The PAL Thread (Video Critique)

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Howdy, I tried to search if there was a specific thread for PAL players but couldn't find one, so I thought why not. This thread for PAL players to post their videos and ask for critique & advise. We can also discuss matchups and other PAL-related nonsense (like nerfed uair that doesn't kill floaties, what's up with that?). Sheik, being a low tier in PAL nerfed beyond reason from her NTSC counterpart, has caused a lot of grief/suffering for PAL players. We can share our painful experiences here and weep together.

I'm struggling with Sheik dittos. Sheik is a weird character to ditto because she combos herself so well and everything seems to work in a weird way. There are certain situations where I don't know what to do, so I'm posting a couple of videos asking for advice.

Bracket: Novi (Sheik) vs. Salevits (Sheik)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BN9vfm-g_UU&feature=relmfu

Pools: Novi (White) vs Salevits (Green)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWJHJvqaE1U

 

[Slhoka]

I haven't had the time to look at your videos yet, but I'll try to give you some help, even though Sheik dittos are one of my worst matchups.

In the mean, I would like advices on one of the following matchups :

Fox (vs Doraki) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgGuN_u0ClI&feature=plcp
I usually do decently well in this matchup, but I know I could be way more efficient.

Jigglypuff (vs Omega) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaNv5Z-EYxM&feature=plcp
I don't know why, but I have this thing that makes Puff players have a bad day when I meet them in tournament. I'm pretty confident with this matchup (despite playing PAL), but I'm not sure whether I win because I'm good or because the opponent sucks.

Falco (vs Charlon) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db0kBuX9ooQ&feature=plcp (if the video has weird movements, just retry a few minutes later)
I hate this matchup, I always get overwhelmed by Falco's approaches and speed.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

I haven't had the time to look at your videos yet, but I'll try to give you some help, even though Sheik dittos are one of my worst matchups.

In the mean, I would like advices on one of the following matchups :

Fox (vs Doraki) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgGuN_u0ClI&feature=plcp
I usually do decently well in this matchup, but I know I could be way more efficient.

Jigglypuff (vs Omega) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaNv5Z-EYxM&feature=plcp
I don't know why, but I have this thing that makes Puff players have a bad day when I meet them in tournament. I'm pretty confident with this matchup (despite playing PAL), but I'm not sure whether I win because I'm good or because the opponent sucks.

Falco (vs Charlon) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db0kBuX9ooQ&feature=plcp (if the video has weird movements, just retry a few minutes later)
I hate this matchup, I always get overwhelmed by Falco's approaches and speed.

Vs. Fox:

Short hop a lot to bait approaches (nair) with fair, I saw you full hopping and throwing needles. Never use dsmash at low percents because it's so easy for Fox to punish that, they don't even to crouch cancel to punish that. I find charging needles (make him approach you) to the full and spacing bair (punish the approach) to be safe at low percentages. When Fox is at 0 it's very hard for Sheik, but once he's about 30-40% it's like a different matchup lol. In a nutshell, play safe at low percents and try to rack safe damage (needles, bair, grab), once you get Fox to higher percentage you can start with the **** (ftilt).

In general I do 3 things at low percents vs Fox:

1. Charge needles (to make them pressured) and saving the charge. Obviously you need to move around a lot and cancel your charge animation frequently, then...
2. Space bair in order to make them shield proceeding to...
3. Grab -> techchase

If you don't find them shielding you can always shoot the charge to rack up damage.
Short hop full charge needle -> fair -> grab also works some times.
I find going for a grab just like that to be unsafe.

As I said, I'm not an expert and you probably know these things, just things I scrutinized from your first video.

I get back to the other videos later.

 

[Lawrencelot]

Nice thread! I always missed the PAL stuff

I'm struggling with Sheik dittos. Sheik is a weird character to ditto because she combos herself so well and everything seems to work in a weird way. There are certain situations where I don't know what to do, so I'm posting a couple of videos asking for advice.

Bracket: Novi (Sheik) vs. Salevits (Sheik)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BN9vfm-g_UU&feature=relmfu

Only saw the first vid. I think you have a very solid sheik, there's not much advice I can give. Only this: I think you don't use the jump-canceled grab, only boost grab or dash grab. You should jc grab against sheik, except on the longest techchase (DI away + tech away), or just the standstill/walk/shield grab if you're close to him, but never dashgrab.

For the rest I noticed you didn't really know how to react when Salevits started spamming sh fair. I haven't really played against a sheik spamming that so I don't know what to do either, maybe use nair under him or try crouching so he misses or try running beneath him or jumping over him or something.


