Instant(-ish) Dash Reset, aka MEGADASHDANCE™

[br8k]

If you hold A (as if you were pivot walking) and get into a full run (past dashdance window), and then flick the C-stick downwards, you'll restart your dash, putting you back in the dashdancable phase. Then you can immediately dash in the opposite direction. Meaning out of a full run, you can start a dash in the opposite direction in, like, 2 or 3 frames. Basically, it's an easy way to do a frame perfect Run > Crouch > Dash forward > Dash-dance in opposite direction.

Has this been found before? It seems like it would be extremely useful since you can run for a while and then suddenly start dash dancing. Or run at an opponent and then suddenly dash back and pivot f-tilt, which is... probably a bit faster than WD f-tilt, or at least a confusing (but much more difficult) mixup, visually. :v

And it gives Bowser an actual dash-dance sort of. It gives everyone the option of an infinitely-long dash-dance with a slower-than-a-legitimate-dashdance-but-faster-than-regular turnaround. You have to prepare a few frames earlier for the turnaround but it seems like it gives better baiting options to characters like Ike who don't have great dash dances... at least compared to characters like Marf.

If you have frame-perfect timing with the backwards dash input, you do a perfect moonwalk instead. Perfect moonwalk out of full run.

Captain Falcon and Snake both duck their heads during the very start of their dash animation, meaning the hold A + c-down input can be used as a way to duck head-height lasers while approaching at a full dash. Which looks absurdly cool if you can pull it off (and the projectile is at just the right height) but is probably ultimately inferior to just crouching out of the dash and then dashing again quickly

 

[AcousticAdrian]

Also, you can perform a retreating pivot grab out of a dash with this.

 

[SpiderMad]

I'ma try your take on it out sometime when my arms are better, but yeah the A held and C-stick thing was possibly known in Brawl or when I got Canadian secrets on it to make this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjpvlB8pMPQ

It probably has a lot more uses we don't know yet

Oh, and if nobody cares to in another year or so I'll make it myself, but a list of the characters it's possible to MW with the trick is something that'd be cool (and possibly rank them in difficulty in someway?). I use to think Falco and Wolf weren't able to use the trick (with Wolf being even harder) but it seems I was able to (though not long enough with Wolf with to put into this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJDkfjFr1F0 cus of how hard it is with him to get past a few)

 

[br8k]

I'ma try your take on it out sometime when my arms are better, but yeah the A held and C-stick thing was possibly known in Brawl or when I got Canadian secrets on it to make this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjpvlB8pMPQ

It probably has a lot more uses we don't know yet

Oh, and if nobody cares to in another year or so I'll make it myself, but a list of the characters it's possible to MW with the trick is something that'd be cool (and possibly rank them in difficulty in someway?). I use to think Falco and Wolf weren't able to use the trick (with Wolf being even harder) but it seems I was able to (though not long enough with Wolf with to put into this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJDkfjFr1F0 cus of how hard it is with him to get past a few)

The guy in that first vid makes using A for the trick look so much harder than it is. Just claw. :v And he mentions the dash reset as "Weird crouch skips while running by pressing down on the C-stick," meaning that he probably didn't realize that it completely resets the dash and allows dashdancing and quick turnarounds.

 

[SpiderMad]

Didn't he claw later on in the video before the snake clip? Like in this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYU3BSq_OCw

 

[roman5hero]

you can also use this to moonwalk endlessly. hold a moonwalk keep tanalog stick held backwards and flick the c stick forward to dash which will just make you do another moonwalk.

 

[SpiderMad]

you can also use this to moonwalk endlessly. hold a moonwalk keep tanalog stick held backwards and flick the c stick forward to dash which will just make you do another moonwalk.

