Violence is on sale today - Anna for DLC! * Waiting for new stock! Bear with us here! *

[Noler_Mass]

Wow you really are a **** you know that. Read my ****ing argument I'd be happy to debate this further.

**** maybe this means you agree with me but you can't admit it cause you are so full of yourself.

 

[Curious Villager]

Noler_Mass. Can you provide us a source that Jigglypuff was kept "because she was in the first game". Is this really a reason that came from Sakurai's own mouth or is this just an assumption made by the fans themselves? Just asking.

 

[Deleted member]

Nothing more than an assumption.
A logical assumption, but an assumption just the same.

Though the fact that Ness was originally going to be scrapped in Melee and the fact Jigglypuff was a low priority character in Brawl shows that being in the original game isn't an automatic safe haven.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Noler_Mass. Can you provide us a source that Jigglypuff was kept "because she was in the first game". Is this really a reason that came from Sakurai's own mouth or is this just an assumption made by the fans themselves? Just asking.

It can be deducted. I'm not sure if he said anything on the matter in fact hell anything regarding the 7 and the last three added is assumption, but it seems pretty clear that since jigglypuff is no longer popular in the series, she was in brawl due to her veteran state.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Nothing more than an assumption.
A logical assumption, but an assumption just the same.

Though the fact that Ness was originally going to be scrapped in Melee and the fact Jigglypuff was a low priority character in Brawl shows that being in the original game isn't an automatic safe haven.

Honestly from the bottom of my heart thankyou for agreeing with me on something. And just clearing things up I did not say that being in the first game made it certain I am aware that jigglypuff was nearly scrapped but the fact that jigglypuff was in the first game likely gave her preference over mewtwo who was only in Melee.

 

[Deleted member]

Jigglypuff was one of two characters that took the least amount of effort to add to Brawl (the other was G&W).
Jigglypuff is pretty much a dolled-up import of Melee's model and animations (painfully obvious when you look at the Air Dodge animation).

Despite this, she was low priority of a character. It says something when a lazy addition is also a deliberately late addition.
Being in the first game means nothing. Otherwise Jigglypuff would not have been low priority in the first place.

 

[Speculator]

Though the fact that Ness was originally going to be scrapped in Melee and the fact Jigglypuff was a low priority character in Brawl shows that being in the original game isn't an automatic safe haven.

Actually I'd say it probably is, now at least. If they had gone ahead and scrapped Ness in Melee then of course it wouldn't be so, but Ness staying indirectly maintained a number of "perfect attendance" characters - there was even an event match in Brawl outlining them as such. I don't like calling anything a guarantee, but I'd say the original 64 fighters are pretty safe for the time being.

 

[Deleted member]

Ness might as well be safe at this point due to him staying alongside his previously intended replacement.

However, Jigglypuff is still up in the air (no pun intended). If she was low priority before, she'll likely be low priority again.

Although this is kind of straying from Anna at this point....

 

[loganhogan]

Anna not having a sticker in Brawl is by no means a fair assumption to mark against her traditional standing. The argument itself is highly questionable. Diddy Kong the second most iconic DK character lacked a trophy in Melee and the same applied to several other important characters. The advantage she has now is the interest of the developing Fire Emblem team. In the past they've always had her around and involved but now she is much more developed, displayed, and evolved than ever. They've elevated her involvement in the series that it's not impossible they could take a step forward and want to represent the only permanent character of the series.

 

[Curious Villager]

Basically the point is that we had a character who was minor compared to other characters from its series becoming playable in smash bros before. And that is Jigglypuff. Yes she had a number of episodes where she sang everyone to sleep in the anime. But she was still minor compared to the likes of Meowth and Mewtwo. Yet she was made playable in smash before these two. (Heck Meowth has yet to make a playable appearance in smash)

If Jigglypuff managed to become playable in smash despite being a "minor" character. Then so can Anna. Heck so can other "minor" characters too who are popular. Such as Toad (although he has been playing larger roles lately, just like Anna actually.) and (Yes I'm totally going there) Waluigi!

 

[Speculator]

Ness might as well be safe at this point due to him staying alongside his previously intended replacement.

However, Jigglypuff is still up in the air (no pun intended). If she was low priority before, she'll likely be low priority again.

Although this is kind of straying from Anna at this point....

