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Let's Talk: Unova Pokemon League

NegaNixx

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 9, 2015
Messages
223
Location
Toronto
So I saw @ Ulevo Ulevo creating threads on different Wii U stages and thought to create one for a 3DS stage.

On the 3DS version we have 5 (+2) legal competitive stages.

Final Destination (Starter)
Battlefield (Starter)
Yoshi's Island (Starter)
Prisim Tower (Counter Pick)
Arena Ferox (Counter Pick)
Reset Bomb Forest*

While this is fine for a 3 starter stage selection, it is a popular opinion that a Full List Stage Striking system is the more fair ideal for stages and the optimal number of stages for that method is 5 (1-2-1),9 (1-2-2-2-1), or 13 (1-2-2-2-2-2-1) stages. The 3DS does not have an abundance of tournament viable stages at it's disposal. and even a liberal stage list struggles to find thirteen competitive stages, while there are also more than five accepted legal stages in the game as well, leaving us to pick 9 for FLSS purposes. At the moment there are six that would be generally accepted, leaving three more to be chosen for the list. I'm here to advocate Unova Pokemon League as a legal stage on this list.

Unova Pokemon League Research Thread By @ ParanoidDrone ParanoidDrone

Unova Pokemon league is a stage that's rocking 3 different hazards, with only 2 being able to appear during a single game, Reshiram's Fusion, Zekrom's Fusion Bolt, and N's Castle's Stairways. Of these only N's Castle is consistent among every game, while Reshiram and Zekrom change between games at random, they will never switch in the middle of a game.

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


The standard layout for the stage is the equivalent to Pokemon Stadium 2, with two equally sized and equally leveled platforms just inside the main platform's ledge. The Platforms are just high enough for Marth to reach through them with U-Tilt, and are one Mario roll length wide.


Stairs:

The Stairs are telegraphed by the castle appearing in the background, if there is no castle there is zero chance of stairs attaching themselves to the stage. They are further telegraphed by the stairs popping out of the other areas of the castle, the stage stairs will always be the last ones to attach.



These Stairs cause 10% damage to those on the ledge when they attach, takeaway the ledge and create a temporary walk-off. They KO Mario at 110% off the top with no DI. They make it so that a player recovering cannot grab the ledge is the stairs are to appear when the character is off stage, and they can be jumped through but cannot be fallen through. They give a boon to characters with exceptional ground game (e.g. Little Mac and Sonic) while slightly hindering those with strong gimping games (e.g. Pikachu, Shiek), this is temporary however and they will go away and ledge play will be available again. The stairs cannot be camped because of the other hazards on the stage.

Zekrom:

Zekrom is the Black Pokemon that shoots off the Electric Bolt. The bolt does 16% damage and is strong enough to kill Mario at 55%, but it's attack target (a part of the stage, not the characters) are telegraphed by the stage shining in that area, a considerable amount of time before the bolt hits. The bolt can hit the centre of the stage from above, either ledge from diagonally above, directly on the side of the stage from the left or right, and the bottom of the sides from diagonally left or right. The impact of the bolt shifts the stage in the appropriate direction of where the bolt landed. Pushing the stage leftwards, rightwards, downwards, or tilting the stage at roughly a 30 degree angle depending on where the bolt hit.

Centre Stage: Downwards Push
Hits the Right Ledge: Turns the stage from a 180-0 degree surface to a 150-330 degree surface
Hits the Left Ledge: Turns the stage from a 180-0 degree surface to a 210-30 degree surface
Hits the Right: Pushes the stage to the left so that the left ledge is in the magnifying glass
Hits the Left: Pushes the stage to the right so that the right ledge is in the magnifying glass
Hits the Bottom Right: Turns the stage from a 180-0 degree surface to a 210-30 degree surface
Hits the Bottom Left: Turns the stage from a 180-0 degree surface to a 150-330 degree surface

The strike breaks the stairs and thus removes the walkoffs.

The bolt, while strong is telegraphed well in advance, allowing players to dodge it consistently. It at most can reset a situation to neutral, and at least shift the stage, and promote either edge play, melee play, or horizontal kills for roughly 10 seconds.


Reshiram:

The most offensive stage hazard Unova Pokemon league has to offer. Reshiram is the White Dragon that drops my mixtape Fusion Flare throughout the stage covering any 2 of 4 (+2) areas in flames. The flames do 11% damage and kill Mario at 161% off the top with no DI. The flames are telegraphed by orbs floating to the targeted areas.

Reshiram can use Fusion Flare on any two of:
The Right Inner half of the stage, including on top of the platform and excluding below the floating platform and the ledge.
The Left Inner half of the stage, including on top of the platform and excluding below the platform and the ledge.
The Right Stairway
The Left Stairway
The Bottom Right Blastzone*
The Bottom Left Blastzone*

*Only if there is no stairway at the time Fusion Flare is used*

This can lead to:

The main stage being blocked off, safe zones being under the platforms. Temporary boon to projectile users. Temporary Stalemate, and reset to neutral.
The Right side of the stage being blocked off. Temporarily forcing CQC.
The Left side of the stage being blocked off. Temporarily forcing CQC.
The Stairways (Or bottom blast zones) being blocked off. Nothing really changes, just a more volatile stairway.

