Ice climbers vs falco

[cavesonic13]

Ok wel i fought Tyderium of Lvl 10, and I kept beating him in matches...he got frustrated and everything, but then he used pillars and kept using it to ill me, i couldnt get out of it so i lost after, is there any good way ice climbers can get out of the pillar falco move?

 

[CORRUPTiON]

Gah I hate the pillar also. Hits you so fast you dunno if it's you or your nana. Could anyone help us on this?

 

[cavesonic13]

People keep telling me to DI but it doesnt work Falco can switch his speed of attacking everytime! Its anoying!

 

[Bloodvein]

Yeah, the pillar is really annoying. Whenever I play my friend's Falco with IC and he starts pillaring to try and win, I just play defensive by playing grab game and chaingrabbing with the D throw to D air combo, and that pisses him off. But when you're caught in the pillar, I don't know what else to do, either. It is annoying. x.x

 

[cavesonic13]

I can fight and everything I have to stay away from him but once my opposing smasher gets me into the pillar I can't get out, its just like your dead, and when your dead your like 100% and higher, its just lame lol!

 

[pockyD]

just to be clear, pillar is a shield pressure technique where they shuffle dair to shine against your shield, not the shine-dair combo

 

[cavesonic13]

I know that! Its just once I am in it! I cant get out of it!

 

[viperboy_74]

this is the most ******** match in the history of match ups...



IC's >>>>>>>>>>>>>> falco

that is all

<3 trail

 

[cavesonic13]

Well I know ice lcimbers are better than Falco cause i can kick other falco's but when they dont use shine combos and stuff, Grabbing is like falcos death! Followed up by some mind games and D Smash

 

[romeo619]

against agressive falco's blizzard with nana when he jumps in with a dair, then grab when he's stunned.

 

[cavesonic13]

I get him in the blizzard chain grab combo, thats when i get to do around 50-80% damage so yeah I know that once he gets to 50 or above a lte nana Down smash

 

[South_Paw]

.... just shield-grab him... since there are two of you it slows falcos fast falling and therefore ruins his l-cancel...

 

[Buddha]

combo combo combo.
utilt.
blizzard + ice blocks >> SHL gayness.
waveshield.
edgeguard ftw.
guaranteed nana dair chains.
don't be stupid = win.

jeeze, what else do you need?

---p.s. you technically can't be hit by pillaring. but who cares... i hate that blue chickenwing and his gay homoshining life partner.

 

[CORRUPTiON]

Can't shield grab 'cause the D air moves you back a little so you get out of range. Sure, you could then try wavegrabbing out of the shield, but the l-cancel makes that really difficult. You can't start your desynced ice blocks 'cause of his annoying laser. Edgegaurding isn't the problem, it's getting him off the edge. Of course CGs are good. What if the Falco is just too **** fast, doing SHL to grabs, pillar combos and such. If you know so much, help. Don't just blow us off.

 

[Delphiki]

Somehow all of you managed to cover the entire IC vs Falco match up without answering the ONLY QUESTION he asked: How can I escape from Falco's pillaring?

The answer is DIing correctly and teching. I think DIing down and to either direction would be the most effective. If you can hit the ground before the Falco does you can tech and escape. Also if you go to either side the Falco has a 50/50 shot at predicting which direction you will go, just as long as you keep it mixed up. Don't always DI the same direction or they will catch on very quickly. But this is not definite, I usually use my Pichu against Tyde, and yesterday when he played my ICs he didn't pillar me often at all, no more than a couple times.

Also it may be possible to sneak out an uair just as he is coming down, or a bair as he is coming up, but I haven't tried either of these so don't take my word for it.

 

[cavesonic13]

THANKS YOU! LOL! DELPHIKI! Thanks for freaking answering my question, all these people think i am a major noob and say all this crap, I was getting tired f this post......

Thanks Dlephiki maybe I get to smash with you this Saturday or some other day! thanks though,

to everyone else who posted: thanks but no thanks

 

[nealdt]

You can't DI Falco's dair downwards. You can't DI any move in the same direction it sends you.

 

[cavesonic13]

It's worth the friggin try!

 

[pockyD]

he's saying physically can't, try all you want and it won't change anything... it's essentially the same as not DI-ing at all (which would get you to the ground faster than DI-ing left or right)

 

[Delphiki]

Yeah, I forgot about that. Thanks neal.

 

[mood4food77]

well pillaring, try jumping and hitting nair with nana (or dair since they are the fast aerials the ICs have), right after he dairs, to me it's the only way to prevent yourself from getting into the drillshine combo, getting out of it now, just constantly change your DI from left to right, it won't last too long because of your floatiness, just try to stick with the HO as much as possible

 

[AzN_Lep]

Just be patient... After Falco shffls a d-air and shines he has only a few options. He can short hop to JC his shine, full hop to JC his shine, WD outta shine, JC grab, or just sit there and look dumb. If the Falco SHs he's likely going to come down with another d-air, take this opportunity to u-tilt, that'll lead to a grab. If he full hops, you can follow him up with u-air to b-air depending on dmg. If fhe does any of the last 3 (WD, JCgrab, or sit there) just d-smash. He can only grab one of you, assuming you ahve both IC. Chances are you're just being flustered by his speed, take some time to analyze your options and act accordingly.