Where did you learn about that

 

[roman5hero]

Where did you learn about that

some YouTube video. i can try to find the link if you want

edit found it Consecutive MoonWalk Trick [P:M]: http://youtu.be/fjpvlB8pMPQ

 

[AcousticAdrian]

I think the blanket technique could be called C-Dashing. Since you are technically using the C-Stick to start another dash, you could just say "C-Dashed into a Dash Dance" when you want to refer specifically to dash dancing out of a C-Dash. For the Auto Moonwalk, you could either say C-Dashed Moonwalk, or give it a unique name like C-MoonWalking if you prefer.

 

[AcousticAdrian]

Oh, you also forgot to mention that C-Dashing is the quickest way to Foxtrot. =P

 

[SixSaw]

This has mad potential.

Some thoughts/ observations:
-Pressing up on the cstick instead of down makes your character do the end-of-run skid which can be canceled with a dash at any time. This might be useful for feints/mixups.
-Similarly, doing a cdash 'super-foxtrot' makes it really easy to alter and mix up your speed with the control stick since you don't have to be inputting every individual dash with it.
-Some characters (Most noticeably Ike. Ganon, Samus, and Falco are others I've observed) move slightly faster by cdash super-foxtrotting with proper timing than running normally. For most it's the same/ very slightly slower (Sonic's however is much slower)
-Pressing attack during a wavedash is a safe and easy way to set up for cdashing.

Edit: Discovered something else: if you do a cdash, then immediately dash backwards and hit forward on the cstick, you will start charging an fsmash.

Edit2: I now realize this is just a more convoluted pivot fsmash.

 

[br8k]

Pressing attack during a wavedash is a safe and easy way to set up for cdashing.

Ooh smart, definitely going to use this.

an fsmash out of full run with maybe 1-3 frames of delay (coining the term "cdash cancel fsmash"). Pretty neat.

But couldn't you just do a regular crouch-canceled c-stick f-smash if you wanted an f-smash out of a full run? Add Z if you want to charge it.

I should make a video of Ike MEGADASHDANCING™ (aka c-dancing aka longdancing). Maybe the lack of a video is why the 370 viewers haven't grasped the significance of this. I haven't actually had an opportunity to play since finding this so I can't test the significance of it myself but it seems like it surely adds a great option to the baiting game, especially for characters that have slow or short wavedashes such that wavedashing backwards isn't as great of a baiting option.

 

[SixSaw]

But couldn't you just do a regular crouch-canceled c-stick f-smash if you wanted an f-smash out of a full run? Add Z if you want to charge it.

lol I didn't know about this. Yeah that's a lot easier.

 

[AcousticAdrian]

I found another useful technique earlier today.

As you might already know, shielding during your dash start up will cause you to immediately stop in place and shield, instead of sliding like you would if you were shielding while in your dash.

So, by flicking the c-stick down and then shielding, you will immediately stop in place and put up your shield.

This would be useful for mixing your approach, mind games, and a safer method of baiting attacks with your shield. It would also be safer vs. grabs, because you can stop just outside of an opponents grab range. To do that with a regular dash shield, you would have to slide just outside of range, giving your opponent more time to react. With c-shielding, you would be near instantly stopping in front of them with your shield. If they wiff a grab or attack your shield (if they have the range) you can wavedash in for a punish. If they wavedash away from you, they are yielding more space to you. The quick little duck you make when you c-dash is also a mind game in the sense that an attentive opponent has to make a decision very quickly--is he going to shield? Is he going to start dash dancing? Is he trying to feint me out? This adds more options when approaching your opponent or trying to gain space.

 

[SixSaw]

I used this vs m2k yesterday and it made him visibly confused. lol

 

[AcousticAdrian]

What Tournament?

 

[SixSaw]

Friendlies at Wavedash Wednesday in Oak Park IL

 

[Kankato]

Friendlies at Wavedash Wednesday in Oak Park IL

What did he have to say about [Insert Technique Name Here]?

 

[SixSaw]

What did he have to say about [Insert Technique Name Here]?

