Q&A "Worthy Opponents Indeed!" - Match-up Q&A Thread

[Frenzy]

He hits me with arrows before I can cast any spells. And in sword to sword combat, he has the edge. Any tactical advice?

 

[Hong]

He hits me with arrows before I can cast any spells. And in sword to sword combat, he has the edge. Any tactical advice?

Merged your thread into MU discussion.

If Link is really far away, the pressure is on him to do something. You can take this time to charge up your Thunder tome and replenish your equipment, as only his arrow can reach you there (which is highly telegraphed). Just shield or jump when he begins to draw his bow. Ultimately, in the neutral game and anything mid-range and closer, it is up to Robin to go in on Link, as his spam is superior.

The Master Sword may have length, but Link's motions are still stiff. Jump over his projectiles and hit him with Arcfire to create openings.

Additionally, while Link is strong against enemies below him and above him while airborne, he is quite vulnerable from the sides, as his fair and bair are easily beaten.

Lastly, remember that you have a pretty far recovery. If you get Link off stage and he's not too high up, you can go way out there and gimp him pretty early with nair, since it seems to have an almost entirely horizontal launch compared to the Levin Sword's upward launch.

 

[Dark Lady]

Merged your thread into MU discussion.

If Link is really far away, the pressure is on him to do something. You can take this time to charge up your Thunder tome and replenish your equipment, as only his arrow can reach you there (which is highly telegraphed). Just shield or jump when he begins to draw his bow. Ultimately, in the neutral game and anything mid-range and closer, it is up to Robin to go in on Link, as his spam is superior.

The Master Sword may have length, but Link's motions are still stiff. Jump over his projectiles and hit him with Arcfire to create openings.

Additionally, while Link is strong against enemies below him and above him while airborne, he is quite vulnerable from the sides, as his fair and bair are easily beaten.

Lastly, remember that you have a pretty far recovery. If you get Link off stage and he's not too high up, you can go way out there and gimp him pretty early with nair, since it seems to have an almost entirely horizontal launch compared to the Levin Sword's upward launch.

I also make Links approach by pissing them off with power shields. The arrow is pretty predictable and visible on most stages, so Link players get frustrated and encroach for boomerangs. Ride the gale to his face and tear him to shreds.

 

[Ultimastrike]

I also make Links approach by pissing them off with power shields. The arrow is pretty predictable and visible on most stages, so Link players get frustrated and encroach for boomerangs. Ride the gale to his face and tear him to shreds.

Seriously. RIDE THAT WIND. Lunk will be mad. Aside from that Arrow Spam is technically a pain if you just leave him there. You can charge Thoron, but you can't beat his shield. It's too good, so give him a good serving of Levin Sword Lightning.

 

[Running Low]

I've being having mayor troubles against Little Mac, and much more when my Arcfire runs out -_- Hope for a shield grab throw offstage and gimp with Nair is one of the best options, but is a little hard to grab good Little macs and more when they know his dash attack is somehow safe on block.

 

[Ultimastrike]

So guys. I'm gonna be heading to a local Smashfest this afternoon, so more or less I'll be able to get some info. I'll try to upload replays later when I get the chance(if ever). It could give us some ideas on how to deal with certain MUs.

Edit: And then hopes come down when you don't have the ability to go and Smash with others. Gotta hate.

 

[Silverfox117]

I've being having mayor troubles against Little Mac, and much more when my Arcfire runs out -_- Hope for a shield grab throw offstage and gimp with Nair is one of the best options, but is a little hard to grab good Little macs and more when they know his dash attack is somehow safe on block.

Camp the edge and charge thoron. This will make him rush you just grab and gimp. Easy kill, but it will make you look like a butt. I am editing this to give out more details.

He can be difficult to grab, but if you just stay on the edge you will get one, and one is all you need to kill little mac. I recommend learning how to roll cancel grab, because once you learn how to do that little mac is a joke tbh.
Just avoid fighting him and you can win. Most of the time you could kill him before he even gets his ko punch which is nice. Even if he is wailing on you just remember to stay near the edge and wait for an opening. Think of it this way you could make 100 mistakes and live, but little mac can't make a single one or he dies.

