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Discussion in 'Samus' started by Corigames, Dec 26, 2007.

  1. zDuck

    zDuck Smash Journeyman

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    For the matchup, you shouldn't try to run away from sheik. You have to stay in close quarters or she'll just throw needles at you and push you to the edge. Shielding needles is actually fine as long as you're close enough to put pressure on afterwards or far enough away that they can't punish you. You were doing great until you tried to fight her at long range
    JerkPhil likes this.
  2. ycz12

    ycz12 Smash Ace

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    Cool, thanks Duck. I guess I'm not super comfortable being in Sheik's face, but I'll just have to get used to it.
  3. JerkPhil

    JerkPhil Smash Journeyman

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    Thanks Duck for your input. I'll try staying close to Sheik as well. It's one of my most troublesome match ups, even though it's PAL. I can't imagine what a pain she's in NTSC...
  4. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    There really arent that many options sheik has when approaching you... run up grab, run up dash attack are both covered by a ftilt, the only option on the ground that is annoying is run up sheik to bait out an attack to then get a grab, in which case you can just wave dash past for a low angeled fsmash shield poke, or away to reestablish neutral game. The only other approach you will see is short hop fair, which you can CC dsmash, or short hop needle into fair/grab, which you can just wave dash past into a rising nair or dash attack. Sheik dominates this MU when you are off the stage, and gets free fairs off of grabs, just watch what she is doing, and being in close quarters shouldnt be too hard to get used to.
  5. ycz12

    ycz12 Smash Ace

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    Last edited: Mar 12, 2014
  6. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    Lol you suck Leon, jk, and you did so well against Gahtzu game 1, but you got way too aggressive for the rest of the set and flubbed essential edgeguards. As for DJN, he knows the samus match up way too well, so you just need to take your line of thinking one step further than you normally would, (you think you are going to catch him with a rising fair from the ledge, but DJN expects and knows that's one of samus's few ledge options, so he is going to wait with an Fsmash, so you bait out the fsmash first and then punish accordingly) DJ plays very reactionary to this opponents, and if he knows exactly what you are going to do, you need to modify your game plan going in.
  7. JerkPhil

    JerkPhil Smash Journeyman

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    I was disappointed in the PS counterpick against Gahtzu. I would've liked to see you taking him to a smaller stage where he can't run away.
  8. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    That really depends on the samus player and how comfortable they are in the neutral vs edgeguarding game, should they not be as comfortable in the neural game against a faster opponent, a smaller stage would pan out worse than a large stage like pokemon stadium in which the samus can space with missiles and make their opponent less comfortable moving around.
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2014
  9. 343

    343 Smash Rookie

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    I think Leon just really likes Stadium (remember ycz vs Lord at Lanhammer?)
  10. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    He does really like pkmn stadium lol
  11. 343

    343 Smash Rookie

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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WECQFq5dj5k near 42:30

    I played ok for the first two stocks, and reaaaally badly for the second two... I think I was (1) too aggressive (kept trying to approach/trade aerials, and I repeatedly did attacks from the edge instead of other getup options), (2) was above him too much, (3) recovered poorly /slowly [allowing him to get charge]

    (maybe it'd be good to critique Sing as well, since I'm sure he made mistakes I didn't capitalize on)

    also, how do I dodge missiles :(
  12. JerkPhil

    JerkPhil Smash Journeyman

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    I just watched those :p
    In dittoes it's even more important to act faster than your opponent as they've got the exact same move set with the same frames. The only difference is the player's reaction.
    Practice your actions out of shield as I saw you miss many opportunities to punish. You were either too slow (standing in shield too long) or too fast (rolling).
    Never approach with aerials when they're grounded.
    Samus should always try to face the stage when recovering to give us the option to grapple recover.
    You can dodge missiles with airdodge into grapple recovery when they are shooting low missiles close to the stage.
    I think you know Samus can clank missiles with dash attack and immediately punish. (this is useful against reflected missiles too)
    Other than that, there's nothing wrong with shielding missiles (or preferably powershield) if you act out of shield fast enough.
  13. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    Jab, tilt, bomb, nair OoS, uptilt, fair, another missile (both smash and homing) all cancel out missiles, I did get to play sing in doubles, and he was just overwhelmed with how agro I was towards him, I didn't get to play him in singles though. and I'm surprised with the number of sami there were at NSA2
  14. Jagoffian

