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Ness Compendi.... blah blah blah. Condensed version!!!

Wave⁂

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Messages
11,870
This is the condensed version of my (our) guide, the Ness Compendiums of Knowledge and Statistics.

Made for those of you with very little attention spans. Or just don't like going so in-depth.

Pros

* Best character to play (statistically) in Low Tier Tournaments.
* Long recovery
* Quick attacks
* Can double jump cancel
* Effective at combo'ing
* Very good aerial attacks
* Good KO moves
* Average weight
* Small target
* Throws can KO and combo
* Powerful forward smash
* Very versatile projectile
* Largest sweetspot range
* Forward smash (if timed correctly) can deflect projectiles

Cons

* Slow without advanced techniques
* Highly abusable recovery
* Extremely low grab range (and slow)
* Slow special moves


A
A fast move. Almost no damage, nor stun. NEVER.


AA
Same a single A. Just.... don't.


AAA
A bit better... the kick gives enough stun to actually accomplish something.


Dash Attack
Ness's best approaching move. It has incredible range and is practically a projectile.
Hit 1 has a semi-spike effect, like a soft YLink's dsmash. Hit 2 does almost nothing. Hit 3 pops hem up.


Ftilt
A nice move. Fast, useful and has a lingering hit box, nice priority and can edge guard. Can be directed by aiming at a diagonal.This attack is more useful than is sounds because it is fast and it has low lag. It goes through many projectiles. Its deceptive priority makes the uftilt fairly useful against shffls.


Utilt
Very fast, has silly priority due to his invincibility, and decent range. A good weapon against space animals. Good in combos.


Dtilt
Possible infinite against walls, usually ends around 300%. Possible edgeguard, but not to replace a proper edgeguard. Using against a full shielding opponent will prevent shield grabbing because it pokes at their feet.


Fsmash
It has insane range and priority, does amazing damage if you tipper, can’t be shield grabbed because of shield stun and they are pushed away. Is used to edgeguard about 50% of the time. Use it to finish combos against fast fallers as well.


Usmash
See Yoyo Gltich Section


Dsmash
Ness's worst attack, hands down. Except for extreme mindgames. (Read: for Simna only ^_^)


Nair
Un-reached potential. If your opponent is at too high a damage to combo into a finisher, this is your move. Very good edgeguard. Very fast, and even faster if DjC'd.


Bair
Ness's best KO move. Especially when DjC'd. Possible edgeguard, but not that good due to it's small range. Not much else to say. (Note the small landing lag.)


Fair
Really good combo'r, but best if you DjC or shuffle so only the weak hit hits, so you can combo them across to stage. A neat thing about fair is that although it appears to be several hits, it is continuously hitting your opponent. One of Ness's best (and only) approaches.


Uair
One Ness's best weapon's against Space Animals, but that will be covered in character matchups (found in the fulll guide). ALWAYS DjC THIS MOVE. ALWAYS. Good killer against floaties like GAW and Jiggz due to their light weight and... floatiness. Ness's best juggler. Equip star jacket by DjC'ing uair.


Dair
Avoid using this in actual combat; there is way too much lag. It is a possible combo starter if you aren't shield grabbed.As a meteor, this kinda sucks. The long hitbox is good, but there is too much lag. Unless you you spike jacket. That looks so fricken cool. Good edge attack, though.



* Forward Throw:
Nothing special about this move... avoid it, unless edgeuarding.

* Back Throw:
FRICKEN AMAZING. This will kill pretty much anyone at 90%, depending on the stage, their weight and DI. If you opponent fails to sweetspot while recovering and lands behind you, turn around and bthrow.

* Up Throw:
Combo starter against fastfallers, leads into a nice uair juggle. Average KO move against floaties. Still not as good as bthrow.

* Down Throw:
Dthrow does 0% to GAW, for some reason. Avoid using this, unless for mindgames.


B:
Never use this except:
-Shield break
-Missed rest ^_^
-Edgeguarding
---98% of the time, edgeguarding will be the reason you use this. Good if you have timing, or against predictable recoveries.


->B
Avoid using this attack. Occasionally, it is pretty good, but without mindgames, never. Aerial PK fire will cancel all lag if landing lag is interrupted by oh-no-I'm-going-to-fall-help-me-ahh animation.


^B
Also only in the full version. Goes WAAAYYYY too in-depth for some of you.


vB
Never. There are 21 fricken frames of lag. Only in teams, healing on Carneria, or.... can't thank of anything else.