True.
Have we discussed healing abilities yet? I know Anna is able to heal other units in Awakening. I understand that Project M gives Ivysaur some healing abilities, does anyone have any experience with that? I would think there would be balance issues or something with people running off to camp and heal up.

 

[Deleted member]

If done right, it can be feasible.
If done wrong, it can be broken.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Anna not having a sticker in Brawl is by no means a fair assumption to mark against her traditional standing. The argument itself is highly questionable. Diddy Kong the second most iconic DK character lacked a trophy in Melee and the same applied to several other important characters. The advantage she has now is the interest of the developing Fire Emblem team. In the past they've always had her around and involved but now she is much more developed, displayed, and evolved than ever. They've elevated her involvement in the series that it's not impossible they could take a step forward and want to represent the only permanent character of the series.

Don't quote me on this but I assume the reason diddy wouldn't have a trophy in Melee is because they generally ripped models from other games for trophies, and all the models that diddy had made were clunky compared to melees graphics. Brawl is a bit different though because I assume that stickers were in part added so they could pay homage to characters that they didn't have models for. If Anna were popular they would've ripped her picture straight from the game and made her a sticker. But since she wasn't that popular, they didn't.

And while minor characters can make these kind of games, they sure as hell shouldn't. Straying away from other topics, no matter how popular Anna is there is clearly many more popular fire emblem characters from fire embelm. The jigglypuff argument is irrelevant since jiggly is a veteran and during Melee her chances were much higher than Anna's are now. At that point the pokemons popularity was a bit harder to predict and we don't even know whether sakurai took the anime in account at all or not. Anna on the other hand, clearly has Marth, Ike, Roy, Chrom, Lucina, lyn, and robin at least in her way and I could name many more that are debatably more popular or at least more relevant.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Don't quote me on this but I assume the reason diddy wouldn't have a trophy in Melee is because they generally ripped models from other games for trophies, and all the models that diddy had made were clunky compared to melees graphics. Brawl is a bit different though because I assume that stickers were in part added so they could pay homage to characters that they didn't have models for. If Anna were popular they would've ripped her picture straight from the game and made her a sticker. But since she wasn't that popular, they didn't.

Melee actually had a huge chunk of trophies with models made just for the game(including Mach rider, Pit, that Ayumi chick, and Tamagon). It's Brawl that mostly used model rips.

 

[Curious Villager]

That was in Brawl where they ripped models from other games. In Melee I believe they actually made them themselves.

The thing is though that the stickers were mainly official art and not the sprites. Maybe there were a few sprites ripped here and there. But they were mainly official art. Plus it doesn't really matter if a character didn't show up as a trophy or sticker before. Diddy Kong and some other characters never had a trophy in Melee either yet they still managed to become playable in Brawl.

I actually wouldn't mind playing as Anna and Toad even if they are "minor" reoccuring characters. Their popular and many people like them. So I don't see why they can't become playable. And I wouldn't count out the Jigglypuff argument yet because I was mainly talking about her in terms of smash 64. And honestly, (besides Marth and Ike) Anna really has Chrom and/or Lucina to worry about. Maybe Lyn and Roy as well. But I don't really see it anymore with them. Honestly, I don't see why we can't have a roster consisting of Marth, Ike, Chrom/Lucina and Anna. If they are going to expand a fifth slot and give one to Fire Emblem as well. Then throw in Roy/Lyn as well. But that's just me really.

Anyway. I'm going to bed. It's getting really late now. I'll carry this discussion on later. (If it still continues) See ya.

 

[Sunnysunny]

Oh?
So has anyone suggested Anna's up-b being the "Rescue" staff yet~?

Because that should be a thing.

However, Jigglypuff is still up in the air (no pun intended).

-DEAD-

 

[ssbHex]

It doesn't matter if Chrom/Lucina/Flavour of the month Lord is more popular, or "relevant" than Anna. Her biggest chance of getting in this game is due to something else entirely. I've said this before, but I honestly think Anna is the solution to all of Sakurai's problems(in regards to Fire Emblem, anyway).

Adding her to SSB would promote her to iconic status if she isn't already. This could convince Intelligent Systems to continue to include her in every FE game, further strengthening her legacy, and then we've got a great cycle going on. The reason Sakurai would want to do this, is because then he doesn't have to worry about a new FE character every Smash game and who to replace if he needs to. Adding the newest Lord is more of a trap for Sakurai than anything, because no one likes cutting characters for new ones.