 

[al-LAYN]

Really enjoying this thread. A lot helpful tips on how to handle Robin's weaknesses. From the gecko it was clear to me that fast pace characters were going to be Robin's main problem. To be honest, the main character that I seem to struggle the most against is, well, Little Mac. I've been able to handle myself pretty well against most fast pace characters since most players have a tendency of spamming the same combo setup (e.g., Sheik's grab to Up Air, spamming Down B, or ZSS players constant spam of Up B).

The other match-up I want to talk about is Greninja:

+High Speed, similar to Sonic so he can apply rushdown
+Water Shurikens for Zoning and Edge Guarding
+Aerial Dtilt Mindgames
+Aqua Jet can push Robin away from the stage to give Greninja the upper hand
+Substitute is about the same as Lucario's Down B
+Levin Sword can't hit Greninja at all on the ground from a hop unless strictly timed
+Can dodge a majority of projectiles like Mac can

-Arcfire prevents *uncharged* Water Shuriken Zoning for a short time, allowing Robin to charge.
-Shadow Sneak is predictable by watching the shadow
-Arcthunder provides a close-range defense

This guy is pretty much Robin's worst nightmare, worse than Little Mac even. His speed is going to kill Robin like Mac does, but Greninjas I've seen tend to roll and Water Shuriken a lot. But for real, should Greninja get in his stuff, Robin's going to have a hard time getting him off. Fire Jabs are gonna be hard to pull off unless you can punish him, and Levin Sword is a definite no unless he's in the air, since we can't hit him accurately enough for it to count. Wind Jabs I'm iffy about because of Down A, which is his Footstool move. He can mindgame with it, and cause quite a bit of havoc, but it's counterable with a well-timed USmash; it's rather recommended to roll out of the way for it though for the punish on his landing lag.

Luckily, Arcfire can prevent uncharged Water Shuriken from zoning Robin to keep him from charging Arcthunder/Thoron for a few seconds. More or less Robin needs to take advantage of Arcthunder in this case, which is applicable to Mac as well. It'll allow him to make some breathing room for recharging, and also do a good bit of damage to Greninja to knock him into the air(provided he doesn't duck under it...). At least Shadow Sneak isn't very good since it's predictable. Though, I've yet to meet a Greninja that can properly use it.

I agree. Although my experience against Greninja players has been often in my favor since most of them tend to spam Greninja's (predictable) Side B, and his Down B. Nonetheless, Greninja is definitely a hard match-up for Robin.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

I've been having a hard time with Dedede. Only arcfire's last hit effects the gordos so essentially if you use arcfire at all without hitting the opponent your going to get punished by a gordo. Elthunder can deflect them but can be pretty hard to hit, especially if Dedede is on the approach.

 

[Running Low]

Camp the edge and charge thoron. This will make him rush you just grab and gimp. Easy kill, but it will make you look like a butt. I am editing this to give out more details.

He can be difficult to grab, but if you just stay on the edge you will get one, and one is all you need to kill little mac. I recommend learning how to roll cancel grab, because once you learn how to do that little mac is a joke tbh.
Just avoid fighting him and you can win. Most of the time you could kill him before he even gets his ko punch which is nice. Even if he is wailing on you just remember to stay near the edge and wait for an opening. Think of it this way you could make 100 mistakes and live, but little mac can't make a single one or he dies.

I don't know, i'm having friend matches with someone of the Littłe Mac boards (that is actually a friend of mine) and i just can't get a way around her, i usually wall Mac with arcfire at the edge to charge thoron, it's really effective since he's only anti-projectile move is suicide at that distance from the edge and his invincibility frames are just near start up. But she actually lets me charge it space herself from me and when i use it she's able to react on time and dodge it with his side b and punish me for it.

When my arcfire runs out is worst but she doesn't run at me, she walks and ftilt in distance, it's really annoying because that didn't let me grab mac. Then i tried spacing her Mac with thunders but she somehow manage to punch through them.

My go to option when i get send offstage was Elwind but she always shield..

I've being having troubles getting close to him, grabbing him because she always space all of Mac's attacks and don't like to rush and even camping him since her Mac always dodge my thoron and somehow punish me for it.

She even did this to me, so always you see a Mac jumping to you offstage attack first, that way you'll completely avoid this:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?list=F2E...91&v=Ggf3vv4-5MI&hl=es&gl=US&client=mv-google

It's good to know that those last words are comforting and true at the same time, it's just that i'm having so much troubles against him but i'll practice more and learn that roll cancel grab, thanks.

