Elements and Attributes Mafia - Game Over!

[Aggressive Mediation]

Would they be better on S&C or Gheb? Or is there a better target?

How about for vigs?

That's actually a good question, and I would probably say Gheb. S&C will probably get night killed, if they're town.

As for Vig? Inactives. Always, always, always inactives in this game. Given the current track record, JTB is the primary target. I would not put BadWolf in the vig pool. In order from most to least want, JTB, FF, then Dark Horse.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

I see you viewing, Legodumbasses. You got anything for me? I haven't heard your salty voice in ages.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

EBWOP: Add Foxy after Dork Horse. Ran/Rake are extremely forgettable and I don't like that from a slot with Ran in it.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Sorry guys, the next time i'll be able to make a decent post is just maybe, tomorrow afternoon.

As for now, Vote: PJB

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

What does that put him at?

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

L-3. Me, You, Potassium, and AM

 

[Kantrip]

ftr this is still a good lynch and im staying planted here until someone convinces me there's a better one. inactives won't cut it, there are other ways of dealing with them. gheb and s&c can insist on protecting joker but it's really not their place, because they're wrong.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

Legolas walks out of the thread without saying anything. Dammit Sheepses.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Sorry to be impatient, but can we just get this done?

 

[Foxy the Silver Fox]

EBWOP: Add Foxy after Dork Horse. Ran/Rake are extremely forgettable and I don't like that from a slot with Ran in it.

I was V/LA yesterday and today. (As stated in the social thread, was out of town/city)

I'll catch up and post some stuffs.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

My bad, didn't see it.

 

[Foxy the Silver Fox]

It's kool.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Vote: PJB

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

Legolas walks out of the thread without saying anything. Dammit Sheepses.

I actually fell asleep while reading/making post, lolz.

Let me see if I can get something up.

Okay so thoughts on AM's case:

Tbh I can see where AM is coming from. Especially wrt PJB always bringing up his alignment and role. I'm slightly paranoid myself about PJB constantly reminding us that he's town/the doctor. It seems calculative, like he's going out of his way to distance himself from the mafia. However, I ultimately don't actually think he's doing this. It's more likely just a natural pattern for him. His explanation of "I'm the town doctor and I had to claim so I'm pied" seems more believable as to why he keeps bringing it up then him being scum trying to manipulate us. If he were

That said.

It's also true that, while PJB is under pressure, he really should have something by now. Even under pressure a townie should have a scum read by now, or at least someone they are pressuring. Instead this entire game he has only responded to attacks. His few attempts to attack someone has been week, at best. Don't like.

Lastly, AM brings up the point that no one has suggested a viable alternative besides inactives, which I really can't argue with.

*taps fingers on keyboard*

hmmm

hmmm

hmmmm

hmmmmmmm

hmmmmmmmmm

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

My gut says no on PJB. I don't believe he's terribly scummy. Everytime I think of something scummy about him I can think of a reason why that's not legit.

Sorry for delaying this more, but I would like to isolate read PJB. If I'm not done by tomorrow midnight I'll just vote PJB.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

I'm to tired now, I'll try to get final reads out by the end of the Day.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

I'm not trying to do anything? There's... nobody ****ing posting in this game for me to interrogate! Everybody is either inactive, a town read of mine, or somebody still attacking me. Every time I try to talk to anyone, all they wanna talk about is how scummy they think I still am and that I should die. Like, wtf how am I supposed to function like this? All the attacks on me are so ****ing generic and awful that it's literally impossible to read it. I'm supposed to tell people's alignments when they all just spout the same generic bull****? How does that work?

 

[JTB]

I was able to read everything, but I got called to cover someone's shift at work in 5 hours, so I can't spend time posting tonight (although I'll be off early afternoon and be able to post more). For now, I just wanted to address FF's 454 as it's the easiest thing to reply to at the moment and something that stuck out to me while reading through. While his reasoning for lynching PJB makes sense, I don't get the impression that he actually has connections he wants to look at post-PJB lynch and is just posting it for the sake of supporting his PJB vote. Going on to the rest of the post, I dislike him playing armchair critic while dropping Ghebs name. His point wrt lynching inactives is clear, but throwing down Ghebs name taints it for me and looks more like he was playing to Ghebs goodside.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

I'm not trying to do anything? There's... nobody ****ing posting in this game for me to interrogate! Everybody is either inactive, a town read of mine, or somebody still attacking me. Every time I try to talk to anyone, all they wanna talk about is how scummy they think I still am and that I should die. Like, wtf how am I supposed to function like this? All the attacks on me are so ****ing generic and awful that it's literally impossible to read it. I'm supposed to tell people's alignments when they all just spout the same generic bull****? How does that work?