A player can also throw opponents into the fire.

Interesting Point: the 2nd (... 4th, 6th, 8th, 10th, etc...) Fusion Flare will always do the opposite of the 1st (... 3rd, 5th, 7th, 9th, etc...) flare. Allowing players to properly read where every even flare will go. If the odd flare pbefore took up the entire midfield, then the next one will take up the outer half, same with left side/right side. It's a very easily telegraphed hazard.

This stage is very versitle in how it can help different characters, through the use of its temporary walk-offs it can help ground based characters, through Zekrom it can help a plethora of characters, and while Reshiram is the only one that can cause a short stalemate, it too can aid projectile characters as well as CQC based characters, depending on where the fire chooses to land. All hazards are telegraphed well in advance, the standard platform layout is unique for this game, and it adds multiple interesting dynamics while being able to reset to neutral the odd time. I see it being a good pick for ground based fighters, or those with poor recoveries so they can use the stairs to their advantage, while the hazards present serve to mitigate the advantage.
 
Last edited:

Woohoo982

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 26, 2015
Messages
149
Location
Clobberin' dat dere Kirby
Let's ban this. Reshiram disturbs gameplay and youre able to camp where there are gaps between the flames(which i like to call Flame camping)and ive done it against CPUs. Zekrom isnt as bad although he does tilt the stage. The bridges are concerning as they can damage anyone on the ledge when they poof up and they are effectively removing the lower blast line until the dragons come along.
 

NegaNixx

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 9, 2015
Messages
223
Location
Toronto
There's a 16% chance of Flare Camping happening during a game with Reshiram present, and a 50% chance of Reshiram appearing in the first place, effectively an 8% chance.This creates a 15 second stalemate or the ability for one opponent to rack on damage, it's only in one form of the hazard (where the flames cover the middle portion of the stage entirely) and one cannot camp in any other formation. The bottom blast zone is absent for roughly 20-30 seconds. No character's main way of killing is from the bottom, the ledges appear with significant warning, in the form of the castle. Being hit by the ledges is like staying on the ground when Prisim Tower lifts off. Getting hit by them is player error and can be prepared for before the hit actually happens.
 

Ulevo

Smash Master
Joined
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Messages
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Yo. Obviously I'm not involved in this in anyway, but I'd suggest adding a poll if possible as it helps to gather consensus on how the stage is received.
 

ぱみゅ

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Let's ban this. Reshiram disturbs gameplay and youre able to camp where there are gaps between the flames(which i like to call Flame camping)and ive done it against CPUs. Zekrom isnt as bad although he does tilt the stage. The bridges are concerning as they can damage anyone on the ledge when they poof up and they are effectively removing the lower blast line until the dragons come along.
All of those are tame. Flame camping lasts for very few seconds and the flames themselves doesn't really do much damage, "damaging people on the ledge" is dumb because the background lets you know when the bridges will come, and "removing the lower blastzone isn't even a real argument.

The most concerning part about this stage is the (small) chance of a player being caught under the stage while the bridges remove the ledge. And even then, it comes with a pretty fair warning.
 

DarkLiquid43

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 23, 2015
Messages
1
I'm not going to be very productive because I'm not a stage analyst,
Although he and some in the comments make very good points and I'd agree to let the stage be legal,
that got damn mix tape little insert had me Rollin. XD
 

Nah

Smash Champion
Joined
May 31, 2015
Messages
2,167
Unova Pokemon League would be a great stage if Reshiram didn't light half the damn stage on fire. Only thing holding it back really.
 

ParanoidDrone

Smash Master
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Messages
4,335
Location
Baton Rouge, LA
Unova Pokemon League would be a great stage if Reshiram didn't light half the damn stage on fire. Only thing holding it back really.
This is true. Depending on how Reshiram feels, it can be a major nuisance to basically negligible. Quite annoying.

Zekrom isn't nearly as hard to deal with.
 

ぱみゅ

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Reshiram's fire lasts for few seconds though, I have no problem waiting it out.
There are no projectiles that hit far and can't be easily avoided/shielded.
:196:
 

ParanoidDrone

Smash Master
Joined
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Messages
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Reshiram's fire lasts for few seconds though, I have no problem waiting it out.
There are no projectiles that hit far and can't be easily avoided/shielded.
:196:
If the stage decides that it hates the players, it can have Reshiram wait until the stairs are receding then blanket literally the entire stage in flame minus some small patches under each platform. This is pretty rare, though, and I'd agree that most if not all other possible occurrences are quite manageable.
 
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