If he just had, say, Marth, Anna, and maybe Roy or Ike or both, he wouldn't have to worry about that anymore. I honestly think Anna is the answer to all his problems, lol.

Pokemon on the other hand would be his next biggest problem, probably. But for the time being he could just add Mewtwo(considering he would also serve the role of a gen 6 rep in some ways), and call it a day.

So, Sakurai is being handed a way out for both of these series if he chooses to take it. I hope he does.

 

[FalKoopa]

I see that the discussion didn't turn ugly. Phew...

If Anna were popular they would've ripped her picture straight from the game and made her a sticker. But since she wasn't that popular, they didn't.

You do realize that no one gave a **** about the stickers? I believe that who appears as a sticker/trophy depends more on the whim of the developers and less about character popularity.

I do agree that she has a lot of competition from others, but at the same time IS is giving her a lot more attention now as compared to Brawl times.

 

[Curious Villager]

I see that the discussion didn't turn ugly. Phew...

I think this thread could really use a counter argument section since we keep getting heated debates every 5 minutes over silly things such as "Anna didn't get a Trophy/sticker" as if that stopped Diddy Kong from becomming playable in Brawl or "She isn't a main character" despite that we got Jigglypuff in smash. ¬_¬

 

[Frostwraith]

I think this thread could really use a counter argument section since we keep getting heated debates every 5 minutes over silly things such as "Anna didn't get a Trophy/sticker so she isn't likely" as if that stopped Diddy Kong from becomming playable in Brawl or "she isn't a main character thus she isn't likely" despite that we got Jigglypuff in smash. ¬_¬

I agree.

When I get time, I will review the thread and work on the counter-arguments.

 

[kikaru]

I agree.

When I get time, I will review the thread and work on the counter-arguments.

At least for me it will take a lot of convincing to do but here are some arguments you could consider addressing:

As far as I know she has yet to become a primary protagonist/become a face character for a Fire Emblem game (Not even worthy of sidekick status IMO).

How can she better compete with characters such as Lyn, Roy, Chrom, Luciana, etc. especially when Roy was planned for Brawl. (Unless you want to consider cutting Ike or add multiple Fire Emblem characters then I believe it would be best to include these arguments separately.) (Or in other words, what can she bring to the table that these characters cannot besides a different moveset? How would these qualities make her more desirable to play as than Lyn, Roy, Chrom, Luciana, etc?)

While she has been in just about every Fire Emblem game you could say that she represents all the series but as far as we know series representation has never been critical, otherwise we would've received second or third generation playable Pokemon in Brawl.

To me she feels like the Nurse Joy of the Fire Emblem series to a much lesser extent in that she has always been treated as a side character. And I believe the closest thing we have to Nurse Joy at this point is Chansey.

And I don't think having three-four blue-haired swordsman is going to be detrimental to Smash they can all possess unique/diverse movesets. (Referencing Takamaru and Chrom/Luciana. None of them have to be clones and all of them can be unique.)

I am honestly looking forward to the counterarguments section as it could very well change my perception/support for Anna.

 

[ChronoBound]

But I don't really see it anymore with them. Honestly, I don't see why we can't have a roster consisting of Marth, Ike, Chrom/Lucina and Anna.

If there was four playable characters for FE, Roy would certainly be among one of them. It would be Marth, Roy, Ike, and some sort of FE13 character (Chrom/Lucina/Anna). Roy is also by far the most wanted FE character for Smash 4. I think a lot of supporters for female FE characters tend to overlook that.

 

[Jaedrik]

The most major fallacy enemies of Anna have is they're mad.

And I'm not.

Spoiler

Butt seriously, her figure reminds me of Twilight Princess Sheik (much more feminine than her OoT incarnation) concept art.
Now I'm not trying to argue from hotness here, but one has to admit, dat. . .
I wonder what she'd look like with that hair down, and without that silly extra Trickster gear.
. . .
Okay, I just slapped myself.
. . .
Okay, I just went and dunked my head in cool water.

