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Official Stage Discussion

Draco_The

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
1,367
As much as I love Phendrana, I think that a Phazon Mines themed stage would be better. The Prime trilogy was all about the Phazon after all, so if we're going to have a single stage representing the Prime saga, I think having Phazon at least in the background should be kind of a must. Since that location was filled with pirates in the game it could also have some in the background doing stuff. Also, the Brawl music would fit better a place like that than Phendrana.

About Hyrule Castle, the combo tent is too small. Things like Charizard's wings and Ganondorf's cape clip quite a lot. Otherwise the stage is fine, and IMO its layout shouldn't be touched, otherwise it wouldn't be Hyrule Castle anymore.
 

Player -0

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 7, 2013
Messages
5,125
Location
Helsong's Carpeted Floor
The stage is too small compared to 64. I've already complained about this. Kind of offsetting when you get your 64 nostalgia feels and get to P:M version and the stage is "puny"
 

GFooChombey

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Messages
595
NNID
GFooChombey
I mentioned this to Pik recently, but the hut of life has some weird collisions. Maybe the inside wall was left slanted like the original while the outside one was straightened... or maybe it was just an error. I also noticed that characters enter their "ledge sway" animation a bit farther back than most stages. I have pictures of these below.
Diddy on the inside wall:



Diddy on the outside wall:



Squirtle's ledge sway animation

I remember reading that higher quality sky textures caused problems, but once you notice those clouds, they can't be unseen. I also hope that the tornadoes return if the wizards can crack the code. I'm only being so nitpicky because the HD stages, particularly this one, are my favorite thing about 3.5. It's one of my selling points when I introduce it to a friend.

Otherwise this stage is still really fun to play on. I know most people wouldn't consider it competitive because of infinites and the hut, but I used to play doubles and even some singles in 64 here and still love to pick it. Absolutely beautiful work.
 
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Cubelarooso

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
1,614
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[Hide my Location]
I love the stage. It's got a lot of cool elements, and although it leads to being really campy, it's still fun in friendlies, and I think viable for doubles. If they ever become possible, tornadoes would be welcome, and could possibly break up camping.
Looks great, too.
 

Chevy

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 12, 2014
Messages
736
The texture on the inside of the tent wall is all smeared, i think green from the roof clips through.
 

Rᴏb

still here, just to suffer
Joined
Feb 1, 2012
Messages
1,595
I don't like how the stage's collisions changed, and I don't like how small the actual stage is compared to the N64 version. The blastzones also seem way too unforgiving.
 

MegaMissingno

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 28, 2014
Messages
574
NNID
missingno
Given that the original is kinda Ridley-sized, I don't have a problem with shrinking it a smidge.
 

Saikyoshi

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
3,921
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Being petty
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KarmaPilcrow
3DS FC
0344-9771-0514
Given that the original is kinda Ridley-sized, I don't have a problem with shrinking it a smidge.
I don't really think there's any point changing the properties of stages that are going to be banned anyway, myself.
 

Sandfall

Stage Designer
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
515
I mentioned this to Pik recently, but the hut of life has some weird collisions. Maybe the inside wall was left slanted like the original while the outside one was straightened... or maybe it was just an error. I also noticed that characters enter their "ledge sway" animation a bit farther back than most stages. I have pictures of these below.
Diddy on the inside wall:



Diddy on the outside wall:



Squirtle's ledge sway animation

I remember reading that higher quality sky textures caused problems, but once you notice those clouds, they can't be unseen. I also hope that the tornadoes return if the wizards can crack the code. I'm only being so nitpicky because the HD stages, particularly this one, are my favorite thing about 3.5. It's one of my selling points when I introduce it to a friend.

Otherwise this stage is still really fun to play on. I know most people wouldn't consider it competitive because of infinites and the hut, but I used to play doubles and even some singles in 64 here and still love to pick it. Absolutely beautiful work.
Thank you for bringing that to my attention. I just went ahead and fixed all that. :p

As for the stage's size, it should be the same, but I'll check to see if any adjustments are needed.
 

InfinityCollision

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
Messages
1,245
I spend entirely too much time on Hyrule Castle. Partly because it's awesome, partly for the music Embarrass I'm glad it replaced Eldin.
 

leekslap

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 17, 2014
Messages
581
Location
Trapped in a .gif
3DS FC
2294-4978-8399
I love the stage. It's got a lot of cool elements, and although it leads to being really campy, it's still fun in friendlies, and I think viable for doubles. If they ever become possible, tornadoes would be welcome, and could possibly break up camping.
Looks great, too.
Tornadoes were one of the main reasons the stage was banned in 64. Sometimes they would go a lot faster than usual or appear where a player is or cover options that otherwise would have been safe. That along with camping spots. Plus, tornadoes aren't exactly the most iconic Zelda thing.

I don't see the point of this stage if it doesn't have untechable walls. That combo tent tho
 

Sandfall

Stage Designer
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
515
Tornadoes were one of the main reasons the stage was banned in 64. Sometimes they would go a lot faster than usual or appear where a player is or cover options that otherwise would have been safe. That along with camping spots. Plus, tornadoes aren't exactly the most iconic Zelda thing.