 

[NJzFinest]

Falco's downthrow is pretty nice on IC. It separates them and setups up for a free smash attack or w/e. Basically, keep shielding and avoid being laser grabbed. Falco isn't that bad vs IC as most people think. M2K told me space animals>>> IC
Also keep in mind that Falco can DI out of the down throw + D-air CG

 

[mood4food77]

that's why there's the reverse dair CT which is really hard to DI out of

 

[meepxzero]

careless falcos are easy to beat its the careful ones that are hard. You cant punish falco if he spaces fsmashes and you cant really di the pillar your best bet is to avoid it. Like nj said if the falco has ic practice he will smash di ur cg and make the match only 10 times harder and reverse cg doesnt work on falco im afraid.

 

[N1c2k3]

Mood4Food: I don't think you've been correct on any statements you made in the past 3 threads I've seen. 1. This isn't a cg thread. You can't say, "Avoid getting pillared by cg'ing." 2. You can't DI down, as Neal stated. That's just ********. 3. Yes, you can shield grab Falco after his dair, easily, but obvioiusly only if he's in range. (I believe he can space it.) 4. Falco is better than IC, period. I know you didn't say all that but I didn't feel like addressing the author of each...

 

[DynamicDuo]

I can beat Falco's but still..........

 

[cavesonic13]

I can beat Falco's now... lol

 

[Wobbles]

One way to avoid being pillared is light shielding. It has numerous effects that can make your life a lot easier:

1: It pushes you way the heck away from Falco. This means he can't pressure your shield in the same manner without attempting to approach again.

2: It ensures that neither you or Nana will get hit with a d-air at the top of your shield.

3: On a platformed level, it will usually push you underneath a platform where your iceblocks can be more effective. To stop a Falco from even approaching in ways that you don't like, if you fire iceblocks at the right height, you can stay beneath a platform while putting your iceblocks on top of it. The space controlled by this technique helps keep Falco from shffl'ing at you, which in turn means he won't be able to pillar you. Prevention is the best medicine, yeah?

4: Another way to stop his approach at all is to run into lasers and dash attack. By dashing you put Nana at a distance behind you where she can't get hit by the laser. If you dash attack into a laser, you will get hit but Nana will not, and she will execute the attack anyhow. If you time this correctly, you can often catch Falco out of his short hopped aerial or his next laser.

5: If all else fails, roll. It puts some space between you and Falco and allows you to de-sync if you so choose. If the Falco is familiar with your IC's at all, then he'll know that charging into a blizzard is a bad idea so he might be afraid enough to give you the space you desire.

6: I thought that you can DI WITH an attack provided you don't use the exact same angle. For instance, Falco's d-air sends you down with a little horizontal motion as well. DI'ing straight down is not the same vector so wouldn't you actually still influence the attack's trajectory?

 

[Delphiki]

I think that's right about the DI, but maybe only for SDI/ASDI. You can S/ASDI any direction as long as it isn't exactly parallel. I think I spelled parallel wrong. 0_o

Oh and Cave.....Tyderium is very afraid of ICs now ^_^. He was almost happy losing to DRGN instead of losing to me ^_^.

 

[choknater]

smash DI, DI, light shielding... all great advice. if you guys are discussing escaping pillars then i'll let yall continue.

honestly though, i'd rather prevent pillars so that i wouldn't have to escape them. i realized how much trouble it is when i played the snap, so i know where you're coming from cavesonic. it's really difficult. if you have trouble escaping, here's some tips from preventing pillars:

- falco's horizontal movement is obviously inferior to ic's (unless he is a ridiculously good wavelander, which is rare.) space him with ice blocks. the lasers are only there to set you up, and if he spams, you will outdamage his lasers if you spam back and hit him with blocks. needless to say, this usually stops him from using lasers (even if for a little while, it gives you a lot of breathing room)

- keep his dairs in front of you. if he dairs behind you then you can't shield grab him, simple as that. be aware of his approaches and remember that your uair and forward smash will beat out his dair.

obviously we all play against falco differently and we've all played against different types of falcos (greatest kudos to Wobbles who plays against Forward often, his advice is probably the best.) just remember that Falco is killed SO EASILY with ic. death combos can be started at any point in the match. just be confident in avoiding pillars and spikes and you will be perfectly fine. in my opinion, falco is ic's easiest matchup.. easier than sheik.

to cave: if you have trouble with tyderium, try playing some other falco players here in norcal that will help you out. if you get the chance, here's some examples: kfc and dm are unique players with unique falcos. jimbo from uc merced plays VERY strangely and you will learn a LOT about playing against falco from his unorthodox style. zoap is great with many characters, falco is one of them. the snap's falco is really stylish and awesome. falcomist is FAST... i beat him but i'm pretty sure he was NOT trying his best that day. bob$ was the most challenging one i played but i still managed to 3-stock him once.

i've never played their falco's, but i'm sure the germ and zel are also amazing. i think sac biweeklies always pull in at least ONE of these falco players. they'll help you a lot if you keep having trouble with tyde... crewmembers always pose problems because they read your mind lol.

hope that helped cave ^_^

EDIT: seriously lmao if you ever get to play jimbo, SEIZE THE OPPORTUNITY. he will very likely come to modesto on the 17th if you wanna come down. his falco is extremely... ridiculously... strange. ever since beating him at a TGE a while back i have not lost more than 50% to ANY falco player.

 

[cavesonic13]

O.o OMG thats good stuff thanks chok >.< love you!!! and Park!!!

 

[DynamicDuo]

ic r the shizzle XD

 

[Dory..?]

Ok wel i fought Tyderium of Lvl 10, and I kept beating him in matches...he got frustrated and everything, but then he used pillars and kept using it to ill me, i couldnt get out of it so i lost after, is there any good way ice climbers can get out of the pillar falco move?

Just on a personal experiance, i use the blizzard to reset their combo or even the spin just to stop it and throw them off..........it also comes in handy sometimes when being bumbarded with Fairs from marth.........