At least for me it will take a lot of convincing to do but here are some arguments you could consider addressing:
As far as I know she has yet to become a primary protagonist/become a face character for a Fire Emblem game (Not even worthy of sidekick status IMO).
How can she better compete with characters such as Lyn, Roy, Chrom, Luciana, etc. especially when Roy was planned for Brawl. (Unless you want to consider cutting Ike or add multiple Fire Emblem characters then I believe it would be best to include these arguments separately.) (Or in other words, what can she bring to the table that these characters cannot besides a different moveset? How would these qualities make her more desirable to play as than Lyn, Roy, Chrom, Luciana, etc?)
While she has been in just about every Fire Emblem game you could say that she represents all the series but as far as we know series representation has never been critical, otherwise we would've received second or third generation playable Pokemon in Brawl.
To me she feels like the Nurse Joy of the Fire Emblem series to a much lesser extent in that she has always been treated as a side character. And I believe the closest thing we have to Nurse Joy at this point is Chansey.
And I don't think having three-four blue-haired swordsman is going to be detrimental to Smash they can all possess unique/diverse movesets. (Referencing Takamaru and Chrom/Luciana. None of them have to be clones and all of them can be unique.)
I am honestly looking forward to the counterarguments section as it could very well change my perception/support for Anna.

It's an argument from degrees. A single Player Character or NPC ("side character"s) in FE by default is more valuable than Player Characters and NPCs in most other games, and the degree of significance Anna was given in Awakening, combined with her storied legacy being (from what I've seen among FE fans compared to, say, Pokemon fans or Koopa fans in Mario) by default more significant, in the earlier games as we have only recently discovered there are multiple Anna sisters, and now with her expanded role, is one of the reasons I support her. I cannot make the comparison you make to Pokemon because of an FE character's unique stature, and would much closer say that Pikachu or Jigglypuff is far more comparable to Anna when speaking of 'generation' and representation, though I view her as more significant than these. (We're not talking about the TV show here, but I'd be a fool to think that they weren't major impacts when first thought of for Smash, and that would, for me, put her at more even ground as her role in Awakening's Jigglypuff :3)

How she stacks up against any other FE representative is curious, and one should only consider her in contest when using the aggregate of all her roles, which I believe amass well enough for her contention, as a Playable Character, the face of DLC, the Outrealm Guardian, Merchant/Secret Shop, System and Data manager, Tutorial giver, and countless other occupations which are yet unexplored.

And in way of fighting uniqueness, the Trickster Playable Character Anna has a bevy of different tactics and weaponry to employ thanks to Awakening, more expressly as I love to point out, through both her expansive use of staffs and the Levin sword, opening up avenues of combatives that none of the mentioned FE competitors, nor any competitor for that matter, have access too (none of them have good magic stats lololololol)
If you're not familiar, staffs usually play all manner of supporting roles, from stats boost to weapons repair to teleportation and healing, it's also a wonderful excuse to use staffs as fighting weapons.
As for the Levin sword, it is not actually a striking sword but it could be much in the manner of the Kris or Flamberge, the latter of which has an expansive set of techniques differed from most other forms of swordplay (Thanks, Association for Renaissance Martial Arts!). The Levin sword provides a way of sword wielders to use their magic stat to attack if they do not have the ability to wield tomes, and in the game it is more directly used as Thunder magic, but just as staffs they could have something done to them which many other characters have also had: A Smash expansion to their powers and domain, and they're more believable than most already.
For her other unique traits it would seem to play off the trickster, assassin, and thief classes: Lucky 7 skill, which gives her +20 to hit and avoid chances for the first seven turns? Lethality skill for her Final Smash? How about an army of Anna for her Final Smash? Neat gimmicks like that, like Lucario's traits, the possibilities are endless, not to mention how many FE characters have borrowed skills which they did not use in their games and seeing her wide selection of possible classes and favorable stats growth allows the woman with many traits and sisters to do many things!

Heck, she could steal some of Olivia's traits, or even more radically Tharja's/Henry's, combine that with staff play, and use rallies and make a pseudo charge character / status effect character, like some combination of M. Bison/Blanka/Guile and a Persona 4/Shin Megami Tensei character! It would be awesome and unique, her potential versatility and uniqueness really push her favorability for me to the highest heights, I just hope Sakurai/Namco Bandai/IS have someone on their team with an argument like mine, or a better one, ha ha!

Eh, most of my support up until now has been "I want her in because I like her," more and more am I seeing her opportunity.

 

[ssbHex]

Seriously, FE deserves 4 reps. 13 games, no longer a Japan only franchise...

