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Buffed CPU's?

Silly_Salamander

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 31, 2015
Messages
1
I was reading the patch notes from the last Sm4sh update and some people said that the CPU's have gotten a lot smarter. I play lvl. 9's when I have no one to play with or don't feel like doing For Glory mode. For the most part, I've been able to destroy them in the past with almost any character ; but even my Captain Falcon (my main) is struggling to take down a lvl. 9 Mario after the update. I see that most of the cast are now utilizing wall jumps and combos I've never seen them pull off before. Hell, even Diddy is able to recover extremely well AND hoo-hah you now. I've been playing 3-5 hours of Sm4sh each day since I got it back in November, so I don't think that it's me. Anyone else experiencing this?
 

BBC7

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 20, 2014
Messages
667
Location
Canada, Ontario
This is just barely related, but a Level 1 Luigi just did the most amazing thing against me. When he was hanging on the ledge, he dropped down and fully charged Side B to get to the other side of the stage. He then proceeded to mash Down B for height, before grabbing the opposite ledge with an Up B. It was crazy
 

SatoshiM

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
68
They indeed were buffed. I think their AI is almost exactly identical to WiiU now, which is a good thing - better practice! They actually shieldgrab now so you can learn spacing! They don't randomly airdodge so you don't get free combos! It's great imo.

By the way, I don't recommend level 9s. Reading inputs means they don't play anything like real players and can teach bad habits.
 

VioletSmashfan

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 15, 2014
Messages
887
Location
New Hampshire
NNID
SVPfan89
3DS FC
2964-9317-6440
The CPUs were indeed buffed to match that of the Wii U cpus' AI (level 1s actually put up a fight now almost as much as they did in Brawl), so if you haven't gotten those 3DS challenges 100% done yet, they've just became alot harder to complete (and I'm only missing like 96 of 105 challenges).

Personally they should have kept the 3DS' CPU AI as it was, since the 3DS version is meant to be the easy counterpart of the Wii U.
 

Hawke753

Smash Rookie
Joined
Nov 23, 2014
Messages
5
Location
Coahuila, Mexico
3DS FC
0834-2790-2061
I honestly think they overdone a little bit with the air dodges on lvl 9 cpu's, they're basically perfect with them and i can't never bait them out, not even the best players i met on FG are that good dodging, kinda frustating sometimes

i recommend going against level 7 CPU's, they still air dodge efficiently but are nowhere near as perfect as lvl 9's :p
 

LimitCrown

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 30, 2014
Messages
636
NNID
LimitCrown
3DS FC
0903-2850-8324
It seems like even level 7 CPUs air dodge a bit too well.
 
Joined
Jan 27, 2014
Messages
1,208
Tbh I haven't noticed much of a difference, but I've only played Classic and Smash Run since the update so maybe something is different in regular Smash and I just haven't seen it yet.
 

MFGFalcon0

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 11, 2015
Messages
10
Glad im not the only one who noticed this, i recently updated my 3ds so i could keep playing with my friends at school. I played a lvl 9 donkey kong and i was surprised at how much i struggled against it .( my main is captain falcon as well)
 
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MFGFalcon0

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 11, 2015
Messages
10
I was reading the patch notes from the last Sm4sh update and some people said that the CPU's have gotten a lot smarter. I play lvl. 9's when I have no one to play with or don't feel like doing For Glory mode. For the most part, I've been able to destroy them in the past with almost any character ; but even my Captain Falcon (my main) is struggling to take down a lvl. 9 Mario after the update. I see that most of the cast are now utilizing wall jumps and combos I've never seen them pull off before. Hell, even Diddy is able to recover extremely well AND hoo-hah you now. I've been playing 3-5 hours of Sm4sh each day since I got it back in November, so I don't think that it's me. Anyone else experiencing this?
Glad im not the only one who noticed this, i recently updated my 3ds so i could keep playing with my friends at school. I played a lvl 9 donkey kong and i was surprised at how much i struggled against it .( my main is captain falcon as well)
 

DiamondDust

Prime Time Player
Joined
Dec 10, 2013
Messages
133
Location
Berwyn, Illinois
NNID
MaysTheCraze
I can also confirm that they appear to be buffed, but I hate going against Lvl 9's. No human is going to perfect shield roll everything every time.
 

COLINBG

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 11, 2015
Messages
275
Location
Kongo Jungle 64
NNID
COLINBG
3DS FC
3067-5729-5039
They are buffed in some ways, and it's not in the player's advantage to train against them.

