The anti ness thread

Yoshi: WTF is that thing!
Other Yoshi: I believe its a Ness sir. Hideous little rascals they are.
Yoshi: Its disgusting.
Other Yoshi: Dont be fooled by its lack of muscles: It packs a major punch and we dont know how to combat it.
Yoshi: There is only one thing to do: TO SMASHBOARDS!

Ok sorry for that annoying dialogue. Anyways, there is no Yoshi vs Ness thread that i found, so i decided to make one.

K so heres what i have on fighting ness:


Yoshi:

Has Power
Has a faster projectile
Better ground game in general
ermm i dunno, Maybe a little faster i guess.
Edgeguarding
Ness:

Has disjointed hitboxes.
Has insanely annoying djc combos that beat urs.
Fair (deserves its own catagory)
Nice WD
U may not know it, but Ness's recovery is pretty good.
Pkt2
YYG (if they pull this off, well, good luck).



Ok

I dont know too much about fighting ness. But ill tell u what i know to watch out for, not feeling like telling u how to counter Ness's attacks (thats what you r for).

K djcd or sffled fairs are rediculous! They come out really fast, are disjointed, and can lead into others. Ness's grab range is terrible, but his throws are really good. Bthrow kills at low percents.
K ermm edgeguarding a good ness can be tricky. I usually egg him, cuz good ness's will likely hit u with his recovery. Well im too tired to list anything else, but this is for any discussion involving fighting ness. I dont really have too much of a problem w/ ness.

Oh god, I should've known. I saw anti-ness thread so I HAD to come see what was going on with this. I've finally figured out why your socks are burnt. Some Ness PKT2ed right into them, didnt he?

yeah, Yoshi's pretty much screwed. lol, I always screw up yoshi's djc nairs due to the djc speed difference, so yoshi's djc game's pretty inferior. A good vid is fumi vs mofo on the ness boards under the vid thread. It has some really good tactics.

This thread is already funny.

Edit: watch out, he can jump out of shield!!!

Stupid ness boards! I knew u guys would come and ruin ur parade. I guess im gonna go make an anti yoshi topic on the ness boards! While ur here, why not give the yoshis some advice.

I only know like on Yoshi and I haven't played him in freaking forever. Sorry I can't help.

I'm going to submit a video I have against arguably one of the best U.S. Ness players from a while ago.

You can take from it what you will--this isn't to show off, but to point out different things each character can do. It's on a nice fair stage and it's a fairly close match all around. Please note that YYG is not abused in this match, so I'm not submitting anything regarding that toward the discussion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amak4yIAPvw

Note the excessive use of downsmashes and shielded upsmashes gets me kicked a lot. Ness' DJC is extremely quick and his grabs **** heavy characters like Yoshi. One definite advantage Yoshi has in this matchup (as with most of his) is sheer power advantage. Also, watch out for PK Thunder. It breaks the jump at 100%.

P.S. - Stomp is gay.

P.P.S. - Yoshi's DJC neutral air is the only reason I this match was as close as it was. Just figured I'd get to the point. Otherwise, it wouldn't have been a contest for this Ness to run away with a victory.

Dang, burntsocks got to this first! Lol!

Im at work right now but i am gonna add my experience to fighting an incredibly defensive Ness later! And might i add, Shiri your Yoshi is still FREAKING AMAZING!! Wow!! Everytym i see it i want it for my own!

LOL you're supposed to watch the Ness! Thank you, though. ._.

Ness' DJC sparkles are quite devastating--I would imagine Yoshi can only CC jab them if they're DJC'd. If they're short-hopped, he probably won't be able to CC the whole thing.

Also, Ness hangs in his shield a lot. Watch out for grabs and WD grabs. Technically, if Ness grabs Yoshi, it should lead directly to a KO. Mainly off of down throw (which I can't remember how to DI right now for some reason >_>). If you get stuck in a combo off of one of his grabs, don't be afraid to DJ out. It'll lead to too much damage if you don't--DI will rarely save you from a good Ness combo.

P.S. - Stomp is gay.

ÖwnÄ said:

Dang, burntsocks got to this first! Lol!

Im at work right now but i am gonna add my experience to fighting an incredibly defensive Ness later! And might i add, Shiri your Yoshi is still FREAKING AMAZING!! Wow!! Everytym i see it i want it for my own!

Click to expand...

Lol i was gonna title the thread "U got owned owna" lol

Anyways, shiri, r u sure that ness was one of the best in the world? He was like not even doing damage with fair, which is pretty much the main point of it. If i were him i wouldve made my djc longer for the fair but w/e, great match either way. I did notice how even though the fair wasnt doing much damage, it was blocking ur approachs. Alright, ummm so djc nair is good? I like using egg poop against ness. Shielded up and dsmash...never heard of that, but generally both those moves suck. Perhaps good for catching people off guard i guess.

Shiri said:

against arguably one of the best U.S. Ness players

Click to expand...

