Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[BJN39]

It takes years to start

For some reason this was really funny to me.

I just imagined it be explained with those words in an off-handed manner. Then I imagined it literally taking years to start.

 

[evmaxy54]

Gurls, I have drank the Melee Kool-Aid halp me ;_;

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Me and BJN39 are the real frame data goddesses although I'm probably a tier above him only because I've been doing this stuff for about 4 or 5 years.

idk how long BJ's been doing it for

*plays monster hunter*

cyclonic storms coming my way, if i disappear it means i have no power, or I'm drowning, or I'm ded

one, or more of those three.

 

[Fernosaur]

Me and BJN39 are the real frame data goddesses although I'm probably a tier above him only because I've been doing this stuff for about 4 or 5 years.

idk how long BJ's been doing it for

*plays monster hunter*

cyclonic storms coming my way, if i disappear it means i have no power, or I'm drowning, or I'm ded

one, or more of those three.

Yikes. Take care, man. Try not to drown, pack your home with supplies and if the house starts flooding run to your roof. And try to come back to keep us posted!

 

[Lavani]

For some reason this was really funny to me.

I just imagined it be explained with those words in an off-handed manner. Then I imagined it literally taking years to start.

I'm pretty sure it does take 3784320000 frames to start, minimum.

 

[Aunt Jemima]

Me and BJN39 are the real frame data goddesses although I'm probably a tier above him only because I've been doing this stuff for about 4 or 5 years.

idk how long BJ's been doing it for

*plays monster hunter*

cyclonic storms coming my way, if i disappear it means i have no power, or I'm drowning, or I'm ded

one, or more of those three.

what about Palutena data tho

 

[「 Derk 」]

I said I would do it quick but I lied, I had to go do something first :/

But here is Zelda breaking out of multi-hit moves before they can kill you. You can't physically see or hear Squall going off but you can easily see the windbox pushing ZSS away.

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

I said I would do it quick but I lied, I had to go do something first :/

But here is Zelda breaking out of multi-hit moves before they can kill you.

Woah, that's amazing! And don't even worry about how long it took to do; thank you so much for making a video on this~

 

[Fernosaur]

Goodbye to your best kill option, Zamus :O!

I added all of today's findings to the thread's OP. Thanks so much D3RK!!

 

[Macchiato]

Goodbye to your best kill option, Zamus :O!

I added all of today's findings to the thread's OP. Thanks so much D3RK!!

I'm halfway done with the squallator percent chart.

It has what percents it works and what percent it kills on every character

 

[2004Zilla]

@ 2004Zilla I lost my **** with this, hahahaha. The humor is 200% stupid, though! (It'sa facebook video but it looks like an image :'D)

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=901391033244547

Dat Brachiosaur in the floatie. :D

 

[Twili]

It was a g-g-g-ghost!

 

[Fernosaur]

Dat Brachiosaur in the floatie. :D

I lost it with the rubbik cube, hahahaha.

 

[Rukia]

I got a kill with usmash today and all I could think was "I hate it when I hit the wrong button."

Spoiler

 

[evmaxy54]

Oh yeah sisters

Did you know Zelda's Ftilt outranges LM's Jab?

And you can dodge Robin's Thoron via the landing lag of Fair/Bair as it goes over you?

/justuselessZeldathings

 

[SBphiloz4]

That's kinky... I suppose.

 

[「 Derk 」]

You know Yoshi's super annoying dair? It's not annoying for Zelda anymore

Some notable moves Farore's Squall either breaks out of or completely prevent:

Dair combos. If you react fast enough you can stop the move from connecting at all. You can also force the second part of up special to miss by pushing Kirby away.

Same as Kirby. Can stop dair from connecting.

stupidly long and million hit Dair. You can break out of it pretty quickly and even net a punish out of it.

Aether. You can escape as early as the first hit.

Shuttle Loop. Similar to ZSS you can't prevent the first hit but you can push away the ending hit so it too far away to connect.

Air Slash: Same as Meta Knight and ZSS. You can prevent the ending hit with the wind box but not the first hit. Fortunately, only the end hit has kill power.