I wrote a program to analyze matchups between low tiers for the purpose of creating a tier list exclusively for low tier tourneys. I used the Phanna Chart matchup values. For details on my methodology and whatnot go here.

Here's a summary of the results.

God Tier
1) Ness

Top Tier
2) Pikachu

High Tier
3) Yoshi
4) Y. Link
5) Link
6) Mr. G&W
7) Luigi

Middle Tier
8) Zelda
9) DK

Low Tier
10) Roy
11) Kirby
12) Mewtwo

Bottom Tier
13) Bowser
14) Pichu

Thought this would make some of you Ness players happy. :)
 

cF=)

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 22, 2005
Messages
1,909
Dthrow is awesome, what are you talking about ? Never seen Dthrow -> DJC Fair -> grab comboes ? It's also extremely easy to land an Uair at lower % against floaties than Bthrowing 'em and loosing the opportunity of racking up more damage.

Also, Dthrow -> PKFire tech chase is the pimpest thing ever, especially if you're in reach for a DJC Fair/Uair and can combo out of it. Those are some exemple of how I use the essential move which is the Dthrow.

Also, the low tier statistics you came up with are not based on actual tourney results. Almost everytime I see a low tier tourney with few good Link players, they always have the upper hand and that's no joke. You can choose to go Ness in some matchups like DK, Pikachu, but Ness has tremendous problems when it's time to dodge projectiles (Campy Samus vs Ness on FD is just a demonstration of the retardness).

I hope this will sparkle some discussion.
 

Wave⁂

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Messages
11,870
Oops. I think i just copy and pasted that from NESSBOUNDER.

Also, Luigi and Link are sometimes banned in low tier tourneys.
 

PwNess

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
17
Dthrow is awesome, what are you talking about ? Never seen Dthrow -> DJC Fair -> grab comboes ? It's also extremely easy to land an Uair at lower % against floaties than Bthrowing 'em and loosing the opportunity of racking up more damage.

Also, Dthrow -> PKFire tech chase is the pimpest thing ever, especially if you're in reach for a DJC Fair/Uair and can combo out of it. Those are some exemple of how I use the essential move which is the Dthrow.

I hope this will sparkle some discussion.
agreed. its a great combo starter against almost everyone except the fastfallers (where you'll most likely be uthrowing them). it's easy to follow your opponents DI after a dthrow and is a set up for you to abuse ness' sick aerial game.
 

BZZL

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 19, 2006
Messages
129
Not bad, except I'd say there's a LOT more to be said about dair. Most of its usefulness comes out of canceling Ness's second jump anywhere in the air and being able to fastfall the kick itself. Excellent use for mindgames. Delay isn't such a big problem if you L-cancel out of it.

edit:
Forgot to mention the sheer length of time that the hitbox stays out. It's crazy for catching people who think the attack's over with.
 

Dogysamich

The Designated Hype Man!
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 3, 2002
Messages
6,140
Location
Warner Robins, Georgia
You cannot convince me that Ness is "god tier" in a low tier tourney.

I guess its "logical" to say that after looking at phanna's charts. But in all seriousness, you cant convince me that ness blows everybody else in lowtiers out of the water.

____

Other than that, i like the idea, but i personally want frame data. D:
 

thesage

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 26, 2005
Messages
6,774
Location
Arlington, Va
3DS FC
4957-3743-1481
He's like the fourth best character besides Link, Luigi, Young Link, and tied with GaW. At least at my level of play. At like simna's level against somebody else at an equivalent level, then ya, it's god tier. Only three people are at Simna's level though...
 

Ademisk

Smash Champion
Joined
May 4, 2007
Messages
2,759
Location
Kirkland, Washington
His combo ability comes from his DjCs. He can jump attack, land and hit again faster than almost anyone. It's really difficult to do sometimes, but when mastered it's definitely not overrated.
 

thesage

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 26, 2005
Messages
6,774
Location
Arlington, Va
3DS FC
4957-3743-1481
Ness can uair combo himself, mow taught me that, in very unpleasant zero to death ditto comboes...
 

Wave⁂

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Messages
11,870
WHAT!?! Ness can combo himself? Well, that just about puts him in God Tier. :lick:
 

Ademisk

Smash Champion
Joined
May 4, 2007
Messages
2,759
Location
Kirkland, Washington
EDIT; Sorry, upon consideration, my assertion requires further testing before I can stand by it. Check back to this post sometime Saturday or Sunday.
 
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