Meta Match Up Discussion - Vs. Ike

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General Rules:

• No Flaming. Respect the opinions of others even if you disagree. Let's not get heated on an online forum for a family-friendly game. Failure to abide by this will result in the wrath of the law.
• Human error isn't something worth serious consideration. Discussions will assume both characters are being played to utmost potential.

The following are suggested subtopics of conversation:

• Character strengths and weaknesses
• How to effectively approach/deter approaches
• Off-stage game
• Positional play
• Punishes/punishing
• Specific moves/strings that are strong for both characters
• Suggested custom movesets
• Stage strengths and weaknesses
• Overall score [NOTE: THIS IS NOT AS IMPORTANT DURING THE FIRST ROUND OF DISCUSSION]

***For general questions not related to the current topic in this thread please use the General Match Up thread.***

This thread shall last for around 8-9 days, with the next thread opening up in about 5-7 days.

 

[DERPFISHsaysNO]

To start, Mewtwo vs Ike is a game centered around forcing Ike to approach unsafely. Shadowball can be used, but I do believe (not 100% don't flame me for it if I'm wrong) that Ike's side b can stop shadowball, and a countered shadowball of high or full charge can decimate mewtwo if he's hit by it. If Mewtwo approaches Ike can shut him out well with fair and nair. If Ike manages his approach well (mixing up fair, nair, RAR bair, and side b) he can get in. Once Ike is close to Mewtwo on his terms, he lays down hurt quite effectively and kills us early. The other side of it is that Ike does struggle to get in on Mewtwo. Dtilt and Jab2/3 are quite good at stopping Ike's approaches and while the latter doesn't have great followups the former does. Once Ike is at kill % from smashes Mewtwo really just needs a solid read or Ike to miss an approach to get the kill. Mewtwo can also edgeguard Ike rather effectively with a spaced bair or high/full charge shadowball.

 

[DERPFISHsaysNO]

Also, Ike's aerials/smashes in general stay out long enough for SHAD/Phase to not be a great option to take.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Are there any videos of high level Mewtwo vs Ike after the recent patch? I'd rather see it play out for myself.

Beyond that: somewhere around even, probably have arguments where each side claims they have the 55-45 edge. Very general idea is that Ike's heavy enough to tone down some of Mewtwo's cannon aspect, and has more than enough killing power/killing options to emphasize Mewtwo's glass aspect. Question is to what levels.

How do Ike's autocanceling/low landing lag, long range aerials do against Mewtwo's high speed and either good range or long lasting aspect to his aerials? How well does Ike keep Mewtwo out? Does his jab/retreating PP tilts do a good job for that if his aerials end up not working? I honestly don't have a clue, I'd need to see it play out.

Ike can probably at least scare Mewtwo in terms of edgeguarding with Eruption.

Mewtwo really wants to make sure he doesn't get grabbed. Large frame + light weight = hello Uthrow -> Fair killing stupidly early while being a true combo still.

 

[iVoltage]

Shadowball and tilts make the matchup funny, that is until you get caught. If you can keep him out your golden. But prepare yourself for a very early grave should he grab you at 70

 

[PyroTakun]

Are there any videos of high level Mewtwo vs Ike after the recent patch? I'd rather see it play out for myself.

I think there's some vids between M2K and Ryo.

I'd say it's about even.
- Mewtwo definitely has to keep Ike out and force him to approach; quick Shadowballs for zoning and N-Airs for when Ike gets too close
- Edgeguarding with a fully charged Shadowball is practically a free stock, so definitely be on the lookout for those opportunities.
- Counter will wreck F-Smash, D-Smash, and up-close Shadowballs; keep those to a minimum
- U-throw kills later on Ike, not sure of the percents though. Only go for guaranteed kills to prevent staling.

- Both characters have D-Tilt > F-Air which makes footsies fairly important.
- Catching rolls with Dash Attack or landings with U-Smash are effective kill options

- Ike's grabs are magical in this MU; U-Throw to F-Air is true and kills around 70%
- Proper spacing on N-Air and F-Air will beat out Mewtwo's aerials and weaker Shadowballs
- A good counter is practically a death sentence

Momentum plays an important role in this MU. If you have it, keep the pressure going.