Character Discussion Thread

[pupNapoleon]

Personally, I wouldn't mind Shadow. He's my favorite Sonic character, and Sonic is, or at least was, my favorite game franchise (its still high up there). I do not think he should be playable in Smash, and don't think he ever would, but I'd really love to see him in another fighting game again, he's got tons of potential.


But yeah, Sonic the Hedgehog is within the Top 10 selling franchises of all time, one of the few to have topped 100m sales. Pac-Man, Metal Gear, and Mega Man don't come anywhere close.

If you don't think Pacman sold 100m, then you are not using the correct figures.
Pacman sold an extraordinary amount of expensive units, the standalone arcade boxes, which have been everywhere- from store locations to arcades to individuals houses, and with many new incarnations of these boxes.
He may not have sold 100m on home consoles, but that was not his biggest market in the first place.

 

[False Sense]

That and he's just hard to master.

This excuse is flimsy.

 

[Burruni]

This excuse is flimsy.

deserves a nomination on that list for the 10 years people didn't know that Rest did anything.

 

[JaidynReiman]

If you don't think Pacman sold 100m, then you are not using the correct figures.
Pacman sold an extraordinary amount of expensive units, the standalone arcade boxes, which have been everywhere- from store locations to arcades to individuals houses, and with many new incarnations of these boxes.
He may not have sold 100m on home consoles, but that was not his biggest market in the first place.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game_franchises


Dunno. Maybe it doesn't include Arcades, but the thing you gotta remember regardless is that Arcade units make money off of people playing them, so overall they'd probably sell less units individually. I'm not sure if this list includes Arcade sales.


EDIT: It says right at the top that it doesn't include Arcade sales. This is the list for Arcade sales:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcade_game#List_of_highest-grossing_arcade_video_games


Even then, it only sold 400,000 boxes. It probably grossed more money, though, naturally.

 

[Strofirko]

Actually I think most of the third party has 0 chances to return,since anything can happen between the time gap from this and the next smash game,and most of them gets a spot in the roster because a bunch of coincidences.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Actually I think most of the third party has 0 chances to return,since anything can happen between the time gap from this and the next smash game,and most of them gets a spot in the roster because a bunch of coincidences.

That logic does not apply. You can't say they have 0 chances to return, if anything, its 50/50, because anything can happen between gets. All third-party characters have a 50/50 chance of coming back. 0 implies they have absolutely NO chance, which simply is not at all true.

 

[Burruni]

That logic does not apply. You can't say they have 0 chances to return, if anything, its 50/50, because anything can happen between gets. All third-party characters have a 50/50 chance of coming back. 0 implies they have absolutely NO chance, which simply is not at all true.

I feel has more around 75% just because of how close Nintendo and Sega have been partnering on titles from the Wii onwards and he just has the far-too-iconic rivalry with .

... yeah, I'll say 50/50. It's because Namco-Bandai is on good terms with Nintendo and his reason for being in this game isn't really gonna change.

.... it's Capcom. I've learned better than to have hope.

 

[Quarium]

I don't wanna sound like a dumb kid on the internet, since I know this ain't possible. But I bet Shovel Knight would fit amazingly into the smash universe, with a wacky shovel based moveset! the idea greatly amuses me.

 

[Kenith]

Anybody got some ideas for a Lana moveset?
Do you think I'm getting desperate yet?

 

[Burruni]

Anybody got some ideas for a Lana moveset?
Do you think I'm getting desperate yet?

I doubt she'll get in but I can make one for you/her thread if you PM me.

 

[Argos]

I don't wanna sound like a dumb kid on the internet, since I know this ain't possible. But I bet Shovel Knight would fit amazingly into the smash universe, with a wacky shovel based moveset! the idea greatly amuses me.

I agree actually. He has moveset potential, an aesthetic deliberately designed to fit in with other characters born on the NES and a damn good game behind him. If Yacht Club has a good relationship with Nintendo around the time Smash 8 or so come around, Nintendo still wants to throw bones to indie developers a la Commander Video trophy and the series is still going strong I could image him actually being a candidate. Not going to be a factor any time soon, unfortunately.