Now some of my vids. First one is against Adam, he's above my level but I always seem to have problems against Falco so advice is welcome.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0N6huRPsjJ4

Against Falcon I always have problems with the DI, never know how to get out of the combos and tech chases:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GogrC8jpl0

 

[gm jack]

Went to a smashfest a couple of weeks ago, and got double eliminated by this jiggs (3-0 then this set).

It seemed to go ok through the first couple of games, with all but the last game of the second set being pretty close. As such, any advice on the way I approach the match up as a whole, but especially the last game (although my mentality did fall to pieces towards the end, as you can probably see) when the jiggs shifted their approach to the match up, would be greatly appreciated.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49eTRwoLGPM&feature=relmfu

There was also a video of me against a fox recorded (in the related if you want to see), but he was pretty poor with the match up, and so I played pretty lazy due to fatigue after the first set with this puff.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Nice thread! I always missed the PAL stuff


Only saw the first vid. I think you have a very solid sheik, there's not much advice I can give. Only this: I think you don't use the jump-canceled grab, only boost grab or dash grab. You should jc grab against sheik, except on the longest techchase (DI away + tech away), or just the standstill/walk/shield grab if you're close to him, but never dashgrab.

For the rest I noticed you didn't really know how to react when Salevits started spamming sh fair. I haven't really played against a sheik spamming that so I don't know what to do either, maybe use nair under him or try crouching so he misses or try running beneath him or jumping over him or something.


Now some of my vids. First one is against Adam, he's above my level but I always seem to have problems against Falco so advice is welcome.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0N6huRPsjJ4

Against Falcon I always have problems with the DI, never know how to get out of the combos and tech chases:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GogrC8jpl0

Only watched two first matches of the first video (vs. Falco).

Very nice Sheik, better than mine at least. Some notes:

01:01

You should have used Utilt instread of Uair. Utilt is quite safe under platforms. In first match you were punished twice for using Uair in that situation.

At low percents vs. Falco I suggest short hopping a lot approaching w/ needles and sh fair. You should use both of these more, I didn't see you use too many needles. I find bair unsafe (at least) on low percents because it's slower. Nair is awesome OoS and on higher percents. Try to play safe on low percents and rack up damage with first approaching with aerials then mixing up with grabs -> techases -> smash and voila, soon they are dead.

Try to stay grounded more and control space. Short hop, needle and wait for an opening for a fair. Falco ***** you in air especially when you fullhop.

Don't approach Falco directly from above (e.g dair is a bad idea). When you are combed just try to DI - SDI away and get to the ground.

Use Usmash only when techchasing.

Move around a lot, Sheik is fast character and against a space master like Falco is works nicely.

When edgeguarding drop down, jump and use Nair, that **** is ridiculously good against Falco's Side B.

Work on L canceling on shield.

About Falcon, I'm bad against him but recently I've found that the matchup is much less complex than I thought so playing simple and using gay stuff works apparently. I've watched M2K's Sheik and two main moves he uses are Ftilt and grab, and just wavedashing and spacing well.

 

[gm jack]

I personally don't like the run off, DJ nair against falco, because he can punish it really well with just a dj dair onto stage, or even with a side b if they do it faster than you are expecting. Nothing feels more undeserved than losing a stock because of that damn side b.

On the other hand, you can try to use other options to force them to upB low, which becomes a free kill. Sheik is also really good at keeping falco in the corner even if they do get the ledge, and repeatedly sending them off stage.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

I personally don't like the run off, DJ nair against falco, because he can punish it really well with just a dj dair onto stage, or even with a side b if they do it faster than you are expecting. Nothing feels more undeserved than losing a stock because of that damn side b.

On the other hand, you can try to use other options to force them to upB low, which becomes a free kill. Sheik is also really good at keeping falco in the corner even if they do get the ledge, and repeatedly sending them off stage.

Well, it's better vs. Fox I agree. I'll comment on your video later, I have something to say about the Puff matchup. Ledge grab -> bair is good

 

[Jolteon]

Fox can counter run off nair as well with DJ nair, it's not really Falco specific (though I do appreciate that Falco gets more from it), I guess my point is that it's still a good option, but shouldn't be used all the time.

 

[gm jack]

Falco (vs Charlon) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db0kBuX9ooQ&feature=plcp (if the video has weird movements, just retry a few minutes later)
I hate this matchup, I always get overwhelmed by Falco's approaches and speed.

Falco is my best match up, so lets have a go at this.

In general, you do quite a lot of things right. However, especially in crucial areas like edge guarding, you make mistakes that make the results more skewed against you than your general play suggests. There were a couple of times where all you needed to do was grab the ledge to get the kill, but you fumbled around with other stuff which then leads to not getting the kill. I don't know if you were choking slightly or not, but make sure you make note of it.

