Switching C-Stick to Attack?

[Rango the Mercenary]

What are the benefits of this? I was playing someone who says it's better for aerials, but how? C-Stick Smash can do aerials too. Is there something I'm missing?

Is this the proper way to play Ike or just an option?

 

[Trueblade]

Simply put, having c-stick bound to smash messes with your aerial movement when you c-stick an aerial attack. Attack bound to c-stick does not.

Say you want to do a retreating bair from a neutral jump. Smash stick would only let you move away once the c-stick is back to neutral position, whereas attack stick will let you move freely immediately while attacking from that neutral jump. It helps to aid Ike in spacing.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

Simply put, having c-stick bound to smash messes with your aerial movement when you c-stick an aerial attack. Attack bound to c-stick does not.

Say you want to do a retreating bair from a neutral jump. Smash stick would only let you move away once the c-stick is back to neutral position, whereas attack stick will let you move freely immediately while attacking from that neutral jump. It helps to aid Ike in spacing.

I almost never use C-Stick for aerials though. I've always stuck with A.

I'm trying both now on Training mode. I'm not noticing much of a difference. I also fear that switching C-Stick to Attack will cost me greatly once I will forget that I switched it during a crucial C-Stick dash USmash attempt.

 

[Trueblade]

I'd recommend giving it at least a shot. Retreating fairs and bairs using the c-stick can be pretty nice, especially with that autocancel.

Go with whatever works best for you though.

Also for dashing up smash, give jump cancelling a shot. Run, then tap jump a split second before inputting the up smash. Think of it sort of like SF4's plinking in terms of input.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

How does that work? I've never even heard of that before.

Edit: Oh my God!! Not only does it give me more distance, but I can use it to turn-around the USmash.

 

[Trueblade]

Yeah it's pretty nuts, especially with fast characters.

How it works though is that there are three or so frames in a jump where you're still on the ground, so in those three frames you can input an up smash and cancel the jump. So dash gets cancelled by the jump and the jump gets cancelled by an up smash to give that great sliding up smash. Pretty neat.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

Yeah it's pretty nuts, especially with fast characters.

How it works though is that there are three or so frames in a jump where you're still on the ground, so in those three frames you can input an up smash and cancel the jump. So dash gets cancelled by the jump and the jump gets cancelled by an up smash to give that great sliding up smash. Pretty neat.

Sounds like a good option for people trying to get back on stage from the ledge. I'll have to try it.

 

[PyroTakun]

C-stick to Attack lets you do things like pivot (and perfect pivot) D-Tilts and U-Tilts, which are really good options for Ike. That and his tilts are just mostly better than his smashes.

 

[GhostUrsa]

I'd recommend giving it at least a shot. Retreating fairs and bairs using the c-stick can be pretty nice, especially with that autocancel.

Go with whatever works best for you though.

Also for dashing up smash, give jump cancelling a shot. Run, then tap jump a split second before inputting the up smash. Think of it sort of like SF4's plinking in terms of input.

I remember reading in another smash 4 thread that when it's set to smash and you are aerial, it mimics the input of + instead of just performing the smash which when using f-air and b-air will push your momentum that way. If you don't use the c-stick for aerial often, you might not notice it much since a similar effect you are already adapting to from using the left stick for it. When the left stick is attack, there is no loss of movement when aerial.

Personally I don't use the c-stick as much for tilts and aerials either, but when on the Wii U I remind myself of a few uses where it excels. Mostly with spiking, as I can short hop over an opponent and stage spike them for a nice surprise without losing my momentum or accidentally fast falling will hitting my target with the sweet spot of Ragnell.

I've read of other players that have trained in using the shoulder buttons for jumping, and rely specifically on the c-stick for attacks. I haven't been that committed to attempting it since I've got some 15 years of experience the other way and unlearning that would take too long, but it's a good place for debate on the merits of such a layout for smash.

 

[Trueblade]

I remember reading in another smash 4 thread that when it's set to smash and you are aerial, it mimics the input of + instead of just performing the smash which when using f-air and b-air will push your momentum that way. If you don't use the c-stick for aerial often, you might not notice it much since a similar effect you are already adapting to from using the left stick for it. When the left stick is attack, there is no loss of movement when aerial.

Personally I don't use the c-stick as much for tilts and aerials either, but when on the Wii U I remind myself of a few uses where it excels. Mostly with spiking, as I can short hop over an opponent and stage spike them for a nice surprise without losing my momentum or accidentally fast falling will hitting my target with the sweet spot of Ragnell.

I've read of other players that have trained in using the shoulder buttons for jumping, and rely specifically on the c-stick for attacks. I haven't been that committed to attempting it since I've got some 15 years of experience the other way and unlearning that would take too long, but it's a good place for debate on the merits of such a layout for smash.

It has to do with the new ability to charge smashes with the c-stick, I believe. They had to mimic the input rather than have it just go "yo throw out a smash" in order to achieve it.

I've personally been trying to get accustomed to L jumping and c-sticking aerials to get reliable retreating fairs, but like you said, years of unlearning the old way takes time.

C-stick to Attack lets you do things like pivot (and perfect pivot) D-Tilts and U-Tilts, which are really good options for Ike. That and his tilts are just mostly better than his smashes.

Wait, you can normal pivot a dtilt? Yoooooo, hitting the lab with this.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

It has to do with the new ability to charge smashes with the c-stick, I believe. They had to mimic the input rather than have it just go "yo throw out a smash" in order to achieve it.

I've personally been trying to get accustomed to L jumping and c-sticking aerials to get reliable retreating fairs, but like you said, years of unlearning the old way takes time.


Wait, you can normal pivot a dtilt? Yoooooo, hitting the lab with this.

I did this randomly and unintentionally yesterday. Used Nair when my opponent was trying to recover, whiffed, and pivoted into DTilt as he rolled behind me and smacked into the attack.

 

[PyroTakun]

Wait, you can normal pivot a dtilt? Yoooooo, hitting the lab with this.

You can't do it out of dash, only OoS, perfect pivot, and just standing still.
It's very useful though.