 

[Strofirko]

That logic does not apply. You can't say they have 0 chances to return, if anything, its 50/50, because anything can happen between gets. All third-party characters have a 50/50 chance of coming back. 0 implies they have absolutely NO chance, which simply is not at all true.

But still requires more than that,containing the character status by the company,the company own status,the pulic status with the character,the partnership status between the company and nintendo,50/50 still to much since most of the third party characters that ever appeared with their faces on smash bros has their company with a some kind of "crisys".

 

[Deleted member]

If an indie character is going to have even a sliver of a chance, they need to have a Japanese release.

 

[Strofirko]

If an indie character is going to have even a sliver of a chance, they need to have a Japanese release.

I really not expecting an indie game to ever appear on a playable shape on smash bros.
It just would seems too "random".

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Anybody got some ideas for a Lana moveset?
Do you think I'm getting desperate yet?

B- Sorceress Tome

Side B- Slingshot

Up B- Deku Leaf

Down B- Wall shield

Final Smash: Deku Tree

It's a bit stiff since I haven't played Warriors in a time, and I don't think she will ever happen unless she appears in another Zelda game, which I don't see much hope for, but you don't deserve grief for wanting her in.

 

[pupNapoleon]

That doesn't mean anything at all. Take Banjo for example. He was planned for 64 and Melee, but then Rare was bought out by Microsoft. SEGA leaving the console market is a similar case as Rare leaving Nintendo.

I follow your logic even less now than I did before.
I asked you why you think Sonic wouldn't be in the next SSB, becaue of which individual.
Would Nintendo not want a legend, or would Capcom not want their mascot in a hugely popular game to promote their struggling sales?

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

I follow your logic even less now than I did before.
I asked you why you think Sonic wouldn't be in the next SSB, becaue of which individual.
Would Nintendo not want a legend, or would Capcom not want their mascot in a hugely popular game to promote their struggling sales?

Because SEGA announced they're moving away from the console market. It's that simple.

 

[Deleted member]

That doesn't mean anything at all. Take Banjo for example. He was planned for 64 and Melee, but then Rare was bought out by Microsoft.

No he wasn't.

Unless you have a valid source to back up this claim.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

No he wasn't.

Unless you have a valid source to back up this claim.

Frankly, it is said he was considered, not really planned. Just like Chrom And the Chorus Kids are thought to have been.

http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2013/...-melee-and-brawl-rosters-did-you-know-gaming/

Disclaimer, I have no expertise in RAREWARE titles for N64 nor do I know much about them, so it took me a while to find this, and I do not call myself an expert on the matter. I don't know if Did You Know Gaming is a joker or not at times, so I do not take 100% stand in what the source says.

 

[Deleted member]

Frankly, it is said he was considered, not really planned. Just like Chrom And the Chorus Kids are thought to have been.

http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2013/...-melee-and-brawl-rosters-did-you-know-gaming/

Disclaimer, I have no expertise in RAREWARE titles for N64 nor do I know much about them, so it took me a while to find this, and I do not call myself an expert on the matter. I don't know if Did You Know Gaming is a joker or not at times, so I do not take 100% stand in what the source says.

Did You Know Gaming got the info wrong.
Their source was what they believed to be a list of characters the development team wanted to include in Smash 64, when it was really the results of a poll for who fans wanted to see in "Smash 2".

Said source does mention that Bowser, Dedede, and Mewtwo were planned for Smash 64 but had to be scrapped during development, however.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Did You Know Gaming got the info wrong.
Their source was what they believed to be a list of characters the development team wanted to include in Smash 64, when it was really the results of a poll for who fans wanted to see in "Smash 2".

Well, overall you did have a point. Banjo wouldn't really have been that likely back in the N64/Melee days anyway.

 

[Substitution]

Still, I would've mained James Bond 1st day if he got in. Forget Snake, Bond is the man we need in Smash.

 

[Deleted member]

Oddjob would have been better.

 

[Substitution]

Nah man, do you honestly want someone worse than Brawl Meta Knight? We can't have that.

 

[Deleted member]

Nah man, do you honestly want someone worse than Brawl Meta Knight? We can't have that.