Up Smash and Side Smash. Up Smash can be easily escaped but the Side Smash can only be escaped if the move is spaced. If Diddy is directly on Zelda the wind box is not strong enough for you to escape. The space needed is very small though, about 1/4th a character length.

Spoiler: Diddy F-Smash

this is enough space to avoid Diddy's f-smash. As long as he's not directly on you then you're safe!

F-smash can escape the second hit. D-Smash and U-Smash can be completely negated with a pretty big time frame to do so for both moves.

F-Smash can escape the second hit. Similar to Diddy, there needs to be a small amount of space due to the range of the move. U-Smash can escape the final hit pretty easily.


F-Smash can escape the second hit. U-Smash can escape both the second and last hit pretty easily.

U-Smash can escape the second hit. Up Special can escape the second hit also.

Basically, Zelda is immune to multi-hit kill moves girls... did we make it out of bottom tier yet?

 

[FullMoon]

Oh man I'm doing terribly on For Glory today.

 

[Macchiato]

Squallator Kill Percents

Character|Percents
Jigglypuff|76%+
Game&Watch|80%+
Kirby|83%+
Rosalina|83%+
Pikachu|86%+
Olimar|86%+
Fox|86%+
Meta Knight|89%+
Zero Suit Samus|89%+
Falco|89%+
Little Mac|89%+
Sheik|87%+
Zelda|89%+
Peach|87%+
Marth|95%+
Lucina|95%+
Duck Hunt|96%+
Palutena|89%+
Diddy Kong|97%+
Toon Link|92%+
Ness|93%+
Greninja|91%+
Pac-Man|93%+
Sonic|95%+
Robin|94%+
Pit|96%+
Dark Pit|96%+
Wii Fit Trainer|92%+
Luigi|92%+
Villager|94%+
Mario|97%+
Dr. Mario|97%+
Lucario|99%+
Mega Man|104%+
Shulk|100%+
Yoshi|98%+
Link|102%+
Captain Falcon|104%+
R.O.B|102%+
Wario|103%+
Ike|104%+
Samus|100%+
Ganondorf|106%+
Bowser Jr.|103%+
Charizard|102%+
DeDeDe|118%+
Donkey Kong|113%+
Bowser|107%+

Tested on Final destination with no DI or Rage

 

[Furret]

You know Yoshi's super annoying dair? It's not annoying for Zelda anymore

Some notable moves Farore's Squall either breaks out of or completely prevent:

Dair combos. If you react fast enough you can stop the move from connecting at all. You can also force the second part of up special to miss by pushing Kirby away.

Same as Kirby. Can stop dair from connecting.

stupidly long and million hit Dair. You can break out of it pretty quickly and even net a punish out of it.

Aether. You can escape as early as the first hit.

Shuttle Loop. Similar to ZSS you can't prevent the first hit but you can push away the ending hit so it too far away to connect.

Air Slash: Same as Meta Knight and ZSS. You can prevent the ending hit with the wind box but not the first hit. Fortunately, only the end hit has kill power.

Up Smash and Side Smash. Up Smash can be easily escaped but the Side Smash can only be escaped if the move is spaced. If Diddy is directly on Zelda the wind box is not strong enough for you to escape. The space needed is very small though, about 1/4th a character length.

Spoiler: Diddy F-Smash

this is enough space to avoid Diddy's f-smash. As long as he's not directly on you then you're safe!

F-smash can escape the second hit. D-Smash and U-Smash can be completely negated with a pretty big time frame to do so for both moves.

F-Smash can escape the second hit. Similar to Diddy, there needs to be a small amount of space due to the range of the move. U-Smash can escape the final hit pretty easily.


F-Smash can escape the second hit. U-Smash can escape both the second and last hit pretty easily.

U-Smash can escape the second hit. Up Special can escape the second hit also.

Basically, Zelda is immune to multi-hit kill moves girls... did we make it out of bottom tier yet?

does this make Zelda the only character with SDI then? :D

 

[Lavani]

does this make Zelda the only character with SDI then? :D

? SDI still exists.