 

[Mr. Johan]

I find myself having issues with Megaman. Jab can really get in your face when you're trying to zone mid-range (plus it stops Arcfire), Metal Blade and Crash Bomber interrupt just long enough for Rock to come in and work, and trying to land is not the easiest thing to do when Rock is nearby charging up Mega Buster. Any ideas?

Also, are we going to have Weekly Matchup Discussions like the old Brawl boards did, or are we going to hold off on that for a few months?

 

[Ultimastrike]

I find myself having issues with Megaman. Jab can really get in your face when you're trying to zone mid-range (plus it stops Arcfire), Metal Blade and Crash Bomber interrupt just long enough for Rock to come in and work, and trying to land is not the easiest thing to do when Rock is nearby charging up Mega Buster. Any ideas?

Also, are we going to have Weekly Matchup Discussions like the old Brawl boards did, or are we going to hold off on that for a few months?

Megaman seems to be a problem for me too. Most people I fight tend to spam Neutral A and walk with A Spam, forcing me to go to the air which he can catch with USmash. The power of zoning is strong with Megaman(too bad his Leaf Shield does squat except be a weird projectile and grab damage increaser). But back to the topic, I think that Arcfire is alright for being defensive, but being at the edge probably isn't a good idea with him considering his incredi-good air game(hovering Aerial DTilts, Flame Saber).

The main thing is is that Robin needs to either get in with Levin Sword and go ham or stay out and prepare the Thoron. Thoron probably is his best tool here considering the large amount of projectiles that Megaman uses outside of his Aerials and DSmash and USmash, considering Thoron will cancel all other projectiles that he throws at you(unless it's a tome/Levin he caught, unsure).

 

[Frenzy]

Rosalina folks. Got crushed by her. What spells the Luma didn't stop, she spins and absorbs them. When I try to get close, her dash grab is too good. Can't even edge guard her properly without her flying over my head. Any advice?

 

[Silverfox117]

Rosalina folks. Got crushed by her. What spells the Luma didn't stop, she spins and absorbs them. When I try to get close, her dash grab is too good. Can't even edge guard her properly without her flying over my head. Any advice?

Rosalina is tough use your nair to seperate then use your momentum. Don't leave her alone she has trouble with us when we are in her face juggling her with our up air. Charge thoron when she is dead. You can't let her set foot. Use arcfire to seperate her from luma mainly.

I don't know, i'm having friend matches with someone of the Littłe Mac boards (that is actually a friend of mine) and i just can't get a way around her, i usually wall Mac with arcfire at the edge to charge thoron, it's really effective since he's only anti-projectile move is suicide at that distance from the edge and his invincibility frames are just near start up. But she actually lets me charge it space herself from me and when i use it she's able to react on time and dodge it with his side b and punish me for it.

When my arcfire runs out is worst but she doesn't run at me, she walks and ftilt in distance, it's really annoying because that didn't let me grab mac. Then i tried spacing her Mac with thunders but she somehow manage to punch through them.

My go to option when i get send offstage was Elwind but she always shield..

I've being having troubles getting close to him, grabbing him because she always space all of Mac's attacks and don't like to rush and even camping him since her Mac always dodge my thoron and somehow punish me for it.

She even did this to me, so always you see a Mac jumping to you offstage attack first, that way you'll completely avoid this:


It's good to know that those last words are comforting and true at the same time, it's just that i'm having so much troubles against him but i'll practice more and learn that roll cancel grab, thanks.

All you need is to get that roll cancel grab down till where you could do it at least 80 percent of the time and lil mac is no longer a threat. I never lost against a little mac player. Nor should I little mac is pretty garbage.

 

[Ultimastrike]

Rosalina technically has never been a threat to me since usually most tend to charge up Neutral B and launch the Luma straight into the Levin Sword Tip. Even then, she is hard to hit with Thoron and the like because of Down B. Reason why Robin needs to go ham with Levin Sword and use Arcfire as a spacing tool to keep Rosalina away. Some Rosalinas keep their Luma as a meatshield so that they don't get whacked by the likes of Arcfire and just have the Luma take the punishment.

 

[Running Low]

Yeah i just figured out that Elwind has like a little spike sweetspot if done near characters, i just send this Mac to he's early death.

For the roll cancel grab how is the input? Or where can i find i thread that explains it?