Would sure beat having HOO HA 24/7.

 

[Substitution]

Would sure beat having HOO HA 24/7.

But the last thing we need is a Down Tilt fest.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Because SEGA announced they're moving away from the console market. It's that simple.

They said they are moving their production away from the console market, not shunning their history on it ever having happened.
Sega doesn't produce Smash bros, all they have to do is lend their character to another game which gives said character more fame, fans, and for themselves, fortune.

You aren't outlining the thoughts that lead you to your conclusions and it makes it difficult to follow your process.

 

[JamesDNaux]

I believe myself that there hidden specifics to Sakurai's criteria doesn't tell about to the public, and you can tell just by the inclusions themselves. In some cases, especially when it comes to uniqueness, you just don't go with what Sakurai says officially and speculate from there, especially in game development and planning where specific decisions are done and especially with a director who's handling most of the decisions made for two new Smash Bros. games.

That's just it, Sakurai doesn't tell us how he picks every character. In fact, time and again we have seen that he has a different criteria for each character, there's no "master plan" that he follows on how to pick a character, game development just doesn't work that way. What he says officially are the best sources because they come from the man himself, you're basically saying to ignore word of god and replace it with our own opinions, which is why I feel your perspective is faulty.

And I believe when Sakurai considers a newcomer, he first decides on if the character has appeared recently in a new game, then looks at the character in face value and then figures what the character offers for a moveset in general, and then considers the factors (such as importance, franchise popularity) before finalizing his decision. It probably explains why Sakurai took extra caution before considering Pac-Man for playability.

I can't even reply to this, because it has been proven wrong by a few characters. The entire roster is not dictated by "these characters are new or have recently appeared in games," he picks each character with entirely different criteria, with few overlaps. It's impossible to look at everything as a whole and set a single specific reason for everything, this is the nature of game development. There's a reason Sakurai said "have you ever made a game?"

 

[BluePikmin11]

Now I'm starting to think explaining a thought process was a pretty bad idea to begin with, it's way too complicated.
But the main factors are probably still talked about when deciding a newcomer.

 

[N3ON]

Comparing Sega's mobile and PC shift to M$'s acquisition of Rare.

Where to start with that one, amirite? xD

 

[ZeldaFan01]

Comparing Sega's mobile and PC shift to M$'s acquisition of Rare.

Where to start with that one, amirite? xD

I don't even know where to begin with that mess my friend!

 

[AEMehr]

If an indie character is going to have even a sliver of a chance, they need to have a Japanese release.

quote confirmed to have the best chance

 

[JaidynReiman]

Honestly, I don't think an Indie character has any chance of being playable at all. Third-parties are added who will help increase sales, so that consists of gaming icons. Some Indie games do amazingly well, but they're still not gaming icons unless your name is Steve, and Minecraft has never been on Nintendo consoles and likely never will be.

 

[Kenith]

Honestly, I don't think an Indie character has any chance of being playable at all. Third-parties are added who will help increase sales, so that consists of gaming icons. Some Indie games do amazingly well, but they're still not gaming icons unless your name is Steve, and Minecraft has never been on Nintendo consoles and likely never will be.

Also, Minecraft is really, really lame.
I would take an obscure Shovel Knight over an overrated genderless block man.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Also, Minecraft is really, really lame.
I would take an obscure Shovel Knight over an overrated genderless block man.

I wouldn't call Shovel Knight obscure. But its not extremely massively popular either. Minecraft has sold massive amounts of copies. Not that I care that much; I can't get into Minecraft because its way too much of a time killer.

 

[Deleted member]

quote confirmed to have the best chance

This says otherwise.

 

[Kenith]

This says otherwise.

Boring, we already have a character that attacks by running.

 

[Deleted member]

Boring, we already have a character that attacks by running.

But not rainbows!

....and technically, Sonic attacks by spinning, not running.

 

[Kenith]

Now that I think about it, Runner2 is a very rhythm-based game! And he doesn't sing!
See? Karate Joe represents rhythm just fine.

Yes, that still bothers me.

 

[AEMehr]

This says otherwise.

BUT WAS BIT.TRIP RELEASED IN JAPAN!?!?!?