :4samus:, pu55yk1ng :4littlemac:, Mlarcin :4lucas::4mewtwo:, Dante :4zelda:, Suzu :4ness:
Volatility: Low
falln :rosalina:, P2P w/ Gibus :4greninja::4lucario:, BB :4mewtwo:, King James :4diddy:, Midas :4marth::4lucina::4corrinf::4dk::substitute:, boosk :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium
MKLeo :4marth::4cloud2::4corrinf::4metaknight:, Viceroy :rosalina:, Nurse :4dk:, Law :4sheik:
Volatility: Low
Luhtie :4zss:, Legit :4diddy:, Quilly :4falco::4bowser:, Brand :4rob::4cloud2:, CORONA17 :4diddy:, Fos Prophit :4wario:
Volatility: High
WaDi :4mewtwo::4rob:, RoguePenguin :4mario:, Zage :4pacman:, Nova :rosalina::4corrinf::4ness::4lucas:, Jerm :4robinm:
Volatility: Medium
Xzax :4fox:, BlazingPasta :4peach::4ness:, Arhungry :4corrinf:, vyQ :4mario:
Volatility: High
Samsora :4peach:, JaKaL :4sonic:, Sova Unknown :4link:, Dr. Copter :4greninja:, Waldo :4myfriends:, Daybreak :4falco::4cloud2:, Sheen :4falcon:
Volatility: High
dyr :4diddy:, Blacktwins :4cloud2::4mario::4diddy:, Snakeee :rosalina::4corrinf:, McDareth :4falco:
Volatility: Low
Konga :4dk:, DKWill :4dk:, Nameless :4diddy:, Scorch :4sonic:, Zucchini :4corrinf:
Volatility: High
You missed someone I'd consider notable in E205:

Onpu :4zelda: makes his American debut!

That said, amazing work! I can't wait for the weekend.
 
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FeelMeUp

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
Messages
1,015
Location
Houston, Texas
NNID
BathMonster
ZeRo stopped blindly SDIing up in his second set against Mistake at LTC. Whoever told him to quit it was the main contributor to him completely wasting the guy in their runback.
 
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Fox Is Openly Deceptive

Smash Detective
Administrator
BRoomer
Joined
Sep 22, 2008
Messages
3,969
Location
WinMelee, Australia
At 5:35 Zero said "bat within allows her to escape most combos and bad scenarios that no other character can".
It has probably been said before, that yes, while BW is frame 1 as opposed to frame 2 or 3 which is the norm, this does not necessarily make Bayo the best at escaping combos. As a character, when compared to say Rosa or Toon, assuming the same distance being launched so adjusting the percents as appropriate, Bayo is going to be experiencing some 3 frames of extra hitstun anyway (before the cap), give or take a frame. So while she may be able to escape a combo starting on frame 1 of her airdodge, in practice that's still going to be later than other character's first invulnerability frame. She's not necessarily going to be the best at breaking out of combos as is sometimes claimed. There are ways in which it would be better obviously e.g. if it isn't a combo we're talking about and is just someone airdodging on reaction, or if the hitstun frames are capped for airdodging and all characters can only airdodge on a certain frame anyway, but even then this does not represent "escaping most combos".
 

|RK|

Smash Marketer
Moderator
Joined
Jan 6, 2009
Messages
4,033
Location
Maryland
Guys like ninjalink have been saying mac beats bayo for ages. Characters win or lose mu based on available options vs a specific character. Bayo does lose a few options which isn't normal for her. But it's too early to say it's a losing mu but it feels like it could become very close like the fox mu has very somewhat similar reasons
Oh, I absolutely don't think Bayo loses. Just calling back to when people thought Mac was free for her.
 

