Meta SSB4 Falco Matchup Discussion 41 - Kirby - Starsailors

[Ffamran]

Welcome to the Kirby matchup discussion.

All credit goes to Quas-quas for the original images.​

Here's a link to the main post: SSB4 Falco Matchup Discussion - Main Post. This will be more for general matchup discussions like making a suggestion and such. Or, you could head over to the social thread and ask there: Where We Prefer The Air And The Points Don't Matter!. Or PM me if you really have to, but don't make a habit out of it.

Oh, and if you guys and girls want to play each other to have fun or learn about the MU, check out the NNID and FC sharing thread on the Falco boards: http://smashboards.com/threads/anyone-want-to-exchange-nnids-or-friend-codes.386513/.

There's also the regular NNID and FC sharing threads in the Online discussion if you just want to ask anyone to play.

Notice: Some rules, guidelines, and tips. Some of these are a given since you joined any forum.

1. Be respectful of each other. No insults, no trolling, no flaming, or any of that nonsense.
2. Be aware that some of the discussions can and will be old, so don't call out someone for "wrong" data if that post was referring to say, patch 1.0.3 stuff.
3. Be impartial; learn to see things from other sides. So, don't boast about all the advantages. Notice weaknesses and strengths from both parties.
4. Stay on topic.
5. Have fun.

And here is a frame speed ranking of their regular attacks and grabs - no Specials yet, sorry - to clear up on things since sometimes a move may feel slow, but it's actually fast and vice versa. Plus more information doesn't always hurt. Data from the Complete Hitbox/Frame Data For Every Character thread.

Note: As of patch 1.1.4.

Move Hit Frames||
Jab|2-4, 10-12, 17-21, 22-26, 27-31, 32-36, (infinite), 41-42|3-3, 6-7, (infinite), (finisher)
Dash Attack|8-11 or 12-19|35-37
Ftilt|6-8|5-8
Utilt|5-9, 12-16|4-5 or 6-9
Dtilt|7-9|4-6
Side Smash|17-19 or 20-20|13-15 or 16-19
Up Smash|7-12, 13-20|14-14 or 15-16 or 17-19
Down Smash|7-9|10-14 or 14-22
Nair|3-5, 6-9, 14-17, 21-24|10-11 or 12-15 or 16-20 or 21-34
Fair|10-13, 14-17, 18-21, 22-25, 26-27, 28-29|10-11, 17-18, 25-26
Bair|4-5 or 6-12|6-7 or 8-14
Uair|7-11|10-15
Dair|16-19 or 20-31|18-19, (4 other hits), 34-34
Grab|8-9|6-7
Dash Grab|10-11|8-9
Pivot Grab|11-12|10-11

 

[Gamegenie222]

Mu experience with this MU is hella limited to only Triple R so i dont feel qualified atm to comment on it i need to grind for a few before i can say something.

 

[Agent Emerald]

Honestly, this is a matchup I'm ot particularly well versed in, but I'll try my best to get some general stuff

As a Kirby, you guys have an easier time escaping utilt chains than fox, but not that much.This is also one of those few matchups where Kirby can regular land combos beacause of Falco's FF status. Lasers are kinda useless for both sides in this matchup because of Ducking and Reflector.

Question? Is Kirby fdaster than Falco? He feels like he's running through molasses.

 

[Ffamran]

Yeah, Kirby runs faster than Falco, but not by much. Kirby's running speed value is 1.5 - fun fact: that was Falco's Melee run speed value - while Falco's is 1.472; rank-wise: Kirby's at 32-36 since he's tied with Ike, Wario, Mii Swordfighter, and Luigi, and Falco's at 38. Kirby's walk speed is 0.93, rank 40; Falco's is 1.28, rank 10. Kirby's air speed is 0.8, rank 49; Falco's is 0.893, rank 42. All of this was compiled by Aerodrome on his site: http://kuroganehammer.com/.

Short answer: aside from fall speed and walk speed, there's not much of a major difference. Their mobility is one major problem people note on them. Kirby and Falco being slow to move makes it difficult to approach other opponents since they could see them from a mile away which makes Ganondorf especially dangerous if he can tell everything you're doing, but in this MU where both are moving similarly and attacking at similar speeds and even having similar moves like both their Down Smashes make their feet intangible allowing them to bypass hits and sort of counter and Dair spiking, it's not going to mean much. How their tools deal with the other is what's the difference.

One thing Kirby can probably do better against Falco is edgeguard him since Kirby can go as deep as Falco off stage, but having multiple jumps means Kirby can switch back quicker than Falco who is a traditional double jumper. If Falco's forced to use Fire Bird and if that Falco's not familiar with how far it travels, that should be a free stage spike, gimp, or spike. Falco Phantasm is intercept-able by practically everything 'cause stupid hitboxes; Kirby can probably Final Cutter him, Side Smash, Down Smash, and Hammer Flip him if he over shoots the ledge. Can Kirby scoop people up before they ledge snap?

 

[Agent Emerald]

I honestly don't know that since I more often than not flub my gimp attempts, but I do know vanilla Final cutter can't ledge snap going up, but it can suckerpunch people going down onstage because everyone either doesn't know about it or forget it does that.

 

[Zionaze]

I like bairing final cutters