You have a pile of nulls that you are not developing in the slightest and you wanna tell me you have nowhere you can go? Bull****.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Don't have much time to post the next days but I'll try to be around before deadline hits and be read up by then. If somebody is needed to hammer PJB I guess I'd be willing to do it but only to prevent a NL. By no means am I supporting his lynch though. Pretty much every damn slot has been in favor of his lynch over the course of the Day at one point and I find it hard to believe that he was more or less bussed out of the blue from the very beginning of Day 1.

I also want to hear your amazing plans on what you are going to do in case he flips town. I swear, half of you people are completely clueless.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

That's what I wanna know. What does anybody actually learn from my flip? That the people who defended me are town/scum based on my flip? Everyone voting me is so fake confident that I'm scum, but at the end of the day, they still wanna see my flip before giving a read on anyone else. Because they're not that confident.

So let's hear it, guys. Everyone on my wagon, where do you go when you see my flip? What are you actually going to learn? I'm scum, right? So where does that leave you? Who do you get reads on by seeing me flip scum? What are you waiting for?

I still don't know why it's my responsibility to fix this town just because you chose to make me the first wagon. Everyone is just sitting with their thumbs up their asses, even though they're so certain I'm scum. When I flip town, you guys are going to be the exact same amount of lost that we are right now. The only difference will be that won't have me around to just be lazy and sit your vote down on for the entire dayphase.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

You're high if you think I'm going to pull out a giant neon sign that says "I'm onto you."

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Yes, it would be so much better for you to take the information to your grave. You're the man, right? You got the whole game figured out, right? So what if scum kills you, and you didn't tell the town who the scum are?

 

[Handorin]

He obviously meant that he won't have a 100% lynch target. That's highly improbable. It rarely happens.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

I'm not trying to do anything? There's... nobody ****ing posting in this game for me to interrogate! Everybody is either inactive, a town read of mine, or somebody still attacking me. Every time I try to talk to anyone, all they wanna talk about is how scummy they think I still am and that I should die. Like, wtf how am I supposed to function like this? All the attacks on me are so ****ing generic and awful that it's literally impossible to read it. I'm supposed to tell people's alignments when they all just spout the same generic bull****? How does that work?

This is true, but nevertheless you should still try to read someone. Even if you can't get a read on them immediately, pressure them, ask someone questions, something. Instead you've been sitting on your hands and crying foul, which is anti-town at best. The fact that you haven' made the effort to scumhunt casts doubt for me on your intention to scumhunt.

I was able to read everything, but I got called to cover someone's shift at work in 5 hours, so I can't spend time posting tonight (although I'll be off early afternoon and be able to post more). For now, I just wanted to address FF's 454 as it's the easiest thing to reply to at the moment and something that stuck out to me while reading through. While his reasoning for lynching PJB makes sense, I don't get the impression that he actually has connections he wants to look at post-PJB lynch and is just posting it for the sake of supporting his PJB vote. Going on to the rest of the post, I dislike him playing armchair critic while dropping Ghebs name. His point wrt lynching inactives is clear, but throwing down Ghebs name taints it for me and looks more like he was playing to Ghebs goodside.

I agree almost completely.

Maybe not so much playing to Gheb's good side, but more so just the feel I get out that he cares more about seeming helpful than actually being helpful. Would totally be up or his lynch toDay, especially if we go the inactive route.

 

[Scylla & Charybdis]

Don't have much time to post the next days but I'll try to be around before deadline hits and be read up by then. If somebody is needed to hammer PJB I guess I'd be willing to do it but only to prevent a NL. By no means am I supporting his lynch though. Pretty much every damn slot has been in favor of his lynch over the course of the Day at one point and I find it hard to believe that he was more or less bussed out of the blue from the very beginning of Day 1.

I also want to hear your amazing plans on what you are going to do in case he flips town. I swear, half of you people are completely clueless.

We supported his lynch since when?

But he's a relatively weak player, easily lynched, and his townplay fits with a lot of classic scumtells. I mean GS mafia (which just finished fyi) his hydra caught this exact same type of attention for similar reasons, it's frustrating but without an active swiss there's no way to match ryker's thread control.