And even more importantly than all of that, Fire Emblem characters are among the most popular characters in Smash Bros. Even for casual fans who have never played Fire Emblem, the FE guys are popular. Sakurai could put in any random Lord, do his thing, and that guy will become instantly popular.


Huge tangent ahead:

Another series like this is Star Fox. Very popular among Smashers. Reason is Fox and Falco are pure badasses. Same goes with all the FE guys. I think it's safe to assume many young and teenaged boys like the cool characters the best, so it's natural.

Star Fox may not be nearly as popular as Zelda, but adding new Star Fox reps is always a good idea regardless. The same goes with FE. Not everyone cares how relevant or important each individual series is and how well they sell, so it doesn't really matter if Star Fox has the same amount of characters as Zelda in my opinion. I think that even if they never made another Star Fox or Fire Emblem ever again, they should still keep adding more characters for the time being, because they're generally well-received.

 

[FlareHabanero]

And I don't think having three-four blue-haired swordsman is going to be detrimental to Smash they can all possess unique/diverse movesets. (Referencing Takamaru and Chrom/Luciana. None of them have to be clones and all of them can be unique.)

Back up that claim regarding to Chrom/Lucina being unique. People claim that the two can become unique, but nobody has come up to prove their worth. If you cannot show me how they can become unique, don't even bother wasting your breath.

 

[Opossum]

And now for a completely relevant post.

Medakadonks

I like this word.

 

[Deleted member]

And now for a completely relevant post.




I like this word.

You can thank 4chan and Nisio Issin:

 

[Jaedrik]

Come on, I link here from the general discussion board to get awesome feedback on my post and hype for Anna, and you guys are going off topic and posting softcore hentai, stahp it

 

[Deleted member]

Come on, I link here from the general discussion board to get awesome feedback on my post and hype for Anna, and you guys are going off topic and posting softcore hentai, stahp it

B-but Medaka Box was OK.

Can we talk about how delicious Ajimu is then?

C'mon, just look at those legs and that soft yet deviant smile, Ajimu is best Medaka Box:

Plus she's a GODLY character with more than 1 Trillion different special abilities.

Spoiler

She will kill you with the power of WORDS.

 

[8-peacock-8]

Oh hai Medaka

 

[Deleted member]

Can we at least try to stay on topic here?

 

[FlareHabanero]

So, nobody can prove that Chrom or Lucina can become unique? Pathetic.

Can we at least try to stay on topic here?

So, how about Anna's hair?

 

[Deleted member]

So, nobody can prove that Chrom or Lucina can become unique? Pathetic.



So, how about Anna's hair?

It's red.

Anyway, this WAS on topic. I was talking about Anna's Medakadonks.

 

[8-peacock-8]

So, how about Anna's hair?

The reason why it's red is because of the blood pressure rage of the people she scammed.

 

[Deleted member]

The reason why it's red is because of the blood pressure rage of the people she scammed.

No, it's because she's a daywalker.

 

[FlareHabanero]

The reason why it's red is because of the blood pressure rage of the people she scammed.

I thought it was red because she bathed in rubies. She does jewel baths so much that her hair turned a bright red.

 

[ChronoBound]

I still think that if there is going to be another Pokemon Trainer/Zero Suit Samus (an unexpected, relatively unrequested newcomer for a veteran franchise) get in Smash 4, Anna has a good chance of being it (that is not saying that Anna has a good chance of being in, but rather if another PT/ZSS were to happen for Smash 4, I think Anna is a good candidate for that).

I can't think of any other possible ZSS/PT type newcomers for Smash 4 aside from Anna.

I do think Chrom/Lucina would be pretty poor choices for newcomers both in the short-term and long-run.

 

[Jaedrik]

Like I said, I wonder how it would look if she let it down. And she's not greedy, she's just a good capitalist who understands the value of capital.

And I sure hope she is the newcomer from our veteran franchise.

 

[8-peacock-8]

I thought it was red because she bathed in rubies. She does jewel baths so much that her hair turned a bright red.

Which connects to the fact that she scammed people and bathed in their rage filled money and jewels.

 

[Deleted member]

Like I said, I wonder how it would look if she let it down. And she's not greedy, she's just a good capitalist who understands the value of capital.

And I sure hope she is the newcomer from our veteran franchise.

No, she's not greedy:

Spoiler

I hope I'm not offending anyone with my racist jokes