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Out-of-the-Box CSS (v1.5)

Ondo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160


Here's version 1.5 of my Character Selection Screen. Download available here.

For this version I used the Brawl renders of the characters for the images (and Project M renders of Mewtwo and Roy). If any artist is interested in creating poses that are specifically designed to have elements of the image outside the border, I think that could make the whole thing significantly better.

I'll also be testing out different arrangements and backgrounds and such; this is just a proof of concept to get feedback and see if anyone is interested in collaborating.

History:
v1.0: Initial draft. (Image)
v1.1: Replaced Mewtwo and Roy Smash 3 renders with Project M renders. Updated Olimar to not include Pikmin. (Image)
v1.2: Switched Wario to plumber outfit; added color to random question mark. (Image)
v1.3: Updated camera; removed shadows; switched images to use palette; removed need for code file. (Image)
v1.4: Updated images for Yoshi, Kirby, Meta Knight, Sheik, Zero Suit Samus, Ness, and Olimar, as well as CSPs for Random. (Image)
v1.5: Moved Wario before Donkey Kong; updated Kirby image; moved images down & left slightly by fixing an oversight; cleaned up internals, reducing file size. (Image)
 
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ShadowGanon

Smash Lord
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Nov 29, 2013
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Location
Washington
I think the Mewtwo and Roy CSS portraits would look better if they were pulled from the official PM portrait.

[collapse=Mewtwo]
I had them already cut out of the pictures on my computer.
upload_2014-8-30_21-32-48.png
[/collapse]

[collapse=Roy]
upload_2014-8-30_21-33-51.png
[/collapse]

EDIT: I would also recommend not including the pikmin with Olimar in his portrait.
 
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JiFoJoka

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jul 12, 2014
Messages
39
Same, I wish it was pure Brawl/Project M renders and not a mix of Smash 4 images like some releases out there.

But awesome job with the visuals and the layout! I hate Wario and Wolf being placed at the very left end in Project M.
 

Ondo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
I think the Mewtwo and Roy CSS portraits would look better if they were pulled from the official PM portrait.
Updated now! Thanks for the renders! I knew they would look better, but I significantly underestimated how much better.

I would also recommend not including the pikmin with Olimar in his portrait.
Having Olimar and the pikmin all in there amuses me, but I suppose just Olimar is better. Updated that as well.

Thanks!
 

JiFoJoka

Smash Cadet
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Jul 12, 2014
Messages
39
Oh, I just realised the Wario is the Biker Costume. Maybe include an alternate for Plumber Wario but it's not a serious issue.
 

ShadowGanon

Smash Lord
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Nov 29, 2013
Messages
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Oh, I just realised the Wario is the Biker Costume. Maybe include an alternate for Plumber Wario but it's not a serious issue.
[collapse=Wario]
upload_2014-8-31_14-2-28.png

It's kind of small... But I pulled it out of the PM common5.pac, so that is to be expected. [/collapse]
 

ShadowGanon

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 29, 2013
Messages
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Location
Washington
Hey, @ Ondo Ondo , I'd also recommend that you replace the random character CSS icon with this one.

[collapse=Random Character Icon]
upload_2014-8-31_18-35-35.png
[/collapse]
 

Ondo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
Oh, I just realised the Wario is the Biker Costume. Maybe include an alternate for Plumber Wario but it's not a serious issue.
I switched to the plumber outfit for now. I do prefer the biker outfit (both for this layout and in general), so in the future I'll look into making a version that uses it and switches the order of the outfits around so it's his default outfit.

Hey, @ Ondo Ondo , I'd also recommend that you replace the random character CSS icon with this one.

[collapse=Random Character Icon]
View attachment 23716[/collapse]
Thanks! I didn't use that one exactly, but I did upgrade the Random icon - I tried to roughly match the Versus text.

You know what would be really cool is if you had an all smash 3 one too
I definitely want to do that in the future, but I think it'll wait until they've finished all the characters. Something I'm eagerly waiting for. :)

or an SJS version!! I would use that so hard...
I'll try to look into this, but I think there's some other things I'll be making a priority first.
 

drogoth232

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 28, 2011
Messages
1,072
Some like ZSS's look questionable. But otherwise it looks really clean and nice.
 

beetlebomber

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This is great! Can you add the ditto for random or just an option for it?
 