 

[BJN39]

Me and BJN39 are the real frame data goddesses although I'm probably a tier above him only because I've been doing this stuff for about 4 or 5 years.

idk how long BJ's been doing it for

Less long.

You a tier higher sounds accuraTe too.

Thanks for that complement btw.

 

[SBphiloz4]

Still wished that we can't use both Squall and FW on the same set. With all the hype we are getting with this custom move, to not be able to use two of her best moves on the same set is really depressing. :/

 

[Macchiato]

Still wished that we can use both Squall and FW on the same set. With all the hype we are getting with this custom move, to not be able to use two of her best moves on the same set is really depressing. :/

What are yew talking about, dins fire and usmash can both be there at the same time

 

[SBphiloz4]

What are yew talking about, dins fire and usmash can both be there at the same time

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

What are yew talking about, dins fire and usmash can both be there at the same time

Speaking of Din's Fire, once we're done testing Squall we should start researching Din's customs, since we already know all of the Phantoms are viable and that the Nayru's customs are just lolnope.jpg

 

[Macchiato]

Speaking of Din's Fire, once we're done testing Squall we should start researching Din's customs, since we already know all of the Phantoms are viable and that the Nayru's customs are just lolnope.jpg

Except rejection, it has a wind box and invincibility at the beginning so that means we can stop rest, KO punch, etc. It super annoying like ask @ Fernosaur

 

[Lavani]

What is there to say about the customs?

Flare is fast but small and still Din's; probably "okay" compared to the default but not exactly groundbreaking.

Blaze is slow but you can act around the same time it explodes, you can move it near-vertically, and the AoE is huge. Useful for edgeguard situations as you can set the explosion high while you cover low with dair (as an example).

I'd say Blaze is her most usable sideB, but Flare might be fast enough to punish certain things (haven't timed it yet).

 

[Soul.]

lol thunder is such a good "combo breaker"

 

[Lorde]

Speaking of Din's Fire, once we're done testing Squall we should start researching Din's customs, since we already know all of the Phantoms are viable and that the Nayru's customs are just lolnope.jpg

I think Din's customs will come down to a matter of preference since neither of them are great. Flare is faster and more spammable but smaller (while still retaining the sweetspot mechanic which is stupid), while Blaze is slower but is useful for setting traps and the like, despite how laggy the move is. It just depends on how people want to play Zelda. (I prefer Din's Flare, if it matters).
_

My copy of MM3D finally arrived today and I'm really liking it. I'm not a fan of what they did to the Bomber's Notebook, but it's not as obtrusive as I thought it would be. I'm already at the first temple (I chose to do Woodfall). I had a jam session at the Deku Palace, too (because the music is fantastic).

 

[「 Derk 」]

Speaking of Din's Fire, once we're done testing Squall we should start researching Din's customs, since we already know all of the Phantoms are viable and that the Nayru's customs are just lolnope.jpg

I'm that 1 guy that would actually use Nayru's Passion. I like drawing people in and watching them fly away . If were being 100% honest though, it's impossible to beat default Nayru in terms of uses. It's a very good defensive option that can also can be used offensively. Something that both the custom options lose unfortunately.

 

[Macchiato]

Okay guys, it's definitive.

Freud's Penissism > Nayru's Passion

Ridic as that sounds, Penissism's invul frames CAN actually be useful at stopping strings and combos, and for putting recoveries in an awkward place. The hitboxes will still give them their Up B back, but they're farther away from the stage anyways, and the invul frames make it so Zelda won't be damaged by most of these recoveries.

In conjunction, Penissism and Squall make for a pretty decent defensive moveset that specializes in stalling the opponent's momentum and interfering with their pacing. They won't make you instantly good, because they're not good specials. They're more like utility specials that let you control, or at least give a degree of randomness to the battle.

These two are definitely the customs we wanna use in tourneys against rushdowns.

