Proposed Character Changes: B Moves (Specials)

[Studstill]

Fox
Up: Allow 2 back to back usages, similar to Pika
Normal: Limit range. Somewhere on the order of Falcon Kick.
Down: LOL. Seems legit.

Yoshi
Up: Seems legit.
Normal: Seems legit.
Down: Deprecate? Make unable to grab edge?

Kirby
Up: Perfection. Reduce ending lag? Stop hating, I`m kidding.
Normal: Enable permanent selection of any 'Normal' B move.
Down: Legit.

DK
Up: Legit. Increase (slightly) vertical range?
Normal: Legit?
Down: Legit.

Jiggs
Up: Enable movement, perhaps with cancelling? Turn it into a player state? Or, complexly addressing multiple variables, just make 'better'?
Normal: Perfect.
Down: LOL Perfect, right? Extend sleep time, perhaps? Should be able to get a side kill respawn 'free hit' after rest IMO.

Luigi
Up: Legit.
Normal: Legit? This would be a great area to boost luigi, maybe larger or faster.
Down: Legit.

Mario
Up: Legit
Normal: Legit? Increase distance or bounce? I always felt like the hitbox should be slightly smaller on these, some kind of a function of non-straight-line movement and square to circle translation.
Down: Legit.

The Captain
Up: Perfect, right?
Normal: Legit.
Down: Legit?

Ness
Up: Another 'complexly addressing multiple variables, just make 'better'' thing?
Normal: I don`t know what to do here, it`s rarely even close to the better options for Ness, so maybe a drastic change?
Down: Make equivalent to Shine, in all lag/frame counts and cancelling ability. Also, make slightly (10ish%) larger, and also heal at a larger factor relative to projectile damage. This is a great place to boost Ness, and this move is garbage in it`s current state.

le Rat
Up: Legit? IMO Either enabling double straight line movement, or weaken it to only have one 'teleport' with about either 150-200% range of one normal 'teleport'?
Normal: Legit?
Down: Legit? Legit.

Samus
Up: LOLOL. Remove. Replace with Egg. XD I kid, I kid. Seriously, though, I would lessen the damage from this move?
Normal: Legit? Remove backwards momentum from shot?
Down: Legit. Perfect?

Link
Up: Legit. Make slightly higher, maaaybe?
Normal: Perfect?
Down: Lock which way Link faces post held bomb explosion. Somehow enable the bomb to second up B trick to be easier/more stable of a technique. Possibly increase default detonation time by half-ish?

Please reference specific moves for comment, and I`m trying to keep adjusting character physics out of this, and only looking at the moves themselves, (Link was really the only one on this note).

 

[Studstill]

Hrmm, I wonder if this is a double post?
Some notes from looking at the hitbox data:

Donkey Kong, Captain Falcon, and Fox all have a different hitbox on jab 1 and on jab 2, but they share the same pair.

The same as above for Kirby and Jigglypuff.


Link, Mario, and Ness have identical hitboxes for jab 1 and jab 2, and all are the same.

Mario and Ness also have identical hitboxes on jab 3.

Fox`s ending hitboxes for the bair and fair are identical to the hitbox for his middle-down angled ftilt.


Captain Falcon bair hitbox is identical to his uair`s middle (chronologically) hitbox.


Jigglypuff`s ftilt is the same no matter which way it is angled.

Mario and Luigi have identical hitboxes for all of the following:
Uair
Dair
Dsmash


Luigi`s forward smash angled up or mid up has an identical hitbox as Mario`s forward smash angled down.

Mario`s forward throw is identical to Luigi`s back throw.
Mario`s back throw is identical to Luigi`s Forward throw, and the back throws of Yoshi and Link.

Mario and Luigi have identical beginning and ending hitboxes for the bair, fair, and nair.
The beginning hitboxes for these three moves are identical to a few other characters.

The beginning hitbox of Samus`s Up B in the air is identical to the 5th hitbox from the Up B when performed from the ground. The last hitbox in the air is identical to the 6th hitbox on the ground; when done from the ground the 7th and last hitbox has an electric effect and Sakurai Angle (Knockback dependent).

All floor attacks have less Knockback than edge attacks.

DK, Yoshi, Ness, Link, Mario, and Luigi all have identical hitboxes for both of their edge and floor attacks, and they are all the same.
Fox has the least Knockback and identical for both edge and floor pairs, although Falcon`s <100% edge attack ties. Falcon`s >100% edge attack is identical to both Jiggly and Kirby`s edge attacks, which are also identical pairs.

Falcon, Jiggly, Kirby, Pika, Samus`s face-up attacks
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Dk, Luigi, Mario, Ness, Yoshi`s both attacks, which are identical to the face down from the 5 above.

There are some other similarities, I`ll post if anyone is interested.

 

[MrMarbles]

i think u have jigg's up-b and down-b mixed up