Another big thing is that you kept allowing the falco to abuse priority where they can. Unless you are directly combing them, you do not want to be directly under them, as that dair will generally beat out everything you have. Lasers also limit what you can do directly horizontally from falco in neutral positions. Therefore, you need to work on your powershield/OoS game as well as your platform movement to help control the neutral game, but also aim to position yourself diagonally to the falco. Fair, bair and needles are excellent options to the standard grab at low percents if you are spacing well, as they can hit at the angles falco is most vulnerable to, in addition to being great moves in general. Once you begin to be able to knock falco down, then you can begin using dash attack and tilts in your tech chases in order to get that damage racking combo.

mini tl;dr - stop letting falco use his good moves so easily.

Falco really isn't that bad to play against (assuming remotely similar skill levels, and non-dr pp level play, because I've never played against a top level falco). Yes he combos you really well, so sometimes, you can just dies of one or two combo starters hitting well, and yes, he controls space really well. However, you have speed and range on him, so once yo begin to slow him down (knock down, grab etc) it can be really hard for falcos to regain a footing if you are smart with your tech chasing, combing and ability to corner him.

 

[fred_]

Hi!
Im afraid that I do not have a video to show atm, but i need help with what to do against Peach? I'm really clueless to what to do in that match-up, how do i approach, play the neutral game and KO?
Im a rather new player and it feels like PAL-sheik is really bad against Peach, how should i play the match-up?

Not sure if im in the right thread, but thanks in advance!

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Hi!
Im afraid that I do not have a video to show atm, but i need help with what to do against Peach? I'm really clueless to what to do in that match-up, how do i approach, play the neutral game and KO?
Im a rather new player and it feels like PAL-sheik is really bad against Peach, how should i play the match-up?

Not sure if im in the right thread, but thanks in advance!

The matchup is pretty hard in PAL and I'm quite bad at it, however some advice:

- Abuse platforms, needle camp and space bair and fair. Your main advantage over her is your speed, so be aggressive but don't overcommit. Don't give Peach room to breathe

- Autocancel fair -> f-tilt might catch Peach offguard (it's pretty good bait but don't overuse it)

-Depending on DI, you can get either dash attack on tech chase (on low percents only), otherwise grab is pretty worthless which is exactly why the matchup is so hard in PAL

-NEVER grouch cancel, do not jab peaches shield. Avoid jabbing in general unless Peach is on high percent (jab -> fair combo), even then it's risky

- Do NOT, I repeat, do NOT try to hit her while she's on a platform because you'll eat downsmash

- Dsmash is good on higher percents, perhaps

- SH Fair pressure is pretty good, but can be countered

E:

Android is the best PAL Sheik at the matchup, so take notes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQGA4Ron3Y8

E2:

Edgeguard with needles, bair and invulnerable nair ledgehop (which counters her up-b)

 

[KirbyKaze]

Howdy, I tried to search if there was a specific thread for PAL players but couldn't find one, so I thought why not. This thread for PAL players to post their videos and ask for critique & advise. We can also discuss matchups and other PAL-related nonsense (like nerfed uair that doesn't kill floaties, what's up with that?). Sheik, being a low tier in PAL nerfed beyond reason from her NTSC counterpart, has caused a lot of grief/suffering for PAL players. We can share our painful experiences here and weep together.

I feel there should be a support group for Sheik mains who lived in North America and moved to Europe and had to suffer the crushing disappointment that is PAL Sheik.

Oh wait there's the Fox board nvm.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

I feel there should be a support group for Sheik mains who lived in North America and moved to Europe and had to suffer the crushing disappointment that is PAL Sheik.

Oh wait there's the Fox board nvm.

Fox sucks in PAL too though

 

[KirbyKaze]

I guess Peach?

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

I guess Peach?

Peach, Puff and Falcon are OP

Falco is god too, because he weights more (80->83) and unlike in NTSC Fox has trouble killing him upwards

E:

There's also the other side of the coin...when you travel to US. tourneys you feel like playing with a broken character. You have more time to reach to techchases, playing against floaties feels ridiculously easy etc.

 

[fred_]

Hi, i'd like to get some critique.
I haven't had a gamecube/wii but i finally have one, so my tech-skills is **** due to that. But i'd like to see what i am doing bad/good. And how can i improve my nonexistent tech-chase/edgeguard? Also my MU knowledge sucks so i'd like to have help with that aswell. Thanks for help in advance!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgEuVTEdP1w Puff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yi9MyYZDVUI (C.falcon)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QwI48ag690 fox ganon

 

[Drephen]

I dont like playing as shiek in PAL