 

[Mr. Johan]

Keep an Arcthunder or Thoron at all times against Rosalina. Just the threat of the moves alone will force her to keep behind Luma for protection and possibly preemptively go for Gravitational Pulls, letting you snipe her with the move. Either way, you've got control. When she starts charging Luma Shot, charge Thoron. If she calls back Luma, get out of the Luma's way - Rosalina can stop Luma immediately for a Smash Attack or Strong Attack. Better to reset the situation than to get KO'd or get put in a bad position because of an unexpected Luma attack.

Fire Jab combo has enough knockback to knock Luma from the exact center of Battlefield to offstage, so if you're needing something to get Luma out of the way while conserving Levin Sword uses, that may be it. Nosferatu will knock Luma away too, so you can use Nosferatu without interruption should the two be together when you go for it.

Ftilt, Fsmash, and Dash Attack beat her Fsmash, Ftilt clanks with Dsmash and I believe Dtilt, and a short hop Nair and Fair gets Robin over her Dsmash to punish. If Rosalina's Smash happy when you're inbetween her and Luma, space her out; if she's grab happy, go for Nairs and Fairs. They're great. Not sure what, if anything, beats her Dash Attack or UpSmash, however if you shield Dash Attack, that's a free Uair or Bair, depending on if she ends up in front or behind you, respectively.

Levin Dsmash starts killing reliably at 110%, and a Rage-boosted Levin Fsmash will take her stock at 75%. If Rosalina starts fishing for the kill, whipping out a Levin Fsmash will make her think twice.


The matchup is all about patience and a full understanding of everything that's going on. Respect the Luma and keep an eye on where it is - Robin can comfortably take Rosalina one on one, but that little thing gives her the edge when the two are together.

 

[Silverfox117]

Yeah i just figured out that Elwind has like a little spike sweetspot if done near characters, i just send this Mac to he's early death.

For the roll cancel grab how is the input? Or where can i find i thread that explains it?

it is dash + shield button this initiates a roll, but before you actually roll you press A and it will cancel the roll with a grab. It could be tricky to pull off for a bit.

 

[Ultimastrike]

Ok guys, LET'S TALK ABOUT THE ROBot. This guy's been a pain in my arse for a while, and I'm having trouble with his laser shenanigans and Arm Rotor, which APPARENTLY reflects low-priority projectiles(Thoron goes through, luckily). But really, let's get this straight: Robin doesn't stand much of a chance against the Robot despite his Levin Sword reach. Thoron is going to be his only friend here because Arm Rotor's a pain in the ass considering it get reflected on impact. The Spin Top he does is at least able to be picked up even at full charge, but he loves to zone him out with it. Anyone got any counters Robin can possibly do against Rob? Because his Arm Rotor seems to have a VERY large hitbox that's stupid even above him.

While we're at it, let's talk about Baby Boozer(Bowser Jr.), who apparently loves to send out Mechakoopas. I'm really struggling with it some because of the fact he can move and attack in his recovery like Sonic can while leaving an explosive behind. It's really getting on my nerves, especially when most tend to spam his kart move. Anyone got tips on this guy?

 

[Silverfox117]

Ok guys, LET'S TALK ABOUT THE ROBot. This guy's been a pain in my arse for a while, and I'm having trouble with his laser shenanigans and Arm Rotor, which APPARENTLY reflects low-priority projectiles(Thoron goes through, luckily). But really, let's get this straight: Robin doesn't stand much of a chance against the Robot despite his Levin Sword reach. Thoron is going to be his only friend here because Arm Rotor's a pain in the *** considering it get reflected on impact. The Spin Top he does is at least able to be picked up even at full charge, but he loves to zone him out with it. Anyone got any counters Robin can possibly do against Rob? Because his Arm Rotor seems to have a VERY large hitbox that's stupid even above him.

While we're at it, let's talk about Baby Boozer(Bowser Jr.), who apparently loves to send out Mechakoopas. I'm really struggling with it some because of the fact he can move and attack in his recovery like Sonic can while leaving an explosive behind. It's really getting on my nerves, especially when most tend to spam his kart move. Anyone got tips on this guy?

Rob, Shiek, and Greninja, characters that have better projectiles are very difficult to deal with as they could stop you from charging Thoron. What can i say for Rob is that sometimes the best course of action against him is to be patient and wait or an opening to use Thoron or grab. Then to juggle him like there is no tomorrow. He has some slow ariels and he wont be so quick to use his Arm Rotor off stage.

