Ike's quick-draw problems.

[nickasstar]

I'm maining Ike, and lately I've noticed in for Glory that if I hit someone mid-air with quick-draw I'll go in a helpless state. I don't think this is what used to happen? Because on smash wiki it states: "Quick Draw no longer leaves Ike in a helpless state when it hits the foe, has less landing lag overall, and covers a greater distance."

So is this intended now, or a ninja nerf? Or did it just bug?

 

[_Magus_]

No, it does leave him in a helpless state. What's different is that now, if Ike hits someone with a side b who's onstage, he'll still grab the ledge. In brawl, quick draw was very vulnerable due to the fact that Ike could be gimped by having someone jump into his path.

 

[Jasudin]

Hasn't happened to me. I'll test this and get back to you.

 

[nickasstar]

No, it does leave him in a helpless state. What's different is that now, if Ike hits someone with a side b who's onstage, he'll still grab the ledge. In brawl, quick draw was very vulnerable due to the fact that Ike could be gimped by having someone jump into his path.

Hmm makes sense, but if I recall correctly, I've used Aether in an instance where my quick-draw got interrupted mid-air and I was able to recover after. This doesn't happen a lot so my memory might just be hazy..

 

[_Magus_]

Hmm makes sense, but if I recall correctly, I've used Aether in an instance where my quick-draw got interrupted mid-air and I was able to recover after. This doesn't happen a lot so my memory might just be hazy..

No, that's normal. If you get hit during any recovery move that would put you in helpless, you get out of helpless and can act again. This goes for any move that would put you in helpless, not just Ike's moves.

 

[nickasstar]

No, that's normal. If you get hit during any recovery move that would put you in helpless, you get out of helpless and can act again. This goes for any move that would put you in helpless, not just Ike's moves.

Yes, I know for a fact that if someone hits you during quick-draw you won't be in a helpless state anymore. But the same thing should happen if you hit someone with your quick-draw in mid-air, it shouldn't go in helpless state, but for me it does.

 

[Yoh]

After you hit hit someone with QD offstage you can still use your second jump if you have it.
If you already lost your second jump, you can still use Aether or QD again, altough often this won´t be enough without jump.

 

[Arrei]

I could be wrong, but I think there's a limited time window after swinging to input your next move - I do recall once becoming helpless when trying to Aether after a swing, but at the time I just assumed I couldn't wait that long.

Although if memory serves, Ike didn't have the usual helpless flashing when that happened, he just drifted down and blew up.

 

[Lavani]

I don't play this character, but after brief testing in training it looks like you have a fair window where you're able to do things after hitting with Quick Draw midair, and if you fail to do anything in that timeframe you end up in helpless again.

Seems that hitting an opponent standing on the ledge of FD leaves you until a little after being off the bottom of the screen before you end up in helpless.

If you hit high with Quick Draw and want to delay your jump/upB, I'd suggest air dodging after the hit.

 

[san.]

There is a time limit to respond. As those above said, jump, air dodge, aether, etc.

 

[nickasstar]

I don't play this character, but after brief testing in training it looks like you have a fair window where you're able to do things after hitting with Quick Draw midair, and if you fail to do anything in that timeframe you end up in helpless again.

Seems that hitting an opponent standing on the ledge of FD leaves you until a little after being off the bottom of the screen before you end up in helpless.

If you hit high with Quick Draw and want to delay your jump/upB, I'd suggest air dodging after the hit.

Ohhhhh, this explains everything! Thank you somuch.

 

[nickasstar]

Thanks all for the fast replies. I'll step up my game with Ike

 

[MaximalGFX]

Sure! Buff fox and falco side-B to give them total controller after the attack and only let Ike act out of his if he hit someone and input a command in the following few frames after the hit. The balance in this game make no sense, Ike needs it a lot more than the spacies.

 

[san.]

Quick draw has the potential to go much farther by itself so it's not that bad of a tradeoff.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

One major problem is that Quick Draw gets outprioritized by a LOT of things, including Bowser's Fair. They can gimp you just by trading with you, rendering your horizontal recovery a dangerous option.

 

[Arrei]

It's not that it gets outprioritized, but that aerials are never canceled so getting traded is always a risk for any horizontal recovery. That's why Ike has to mix up his recoveries and stay unpredictable, and a charged QD from higher up is perfect for that.

 

[Mariofan13]

There are also some gltiches, including Quickdraw.:

• If you hit Pacman and while being still in the qickdraw animation you get pushed off the ledge by his fire hydrant's water shot, you will enter the helpless state. The same thing occurs with other windboxes.
• Sometimes you will miss the ledge and Quickdraw directly "into" the stage and fall down to the bottom blast line. This occurs especially on stages like Battlefield and Kongo Jungel (N64) with "glitchy" ledges.
• Normally, you cannot fall off a platform with an onstage Quickdraw because Ike stops at the ledge. In some cases, like when one floor in Wrecking Crew disapperas and ths Stage falls down, Ike doesn't stop at the ledge, enters helpless animation and dies.
• In Trophy Rush, if you use an airial/offstage Qickdraw, you will sometimes fall through the stage and die.