I don't see the point of this stage if it doesn't have untechable walls. That combo tent tho
Good thing this is a "for fun" stage that isn't targeted toward competitive play anyway :p

Regardless, in the unlikely event that we come up with a way to make the tornadoes, they will almost certainly be added to the stage.
 
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GFooChombey

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Messages
595
NNID
GFooChombey
Fun Fact from SOJ: They tried to put a tornado in the background, but it didn't work.

Source: I played some friendlies with him at MAGfest last night.
 
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leekslap

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 17, 2014
Messages
581
Location
Trapped in a .gif
3DS FC
2294-4978-8399
Good thing this is a "for fun" stage that isn't targeted toward competitive play anyway :p

Regardless, in the unlikely event that we come up with a way to make the tornadoes, they will almost certainly be added to the stage.
Oh, OK. Fair enough.

Can we get a revamped Brinstar pl0x? Give it the Wario Ware/Yoshi's Story/Yoshi's Island Brawl kind of base with walls, maybe big Congo Jungle type moving platforms, slower and weaker lava that lingers more, moving platforms everywhere, a more canonical look, etc. Basically base the stage off the idea of lava and make it look like how it's supposed to. Make it kind of competitive though even if it means just having the lava at the very bottom without moving with very high base knockback but very little knockback growth so that the characters can get edgeguarded. Maybe the moving platforms are a stupid idea and it's better to have a triangle stage IDK make it unique.

Or instead of having a revamped Brinstar( at least layout wise since I still want a new look for it and maybe a hazard removal ), make Tourain. It's 10 times more iconic than every other Metroid stage ever! I can already imagine Mother Brain and her Rinkas and cannons affecting the battle in fun ways. Maybe make it like the third part of Halberd with weaker hazards? I'm just mother brainstorming... OK, I'm sorry. That was... that was SO bad.
 

Nefnoj

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 2, 2014
Messages
1,911
Location
Spiral Mountain
I've always wondered, why does Project M replace stages, rather than adding them via custom stage option? Might be easier to organize that way, and for us casuals who like hazardous stages, but still want that Project M feel, we would be able to keep both Metal Cavern and Mushroomy Kingdom. The limited 1-music-a-stage wouldn't be a problem at all, and you'd have more liberty to make pretty stages. For instance, Brawl Norfair could have the active lava on one stage, but there could be another stage that's 3.5 Norfair, with an aesthetic themed around Tallon Overworld.

I stopped getting notifications from this thread... >:[
Good thing this is a "for fun" stage that isn't targeted toward competitive play anyway :p

Regardless, in the unlikely event that we come up with a way to make the tornadoes, they will almost certainly be added to the stage.
I don't know what exactly is possible, but I do know you guys can do collision with animation, right? You could probably just put some weird slippery "wall" that can't be wall-jumped nor ledged on a spaztic animation, then play Link's tornado particle system in the same location. I'm not as smart as Project M people though.

Yeah, collision updates would be cool, maybe smooth out Kaepora Gaebora's animations. It would also be really awesome if you guys made it change from night to day, in reference to the cycle of Ocarina of Time. During the day, the gate could open, and at night, close, though you'd have to add things, and I don't know how many more things the Wii could handle hardware-wise on that stage.

A lot of people are mentioning size, I honestly like it's current size, but I definitely wouldn't mind it being larger.
In other words, I don't care. However, Smash 64 had larger stages in general, due to its' floatier physics, so a transition from-engine-to-engine wouldn't be an easy one. Unless if you guys are comparing it to the 3.02 Hyrule Castle, in which case, I dunno, it's been too long and 3.5 Hype fried my brain.

Oh, OK. Fair enough.

Can we get a revamped Brinstar pl0x? Give it the Wario Ware/Yoshi's Story/Yoshi's Island Brawl kind of base with walls, maybe big Congo Jungle type moving platforms, slower and weaker lava that lingers more, moving platforms everywhere, a more canonical look, etc. Basically base the stage off the idea of lava and make it look like how it's supposed to. Make it kind of competitive though even if it means just having the lava at the very bottom without moving with very high base knockback but very little knockback growth so that the characters can get edgeguarded. Maybe the moving platforms are a stupid idea and it's better to have a triangle stage IDK make it unique.

Or instead of having a revamped Brinstar( at least layout wise since I still want a new look for it and maybe a hazard removal ), make Tourain. It's 10 times more iconic than every other Metroid stage ever! I can already imagine Mother Brain and her Rinkas and cannons affecting the battle in fun ways. Maybe make it like the third part of Halberd with weaker hazards? I'm just mother brainstorming... OK, I'm sorry. That was... that was SO bad.
Naw, I think there are enough competitive altered battlefield copies, though I am a biased casual... But I think they should slightly change Brinstar to make it a reference to Zebes: Increase the size, add background aesthetics featuring Ridley and Wavers, and add a platform to the right, while keeping the damage-able ground (I love that thing), and the two fleshy stalks keeping the platforms in place. (I somewhat love those things)
 

leekslap

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 17, 2014
Messages
581
Location
Trapped in a .gif
3DS FC
2294-4978-8399
But I think they should slightly change Brinstar to make it a reference to Zebes: Increase the size, add background aesthetics featuring Ridley and Wavers, and add a platform to the right, while keeping the damage-able ground (I love that thing), and the two fleshy stalks keeping the platforms in place. (I somewhat love those things)
No. Just no. You are making me remember... Ridley is love. Ridley is life.
 