NINTENDO Galaxy

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 29, 2016
Messages
906
Location
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NNID
NINTEN_Galaxy
3DS FC
2836-0624-6177
Switch FC
SW 0903-5888-6097
A list of Lucas mains that I recognize who are currently are Super Smash Con
EDIT: I updated this list twice today, the total is now 20 Lucas mains!
(Dashes are where I will update with their pool links when they are available)

:4lucas:Pauleke - (E207) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406396
:4lucas:Lamp - (D203) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406376
:4lucas:Jebb - (B206) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406347
:4lucas:Mlarcin - (E208) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406397
:4lucas:Juice - (B212) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406353
:4lucas:Kodystri/Nova - (E212) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406401
:4lucas:Trublu - (E211) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406352
:4lucas:G-Rain - (C201) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406358
:4lucas:Son - (D208) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406381
:4lucas:Crits - (B215) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406356
:4lucas:DoubleC - (D202) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406375
:4lucas:ChaosArc - (E212) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406401
:4lucas:Rex - (D213) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406386
:4lucas:PoisonHeath - (E210) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406399
:4lucas:HSY - (B203) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406344
:4lucas:Tealminivan - (C207) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406364
:4lucas:Calvacide - (C209) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406366
:4lucas:Takinivataru - (C206) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406363
:4lucas:Kimi-San/Mr. Kimi - (E206) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406391

Watermelon - (C207) https://smash.gg/tournament/super-smash-con-2017/events/wii-u-singles/brackets/144666/406364

20 in total!!!!

If you know a lucas main attending or are one yourself, including secondaries, feel free to drop a comment.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jun 25, 2014
Messages
607
NNID
User7a1
Weekend thread is up.
Gonna do a brief overview of the notable players Super Smash Con pools now that they're finalized. There's a lot more going on than there was in EVO round 1 pools, though there are still a good amount that aren't really interesting:

Salem :4bayonetta:, ADHD :4diddy:, Squerk :4yoshi:, Pipp :4metaknight::4dk::4sheik:
Volatility: low
Dath :4robinf:, Black Yoshi :4bayonetta:, Nom :4sheik:, Bryce :4dedede::4luigi:, Naranja :4corrinf:
Volatility: High
Shoyo James :4diddy::4luigi:, Blank :4sheik:, Rython :4littlemac:
Volatility: Medium
ESAM :4pikachu::4samus:, Doraz :4yoshi::4diddy:, AceStarThe3rd :4bayonetta2::rosalina:
Volatility: Low
VoiD :4sheik::4fox:, MrRyanNess :4kirby::4megaman::4lucina:, Pootietang :4falcon::4diddy:
Volatility: Low
6WX :4sonic:, Kiki :4diddy:, JeBB :4bayonetta::4lucas:, Nicklecat :4greninja:, Winks :4zss:
Volatility: Medium
Vinnie :4sheik::rosalina:, JILL :4fox:, Z8 :4luigi:, Wawa Peach :4cloud2::4marth:, Meekspeedy :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
NAKAT :4fox::4ness::4lucina::4dk::4pikachu:, Red Berpo :4bayonetta:, Gains :4diddy::4luigi:
Volatility: Low
Komorikiri :4cloud2::4marth::4sonic:, Ralphie :4cloud2::4fox:, Ferf :4sonic:, Poyo :4kirby::4luigi:
Volatility: Medium
SuperGirlKels :4sonic:, RiotLettuce :4bayonetta::4dk:, BONK! :4metaknight:, Khat :4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Ryuga :4corrinf::4bowser:, Max Ketchum :4lucina::4cloud2:, TruBlu :4lucas::4mewtwo:, DanTheMan :4charizard:
Volatiliy: Low
CaptainZack :4bayonetta:, Juice :4lucas::4fox:, Xerom :4ness:
Volatility: Low
ZeRo :4diddy:, Stretch :4marth:, Ketsen :rosalina:, Upchuckle :4greninja:, Cowhunter :4cloud2::4marth:
Volatility: Low
Cashmere :4falcon:, JJROCKETS :4diddy:, Zebra :4mewtwo:, Slayonetta :4bayonetta:, JetKick :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium
8BitMan :4rob::4diddy:, Tension :4fox:, Rishi :4kirby::substitute:, BugCatcherWill :4lucario:
Volatility: Medium
Sonido :4sonic:, Dandy Penguin :4duckhunt:, Lightshad :4fox:
Volatility: Medium