- The air dodges are really hard to punish. When I try to bait it, they don't air dodge at all, and when I attack, the do frame pefect air dodges. Sometimes they don't, but most of the time they do. It's almost like they can read your inputs and react immediately (at least, it's the impression I get).

- You can't pummel them. If you try to pummel below high percents, like a hundred, the simply get out immediately; you have to throw them right away. Above a hundred, you can usually get a pummel or two, but you're still limited. This creates a bad habit of not pummeling at all against human opponents.

- They have a good defensive game, and an awful attacking one:
If you just sit there and shield/roll/walk/spot dodge/short hop when they come closer, the AI usually doesn't know what to do. They will simply walk back and forth waiting for you to do something. Projectile-heavy characters are a bit better at ''doing something'' when you don't, but it's still funny how easily you can take no damage at all by not fighting.
When you attack, however, their punishing game is really good, and their playstyle seems to be based on that in a way.

There's more things, but these are the three major problems I observed.

Also, they don't really know how to combo (I have never seen a Diddy CPU doing a Hoohah), and they are quite easy to beat when you take your time, because they don't know how to adapt. Even if you keep punishing one of their moves, they'll continue to do it.

For these reasons, I do believe they have huge buffs, but also weaknesses that are easy to take advantage of. The level 8s are much better, because they do less ''inhumane'' stuff, so it's both more enjoyable and you get less bad habits. Lower than that it's too easy. The best is still to play against human opponents though.
 
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optimuskirby

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
60
Location
washington
3DS FC
1118-0746-7459
Well, I did a test with Zelda & her teleport, & the CPU did either 1 of 2 things:
Dodge the opposite way from where I'm going
or
Run in the direction of which way I'm going to punish with a grab.
What I'm trying to say is: They can read your input commands.
 

COLINBG

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 11, 2015
Messages
275
Location
Kongo Jungle 64
NNID
COLINBG
3DS FC
3067-5729-5039
Well, I did a test with Zelda & her teleport, & the CPU did either 1 of 2 things:
Dodge the opposite way from where I'm going
or
Run in the direction of which way I'm going to punish with a grab.
What I'm trying to say is: They can read your input commands.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Soemtimes they simply act too fast in a too perfect way for it to be ''luck'', or ''reacting like a real player''.

I also did a test myself, going Pacman against a Villager level 9 on an omega stage.

I waited for him near the ledge, not doing anything, and he threw Lloids and came up to me with a dash attack or a grab every time. I simply jumped over him. Sometimes he would try to Usmash me as I was in the air. He never hit me, and he repeated the same string for a good 5 minutes before I got bored of doing it.

Then, I tried rolling instead of jumping, and he could never punish. I took it further with simply spamming rolls from one side to the other without interruption, and he could barely punish that too. When he did, it wasn't because he adapted and learned my habit, but because he saw I was coming towards him and threw an attack.

Finally, I went back to rolling from his dash attacks, and tried punishing, which I managed to do everytime.

I also finished the match normally, by going in and attacking him like I would a normal player, and it was much harder to rack up damage and not getting punished.

So I think we can affirm two things:

1. They read inputs and act accordingly.
2. The are completely helpless when you don't do anything and THEY have to approach. Their entire game is based on punishing (by reading the inputs).
Edit: This is bad, because it's nowhere near what a match against a player in real time is like, but it also lets you see what is a safe option or not, because you'll most likely get punished every time by missing unsafe options.
 
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optimuskirby

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
60
Location
washington
3DS FC
1118-0746-7459
Hm, well in my experience, the difficulty is what it wants to be. For example: I used to play with certain items on, & win a lot, but now its impossible to play with items, I usually always lose. & speaking of grabbing: have you ever gotten grabbed by a cpu while you were still win the air? Cuz that has happened to me..... a lot!
 

COLINBG

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 11, 2015
Messages
275
Location
Kongo Jungle 64
NNID
COLINBG
3DS FC
3067-5729-5039
I don't recall it. When I land it does happen, but in the air, I don't think they ever grabbed me with anything other than a command grab. You are sure it was a real grab and it was in the air?
 

EnderCat39

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 25, 2020
Messages
1
When I played on smash ultimate against lvl9 cpus the were perfectly reading my inputs and my attacks went through them a lot of the time without them spotdodging, rolling, shielding, or air dodging. Edit: when I used things like shieks up b or other teleport moves they ran exactly where I was going to teleport
 
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