Who are the Possible Clones and Semi-Clones in Smash 4

[Spazzy_D]

I just want to start this thread off by saying that this is NOT a place for people to give their opinions on clones. If you’re just going to come in here and say “ugh, I hope we don’t have any more clones” then you are missing the point.

Every Smash game so far has included unlockable clone or “semi-clone” characters. It would seem to reason that this game, especially if the game is on or ahead of schedule (and Sakurai has recently said that Smash development has been smooth), will also have a few new clone or near clone characters. So I was wondering who everyone thinks might make the cut? Here are a few that I think might have a chance:

Dixie Kong – I think Dixie makes a lot of sense as a Diddy semi-clone, although I think she would more have a Diddy flavor (like Wolf to Fox) as she has plenty that can make her unique. The fact that she now has a bubble gum gun makes her being a clone more likely, but she still has her hair to differentiate her.

Bowser Junior – Mario already has a lot of reps, but I think it would still make sense to have an unlockable rep for the series. Junior has enough move potential to be a completely unique character, but he has also shown to be enough like dad that it would make sense to see him as a partial clone. With Bowser looking faster and much more athletic himself, this is even more likely. A fast, tiny Bowser also sounds like a good deal of fun.

Dr. Mario – Works better as a costume, but as he was part of the “forbidden 7” I would think he still has some chance of coming back.

Roy – Roy is pretty popular, but I have a hard time seeing him getting a spot over Ike or an Awakening rep – it’s a possibility but I wouldn’t count on it. If he does make it back it will most likely be an unlockable and a Marth clone. He has enough visual differences to make him an interesting choice over a lot of other FE Lords, and his moveset can be easily tweaked to make him feel like a much more unique character.

Tom Nook – or any other Animal Crossing Rep, really. Female Villager is likely a costume, but the Animal Crossing franchise has a lot of other characters. If another character did get in they would likely share at least their neutral B with villager.

Toon Zelda – Part of the forbidden 7, and would honestly be a nice compliment to Toon Link. I’m just not sure if Toon Shiek would make an appearance or if Tetra, who would basically be a brand new character, would be her transformation.

Plusle and Minum – Basically here just because of the forbidden 7, and because it would be nice to have some non-Gen 1 Pokemon reps. Sakurai has also said he knows that people get attached to characters and play styles, and it would be nice for that one guy that mained Pichu in Melee to have a some what related character to play as.

Medusa - If Palutena gets in, Medusa could easily be a clone of her. They both have very similar builds and are staff users, and it would be easy to replace light magic attacks with dark magic attacks. This, of course, would all depend on Palutena getting in in the first place, and three Kid Icarus reps is probably pushing it.

So, what does everyone think? Did I miss out on some really obvious clone possibilities?

 

[Cap'nChreest]

If they declone Ganon and if they add Jimmy T. then I could see Jimmy T being a Captain Falcon clone/semiclone. I know Jimmy T. is unlikely though. But if the Wario ware series gets another character then Jimmy T. and Mona are the most likely.

 

[Ryan.]

Veteran wise, I definitely see Falco coming back, and probably Wolf. Lucas...I hope so with him, I think he fights differently enough from Ness to be included. Plus, he is a Brawl newcomer, so changing a couple specials like with Pit is not out of question.

Newcomer wise, I agree with your Dixie Kong and Bowser Jr.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Lucas' play style is so different from the Ness that it would really be a shame if he didn't come back. Brawl honestly did a good job of making the new "clones" feel pretty unique. I don't even really consider Wolf a clone as much as I think of him as character inspired by Star Fox.

 

[R0Y]

Mewtwo probably

 

[MilkDS_81]

Falco and wolf will probably stay clones/semi-clones, but i do not see ganon staying a clone. Dixie will probably be a semi-clone if she is confirmed, since it looks like she and diddy will not be a duo after all.