Nothing really. I ran at him from one end of BF to the other, cdashed and started dashdancing. He was like "what?" under his breath and kinda paused for a second, then resumed bopping me. I guess it didn't occur to me to say anything at the time and iirc we were interrupted midway through the match so he probably still doesn't know about it.

 

[Kankato]

Nothing really. I ran at him from one end of BF to the other, cdashed and started dashdancing. He was like "what?" under his breath and kinda paused for a second, then resumed bopping me. I guess it didn't occur to me to say anything at the time and iirc we were interrupted midway through the match so he probably still doesn't know about it.

Mm. I'm curious just how powerful this tech is. It's a cool addition to Project M and it has mad potential, but I don't want it to be removed because it's an accident or something. I know m2k has tons of knee-jerk reactions to things, but a high level player opinion would be nice.

 

[DJ _ICE]

Hey, wavedashing was pretty much an accident. It would be cool to see this change P:M as wavedashing did for Melee

 

[210stuna]

Waiting for a PMBR member to confirm this before adjusting accordingly.

 

[Mansta]

All that's going through my mind by reading this thread is all the Luigi shenanigans I can try.

 

[ItsRainingGravy]

This is a very interesting technique. I'm not really sure how strong the technique would be for certain characters when people master it, though it could be extremely scary in the hands of a skilled Fox player. For now, I would like to see the technique be kept though.

It even fits comfortably with my control scheme too, as I use R button for attack (DACUS reasons). Now I have yet another reason to have one of my shoulder buttons set to attack, for the time being anyways.

 

[br8k]

Not sure if I dislike c-dashing for being too much of a change from the "predictability" of Melee, or like c-dashing for giving Project M some extra uniqueness and a further reason to be considered as a completely seperate entity.

I mean... given how important reads and predictability are, I'm not sure I like the existence of a technique that gives running even less commitment, but hey, if this didn't exist, everyone would eventually just perfect up that thing Cactuar "found" recently.* This is just a cheat code for doing that exact same thing faster and with less effort.

*it's not actually a new thing, and leffen was definitely using it before Cactuar was, but it's certainly an underexploited thing.

 

[Spralwers]

Just another detail to add: you can transition from running to moonwalking very easily with this. As soon as you hit C stick down during the run, immediately do the moonwalk motion with the controller. And then like mentioned above, you can keep flicking the c stick in the direction your character is facing to get those repeated moonwalks. This is so much fun and I don't think I'll be able to play characters that can't moonwalk for a while

 

[sushifreAk]

Hella cool find, Strider. Love the name. It's catchy.

 

[1FD]

sexy thang there

Strider is a nice name for it!

 

[GaretHax]

Uh... Doesn't this have the potential to be more over-centralizing than dashdancing was to begin with? IDK, this doesn't really scream "keeper" to me.

 

[DrinkingFood]

No
it doesn't
it's still slower than an actual dash dance pivot by 3+ frames
It would be two (one for crouch, one for the dash forward preceding the dash backwards), but almost nobody can consistently do a frame perfect dash-pivot-backwards dash
It also requires you to move your finger down to the cstick, so moving it back up to act out of the dash is slower than minimum reaction time.
So it's not quite as easy to cancel into, say, a JC grab.

 

[1FD]

It's lulzy for sure.
Couldn't do anything with it, but could do it easy enough. ha

 

[GaretHax]

No
it doesn't
it's still slower than an actual dash dance pivot by 3+ frames
It would be two (one for crouch, one for the dash forward preceding the dash backwards), but almost nobody can consistently do a frame perfect dash-pivot-backwards dash
It also requires you to move your finger down to the cstick, so moving it back up to act out of the dash is slower than minimum reaction time.
So it's not quite as easy to cancel into, say, a JC grab.

It is faster than wavedashing, which was pretty much the only grounded option left after going into a dash animation, and also leads to a neutral character state, that's kind of a big deal in a game already ruled by dashdancing.