Reading is fun. :D

And yeah, you hit the nail right on the head--Ness' forward air doesn't HAVE to do damage if it blocks you or sets up for grabs (which it did almost everytime this man used it). Downsmash I'm trying to wean myself off of (former Peach main LOL) and upsmash is good when you can catch an opponent behind you, but Ness stays in his shield so much, upsmash just gets blocked; you better have kick DI at the ready when that happens, ROFL!

I think you DI the dthrow forward.

Ness has received so much hate lately for some reason. I kind of like him actually. Not to say this thread is hating on Ness or anything.

Of course not. o_o

**hatehatehate** >_>

LOL, this thread is priceless. Especially since more Ness players have posted than Yoshis (as far as I can tell).

To beat Ness, you jump off the edge and use Yoshi Bomb. The Ness will instinctively follow you off the edge and suicide as well.

Shiri, i wasnt talking about yoshis dsmash and usmash, i meant ness's. And after watching that vid a few more times, that ness was really good. OOOOOOOOOOOO I get it now! U meant u were doing dsmashs and usmashs...i thought u meant the ness was. Thats why i said Usmash and dsmash suck, becuase ness's do, not yoshi's. Ok my bad...

Anyways, i saw u getting owned by those djced fairs to grabs, but how do u stop them. Since he was doing that alot, why not run in, spot dodge to dsmash. Its simple but its worth a shot i think. Any other ways to stop them.

I HATE spotdodging against Ness. The only times I do it are totally out of habit.

His stomp WRECKS almost every characters' spotdodges. It's so lame. Again, not much Yoshi can do about DJC sparkles except maybe get over him and time a nasty fastfall. Nothing really gets through them. I could be missing something, though. Maybe you can CC and then jab his grab attempt? I'm not good at CC, so I don't know how much it would help. x_x

If he djcs a fair u could spotdodge, maybe do it a bit early if he is already gonna do a fair, then jab, ftilt, or dsmash. CC works somewhat (though im used to nesses that use fair to rack up damage, so that doesnt work against them). Keep your distance! Use eggs to try and block off approaches! It works well, and ness doesnt really have a good ground approach except for dash attack, which u can jump over and DJC a nair. I like being defensive, especially against wicked quick nesses like Mew2matt's. By stomp do u mean ness's dair? cuz it doesnt really give me trouble, errrmm its really not that good. Btw, when playing defensive lightshield alot!

Stomp isn't that good of a move, but its weakness is its advantage. It is timed slightly off what you would expect, so if you try to sidestep often you get hit by the delayed hitbox. That's why the move is annoying.

Doing the sidestep to avoid the DJC f-air would work if the Ness can't l-cancel. If he can, you would have trouble timing it that perfectly. Sidestep is for grabs and laggy aerials, not multi-hit difficult to predict and hard to counter moves like Ness' DJC f-air.

Alright thanks bringer. What would u suggest doing against nesses fair?

don't have time to read this right now so I apologize if people have said this already.

The |Egg| Sniper does this combo to me a lot:
Baits me into the air or uses stage manipulation with eggs to eventually pop me up and then he does a fair into a falling nair and then chases with a dash attack because Yoshi's is...well...awesome =_=. But yeah that kinda happens whether I tech the fair or not [or even if I crouch tech the falling nair]...his reaction time is usually pretty good, and if I reads me well enough and I either tech in place or try to roll the other way [though the momentum from crouch-teching the other way causes me to stay pretty much in the same place at medium-high damage] he'll dsmash.

Either way, it's always a better choice to stay grounded against a Yoshi because once you're in the air, there isn't a whole lot you can do. Dean, Egg Sniper, really earns that name whenever he gets me off of the stage. As soon as I start to PKT, I'm already hit with an egg...and then once I'm far away, he'll egg-edgehog so basically I'm screwed no matter where I go. If I go to the edge, yeah I'm edehogged, and if I go above, I get hit by the egg, and then he rains doom on me with awesomeness that I block out of my memory.

That said, Ness DOES have the upperhand, but he has to be extremely defensive and reaction-based. DJC-fair-grab-dthrow-etc etc etc can only do but so much because if the Yoshi is ready for it, the dthrow can be DI'ed out of another grab.

But yeah...tech chasing with dash attack??? ugh. Hurts my feelings. So does being dtilted when I narrowly miss a sweetspot with PKT2. If you're going to tech, Nessians, ALWAYS tech-walljump. Always.


****ing eggs. [note, kids: censor dodging is bad. ^_^]
;___;

Thanks toasty. ANd thanks Egg sniper for teaching Toasty what Yoshis can do.

OH WAIT! one more crucial thing. I completely forgot his main way of setting up that first combo [and continuing it]. Sometimes, if the Ness isn't perfect [and hardly any of them are] with timing and mindreading [hah], then what the Yoshi will do is this:

grab>dthrow>fair>nair>tech-chase grab

pretty sure he can chain this once or twice. After that the Ness has enough damage to get out of it, I think. I'll need to test that again...but yeah once the chain is broken, sometimes Dean will dthrow me, and nair, or that's when he'll do the fair>nair>dash-attack