Meta SSB4 Falco Matchup Discussion 17 - Shulk - Air Slashers

[Ffamran]

Welcome to the Shulk matchup discussion.​

All credit goes to Quas-quas for the original images.​

Here's a link to the main post: SSB4 Falco Matchup Discussion - Main Post. This will be more for general matchup discussions like making a suggestion and such. Or, you could head over to the social thread and ask there: Where We Prefer The Air And The Points Don't Matter!. Or PM me if you really have to, but don't make a habit out of it.

Oh, and if you guys and girls want to play each other to have fun or learn about the MU, check out the NNID and FC sharing thread on the Falco boards: http://smashboards.com/threads/anyone-want-to-exchange-nnids-or-friend-codes.386513/.

There's also the regular NNID and FC sharing threads in the Online discussion if you just want to ask anyone to play.

Notice: Some rules, guidelines, and tips. Some of these are a given since you joined any forum.

1. Be respectful of each other. No insults, no trolling, no flaming, or any of that nonsense.
2. Be aware that some of the discussions can and will be old, so don't call out someone for "wrong" data if that post was referring to say, patch 1.0.3 stuff.
3. Be impartial; learn to see things from other sides. So, don't boast about all the advantages. Notice weaknesses and strengths from both parties.
4. Stay on topic.
5. Have fun.

And here is a frame speed ranking of their regular attacks and grabs - no Specials yet, sorry - to clear up on things since sometimes a move may feel slow, but it's actually fast and vice versa. Plus more information doesn't always hurt. Data from the Shulk Hitbox Data by @Indigo Jeans and the Complete HItbox/Frame Data For Every Character threads.

As of patch 1.1.4.

Move Hit Frames||
Jab|2-4, 10-12, 17-21, 22-26, 27-31, 32-36, (infinite), 41-42|5-6, 15-17, 33-32 or 34-34
Dash Attack|8-11 or 12-19|15-16
Ftilt|6-8|12-13
Utilt|5-9, 12-16|11-23 or 13-23
Dtilt|7-9|10-11
Side Smash|17-19 or 20-20|14-15 (normal) or 14-16 (angled) , 23-24
Up Smash|7-12, 13-20|18-33 (Monado Slam and Beam) or 18-21 (Monado Beam-only)
Down Smash|7-9|18-19, 23-24, 28-29, 35-36, 41-42
Nair|3-5, 6-9, 14-17, 21-24|13-30
Fair|10-13, 14-17, 18-21, 22-25, 26-27, 28-29|14-18
Bair|4-5 or 6-12|18-22 or 21-22
Uair|7-11|14-15, 24-25
Dair|16-19 or 20-31|14-15 or 23-24
Grab|8-9|7-8
Dash Grab|10-11|9-10
Pivot Grab|11-12|10-11

 

[NotAnAdmin]

I'm going to start with what I think Falco has the upper hand on.

Lasers, used in the right situation can force Shulk to come over.
He has his hoo-haa, and with certain mix-ups, Falco can rack up damage quickly and keep Shulk on his toes.
With no Monados, Falco's speed isn't far off from his. I think he can keep up pretty well. He should stay out of range as much as he can and bait Shulk into committing to an attack and punish, as per usual.

For the Monado boy:
He can literally have any type of playstyle you want with Monado.
He can rush you down with speed, stay back and bide time with shield, and then switch and do extra damage or knockback with buster and smash monados. The extra bit of knockback added with possible rage mode at high percents can really put Falco at a bad spot off stage, and Falco's recovery is even easier to intercept with his godly range.

60-40 In my opinion
Falco is too easily out-spaced, nairs ,fairs, and the possible uptilts or fsmashes are a threat.
Another uphill battle, but I still think it's possible if Falco can learn his range and stay out of it at all times. It's not easy, but it is possible.

 

[Ffamran]

The thing about Shulk is that while his air speed and ground speed can be good through his Arts, the issue is that his ability to change direction while in the air stays pretty much the same. If he decides to jump forward, then he's going to soar with not much he can do to reverse that direction unlike Jigglypuff's godplayer air direction changes. So, Shulk could over shoot which Falco might not be able to punish well beyond Blaster, Phantasm, and Reflector.

