volt. 雷
Smash Rookie
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Thanks for replying! For future reference, where should i post something like this?Welcome to the boards!
I do not think that this is the right place to post this, but I'll reply anyway. I think a lot of people can agree that Roy being Bottom 7 is probably incorrect, but I also think that saying that he is better than Marth is a bit of a stretch to say the least. Marth and Lucina have been proving their worth a lot recently, and their theories and gameplay are being exploited to the maximum, with them growing a lot everyday.
Ok, thanks. I'll keep that in mind.I am not sure, that would be the mods' job to decide. Perhaps the Roy boards? Though this could still generate interesting discussions.
This is misleading. Roy uses the full length of his sword same as any sword character. Sours lead into tech chases and can set up kills, not to mention they're less commital than sweets. Roy is about controlled pressure, knowing how and when to get in and get big damage, while also knowing when to space aerials and stuff approaches.since he gets the most out of being up and close.
Ah, I see. Thanks for clearing that up, I never really tried taking advantage of the sourspot for setups. I'll go try that next time I play Roy.This is misleading. Roy uses the full length of his sword same as any sword character. Sours lead into tech chases and can set up kills, not to mention they're less commital than sweets. Roy is about controlled pressure, knowing how and when to get in and get big damage, while also knowing when to space aerials and stuff approaches.
This is why I keep preaching the virtues of aerial wavebounce DED, it's pretty much essential for Roy's aerial mobility. The ability to safely reverse Roy's aerial momentum on a dime is not only useful for mixups and reorienting, but is absolutely ESSENTIAL for Roy to reset neutral when he's launched in the air by opponents who can easily anticipate his landing or have good aerial juggling. Even ZeRo recently lamented that Roy has difficulties with landing back on stage, which simply isn't the case if you just properly time Roy's aerial wavebounce to move away from the direction your opponents anticipate you'll land (even better if they commit by dashing to where they think you'll land, as it will be much harder for them to turnaround in time if you change trajectories in the opposite direction). Watching even Ryo's matches there are so many times where Roy is launched in the air and trying to land safely, only to be easily intercepted by a waiting opponent's attack, that could have been completely avoided by wavebouncing safely away. It's so important to Roy's repertoire but from what I can tell practically nobody's doing it, and it's maddening when I see Roy mains slip from a perfectly good lead because they become juggle fodder. Like anything in Sm4sh it isn't 100% guaranteed in all situations, but in most cases it works great.Everyone knows about Roy's high air speed but low air acceleration, but few people talk about what that really means. It means that Roy can move fast in any direction he chooses when he jumps, but once you commit to a direction, you have to use a resource (double jump) to course correct because he cannot weave very well while in the air. I made this spreadsheet a while ago to show how you can control how far you travel based on how you execute your jump. Using this knowledge, you can actually execute proper retreating aerials, and cover huge amounts of space...but you gotta practice it, and it's different than for most other characters.
The other thing you'll have to learn as Roy is how to manage your disadvantage state. Roy eats a lot of combos, and you'll have to manage your resources (double jump) carefully, or you'll end up getting gimped. Knowing when you can escape is very important, so you don't end up getting your double jump sniped (which'll pretty much guarantee you'll eat double the amount of damage you would've otherwise).
First of all, thank you for informing me about those sources, I'll fix that as soon as possible. Second, I think you misunderstood me. His dash attack is not his only amazing move, it's just an example of a move that I love to use for combos. And BTW, I have been playing Roy for about 4 years now. Sorry for the miscommunication!Hmm, the second two videos you posted don't seem credible. The second one in particular seems to have misinformation, for example it lists super armor on Roy's recovery as a pro...but Roy doesn't have super armor on his up+b when he's recovering, only when he's grounded. Also claims Roy has the best punish game because he has a fast fsmash that kills early. :-/ Not to mention the creation date on both of those videos is super old. The first video, Art of Roy, is good, though.
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I'm not sure how much you've used Roy if you're listing dash attack as his amazing move.
