So...none items user....cant adapt?

Items get in my way and destroy my techniques and combos. They are based on randomness and any character that gets a weapon has an advantage over the other players. For example, one could be pwning the other with combos and skill in a three stock battle. All of a sudden, the other character gets a final smash such as a landmaster or super sonic and kills them two times. Items are fun for casual play, but on a competitive level, they are very irksome.Also, how does the fact that items force you to dodge mean that it takes skill to win. Dodging does not require much skill

Randomness is half the fun of Super Smash Bros. If you're about to KO someone, but suddenly they pick up a hammer and KO you, that's funny, it sucks to be you, and get over it.

Although I fully understand where this would be avoided in competitive situations.

There are items torunaments?

...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHahaHAHaHahaHAHAHHAHAHAHAHahaHAhahahaHaHahhaahaHaHAHAhAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhahaHaHaHaHa!!!

Oh, man. Oh man.

Anyway, put it into another perspective - someone mentioned that there is technically more survival involved with items play. This is true. However this is also where it cases to become a fighting game - because many items on matches boil down to players camping and running in order to wait for the most opportune item. Forget about opinions - play style itself dictates that items on play is not necessarily about who is better at attacking, defending and fighting, but who is better at running and collecting. Once again, I like fighting games.

There are items-on tournaments?

...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHahaHAHaHahaHAHAHHAHAHAHAHahaHAhahahaHaHahhaahaHaHAHAhAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhahaHaHaHaHa!!!

Oh, man. Oh man.

Anyway, put it into another perspective - someone mentioned that there is technically more survival involved with items play. This is true.

However this is also where it ceases to become a fighting game - because many items on matches boil down to players camping and running in order to wait for the most opportune item.

Forget about opinions - play style itself dictates that items on play is not necessarily about who is better at attacking, defending and fighting, but who is better at running and collecting. Once again, I like fighting games.

apokalypsis. said:

Randomness is half the fun of Super Smash Bros. If you're about to KO someone, but suddenly they pick up a hammer and KO you, that's funny, it sucks to be you, and get over it.

Although I fully understand where this would be avoided in competitive situations.

Click to expand...

This is what we're talking about... competitive situations...

A New Challenger said:

Forget about opinions - play style itself dictates that items on play is not necessarily about who is better at attacking, defending and fighting, but who is better at running and collecting. Once again, I like fighting games.

Click to expand...

Ahah, there is some truth to that!

Imp said:

Didn't bother to read the whole thread for this soul reason:
The author's join date is March 2008, the likelihood of him ever being in the competitive side of Melee, or any smash prior to Brawl is near implausible. If you know nothing of the competitive style of game play, how can you ever expect to change it? This is why you can't be the president of a country and not have ever lived in it. It is impossible for you to know the other person's view of the subject.

Items are more fun, for casual players. Casual players game play will never be accepted in the professional/competitive style. No pro I know is afraid of items, nor am I, in fact in a fun game with friends I prefer it. But when it whittles down to a skilled 1v1 or a team battle, items will always be turned off in my book.

DanteSmash7, you have a very moot point and are preaching to the wrong crowd. I'm positive you already know that, you just like to argue for the sake of arguing. This is a fruitless thread, and you will receive nothing from it aside from being looked down upon.

Click to expand...

So being here since April of 06 makes you better? You've got 22 posts, does that make you useless? For the most part, sign up time and post count (my point, not yours) are nothing but a way for people to think they're better and more experianced than people who've not been on their forum. I've got 1,700-something posts and almost 2 years at another forum, doesn't give me an inch of authority or superiority.

A New Challenger said:

There are items-on tournaments?

...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHahaHAHaHahaHAHAHHAHAHAHAHahaHAhahahaHaHahhaahaHaHAHAhAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhahaHaHaHaHa!!!

Oh, man. Oh man.

Anyway, put it into another perspective - someone mentioned that there is technically more survival involved with items play. This is true.

However this is also where it ceases to become a fighting game - because many items on matches boil down to players camping and running in order to wait for the most opportune item.

Forget about opinions - play style itself dictates that items on play is not necessarily about who is better at attacking, defending and fighting, but who is better at running and collecting. Once again, I like fighting games.

Click to expand...

Not everyone always rushes OCD to grab items. I know, I play with them.

The guy who runs to a ledge to get the item is the defenseless guy who gets smashed off.

Noypi_GjD said:

Still waiting for Mario Kart Wii... to aid purge these forums.

Click to expand...

Bad news, c*ck*ss, I'm not getting Mario Kart Wii.

So being here since April of 06 makes you better? You've got 22 posts, does that make you useless?

Click to expand...

It almost amazes me that you can quote a post and manage to completely misinterpret it at the same time. I didn't boast about my superior join date, I stated the likelihood of him being a non casual is very low. I didn't state it as fact.

I've got 1,700-something posts and almost 2 years at another forum, doesn't give me an inch of authority or superiority.

Click to expand...

I've got near 3 years and 3k posts at another forum, and no, it doesn't give direct superiority. But it is proof that you have been around longer, thus being more knowledgeable; hopefully. It isn't always the case, but more often so then not, it is.

prat.