For Baby Boozer is to remember your projectiles are better than his, and whenever he uses his kart move. That is when you punish him hard with your down smash. You could also grab his Mechakoopas and throw them back at him for some good damage. Also are you using your Tomes after they are depleted. They kill at a lower percent then anything else Robin has, and they are super fast. They also are really hard to see, and you could get some cheep kills with them.

 

[Delzethin]

Adding about Bowser Jr.: if you catch one trying charge a cannonball from a distance, that's the perfect opportunity to charge Thoron and just shield the cannonball when it flies by. You can store your charge; he doesn't get to.

Does anyone know if our nair outranges his hammer aerials during his Up-B? If so, he has be veeery careful trying to recover against us...

 

[Ultimastrike]

His nair after his Up-B is stupid fast and is kinda hard to approach. His Hammer aerials I don't know. Haven't seen a Bowser Jr. that ever used that.

Also, I've got something to add about Mac: The fight against him has now become a derp. We can't recover low because of Mac's ungodly nair gimping, so how're we supposed to even get back on stage? Levin Sword Aerials can't be used below unless we're lucky enough to have enough space to Elwind up enough to grab the ledge.

 

[Delzethin]

Ideally, the best solution would be to counterpick a stage that gives you multiple places to recover to...

I'm really starting to think that For Glory makes Robin look worse than he actually is. The completely flat stage gives advantages to fast rushdown characters and projectile spammers, Robin's biggest problems, and the lack of custom moves means Robin can't even the odds with Fire Wall or Arcfire+ (respectively) and can't use Thoron+ to become a massive threat at any distance.

 

[Ultimastrike]

I'm almost thinking For Glory should include those stages that aren't banned, and also neutral. FD always is the thing and a stage like Battlefield(not Omega) would be nice to add in For Glory. I might think about just Friend matches from the forum for now to get data.

 

[Moydow]

It's probably just me, but I'm beginning to feel as if it's almost impossible to beat Ness with Robin, or at least that Ness is a very very hard counter. I just played a guy who was clearly not very familiar with Ness - I switched to Marth after two attempts, and every time I got him off-stage he died because he didn't know how PK Thunder worked for recovery - and he completely destroyed me. The problem is that Ness can use PSI Magnet to eat everything Robin can throw at him, meaning you need to fight at close range, which is obviously not Robin's speciality - and Ness' specials make it hard to even get close enough to take him on. Can anyone point me in the right direction with this matchup?

Maybe a lot of this only applies on Final Destination, and I'd have better luck on a stage with platforms, but I'm still not very optimistic.

 

[Ultimastrike]

It's probably just me, but I'm beginning to feel as if it's almost impossible to beat Ness with Robin, or at least that Ness is a very very hard counter. I just played a guy who was clearly not very familiar with Ness - I switched to Marth after two attempts, and every time I got him off-stage he died because he didn't know how PK Thunder worked for recovery - and he completely destroyed me. The problem is that Ness can use PSI Magnet to eat everything Robin can throw at him, meaning you need to fight at close range, which is obviously not Robin's speciality - and Ness' specials make it hard to even get close enough to take him on. Can anyone point me in the right direction with this matchup?

Ness is probably a problem match-up for Robin because PK Magnet likes to eat projectiles. I mean, HE EVEN EATS THORON. You can't contest that. So, try to mindgame some against him with Arcthunder, since Ness needs to approach you to even fight. Use Arcfire Sparingly, however, since he can just inch right next to it and absorb it for health. If he's in the air, go ham on him with that Levin Sword. Robin outspaces his air game with that. Punish with Nosferatu as needed. If he's trying to recover with PK Thunder, go give him an Elwind spike to the face(provided he's not recovering TOO low).

 

[Silverfox117]

It's probably just me, but I'm beginning to feel as if it's almost impossible to beat Ness with Robin, or at least that Ness is a very very hard counter. I just played a guy who was clearly not very familiar with Ness - I switched to Marth after two attempts, and every time I got him off-stage he died because he didn't know how PK Thunder worked for recovery - and he completely destroyed me. The problem is that Ness can use PSI Magnet to eat everything Robin can throw at him, meaning you need to fight at close range, which is obviously not Robin's speciality - and Ness' specials make it hard to even get close enough to take him on. Can anyone point me in the right direction with this matchup?

Maybe a lot of this only applies on Final Destination, and I'd have better luck on a stage with platforms, but I'm still not very optimistic.