Thoughts on hando?

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

Handorin where's your head at? Earlier you were voting PJB, and tbh I'm not entirely sure why. Now you're voting no one. Do you have anyone you want to see die toDay?

 

[#HBC | Joker]

He obviously meant that he won't have a 100% lynch target. That's highly improbable. It rarely happens.

That's a ****ty answer though. If he doesn't have a 100% lynch target, then gimme more than one name. If he doesn't have any names to give me, then what the **** did he learn from my flip?

It's like you guys just don't get it.

 

[Foxy the Silver Fox]

Just for you guys, I appear out of the dust.

Sorry for the misunderstanding then.

I don't really know what to tell you on why I changed my mind. It's not one particular reason but more a number of smallish reasons that together add up to the conclusion that he's likely town, in my opinion anyway. One of those reasons is based on the people who have joined to wagon. By the time I unvoted it was only AM I felt comfortable with being on the wagon. I don't think I can agree with Kantrip, JTB or Hando being on the wagon nor am I convinced by their reasoning and that bugs me enough to second guess the whole thing. To be perfectly honest, every single player on the PJB wagon except AM is a good counter-argument against that lynch to me right now. It also just so happened that my clearest town reads [Lego + Foxy] both argued against the wagon. As for my own reasoning, I guess it's just that I'm probably the one person who tends to second-guess himself the most over the course of a game and I can see myself being wrong on PJB easily enough. Looking at the facts, I see a lot more arguments against the PJB lynch than for it.

Don't feel this post by Gheb.

Kantrip had every reason to be on the wagon and PJB's reactions to Kantrips posting read as off to me right now.

Kantrip's playing an entirely new side of the page but he needs to stop stroking his own **** and get another scum read outside PJB.

Anyone can say they get something from a wagon but it can never be that simple.

Gheb's trusting of us is off at this point, we haven't been town-telling in the slightest yet and the confidence to put this out reads of townie to me.

I doubt Gheb tries to get on our goodside after me n Scylla om nommed his scum team last time

That means Rake, right?

we're each leaving each other to do our own thing while discussin our feels.

@Foxy: Analyze PJB's reactions to being wagoned.

I'll do you one better and ISO his posts from wagon start till now and give you my feels on them.

This is 100% dependent on work not happening today so cross your fingers

So wait, Swiss didn't make post 361? I sounded so much like it was coming from his perspective . . .

Anyways.

We shouldn't lynch PJB because he's town. There are aspects of his play that worries me but I think it's overshadowed by just how open and honest he's been this game. If he is scum, then he hasn't been doing himself any favors by posting read lists where the worst he gives anyone is null or saying that the reason he doesn't want to sheep someone is because he doesn't want to be connected to them in case they flip scum. A couple of people (Kantrip and DH) were supposedly reading scum intention into the latter, but I've actually taken the exact opposite out of it. I'm glad that PJB wasn't censoring his input and reading PJB say that "I don't want to be connected to a potential scummy" just seems more honest than scummy to me.

Also I know I shouldn't be using meta so ignore this point if you're totally against meta, but taking into consideration PJB's scum play he hasn't been acting like his previous scum play would suggest he would. He seems to be antagonistic as both alignments, but a key difference I noticed is that he was much more reserved and selective about what he outputted as scum. I kinda expect a scum PJB to have rolled up into a ball by now with all the pressure he's getting but he hasn't.

Still though, PJB did tell me at the end of Persona mafia that I showed him what to avoid doing as scum so I kinda only take the above paragraph half-heartedly. Despite this I think my first paragraph as to why PJB shouldn't be lynched toDay stands on it's own feet and is enough reason not to lynch him.

This whole posts makes me want to /wrists

Mfw honesty is not a town tell

underlined is especially bad, indies do it all the time. It's called safety net play an AM's point wrt Joker are hard to refute in that sense.

An yet here I stand.

Some Only Hate Call-outs Aimed Heavily Toward Own Actions.

You are the best type of person

 

[Foxy the Silver Fox]

We should lynch Badwulf.

His entire joker read is hella opportunistic and it smells of scum badwulf dredging himself from the depths to the easiest wagon.

If joker is scum he's not being led by a strong OS type.

Also S&C's entire line about Joker town is really bleck but it came from Adumb who's got this penchant for picking out the most goofball townies.