WHY IS THIS THREAD STILL HERE!?! PLEASE STOP, FOR WITH EACH POST, I LOSE MORE AND MORE FAITH IN HUMANITY!!!

Seriously, items are not fair. Plenty of arguments have been made. None have been refuted. All have merely been ignored.

seriously. lock this thread. The OP can't even write..

For the record, saw this article about Smash Bros 64 by Sakurai:
http://www.n-sider.com/articleview.php?articleid=637

My favorite quote is "There is a mechanism of accidents occurring, balanced so that the game's progress and results falter easily. Whether you win or lose, you enjoy a hearty laugh, and move on to the next round. I think this makes quite a good game."

This may be better actually, "When you experience defeat, you should not feel down or remorseful, but rather praise your opponent for putting up a good fight. This is the essence of Smash Bros."

The ESSENCE of Smash Bros, as stated by good ol' Sakurai himself. It isn't just a freak show of who can memorize lag times on down airs faster. It's supposed to be enjoyable and fun.

Ragingtsunami726 said:

For the record, saw this article about Smash Bros 64 by Sakurai:
http://www.n-sider.com/articleview.php?articleid=637

My favorite quote is "There is a mechanism of accidents occurring, balanced so that the game's progress and results falter easily. Whether you win or lose, you enjoy a hearty laugh, and move on to the next round. I think this makes quite a good game."

This may be better actually, "When you experience defeat, you should not feel down or remorseful, but rather praise your opponent for putting up a good fight. This is the essence of Smash Bros."

The ESSENCE of Smash Bros, as stated by good ol' Sakurai himself. It isn't just a freak show of who can memorize lag times on down airs faster. It's supposed to be enjoyable and fun.

Click to expand...

sure, cuz memorizing lag times on down airs make you immune to hearty laughs , and makes you stop playing when you lose , feel dow and insult your opponent amirite? memorizing lag times on down airs is so **** far from the essence of Smash Bros it destroys your melee discs

Ragingtsunami726 said:

The ESSENCE of Smash Bros, as stated by good ol' Sakurai himself. It isn't just a freak show of who can memorize lag times on down airs faster. It's supposed to be enjoyable and fun.

Click to expand...

Did it ever occur to you that the competitive style of Smash with items off is fun? If it wasn't fun, why the hell would we be playing it? Sakurai gave us the option to turn off items because he realizes that everyone has their own preferences not just his grand idea of Smash. Just so happens that a lot of players prefer no items due to the element of randomness they add to the game.

Ragingtsunami726 said:

For the record, saw this article about Smash Bros 64 by Sakurai:
http://www.n-sider.com/articleview.php?articleid=637

My favorite quote is "There is a mechanism of accidents occurring, balanced so that the game's progress and results falter easily. Whether you win or lose, you enjoy a hearty laugh, and move on to the next round. I think this makes quite a good game."

This may be better actually, "When you experience defeat, you should not feel down or remorseful, but rather praise your opponent for putting up a good fight. This is the essence of Smash Bros."

The ESSENCE of Smash Bros, as stated by good ol' Sakurai himself. It isn't just a freak show of who can memorize lag times on down airs faster. It's supposed to be enjoyable and fun.

Click to expand...

This article clearly points out everything that non-item supporters have stated. We don't want "accidents" occurring that cause the "results to falter easily." This may be fun in casual play but it is not the result most tournament players want to see. Whether competitive players win or lose they still, "enjoy a hearty laugh and move on to the next round." If they couldn't do that then they would never have developed into a competitive player; however, we move onto the next round to get better, not to have "the game's progress and results falter."

Even when we experience defeat, competitive players don't feel any more "down or remorseful" than a player who plays with items. The only time most tournament players feel any remorse is when they lose at a tournament, as they have lost the chance at the prize. This would hold true whether or not items were allowed in the tournament. We also "praise our opponent for putting up a good fight." If the opponent won, then we practice until we can defeat them. If the player won, then they shake hands and commend their opponent on a good fight. Nobody is going to be as praised in a tournament where they won because the game favored them.

Maybe people defending that the game must be played with Sakurai's "Essence of Smash" should consider this other quote, "No matter how people play, I want everyone to be happy! Is this asking for too much?" We are happy playing in fair, one-on-one matches that does not have "progress and results falter easily."

I greatly appreciate this article. You just gave us ammo, directly from the game developer himself, that states that items are created to weaken competitive play and make the game more fun for the casual player. We'll continue turning these items off to enhance our competitive gaming.

My joy for competitive gameplay is to win; and if I lose, I'm almost more excited then if I would have won. Ever since the 64 version of smash me and my older brother played competitively, and he was always better then me. I didn't toss the control and start slitting, I continued to train and get better. The day I finally surpassed him was so worth it.

What I do dislike is losing to someone that I am better then due to luck. i.e. items, crap stages, etc. 1v1 3 stock 8 mins finds the player with the better skill every time. Not counting fatigue and outside circumstances like that.

The better player should always be the victor, luck conflicts with that, thus it will never be included.

i wish this thread would go away............ I'm tired of seeing "none item user"

Yeah, it dosent even sound right.

so let's bump it again...........



"sigh"