Ondo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
Some like ZSS's look questionable. But otherwise it looks really clean and nice.
So if you (and anyone else) could let me know which icons in particular you like or don't like, I'd appreciate it. So far I've only done an initial pass on most of them, where I was just trying to get something that was okay and not worrying about making it the best I could. So I'll be going over each of them again at some point in the future, and knowing where to focus my attention would be helpful.

This is great! Can you add the ditto for random or just an option for it?
I'm not going to make it the default icon, but I could make a version for people to add to the pack themselves if they want. If you could find me a good render of ditto (maybe just a CSP of him, if that's the best around), that'd speed up the process.

This is awesome. Is there a version with the original CSS order?
Thanks! There's not a version with the original order - I'm not sure how that'd work? With a different number of rows and columns, it'd do things like put Wolf and Fox at the end of the first row, and Falco at the start of the second. And some of the icons need to be on particular edges to work - Mario on the left, King Dedede on the top, and Meta Knight on the right.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Looks neat! Are you able to make a version with SJS's CSPs?
 
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ShadowGanon

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Nov 29, 2013
Messages
1,120
Location
Washington
So if you (and anyone else) could let me know which icons in particular you like or don't like, I'd appreciate it. So far I've only done an initial pass on most of them, where I was just trying to get something that was okay and not worrying about making it the best I could. So I'll be going over each of them again at some point in the future, and knowing where to focus my attention would be helpful.
Olimar, Kirby, and Metaknight are a little small compared to the rest of the cast. And ZSS hair just looks a bit weird (You could fix it by moving both Samus and ZSS back over to the right side and shifting the rest of the row to the left so ZSS's hair wouldn't block out any of the other character's faces if you were to put the entire ponytail in).

Those are the only ones that looked to me like they needed some adjustment.
 
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Ondo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
Version 1.3 out! Several things I did here - most notably, I altered the camera aspect ratio so my square icons are actually square, and moved it in a little closer so the 50x50 icons actually take up almost exactly 50x50 pixels on the final image.

I also removed the shadows under each character icon; they weren't very noticeable against the dark background, but it's still better without them.

Internally, I switched the images to the CI8 format instead of RGB5A3, so they're smaller. Should cause less problems with the file getting too large for people adding in costumes and such.

I also removed the need for the code file; instead of altering the code to put Mario in the first spot, for example, I made it so the upper left square is actually position 2.

Olimar, Kirby, and Metaknight are a little small compared to the rest of the cast. And ZSS hair just looks a bit weird (You could fix it by moving both Samus and ZSS back over to the right side and shifting the rest of the row to the left so ZSS's hair wouldn't block out any of the other character's faces if you were to put the entire ponytail in).

Those are the only ones that looked to me like they needed some adjustment.
Thank you! I agree, once you point it out, and I'll work on fixing these.
 

Ondo

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Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
So version 1.4 is out! I tweaked the images for Yoshi, Kirby, Meta Knight, Sheik, Zero Suit Samus, Ness, and Olimar.

I also updated the question mark CSPs for Random.
 

Ondo

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Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
How come you didnt include the gct file for v1.4?
It's no longer needed, as of v1.3.

It is possible to change the order back to regular?
Yes.

You'll need BrawlBox v0.73b (available here) - older versions have a bug related to editing a model with no polygons, which you'll need to do for this.

In common5.pac, go to sc_selcharacter_en > MiscData[30] > 3DModels(NW4R) > MenSelchrPos_TopN > Bones > MenSelchrPos_TopN - you'll see cpos1 through cpos6, then pos2, pos3, and so on, not in numerical order. To get them back in default Project M order, rename them so they're back in numerical order.

One other thing - Meta Knight's slot (pos32, the 11th one) is different, to support a wider character image. If you're putting a different character there, switch the Scale from (1.125, 1, 1) back to (1, 1, 1), and change the Translation to have 0.05 less in the X direction - from (22.55, 15.7, 0) to (22.5, 15.7, 0).

Additionally, here's a new Meta Knight image that doesn't extend extra far to the right, suitable for use when he's not on the right edge:

To use that one, save it to your computer and use it to replace sc_selcharacter_en > MiscData[70] > Textures(NW4R) > MenSelchrChrFace.022.
 
