Match-up discussion #10: Marth

I've decided to do the match-ups a little faster, to have a full index asap. Besides, most discussion are rather short anyways...

This time we're doing Marth. I know it's frustrating to do all the bad match-up first but we have to deal with the higher tiered characters before the others - there is more pleasent stuff to come later...

This match-up has been discussed on the Marth boards already and it's pretty much covered: It's a 60:40 advantage for Marth. He wins in range and is speed-wise up to par with Wolf. KOing his opponent is no issue for him. To win this battle you have to prevent laggy moves, since Marth has good punishing options - but so does Wolf, so use your chance, when you see it! Other than that, spacing is yet again a key factor to win this battle. Trying to sneak in a blaster shot every now and then won't hurt either. It should be noted, that Marth is very light and easy to finish for Wolf. The sooner you manage to sinish him off, the easier the battle becomes...

Discuss.

45/55 or 40/60 Marth's favor.

Wolf can deal with Marth just fine on the stage, but Marth has advantage on the ledge and offstage.

I actually feel that wolf almost has the advantage in this one or that its equal. Wall of wolf is good and the pistol is good too and it forces marth to approach. I feel that wolf can do a better job of spacing than marth using moves like retreating 0-lag f-air and the b-air right.

Plus wolf can kill marth pretty good. The marth forums got it as 60/40 for marth but im gonna say its 50/50 in my opinion.

wolfs blaster=life saver in this match.

I for one agree with the Marth boards, 60/40 Marth's favor.

On-stage: The only move that can compete with Marth's sword is.... you guessed it, Bair, that's the only move that can really get through Marth's Fair and other moves. The simple fact is that Marth can generally outspace you, The only exception is Bair, which you have to space PERFECTLY and TIME perfectly. I'm honestly not sure what happens if Marth's Fair and Wolf's Bair are done at the same time... it would seem like they'd trade hits, or maybe Marth's might win out. But in general, Marth has a better spacing game.

Killing: Marth can kill at ABSURDLY low percents with a tippered Fsmash. Wolf can kill fairly well with a fresh Dsmash, Marth isn't the heaviest. But Marth can still kill fairly well without a tipper... just not as well imo as Wolf. But WITH a tipper... that's a different story. We're going to assume that a good Marth is going to have good spacing. So Marth can kill better than Wolf.

Off-stage... Need I say more? Wolf's recovery sucks/kinda predictable + Marth is great off stage, However, with smart play by the Wolf, the recovery is going to be harder to gimp. So eh, he's not going to get gimps left and right....

I forget what else, but yeah, Marth can barely outspace Wolf, he can kill better than Wolf, and he has a better off stage game.

Forgot two things:

Recovery: Marth's is kinda iffy, it's possible to edgehog him =)

Lasering: This ruins Marth's SH approaches from afar... up close it's too dangerous, all Marth has to do is run under your SH laser and get a free USmash... 18%... and Marth can just airdodge to avoid the lasers from afar, and keep pressure on you so you don't get that far away. So yeah, lasers are helpful, but they don't make this matchup much better.

It probably is 60/40 for marth.

OK, 60/40 for Marth then...

I know about this one, I main Marth. OK first off, Marth's sword is great, and his Fair is godly. If you can compete with a bunch of quick auto-cancelled Fairs getting thrown in your face, then kudos to you, but it's hard. Marth also has his Dtilt which is great and has IASA frames after a certain frame, I forgot which though. So Marth will be using lots of that because it is so fast. DO MOT SH and attempt to 0 lag Fair, Ftilt will tip you away and it will be followed up with a DB. DB is amazing, I use it so often in my gameplay, watch out for it, because 1. it does lots of damage and it is a good mixup to not use the whole combo 2. it refreshes Marth's other moves because the four hits all count separately. DO NOT touch Marth's shield with anything other than a mid-range or long-range blaster or you will eat a Dolphin Slash out of shield since it has invincibility frames for the first five frames. Play patiently and use Reflector often to throw off Marth's rhythm. Bair is your friend and I'd suggest you don't use Fsmash at all because you will be punished. If Marth messes up, you should punish accordingly, but be careful and play intelligently.

Summary:

Play Patient

Don't touch his Shield

Use Bair a lot

Blaster is your friend

Reflector to throw off Marth

Don't Fsmash

Marth also has a pseudo 0-death. He can chain fthrows on you to around 25% (or so I recall from the marth boards), fair then dair spike. Marth's shield pressure game is awesome, so beware. Marth has great aerial control as well (although I'm not sure if it's as good as Wolf's) so it will definitely be an uphill battle for spacing bairs. He beats you offstage and in the air overall, which really sucks, and it's not as much in your favor on the ground. Fortunately he has no real solution for blaster. I see this as more of a defensive game TBH, work on dodging and then hope for and capitalize on an opening. However, both characters require good spacing, but a good marth will likely be able to space better in this matchup, limiting your safe options. 60:40 marth, not unwinnable but still a pain.

OK, 60:40 Marth seems to be commonly agreed. In that case I'll move on to Wario later...

Marth can PS the blaster Ishy.

So can everyone But honestly its better than nothing, and a good wolf should use it at a distance where the opponent won't be able to own you after perfect shielding (which means anything over 3/4 of the distance, as a rough estimate)

EDIT: Yeah by real solution I generally mean another projectile or reflector to compete at a distance. There was this one match of DSF vs Germ, shield dashing, 3 perfect shields, and then DSF began the ****. Any character can do this, but if used properly, it forces them to approach while giving you time to react to their approach. A solution involves forcing wolf to approach. Sorry for being unclear, I do that a lot.

DSF doesn't even main Marth, lol. And I get it, if Marth forces Wolf to aproach by learning to PS, he can win, and I may be wrong, but I doubt that WoW works at all against Marth, since Marth is better in the air IMO.