 

[Handorin]

Handorin where's your head at? Earlier you were voting PJB, and tbh I'm not entirely sure why. Now you're voting no one. Do you have anyone you want to see die toDay?

I don't mind PJB, it's just that I can foresee his actions working for or against us, and it's easy to make sure of what it is. Like I said, I'll throw my vote back on if needed. My earlier reads are still standing as well, which means I would like Kantrip and Fox dead.

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

Why do you want Kantrip dead?

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

This whole posts makes me want to /wrists

Mfw honesty is not a town tell

underlined is especially bad, indies do it all the time. It's called safety net play an AM's point wrt Joker are hard to refute in that sense.

An yet here I stand.

I honestly don't know what "safety net play" means nor do I know exactly which one of AM's points you are referring to.

I'm actually doing an ISO on PJB right now and I'm finding that I still like his 51. I suppose scum could be honest for town points but I still like because I think it shows PJB is thinking for himself. I'll just post my notes on the post so you can see what I mean.

51: I like this post. I feel like a lot of people misinterpreted exactly what PJB was saying. He wasn't being asked to sheep at the time, he was just using himself as an example as to why he didn't feel like sheeping was a good idea. He was saying, "I don't think sheeping is a good idea, because if someone sheeps another player that's scum, and if that scum flips, then a false connection might be established." This might seem like a weird thought process to have but I'm actually glad he didn't respond with something generic like "they could be scum" or "they could be wrong." Shows to me that he's thinking for himself. +0.5.

Besides given the context of the situation it doesn't seem like PJB was going out of his way to for town points by being honest, rather he was just responding to someone.

I have to rethink the reads he gave (which I'll get to in my ISO) because they did seem rather rushed. However I'm still liking the fact that he didn't post scum read for the sake of posting scum reads. It really does feel like scum would have been pressured at that point to call someone scum.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

I don't mind PJB, it's just that I can foresee his actions working for or against us, and it's easy to make sure of what it is. Like I said, I'll throw my vote back on if needed. My earlier reads are still standing as well, which means I would like Kantrip and Fox dead.

What AM said. You need to be 100x more descriptive of what you're thinking. Why Kantrip? Why Foxy?

Also I know I didn't ask this before but why were you originally suspicious of PJB at all?

 

[Handorin]

Cause they're scum mates with PJB. I've quoted and requoted my stance a few times already. And if you read nearly every proPJB lynch post, then you'll get my view again.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

We should lynch Badwulf.

His entire joker read is hella opportunistic and it smells of scum badwulf dredging himself from the depths to the easiest wagon.

If joker is scum he's not being led by a strong OS type.

Also S&C's entire line about Joker town is really bleck but it came from Adumb who's got this penchant for picking out the most goofball townies.

Badwolf's posts aren't really that out there in terms of him striking out on his own nor his own opinions, but what gives away he is trying to look for an easy lynch?

What wording? What posts?

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

We should lynch Badwulf.

His entire joker read is hella opportunistic and it smells of scum badwulf dredging himself from the depths to the easiest wagon.

If joker is scum he's not being led by a strong OS type.

Also S&C's entire line about Joker town is really bleck but it came from Adumb who's got this penchant for picking out the most goofball townies.

This is by Rake right?

Yeah, where else would you want me to go? I have a null-scum read on Gheb only because of his hardbody protection of PJB but in reality, there's not a chance in hell that I'm going to get him lynched toDay. It's just not going to happen. I'm not being opportunistic rather logical.

 

[JTB]

Getting held over an additional 5 hours at work, so I cant post until late tonight

 

[Scylla & Charybdis]

Cause they're scum mates with PJB. I've quoted and requoted my stance a few times already. And if you read nearly every proPJB lynch post, then you'll get my view again.

>_>

<_<

Vote: Handorin

 

[Aggressive Mediation]

I honestly don't know what "safety net play" means nor do I know exactly which one of AM's points you are referring to.

I'm actually doing an ISO on PJB right now and I'm finding that I still like his 51. I suppose scum could be honest for town points but I still like because I think it shows PJB is thinking for himself. I'll just post my notes on the post so you can see what I mean.

These aren't town tells.

 

[Kantrip]

@Foxy: Another scumread? How about two: Gheb and S&C

Gheb on PJB scumflip
S&C on PJB townflip

There. I have a direction after the lynch, and the result of it does matter for developing my reads on these harder to read slots