 

[Khao]

I really, really don't want Toon Zelda to happen, having two Zelda characters with an alternate version before adding other chars fom the Zelda franchise that would be a far greater addition seems like a gigantic waste. Especially if it also means Toon Sheik, just... eugh. Not saying it won't happen, because I can totally see it happening, I just really don't wait it to.

And this is not about her being a clone, by the way, it's about the character by itself, she could have a completely original moveset, but just there being both two Zeldas and two Links in the roster seems really dumb when there's plenty of interesting, and completely unique characters in the series to choose from.

Dixie Kong as a sorta-Diddy I'd be okay with, though, Donkey Kong could use a third rep, and Dixie pretty much has Diddy's playstyle in the old DKC games save for a few differences, which means it'd make sense for her to be similar.

An extra Mario character is too much at this point, especially a clone one, so I don't really see either Bowser Jr. or Dr. Mario getting in. And I sincerely hope Dr. Mario never returns as anything other than a costume for Mario, because honestly, that's exactly what it is, Mario with a Doctor suit.

I really, really doubt Roy's getting back over a FE character from a newer game and/or Ike, wouldn't mind seeing him return, but yeah, unlikely at this point.

What I've been wanting ever since I first saw it being mentioned is adding an extra F-Zero character, and giving him Ganondorf's moves and playstyle, that way you could give Ganondorf the moveset he "deserves" without completely dissapointing people who liked playing as him.

 

[Sarki Soliloquy]

We already have one confirmed clone: Toon Link. Although, whether his Side Special is the Cucco (doubt it because it shares the Skyward Sword design) or his Boomerang remains to be seen.

Luigi is really the only semi-clone we have already in the game. His moveset remains the same as previous entries with the disappointment of no Poltergust. Lucas, Falco, and Wolf will probably return as semi-clones and Ganondorf is probably coming back as well. Although, if we get the ****ty worn-down version of Captain Falcon's specials for him, I'll be extremely disappointed.

Heck, we may have the ability to completely negate clones and semi-clones altogether if "character customization" allows you to customize their specials and maybe even standards and additional mechanics.

As of Tropical Freeze, Diddy and Dixie should only share one move: the Peanut Popgun and Gumball Popgun respectively. You could think of it as a Mewtwo-Lucario Neutral Special predicament. Although, maybe they should find a way to mix that up with her moveset, as something having to do with her helicopter ponytail is the most recognizable move from her and could hand something more useful to Kirby when he inhales her. I'm not concerned about Dixie's moveset potential, as she already has a lot of anonymity going for her.

I'm probably going to be lynched for suggesting this one, but honestly, I'm starting to grow fond of the addition of Roy as Marth's alt costume, especially if Mewtwo returns as an independent character. Marth doesn't have much visual variation throughout the Fire Emblem series even with his visual updates across games or class changes. Roy really doesn't have much of a chance with his competition for a slot and he is still a Marth clone in Melee. You could think of Marth into Roy as a reskinned character a la Kuma into Panda in Tekken 6. Only Roy would have a different model, announcer name, fanfare, voice clips, particle effects, and his own set of recolors than Marth. Especially if they're going to be clones of each other, it would save on roster space for sure.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Mewtwo probably

What? Lollllllll

 

[Spazzy_D]

What? Lollllllll

He wants them to dump Mewtwo's moves and make him a clone of Lucario, obviously.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Mewtwo probably

...

I see what you did there.

 

[Curious Villager]

We already have one confirmed clone: Toon Link. Although, whether his Side Special is the Cucco (doubt it because it shares the Skyward Sword design) or his Boomerang remains to be seen.

Was there even any Cucco's in Skyward Sword? I thought it only had those Remlits (Cat/Raccoon things)? They look more based of their Twilight Princess designs if I recall correctly.

Anyway, about possible semi-clones we could see.