Light :4fox:, Promaelia :4corrin:, Lunchables :4feroy:, G-Rain :4lucas:
Volatility: Medium
Fatality :4falcon:, Vivid :4lucario: (Supposedly officially dropped Corrin), Hammer :4bowser:, Tony Guava :4mewtwo::4metaknight:, Duffy :4yoshi::4mewtwo::4marth:, Van :4ganondorf:
Volatility: Medium
Rich Brown :4mewtwo:, Dill :4diddy::4mewtwo::4sheik:, Aiba :4yoshi:, Miloni :4cloud2::4marth:, Elu :4greninja:, Wolf :4sheik:
Volatility: High
DSS :4metaknight::4gaw:, Zoan :4mewtwo:, Kresent :4megaman::4ryu:, Bloodcross :4charizard::4fox:, Colinies :4fox:
Volatility: High
RFang :4mario::4cloud2:, DJ Jack :4ryu:, Darkblues :4cloud2:, Edwin :4megaman::4pacman::4sonic:, Horse :4ness::4zss:, Kasper :4littlemac:
Volatility: High
Cosmos :4corrinf:, Sol :4littlemac:, Jams :4rob:, Nature :4mewtwo:, Cinnpie :4zss:
Volatility: Medium
ZD :4fox:, Rideae :4pikachu:, Jimmy :4cloud2:, Suar :4sheik:
Volatility: Medium
Peabnut :4megaman:, Rags :4metaknight:, Aceto :4metaknight:, Port :4pacman:
Volatility: Medium
Remzi :4zss::4corrinf:, Wonderbread :4littlemac:, Deven3000 :4kirby:, bsquared :4tlink:, Crazycolorz5 :rosalina:, Midnight :rosalina:
Volatility: High
Locus :4ryu:, Hackoru :4mario::4diddy:, Freelancer Leo :4mewtwo:, CC :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
Mr. E :4marth::4lucina:, Mav :4cloud2:, Hart :4sheik:, Twox :4miisword:
Volatility: Low
saj. :4bayonetta::4peach:, Lycan :4diddy:, Infinity :4cloud2:, GwJ :4rob::rosalina:
Volatility: Medium
Xaltis :rosalina::4lucina:, Oatmeal :4metaknight:, Puppeh :4sheik:, Mystearica :4bayonetta:, Diamond :4zelda:
Volatility: Medium
MVD :4diddy:, Archy :4sheik::4diddy:, Osiris197 :4falco:
Volatility: Low
Abadango :4mewtwo::4bayonetta::4metaknight:, Sync :4cloud2:, F.O.E. :4greninja::4tlink:, Moser :4villager:
Volatility: Low
Tweek :4cloud2::4dk:, Gen :4ryu:, Mugi :4corrinf:, Shadow :4sheik:, Dingus Joe :4gaw:, PHaZeX3R0 :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium

Ned :4cloud2:, Querty :4lucario:, Hungrybox :4jigglypuff::4mario::4ness:, Roxas :4feroy:
Volatility: Low
Kameme :4megaman::4sheik::4wario:, Redeemer Z :4mario::4rob:, Coldweatherr :4marth:, Thunderz :4fox:
Volatility: Low
Craftis :4sonic:, Zephyr :4cloud2:, Ke-ya :4robinf:
Volatility: Medium
The Great Gonzales :4ness:, Seth :4yoshi:, Manzano :4peach::4jigglypuff:, Karinole :rosalina::4greninja:, Skance :4fox::4ryu:
Volatility: High
JK :4bayonetta:, MattyG :4cloud2::4megaman:, Saber :4metaknight:, Hiro :4diddy::4bowserjr:, Anima :4peach::4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Ally :4mario:, Squidboy :4metaknight::4lucario:, Aqua :4luigi:, Draxsel :4falcon::4cloud2:, Disgaea :4gaw:
Volatility: Low
Nairo :4zss::substitute:, SETHsational :4falcon:, Fahrenheit :4bowser:, Lv^Ludo :4diddy::4fox:
Volatility: Low
Mr. R :4sheik::4cloud2:, Ten :4fox:, Iota :4wario2:, Son :4lucas:, The Real Mr. M :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Ryo :4myfriends::4feroy::4corrinf:, Smasher1001 :4megaman::4mario:, Vash :4marth:, BlaiseAgain :4yoshi:, Literal Bacon :4littlemac:
Volatility: Medium
Frozen :4corrinf:, Parappa :4larry:, Kam Steele :4fox:, Xion :4cloud2:, VikkiKitty :4corrin:
Volatility: Medium
Dabuz :rosalina:, Lee :4bowser:, Cagt :4littlemac:, Muj :4corrinf:
Volatility: Low
Mute Ace :4peach:, Biddy :4tlink:, LeeT :4jigglypuff::4miibrawl::4miisword:, Jdawg :4dedede:, StylesX2 :4megaman:
Volatility: Medium
tyroy :4bayonetta:, Donquavious :4greninja::4zss:, Pelca :4diddy:, Sparky #25 :4pikachu:
Volatility: Medium
Nicko :4shulk:, Raptor :4yoshi:, Riz :4metaknight:, Arch :4palutena:, ChuDat :4zss:
Zinoto :4diddy:, iModerz :4fox:, Kiwi :4pacman::4mewtwo:, Bloodynite :4ganondorf:, Pazda :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Manny :4sonic:, THUNDER :4ryu:, Spirunk :4yoshi::4bowser:, Minix :4bayonetta:, Ninja :4mario:
Volatility: Low

Darkshad :4ryu:, Dark Wizzy :4mario:, BC Luck :4lucina::4luigi:, Shadow_PR :4bayonetta:, Mega :4myfriends:
Volatility: High
Seagull Joe :4sonic::4diddy:, dekillsage :4fox::4mewtwo:, Unknown :4sheik:, Rickles :4cloud2::4ganondorf:, ARS3 :4sonic:
Volatility: Medium
Larry Lurr :4fox::4dk::4metaknight:, Bankai :4zss:, Ak8s :4zss:, Hex :4sonic:, MS. SAYIAN :4pikachu:
Volatility: Low
Mistake :4bayonetta::4zss:, Ash23 :4bowser:, Winds :4tlink:, Sect :4metaknight:, The Cheese :4littlemac:
Volatility: Low
Pink Fresh :4bayonetta:, LazyBoredom :4littlemac:, Onpu :4zelda:, Player-1 :4diddy:, BOW :4mario:
Volatility: High
Aarvark :4villager::4villagerf:, Dexter :4marth::4corrinf::4feroy:, cFive :4fox:, Dapuffster :4miibrawl:
Volatility: Medium
Sinji :4pacman:, Zeta :4zss:, Jayy :4sheik:, DK DAN :4dk:, El Chapo :4mewtwo:, poKevSim :4mewtwo:
Volatility: Medium
IcyMist :4samus:, pu55yk1ng :4littlemac:, Mlarcin :4lucas::4mewtwo:, Dante :4zelda:, Suzu :4ness:
Volatility: Low
falln :rosalina:, P2P w/ Gibus :4greninja::4lucario:, BB :4mewtwo:, King James :4diddy:, Midas :4marth::4lucina::4corrinf::4dk::substitute:, boosk :4greninja:
Volatility: Medium
MKLeo :4marth::4cloud2::4corrinf::4metaknight:, Viceroy :rosalina:, Nurse :4dk:, Dainosuke :4diddy:, Law :4sheik:
Volatility: Low
Luhtie :4zss:, Legit :4diddy:, Quilly :4falco::4bowser:, Brand :4rob::4cloud2:, CORONA17 :4diddy:, Fos Prophit :4wario:
Volatility: High
WaDi :4mewtwo::4rob:, RoguePenguin :4mario:, Zage :4pacman:, Nova :rosalina::4corrinf::4ness::4lucas:, Jerm :4robinm:
Volatility: Medium
Xzax :4fox:, BlazingPasta :4peach::4ness:, Arhungry :4corrinf:, vyQ :4mario:
Volatility: High
Samsora :4peach:, JaKaL :4sonic:, Sova Unknown :4link:, Dr. Copter :4greninja:, Waldo :4myfriends:, Daybreak :4falco::4cloud2:, Sheen :4falcon:
Volatility: High
dyr :4diddy:, Blacktwins :4cloud2::4mario::4diddy:, Snakeee :rosalina::4corrinf:, McDareth :4falco:
Volatility: Low
Konga :4dk:, DKWill :4dk:, Nameless :4diddy:, Scorch :4sonic:, Serynder :4jigglypuff:, Zucchini :4corrinf:
Volatility: High
If it's alright, I'll be adding this to the thread's OP.
 