Honestly this match up is pretty even if played right. Ness could make it difficult to charge up, and he could hurrass with pk thunder making it difficult to charge thoron. However, Arcfire is infinity better pkfire. Spam it it is your friend. Robin has a better in game then Ness just don't let Ness play his game of spamming pk thunder. A good thing to do is when Ness is going to use it roll past him and down smash. Be quick or you could eat a nasty attack tho. A lot of great Ness players will use pk fire and then down grab you and use that to harass after the grab we could actually nair out of it. We could juggle Ness decently. Ness is easily gimpible too. Use that to your advantage for free kills.

Ness is probably a problem match-up for Robin because PK Magnet likes to eat projectiles. I mean, HE EVEN EATS THORON. You can't contest that. So, try to mindgame some against him with Arcthunder, since Ness needs to approach you to even fight. Use Arcfire Sparingly, however, since he can just inch right next to it and absorb it for health. If he's in the air, go ham on him with that Levin Sword. Robin outspaces his air game with that. Punish with Nosferatu as needed. If he's trying to recover with PK Thunder, go give him an Elwind spike to the face(provided he's not recovering TOO low).

Just because he has pk magnet doesn't mean anything. You should only use Thoron on guaranteed hits in the first place like when they land, or catch them rolling or dashing to you. I love baiting the pk magnet by standing still then killing the Ness with a down smash. Use his "Advantage" to your advantage and punish him hard.

 

[al-LAYN]

It's probably just me, but I'm beginning to feel as if it's almost impossible to beat Ness with Robin, or at least that Ness is a very very hard counter. I just played a guy who was clearly not very familiar with Ness - I switched to Marth after two attempts, and every time I got him off-stage he died because he didn't know how PK Thunder worked for recovery - and he completely destroyed me. The problem is that Ness can use PSI Magnet to eat everything Robin can throw at him, meaning you need to fight at close range, which is obviously not Robin's speciality - and Ness' specials make it hard to even get close enough to take him on. Can anyone point me in the right direction with this matchup?

Maybe a lot of this only applies on Final Destination, and I'd have better luck on a stage with platforms, but I'm still not very optimistic.

To honest I do find Ness to be a hard match-up for Robin, but not because of the PSI Magnet. Most Ness players don't even use his Down B that often. STILL, he is a difficult match-up for Robin.
I would suggest that you watch (and analyze) this match between NAKAT () against Nairo ():

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSYwAf_BXgc

Pay special attention towards the end of the video. You can see how versatile (and adaptable) Ness' gameplay can be against Robin. Even after Nairo got some good reads on NAKAT's play-style, he struggles and further showcases how limited/predictable Robin's actions can be.

P.S.: You can clearly see NAKAT's rarely use of PSI Magnet, often using it only while he was offstage.

 

[al-LAYN]

By the way, other than Little Mac, I tend to struggle a lot against Captain Falcon players. His speed alone can prove to be a hard time for Robin, and his game-play tends to be less predictable than Little Mac's. It's really easy for him to jump over Arcfire, grab you, and get a decent follow up combo, not to mention that they can always Powershield any and all projectiles that you throw at them. Any suggestions?

 

[NAKAT]

Nairo and I believe it's 6-4 Ness's favor.

 

[PK Gaming]

Our problem matchups:

Sheik, Greninja, Diddy, and possibly Rosalina

It's difficult to utilize ArcFire against them, but the matchup isn't unwinnable. It just requires that we focus less on our tombs and more on normals.

 

[Silverfox117]

Shiek and Greninja are the biggest problems to us. These are our worst match ups easily. Quick rush down, spam-able projectiles, and an aerial game that will make every Robin cry. I lost pretty badly to a pretty good Greninja like 3 times in a row. Once he found the perfect combination of rush down and spamming his shuricans I couldn't do anything to him.

 

[Delzethin]

Worth mentioning that we could counterpick longer stages against Greninja. Water Shuriken has shorter range than you'd think it would, and any breathing room helps us zone or charge Thoron.


Can we switch gears for a bit? It seems like everyone this time around has characters that give them fits, but we've spent so little time talking about the matchups where our favorite tactician truly shines. Who among the cast does Robin counter?

 

[Xzax Kasrani]

So far my hardest match ups have been Rosalina, Sheik, Greninja, and then like Diddy/TL. Anyone who is good at rush down or outcamps you will do good until the MU is truly figured out. Just keep working on your craft and lets become the super race!