Well if you consider them as such. All the ones from Brawl I could see returning. I guess Roy and Dr. Mario and Mewtwo too.
Then I guess possible semi clone newcomers could probably be the likes of Chrom, Toon Zelda and perhaps Dixie Kong maybe. Those are the only ones I can really think of that really have a chance of making it in I guess.

And then there is Toon Link who is already confirmed to be back.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I could have sworn I wrote in Medusa when I wrote the opening post. Well then, added.

Medusa - If Palutena gets in, Medusa could easily be a clone of her. They both have very similar builds and are staff users, and it would be easy to replace light magic attacks with dark magic attacks. This, of course, would all depend on Palutena getting in in the first place, and three Kid Icarus reps is probably pushing it.

 

[Wegenbarth]

*looks at Ganondorf and Captain Falcon*

Ridley - Semiclone of Charizard, has 4 jumps instead of 3.
KingKRool - Clone of Bowser, instead of fire he breaths water.
Geno - Ness Clone except for the Final Smash
Lucina - Marth Clone
Chrom - Ike Clone
Palutena - Zelda-Semi Clone, same B attacks with different names except for DownB
Tingle - Villager Semi-Clone
Takamaru - Roy Clone
Captain Rainbow - Captain Falcon Luigi Semi-Clone
PacMan - Yoshi Clone
Mii - Full Villager Clone
Isaac - Ganondorf Semi-Clone (yes im srs, his neutral B will be his blast Hands from the assist trophy)
Shulk - Takamaru Clone who is a Roy Clone who is a Marth Clone
Mewtwo - Samus Semi-Clone, with a Landmaster as his FinalSmash

 

[Wanderer from Roseyard]

Dry Bowser, Bowser.
Emolga, Pikachu; It could hurt itself like Pichu and glide.
Lucina, Marth.
Alph, Olimar; using the Rock and Winged Pikmin!
Dark Samus, Samus. Phazon effects would be nice!
Daisy, Peach or possibly Wii Fit Trainer. Or a mashup of both?
Dixie Kong, Diddy. Ponytail replacing Diddy's tail attacks, of course.
Birdo, Yoshi.
Toon Zelda, Zelda.
Impa, Sheik.
Toad, Villager. Pulling Mario-themed things from hammerspace rather than Animal Crossing things.

 

[greenluigiman2]

I HIGHLY doubt there will be any newcomer clones/semi-clones. Smash 4 has the most unique batch of newcomers we've ever seen in a Smash game, adding new clones would kill the streak. Also, a lot of people thought that Rosalina would be a clone/semi-clone of Peach, and she ended up being on of the most unique Smash characters EVER.

As far as veterans go...

Clone/Semi-clone vets:
Toon Link - Already confirmed to be a clone, which I'm completely fine with. I just wish he had 1 or 2 unique special moves (Preferably Neutral & Side Special).
Luigi - Luigi is almost perfect as he is, he just needs his old down special replaced with the Poltergust.
Falco - I don't have Falco on my roster, but he's a character that I'd be glad to see return at the same time. Like with Toon Link, I hope he gets 1 or 2 unique special moves.

De-cloned veterans:
Ganondorf - There are no excuses anymore for Ganon being a clone. I doubt the guys at Namco would "allow" Sakurai to get away with it again. He'd be too fun to make into a unique character.
Wolf - Wolf is not really a clone, but at the same time he has too many similarities to Fox. The only move I think he should share with Fox is his neutral special.
Lucas - Another character I don't have on my roster. I don't want Lucas in the game, but if he returns I hope he is COMPLETELY unique from Ness, not sharing a single move.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Yeeeeaaaahhh... Tom Nook can't be a semi-clone.
He has too many potential moves for him to be a semiclone.

 

[Jigglymaster]

Tails as a Sonic clone. Prolly would share spindash and a few other moves, the rest would be unique to him.

 

[Speculator]

I think we're done with clones. Looking at all of the newcomers so far, I can sense the time and effort that's going in to make them feel unique and interesting. All of them are bringing something brand new, whether it be a new gameplay mechanic or new series representation. I don't think any of the newcomers will share elements with anyone already present on the roster, or with each other.