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Antonio Garcia

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Aug 16, 2014
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Just curious, was it necessary to switch anything around or we could just leave it the way it is?
 

Ondo

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Jun 20, 2007
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Just curious, was it necessary to switch anything around or we could just leave it the way it is?
I'm not sure what you mean? Of course you don't have to switch things around; if you don't, you'll have the CSS ordered the way I chose, which I think is pretty great. If you want it ordered like in standard Project M, you can switch it around - but I think keeping an order designed for one layout of rows and columns and applying it to a different layout is a terrible idea (and I wasn't a fan of Project M's order even on their layout).

I've been thinking I should explain the reasoning behind my ordering, so I'll go ahead and do that. There's a lot that I'm really happy with and don't want to change, but there are also some decisions that I'm much less sure about.

A few main obvious things - every franchise is grouped together horizontally (and DK, Yoshi, and Wario are with the Mario franchise); the franchises represented by only a single character are all together on the bottom row; and unless there's a reason to do things differently, the order is chronological.

Obviously it starts with Mario, and his group of 8 characters. Within the Mario franchise proper, chronologically it's Mario, then Luigi, then Bowser/Peach (both introduced in the same game). I put Peach before Bowser - this matches Brawl and Project M, but Melee did it the other way around. I don't have a strong opinion on this, and could switch if there's a reason.

For the Mario-related franchises, chronological order would be Donkey Kong, then Yoshi, then Wario. I put Yoshi first because I feel he's even more of a Mario character than the others. Looking at it again now, I think I may move Wario in front of Donkey Kong as well - I don't really like having just the one after Donkey Kong's two, and he feels more tied to the Mario franchise now that he's in his overalls. And Diddy Kong is pretty clearly the least tied to Mario of the 8, so him being last feels right.

After the Mario group there's three more slots on the first row - I could have put Fire Emblem there, as the oldest of the franchises with three characters, but I thought Kirby worked better - more similar to Mario and more important than Fire Emblem. I put Meta Knight after King Dedede (unlike Brawl and Project M) because he didn't appear in the first Kirby game, so he's later chronologically, and I didn't see a reason to switch that up. (Not sure why Brawl did.)

To start the next row we have the next franchise chronologically, the Legend of Zelda. I went with chronologically ordering - Link and Zelda from the original, Sheik and Ganondorf from Ocarina of Time, then Toon Link from Wind Waker. The obvious potential change is moving Toon Link next to Link - would people like to see that?

After that there are six more slots on the row, which go to the two franchises with three each remaining, Fire Emblem and Star Fox. Fire Emblem is first because chronology, and is Marth, Roy, Ike because chronology. Star Fox is Fox, Falco, Wolf, because of course.

Third row has Metroid, Mother, and Pokemon, in that order because of chonology, again. Metroid and Mother's ordering is again obvious and straightforward.

Pokemon has 6 from generation one, and Lucario. So obviously I put Lucario last. I put Mewtwo next to Lucario. I started with Pikachu then Jigglypuff, because of them being in the first Smash. The Pokemon Trainer pokemon were ordered with the lowest evolution first. I'd be open to potentially reordering these if there's a reason, but I'm pretty happy with this order.

For the final row, it's again chronological order (of the Nintendo characters), with the exception of R.O.B being moved before the Ice Climbers in order to be next to Mr. Game & Watch. Then it's the guest characters, in chronological order, then Random.

One potential change would be moving Random to the middle of the bottom row, instead of the end. Separating the 4 retro characters from the others. Not sure what I think about that - anyone else have an opinion?
 

Narpas_sword

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TBH, i like that Wario is highfive-ing Kirby.

I do find it weird having spacies on the right, Maybe Starfox, zelda then FE? (3,5,3)
could also go 2,7,2 with Mother, Pokemon (i feel they should be ordered by pokedex) then Metroid.

I feel weird about falcon being with the weirdos too.

Your way all makes sense though
 
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ShadowGanon

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Nov 29, 2013
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I'm with the guy above me. I feel like the spacies need to be on the left (probably with Wolf on the far left so you can put his entire arm in). And I too think that Samus should be on the far right so Zamus' ponytail isn't cut off by another character slot.
 