Recovery-wise, Shulk's linear he doesn't snap the edge well nor does he have Ike's wall from Ragnell traveling up and down. Shield would be a mis-input that would greatly benefit Falco, so it might just be better to just let Shulk fall to his doom while vanilla, Buster, and Smash Shulk don't get anything for recovering. It's only Speed and Jump where Shulk's recovery with Air Slash is improved. Even then, Air Slash won't snap to the ledge well which Falco could just wait at the ledge, shield, and ledge trump if he knows the timing.

Because of Shulk's slow attacks, Falco wants to stick to Shulk like a tick and just continually pressure him. The problem is how to get in which or maybe, Falco shouldn't approach if Shulk is recklessly charging in. Both have poor disadvantages, but Shulk's is better because with Speed and Jump, he can move out faster or even use Smash to increase his taken knockback and make it difficult for Falco to follow up. Shield ends up making Shulk a wall, but Falco could take advantage of that and just continually damage Shulk.

Shulk's slow attacks are made up with incredible range, disjoints, and they linger, especially Down Smash. I believe Shulk can D-throw to Utilt easily since Utilt has a lot of range. His Nair is unique as it covers down-up instead of up-down like his Fair or Ike's Nair and Fair. So it will clip through the ground and it will catch you if you don't get away from Shulk's back in time.

With Shulk's Vision, don't charge Smashes as Vision lasts a long time and it's one of the more powerful counters in the game, especially Power Vision. This means that Falco shouldn't get predictable which holds true for any fight.

 

[gameplayzero]

Old post, but Ffamran always knows how to take the words from my mouth. My doubles partner is a shulk. Short story short you just need to play shulk's game and change your strategy according to what art he has up AND how the shulk plays. This is definitely in shulk's favor though. The most HILARIOUS thing to do is to laser a shulk during art switch. Such a stupid thing can be to your advantage. Against crappy shulk's who only rely on a few arts this WILL be their downfall. Against good shulks like my partner who know how to use every art to their advantage they will either stick with the art or cancel it wasting seconds off that monado art till later. You will mostly not be able to gimp shulk unless its a dair or stage spike from a bair. Shulk can't ledge snap so always always always watch to see if he over shoots the ledge. May be able to power shield and downsmash him to death unless he has jump active. With shulk's range, recovering against him horizontally is just asking for death, especially in smash. Always try to recover in the safest way possible with I'd would say is low (shulk's dair isn't that great and needs serious timing). Just wait for openings and go in to punish. Any smash attacks a shulk does are EASILY punishable. Those are your biggest opportunities.

Kill options for shulk: Bair, off stage fair, f-tilt, up-tilt, up-b, and smash attacks


Dealing with the arts



Speed is pretty much for going in and confusing opponents. This is a rather trick art to deal with depending on what he does. How to deal with this art is entirely dependent on how the shulk plays. He either uses the art aggressively but going in for some grabs and doing some strings, or uses this to overwhelm you by spacing himself and fading in and out. If its the former than you have a chance to deal with the shulk spending on how you space and time your moves. If its the latter then you need just play patiently. His moves are pretty damn laggy. If you know when and where to punish that then thats your best bet. Just watch and react.

Buster
this art on top of falco's damage output is amazing for us. If you are feeling super confident against fighting this shulk you might as well take advantage of this. This is pretty big. Don't get to hasty though since you'll eat up a lot of damage and face smash next.

Smash
also a double edge sword thanks to falco's killing power, but if you are at a high percent and the shulk isn't the best thing to do is play it ridiculously safe until the art ends and try try try to stage on stage since smash fair will most likely kill you.

Jump
probably one of the more trouble some arts imo. This is where shulk gets the jigglypuff ability and can wall of pain you off stage. When caught in a fair string DON'T JUMP UNLESS YOU KNOW ITS SAFE. If you lose your jump during a fair string its over. His jump is comparable to ours now as well.

Shield
having him slower than us is nice. Usually people either camp this out or just tack on extra damage while shulk is in this. He can still be killed at super percents in this, but imo its not worth challenging unless you know you can handle it or you have a pretty big stock lead. Lasers and stuff should do the trick.