Currently the biggest offenders on the roster are Ganondorf and Wolf. Ganondorf because he feels almost nothing like the character he's supposed to represent. He's missing crucial character elements like his lightning tennis balls or his swordplay. I'd like to see him become a kind of spellsword character, that uses heavy sword attacks for his normal moves and magic attacks for his specials. Maybe his smash attacks could combine his swordplay and his magic. That said, he should retain a few Captain Ganon elements - he's had two games of those now, so arguably they've become a small part of his character. Plus, a revamp should still try to appeal to those who liked Ganondorf in Melee and Brawl.

People point out that Wolf isn't as much of a Fox clone as Falco, and they're right. The problem with Wolf is that he shares distinct similarities with two characters, something unique among the Star Fox characters. The fundamentals of his moves are the same as Falco's, and the fundamentals of Falco's moves are the same as Fox. There are mechanical tweaks and changes but on a basic level it's blaster, dash, reflector and rocket. Wolf brings very little to the table, and I think it's a shame. If he was given a revamp with some kind of truly unique new aspects (although in honesty I'm not sure what they could be), it would go a long way to making him feel less redundant.

 

[Dinoman96]

@ Speculator I actually kind of understand why Fox, Falco, and Wolf all share similar specials: It's because those specials in particular actually are inspired by actions of an arwing.

Neutral B: Shoot
Down B: Reflect
Side B: Boost

An arwing does that. I think it's kind of a cool way to keep the SF gang somewhat representative of the gameplay of SF. I would like to see Falco get some new A moves though (But don't dare change the down air).

EDIT: At the very least, they need new FSs.

 

[Speculator]

@ Speculator I actually kind of understand why Fox, Falco, and Wolf all share similar specials: It's because those specials in particular actually are inspired by actions of an arwing.

Neutral B: Shoot
Down B: Reflect
Side B: Boost

An arwing does that. I think it's kind of a cool way to keep the SF gang somewhat representative of the gameplay of SF. I would like to see Falco get some new A moves though (But don't dare change the down air).

That's definitely a good point, but if that's all Star Fox has to offer then I think three characters is excessive. If we have two characters representing Arwing combat, I think it's safe to experiment with the third while still sticking close to the source material.

 

[UltimateWario]

Well, for one, Mewtwo is going to be the only pure clone on the roster. I think we can fully expect that any filler characters will be semi-clones.

For two, I think the most likely semi-clones are Dixie and Dark Samus, in addition to the ones we have already.

 

[Depressed Gengar]

I'd like them to at least represent some more things currently unrepresented for the Arwings. Like the upgrade system, U-Turns... and yet they can remain semi clones.

 

[greenluigiman2]

Here's an idea for a unique Wolf move set:

B: Sniper Rifle (Similar to ROB's laser, except it doesn't have to charge. You can aim it by holding B and shoot by releasing)

B>: Smart Bomb (Less devastating version of the item)

B^: Fire Wolf (Same move he already has)

Bv: Barrier (Works like a bigger version of a regular shield. It stops projectiles in their tracks and protects against physical attacks, and you can also walk around with it. After use you have to wait a certain amount of time to use it again)

FS: Wolfen (Self explanatory)

 

[evildevil97]

While I'm generally not a fan of clones, the only way I see Bowser Jr making any sense is as a faster and weaker version of Bowser. I've read a lot of movelists with the paintbrush, but those never made sense to the character as a whole, as he never really used it outside of Sunshine.

 

[Opossum]

While I'm generally not a fan of clones, the only way I see Bowser Jr making any sense is as a faster and weaker version of Bowser. I've read a lot of movelists with the paintbrush, but those never made sense to the character as a whole, as he never really used it outside of Sunshine.

If it helps, he uses it quite often in the spin-offs. Not that Bowser Jr. really has any realistic chance anymore.