Ondo

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Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
TBH, i like that Wario is highfive-ing Kirby.

I do find it weird having spacies on the right, Maybe Starfox, zelda then FE? (3,5,3)
could also go 2,7,2 with Mother, Pokemon (i feel they should be ordered by pokedex) then Metroid.

I feel weird about falcon being with the weirdos too.

Your way all makes sense though
Interesting, thanks.

I don't really find it weird having the spacies on the right. I'm not that used to Melee or Project M's layout, so I'm fine with changing it up; I rather have an order that makes sense to me than one that is changed to match other layouts.

I'm not going to argue that's a wise decision, or a common one, but it's the way I feel, so I'm going with it.

Falcon being with the weirdos may be a little weird, but, well, he is the only rep for F-Zero. I would like to have him next to Ganondorf if there was a way to work that out, but it didn't seem feasible for this layout.

Thinking about Pokedex order, that'd be Ivysaur, Charizard, Squirtle, Pikachu, Jigglypuff, Mewtwo, Lucario, right? So swapping Pikachu and Jigglypuff with Ivysaur and Charizard. Thinking about it, I think my problem with it (and my Pokemon knowledge isn't great, so correct me if I'm wrong) is that will the original starters are significantly more prominent than Pikachu and Jigglypuff in the original games, their remakes, and X and Y (I think), don't they have no role in the other games (unless brought in from those games) while Pikachu and Jigglypuff show up as wild pokemon in all the games? If that's right, it has me leaning towards leaving those ones first in the order. Though pokedex order certainly has some appeal.

I'm with the guy above me. I feel like the spacies need to be on the left (probably with Wolf on the far left so you can put his entire arm in). And I too think that Samus should be on the far right so Zamus' ponytail isn't cut off by another character slot.
Yeah, that makes sense; I'm just not interested in changing the order based on how it would work for the poses in the standard renders. Maybe I should be, I don't know, but I'm not. I do appreciate you sharing your thoughts, though.

Definitely if anyone is interested in making their own version of this CSS, modifying the order or anything else, let me know and I'll see what help I can give you.

This is great! Can you add the ditto for random or just an option for it?
i like this css but i would like it better with the ditto as random
Here's a Ditto for random:

Save that and use it replace sc_selcharacter_en > MiscData[70] > Textures(NW4R) > MenSelchrChrFace.051. You can grab a copy of the CSP here; use that to replace sc_selcharacter_en > MiscData[30] > Textures(NW4R) > MenSelchrFaceB.501, 502, 503, 504, and 505. Best to set the format to CMPR when replacing those. (I grabbed the Ditto CSP from Theytah's build - I couldn't track down where it originated. Since the CSP that had been saved as CMPR was the best render I had, I'm not entirely happy with the quality of the final image.)
 

Yeller1999

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Jan 14, 2014
Messages
210
Here's a Ditto for random:

Save that and use it replace sc_selcharacter_en > MiscData[70] > Textures(NW4R) > MenSelchrChrFace.051. You can grab a copy of the CSP here; use that to replace sc_selcharacter_en > MiscData[30] > Textures(NW4R) > MenSelchrFaceB.501, 502, 503, 504, and 505. Best to set the format to CMPR when replacing those. (I grabbed the Ditto CSP from Theytah's build - I couldn't track down where it originated. Since the CSP that had been saved as CMPR was the best render I had, I'm not entirely happy with the quality of the final image.)
thanks but i dont know how to do that stuff with brawl box
 

Yeller1999

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Jan 14, 2014
Messages
210
i know but i am a slow learner like how am i supposed to replace that stuff
 

Ondo

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Jun 20, 2007
Messages
160
Version 1.5 is out - not a big change. I moved Wario to before Donkey Kong, and slightly adjusted Kirby's image. I also moved the images left 3 pixels and down 4; I found a place where I'd left values the same that should have been changed.

Also a lot of cleaning up the internals - I'm now using the reduced size CSS I made as the base. Which started out as some of the things I did getting this CSS to work, but I put in more work on it.

Yeller1999 Yeller1999 , did you get the Ditto version working?
 
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