mimgrim

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Messages
9,233
Location
Somewhere magical
Oh! "Breaks random select", how so? What's "striking"?
Go to the random selection for stages then turn a few of the stages off. Now go to the actual stage selection screen after the CSS and press "Y". You should now see some stages blacked out with an "X" symbol which then prevents them from being selected. You can also press the "X" button on the controller while having the cursor to block it out with the same symbol. You can press Z to reset any blocked out stage. Striking is process in tournaments by the players to determine the first stage to go to of the legal start stages for the first round and after that is used by the winner to declare 3 bans that the loser of the first can't go to when counter picking.
 

Nefnoj

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 2, 2014
Messages
1,911
Location
Spiral Mountain
Go to the random selection for stages then turn a few of the stages off. Now go to the actual stage selection screen after the CSS and press "Y". You should now see some stages blacked out with an "X" symbol which then prevents them from being selected. You can also press the "X" button on the controller while having the cursor to block it out with the same symbol. You can press Z to reset any blocked out stage. Striking is process in tournaments by the players to determine the first stage to go to of the legal start stages for the first round and after that is used by the winner to declare 3 bans that the loser of the first can't go to when counter picking.
OOOOOOoooh, yeah! I didn't know what the word for that was. Pretty neat function, though I've never used it productively.
You sound like a competitive player. Lots of big words, haha.
*Cough*
I'm a casual please don't hurt me.
 
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Sandfall

Stage Designer
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
515
Thanks for the feedback on Hyrule Castle. Here's a new stage discussion!

Let's talk about Ness's home: Onett!
 

Cubelarooso

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
1,614
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[Hide my Location]
Don't really play it anymore. I dislike walk-offs, but Onett's is relatively acceptable.
It's all right for a casual stage, and I don't see much potential from a competitive version, so I'd say just leave it totally as-is.
 

Nefnoj

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 2, 2014
Messages
1,911
Location
Spiral Mountain
Thanks for the feedback on Hyrule Castle. Here's a new stage discussion!

Let's talk about Ness's home: Onett!
Don't change the gameplay of the stage or I'll cry.

Maybe add some background aesthetic? It's a bit odd for a billion cars to be going about all day without any of the Earthbound NPC's taking their hourly strolls. You could add dogs, punks, snakes, crows, one of the various bosses, and even though they're not in Onett in Earthbound, HIPPIES.
In other words, just improve the graphics and I'll be a happy sailor.
I wouldn't mind the edges being increased.
 

Saikyoshi

Smash Master
Joined
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Messages
3,921
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Being petty
NNID
KarmaPilcrow
3DS FC
0344-9771-0514
There's really nothing to say about it. It's been in three official games now, so pretty much all that's there to say has already been said.

I guess hypothetically, it could be replaced by Magicant 3DS (sans the flying man) to give another competitive stage, but I don't really see that happening for a number of reasons.
 
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Nefnoj

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 2, 2014
Messages
1,911
Location
Spiral Mountain
Aside from adding stamina mode collisions (which were added to most stages), Onett hasn't been touched at all in 3.5
"Stamina mode collisions"? I know that Stamina mode has the optional "balloon fight" death zones, but I didn't know it reserved special collisions!
 

MegaMissingno

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 28, 2014
Messages
574
NNID
missingno
I think that's just referring to either the wraparound function itself needing to be baked into stage files, or having to modify walkoff stages so that it's possible to rise through the otherwise solid floor when flying up. Is that right?
 

GFooChombey

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 20, 2013
Messages
595
NNID
GFooChombey
I'm really tired of this stage. I never really liked it in Melee, but that's just an opinion. Then I was disappointed to see it return in Brawl, and now it's back in Smash 4. It's just grown stale. At least the other stages that constantly return, including Temple, have been changed to keep them fresh. I would have no objections to a brand new Earthbound stage in it's place, but still somehow using the cars if possible.

To elaborate on my dislikes: I feel that there is no neutral position and my movement feels contrived. The blastzones make me feel cramped. And again, I feel like the stage has just grown stale.
 

Cubelarooso

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
1,614
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[Hide my Location]
or having to modify walkoff stages so that it's possible to rise through the otherwise solid floor when flying up. Is that right?
It's the other way around. Floors don't act as ceilings: they're floors. Thus any stage with walls that extend to the bottom (GHZ, WW, etc.) or walk-offs had to be given ceilings at their bottom, so people don't come flying up from the ground.
 

leekslap

Smash Ace
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Jun 17, 2014
Messages
581
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Trapped in a .gif
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Common idea I see for a competitive Onett is to make the stage a alien saucer with unforgiving ledges and a strong center stage advantage, but can we please be a little more creative than that? To be honest, I just want some Earthbound music.
 
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