Aaron1997

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 29, 2014
Messages
709
Location
Arkansas
NNID
Aaron1318
The Pac's have came to play this week. Its looks like 2015 with all the Pac Rep
And there's most likely more than this

Edwin :4pacman::4megaman:
Port:4pacman:
Sinji:4pacman:
Zage:4pacman:
Kiwi:4pacman::4mewtwo:

Tea:4pacman:
Ginko:4pacman::4mewtwo:
Beji:4pacman:
 
Last edited:

ArnoldPalmer

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 3, 2016
Messages
116
"There is a deadzone on the control stick where you decelerate at a separate rate equal to air friction (except for Ryu, he's coded specially)"

@Emblem Lord is going to riot about this
 

Kofu

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 2, 2009
Messages
4,609
Location
The caffeine-free state
NNID
Atoyont
3DS FC
1521-4492-7542
"There is a deadzone on the control stick where you decelerate at a separate rate equal to air friction (except for Ryu, he's coded specially)"

@Emblem Lord is going to riot about this
Ryu's movement is kinda weird in general to give him a Street Fighter feel.

Also I'm not sure if I'm just tired, but what exactly does that dead zone mean?
 

Ilikebugs

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 22, 2016
Messages
39
Does Edge winning Sumabato 18.5 change any opinions on Diddy?
 
Last edited:

Jaguar360

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 9, 2014
Messages
1,863
Location
NJ
NNID
Jaguar360
3DS FC
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Does Edge winning Sumabato 18.5 change any opinions on Diddy?
To my knowledge, Sumabato 18.5 didn't have a regular singles bracket. Edge won Doubles with Mangalitza:4cloud:, though I don't see why that would incite discussion. Diddy/Cloud's always been a pretty good team.
 

RonNewcomb

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2014
Messages
449
Ryu's movement is kinda weird in general to give him a Street Fighter feel.

Also I'm not sure if I'm just tired, but what exactly does that dead zone mean?
The size of the area of stick that registers as neutral.
 

TDK

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 11, 2015
Messages
3,717
Location
British Columbia
NNID
GrayCN
Sumabato 19 (273 Entrants) (Japan)

1. HIKARU:4dk:
2. 9B:4bayonetta:
3. Edge:4diddy:
4. Kiosk:4fox::4sheik:
5. Zaki:4dedede::4charizard:
5. Masha:4diddy:
7. Tea:4pacman:
7. YOC:4corrinf::4cloud2:
9. Gomamugitya:4lucario:
9. ikep:4bayonetta2:
9. Masashi:4cloud2:
9. Ri-ma:4tlink:
13. Saiya:4falcon:
13. Poro:4sheik::4fox::4cloud:
13. Ageha-sama:4lucas:
13. Kie:4peach:

Umebura 28 (256 Entrants) (Japan)

1st: KEN :4sonic:
2nd: RAIN :4cloud2: :4diddy:
3rd: Choco :4zss:
4th: Kirihara :rosalina:
5th: bAhuto :4mario:
5th: Shu :4bayonetta2:
7th: Brood :4duckhunt:
7th: Shogun :4fox:
9th: Eim :4sheik:
9th: Lea :4greninja:
9th: Kisha :4bowser:
9th: Shky :4zss:
13th: RYO :4sonic:
13th: Some :4greninja:
13th: KaPMk :4metaknight:
13th: Nietono :4sheik:

17th: T :4link:
33rd: Earth :4pit:
 

Finh009

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 10, 2016
Messages
143
Location
Hidden Village
NNID
Finh009
Sumabato 19 (273 Entrants) (Japan)

1. HIKARU:4dk:
2. 9B:4bayonetta:
3. Edge:4diddy:
4. Kiosk:4fox::4sheik:
5. Zaki:4dedede::4charizard:
5. Masha:4diddy:
7. Tea:4pacman:
7. YOC:4corrinf::4cloud2:
9. Gomamugitya:4lucario:
9. ikep:4bayonetta2:
9. Masashi:4cloud2:
9. Ri-ma:4tlink:
13. Saiya:4falcon:
13. Poro:4sheik::4fox::4cloud:
13. Ageha-sama:4lucas:
13. Kie:4peach:

Umebura 28 (256 Entrants) (Japan)

1st: KEN :4sonic:
2nd: RAIN :4cloud2: :4diddy:
3rd: Choco :4zss:
4th: Kirihara :rosalina:
5th: bAhuto :4mario:
5th: Shu :4bayonetta2:
7th: Brood :4duckhunt:
7th: Shogun :4fox:
9th: Eim :4sheik:
9th: Lea :4greninja:
9th: Kisha :4bowser:
9th: Shky :4zss:
13th: RYO :4sonic:
13th: Some :4greninja:
13th: KaPMk :4metaknight:
13th: Nietono :4sheik:

17th: T :4link:
33rd: Earth :4pit:
Other notable placings:

Sumabato 19:

17th: Kome :4shulk:
25th: Oiisitofu :4greninja:
33rd: Sigma :4tlink:
49th: Taiheita :4lucas:
49th: Chanshu:4ryu:

Umebura 28:

17th: Tsu-:4lucario:
17th: Takera :4ryu:
65th: Songn:4gaw:
 

NINTENDO Galaxy

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 29, 2016
Messages
906
Location
Texas
NNID
NINTEN_Galaxy
3DS FC
2836-0624-6177
Switch FC
SW 0903-5888-6097

Skeeter Mania

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 23, 2015
Messages
959
Location
Highland Heights, KY
NNID
Ampharos2935
Sumabato 19 (273 Entrants) (Japan)

1. HIKARU:4dk:
2. 9B:4bayonetta:
3. Edge:4diddy:
4. Kiosk:4fox::4sheik:
5. Zaki:4dedede::4charizard:
5. Masha:4diddy:
7. Tea:4pacman:
7. YOC:4corrinf::4cloud2:
9. Gomamugitya:4lucario:
9. ikep:4bayonetta2:
9. Masashi:4cloud2:
9. Ri-ma:4tlink:
13. Saiya:4falcon:
13. Poro:4sheik::4fox::4cloud:
13. Ageha-sama:4lucas:
13. Kie:4peach:

Umebura 28 (256 Entrants) (Japan)

1st: KEN :4sonic:
2nd: RAIN :4cloud2: :4diddy:
3rd: Choco :4zss:
4th: Kirihara :rosalina:
5th: bAhuto :4mario:
5th: Shu :4bayonetta2:
7th: Brood :4duckhunt:
7th: Shogun :4fox:
9th: Eim :4sheik:
9th: Lea :4greninja:
9th: Kisha :4bowser:
9th: Shky :4zss:
13th: RYO :4sonic:
13th: Some :4greninja:
13th: KaPMk :4metaknight:
13th: Nietono :4sheik:

17th: T :4link:
33rd: Earth :4pit:
Any newfound opinions on DK perhaps?
 

C0rvus

Pro Hands Catcher
Joined
Nov 11, 2014
Messages
1,554
Location
East Coast
How on earth does he suck? Unless your definition of a bad character is anyone outside of top tier. I think he's a very potent counterpick character with very good normals and a stupid kill confirm. That's all you need in Smash 4.
 
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