 

[Ultimastrike]

Worth mentioning that we could counterpick longer stages against Greninja. Water Shuriken has shorter range than you'd think it would, and any breathing room helps us zone or charge Thoron.


Can we switch gears for a bit? It seems like everyone this time around has characters that give them fits, but we've spent so little time talking about the matchups where our favorite tactician truly shines. Who among the cast does Robin counter?

*ahem*

Let's get on this topic, shall we? Starting with D3. Robin can beat D3's Gordo back at him for an easy hit if he doesn't shield, but that'd take some watching on Robin's part on whether he's playing defense or offense. Other than that, D3's Air Game is beat out by the Levin Sword, but his nair can be troublesome if fast-falled. Elthunder/Arcthunder/Thoron are just there to put icing on the cake for this guy. The only thing is, as we all know, are his lingering hitboxes. Also we need to watch out for his FSmash, which can also work as some kind of anti-air if people don't see how large the hitbox on it is. His Recovery is pretty punishable, despite the extra room he has. Just a note of warning: DO NOT USMASH HIM. It'll only wind you up getting squished by him(as shown in one of the videos in the video thread vs. D3). Aside from that, Robin has a good advantage against him with zoning and the Levin Sword.

Note: You can't Jab the Gordo back. nair is usually a safe way to do so.

 

[Mr. Johan]

I don't think Robin has any matchups where he completely commands the fight. He's got a few weaknesses that everyone can capitalize on to make the matchup nothing worse than 6:4.

And I personally prefer that. I don't like matchups where you have the win lock, stock, and key provided you have the basic essentials down. It's just not fun in my view, and it's certainly not fun for the opponent.

Robin's not going to have any matchups handed to him for free. He's got to work and utilize tactics to get the win. Which is fine.

 

[Ultimastrike]

I don't think Robin has any matchups where he completely commands the fight. He's got a few weaknesses that everyone can capitalize on to make the matchup nothing worse than 6:4.

And I personally prefer that. I don't like matchups where you have the win lock, stock, and key provided you have the basic essentials down. It's just not fun in my view, and it's certainly not fun for the opponent.

Robin's not going to have any matchups handed to him for free. He's got to work and utilize tactics to get the win. Which is fine.

He is called a Tactician after all. Robin just needs to put every utility he has to use and use them accordingly to the situation. But, I suppose Sonic does make a point when it's just basic essentials. Regardless, as much as Robin sees the field, you do too for him like any other unit.

 

[PK Gaming]

Worth mentioning that we could counterpick longer stages against Greninja. Water Shuriken has shorter range than you'd think it would, and any breathing room helps us zone or charge Thoron.


Can we switch gears for a bit? It seems like everyone this time around has characters that give them fits, but we've spent so little time talking about the matchups where our favorite tactician truly shines. Who among the cast does Robin counter?

I know how you feel, but it's far better to stamp out the problematic matchups rather than seek it out good matchups. Seeking out "easy" matchups barely helps us. Aside from a temporary pat on the back, it doesn't help our character get strong. Figuring out how to mitigate problem matchups is infinitely more useful.

I don't think Robin has any matchups where he completely commands the fight. He's got a few weaknesses that everyone can capitalize on to make the matchup nothing worse than 6:4.

And I personally prefer that. I don't like matchups where you have the win lock, stock, and key provided you have the basic essentials down. It's just not fun in my view, and it's certainly not fun for the opponent.

Robin's not going to have any matchups handed to him for free. He's got to work and utilize tactics to get the win. Which is fine.

I feel the same way. On the bright side, Robin doesn't have any "impossible" matchups. Every character can be beaten through smart play.

 

[Xzax Kasrani]

I feel like Robin is gonna be a really strong character but its gonna be really really hard to master him and get him to that level but I'm gonna try and I know everyone else is too

 

[Delzethin]

I know how you feel, but it's far better to stamp out the problematic matchups rather than seek it out good matchups. Seeking out "easy" matchups barely helps us. Aside from a temporary pat on the back, it doesn't help our character get strong. Figuring out how to mitigate problem matchups is infinitely more useful.

Knowing who Robin counters may not help us know what matchups to look out for, but it does help us figure out when Robin shines and which characters need to be afraid of him. All things to look into when building a strategy, right?