(Btw Freud's Penissism = Nayru's Rejection)

@ S.F.L.R_9 kinda why Rejection is good

 

[Fernosaur]

Except rejection, it has a wind box and invincibility at the beginning so that means we can stop rest, KO punch, etc. It super annoying like ask @ Fernosaur

It's pretty annoying, yeah, but I still think Nayru's Love is a hundred times better than Penissism. I mean, Rejection has its uses but it's very granular and an annoyance at best, whereas Nayru's does a lot of things. The only thing Rejection can do that Nayru's can't is gimp certain recoveries or put them in awkard places but honestly Squall does that 10000 times better.

Tbh I'd say we don't really need to consider Rejection as a custom must for that database thing, but if some people want to use it because of the invul-frames (which is its biggest feat imo), then we could ask for it as well.


I also like Din's Flare better. It may be smaller and whatever but honestly when do we actually hit people with Din's Fire? Hahaha. I haven't tested Din's Blaze, so I dunno. I think it being so slow and laggy make it virtually useless despite the bigger hitbox and the vertical range.

 

[Soul.]

ok
I don't know where did the "Pikachu has a slight disadvantage against Greninja" thing come from. where did that come from.
I was doing some matches vs. a Greninja and as I said, Thunder is a good combo breaker. so yeah, Uber ninja tries to UAir a Pikachu after a uthrow, use Thunder.

although uair stuff is irrevelant, pls go on

 

[Macchiato]

I also like Din's Flare better. It may be smaller and whatever but honestly when do we actually hit people with Din's Fire? Hahaha. I haven't tested Din's Blaze, so I dunno. I think it being so slow and laggy make it virtually useless despite the bigger hitbox and the vertical range.

Also it does as much KB and damage as a full distance fire

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

I also like Din's Flare better. It may be smaller and whatever but honestly when do we actually hit people with Din's Fire? Hahaha. I haven't tested Din's Blaze, so I dunno. I think it being so slow and laggy make it virtually useless despite the bigger hitbox and the vertical range.

The main use for Blaze will probably come from traps. For example, you can set it horizontally while someone is recovering so they're forced to recover low and you can spike them. However, Phantom can do the same thing. I'm sure we can do on stage traps with Blaze, though I agree that with our current knowledge Flare is probably better.

 

[Jaguar360]

Flare's speed makes it so much better than regular Din's imo. It can force approaches more quickly and edgeguarding more effeciently at the mostly trivial cost of not being able to move the fireball up or down.

Din's Blaze has potential and needs to be explored. The mine/trap-like aspect of it is interesting.

I like drawing people in and watching them fly away .

This made my day lol.

I would also use Naryu's Passion btw. I still don't think it's bad yet.

 

[Macchiato]

The reason I think blaze is bad because of how much endlag it has and how slow it is. Imagine how hard it is to hit a fire, now look at how many times you'll hit a blaze which is harder to land. Exactly

 

[「 Derk 」]

For me I like default Din's Fire the most overall. I also really like Din's Blaze but it's a lot harder to force air dodges (which is my main use for Din in general). Din's Fire has enough control to still be effective at edge guarding and landing traps while Din's Blaze is mainly for settings traps and forcing opponents into positions. I love the option of making the opponent air dodge offstage to make them recover low. This forces a choice between eating Din's Fire or recovering low and probably eating a Dair spike.

In doubles I would use Din's Blaze more because it has a lot of team synergy. If your parter grabs someone while you are setting up a Blaze on the stage they can throw them into it for massive damage. You can also use Din's Blaze to close off parts of the stage momentarily.

For me:
Singles:
Din's Fire > Din's Flare > Din's Blaze

Doubles:
Din's Blaze > Din's Fire > Din's Flare

It all really depends on your play style.

 

[Rickster]

I don't like Flare because of the lack of vertical movement. It takes the one decent thing about Din's (it may be bad, but you gotta admit it has range) and gets rid of it for speed. All they have to do is jump to avoid it now. At least regular Din's isn't THAT easy to avoid.
I like blaze better because it gives us some sort of a weak stage control hazard. But it IS quite similar to Phantom, in that regard, so it's kinda redundant.

But then again Din's is still terrible, so I don't think it matters so much.

EDIT: I guess I should add that I actually prefer the default. Original awfulness!