Thanks for the advice!this spreadsheet[/URL] a while ago to show how you can control how far you travel based on how you execute your jump. Using this knowledge, you can actually execute proper retreating aerials, and cover huge amounts of space...but you gotta practice it, and it's different than for most other characters.
The other thing you'll have to learn as Roy is how to manage your disadvantage state. Roy eats a lot of combos, and you'll have to manage your resources (double jump) carefully, or you'll end up getting gimped. Knowing when you can escape is very important, so you don't end up getting your double jump sniped (which'll pretty much guarantee you'll eat double the amount of damage you would've otherwise). Remember Roy's up+b has better hitboxes in front than above, so using a diagonal recovery is generally better so you can have those protective hitboxes.
*yawn* ended up typing more than I expected lol. But yeah, this is some of the stuff you'll need to think about when using Roy in S4.
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This is misleading. Roy uses the full length of his sword same as any sword character. Sours lead into tech chases and can set up kills, not to mention they're less commital than sweets. Roy is about controlled pressure, knowing how and when to get in and get big damage, while also knowing when to space aerials and stuff approaches.
his sourspots and bleh recovery are definitely very exploitable.He's viable I think. He's certainly not one of the better swordfighters and there's not much reason to play him over better swordies, but I don't see him having any matchups that are undoable. I don't play the character but I'd imagine most of his matchups are in the -1 to evenish area.
If you like him, play him. I think his placement is more due to lack of rep. He's probably mid tier somewhere. He certainly doesn't have any super bad exploitable trait that other low tiers have like mac's recovery, ganon mobility, shulk frame data, ect. It's more that his options are all average-ish while not having anything super amazing.
This is incorrect, as his sourspots are not a weak point, but a strong point. they are great for combos and tech chases.his sourspots and bleh recovery are definitely very exploitable.
Apologies for the miscommunication, I don't play PM Roy, and didn't speak towards PM Roy except on dtilt, since I don't know that character very well. I specifically wasn't sure how long you'd been playing S4 Roy (obviously not 4 years in that case, as S4 isn't that old as a game), and PM Roy and S4 Roy are very different. It's a bit hard to know which version of Roy you're talking about at which points tbh. I'll probably only talk in terms of S4 Roy, unless explicitly mentioned.First of all, thank you for informing me about those sources, I'll fix that as soon as possible. Second, I think you misunderstood me. His dash attack is not his only amazing move, it's just an example of a move that I love to use for combos. And BTW, I have been playing Roy for about 4 years now. Sorry for the miscommunication!
I've seen that before, you've mentioned it before here lol. Many Roys use wavebounce DED and flare blade.This is why I keep preaching the virtues of aerial wavebounce DED, it's pretty much essential for Roy's aerial mobility. The ability to safely reverse Roy's aerial momentum on a dime is not only useful for mixups and reorienting, but is absolutely ESSENTIAL for Roy to reset neutral when he's launched in the air by opponents who can easily anticipate his landing or have good aerial juggling. Even ZeRo recently lamented that Roy has difficulties with landing back on stage, which simply isn't the case if you just properly time Roy's aerial wavebounce to move away from the direction your opponents anticipate you'll land (even better if they commit by dashing to where they think you'll land, as it will be much harder for them to turnaround in time if you change trajectories in the opposite direction). Watching even Ryo's matches there are so many times where Roy is launched in the air and trying to land safely, only to be easily intercepted by a waiting opponent's attack, that could have been completely avoided by wavebouncing safely away. It's so important to Roy's repertoire but from what I can tell practically nobody's doing it, and it's maddening when I see Roy mains slip from a perfectly good lead because they become juggle fodder. Like anything in Sm4sh it isn't 100% guaranteed in all situations, but in most cases it works great.
Not sure what you mean by his sour spots being exploitable? They are not punishable on hit. They can't directly kill, but you can use several of them (i.e. sour falling uair <3 ) as a solid combo option.his sourspots and bleh recovery are definitely very exploitable.