    Jagoffian Smash Apprentice

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    I had the opportunity to get bopped by MacD the other day (sup McCain. I know you namesearch now <3). This is the matchup I've been struggling with the most lately, so I'd really appreciate any advice.

    http://www.twitch.tv/kboosy/b/516872950?t=30m

    You can also scrub ahead to see other matches. It was hard to pick one because they were pretty much all 2-stocks, lol.

    I also played against a Falcon/Marth. Would appreciate critique on these as well :p

    Falcon: http://www.twitch.tv/kboosy/b/516872950?t=200m45s
    Marth: http://www.twitch.tv/kboosy/b/516872950?t=216m50s
  15. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    Dude this is the only advice I can give you, slow the **** down. You have a great amount of control over your character, but it looks like you are playing the same way against every single opponent, you need to think as a samus main, and understand your opponents intentions. The way you are playing is almost auto pilot trying to better playing on McCain, and that isn't going to happen, they are going to get a read on your patterns and start destroying you after a few matches. Another useful thing samus has, (along with the rest of the cast) is something called a shield, and believe it or not, its super useful to use lol.
  16. Jagoffian

    Jagoffian Smash Apprentice

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    Yeah, I'm working on playing more conservatively and not constantly running into ****. (disclaimer: I watch a lot of IHSB vids). Are you simply telling me to play more defensively with the shield comment, or do you recognize certain situations where I should shield instead of doing something else? I'd rather you clarify instead of just leaving a snide comment. >_>
  17. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    The biggest problem with IHSB game was his complete lack of neutral game, he ran around the stage in seemingly random patterns throwing out moves in hopes that his opponent would follow and then run into them. There are many instances in all of those matches where you should have used your shield, but primarily you want to be dash dancing around into shield, or wave dashing out of a dash dance into shield when you believe your opponent is exiting their neutral game in an attempt to attack you. If seems like up B is your best friend, but characters that are not as floaty and slow as peach will bait it out from you and punish you from doing it as much.
  18. MaskedEpsilon

    MaskedEpsilon Smash Cadet

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    Last edited: Apr 13, 2014
  19. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    learn to wavedash, dash dance into sheild, crouch cancel down smash, don't just standing missile on the ground, and get better control of your character
  20. MaskedEpsilon

    MaskedEpsilon Smash Cadet

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    could you clarify some of that for me?

    Am I wavedashing wrong? I do use it.

    I thought this was a bad idea against marth. I've done this a lot before and ate a lot of movestrings because of the cc. Am I missing something?
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2014
  21. KLit

    KLit I am the KLit Commander

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    You are constantly jumping around instead of dash dancing into wave dashes into f tilts, or dash dancing into shield, just watch this match and look how drastically different your movement is from Hugs, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXVxL5hN-Zw

    As for the CC downsmash, the thing about marth is you can only CC hit moves when they are not tippered up until like 70-80 percent... if any of marths sword based attacks (for the most part) hit you with the tip of the sword, you cant CC it, thats why you need to get on marth instead of just jumping at the marth with aerials and losing to the priority of the sword.
  22. MaskedEpsilon

    MaskedEpsilon Smash Cadet

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    Alright, thanx man. I appreciate the help. I've been trying to slowly crawl my way out of scrubdom.
  23. JerkPhil

    JerkPhil Smash Journeyman

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    Another thing, you need to DI out of Marth's comboes. Cover your approaches with missile cancels.
    And yes, as KLit already mentioned, learn to control your movement better :)

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