Social Zelda Social: An Upgraded Recycling Bin Princess

Are you happy with the Link Between Worlds redesign?

  • Yes, she's gorgeous and expressive.

    Votes: 152 60.6%
  • No, Breath of the Wild had such potential.

    Votes: 50 19.9%
  • No, Twilight Princess death stare Zelda was the best design.

    Votes: 33 13.1%
  • I'm happy with any design, just as long as she's viable,

    Votes: 16 6.4%

  • Total voters
    251

Luminario

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#1


Welcome to the Zelda discussion thread, for all subjects about the paragon of wisdom and Smash's resident spellcaster herself.
As was shown off at e3, Zelda is sporting a gorgeous new redesign in the style of Link Between Worlds, retaining pretty much all of her moveset from what I can tell.
Some small changes I've noticed are:​

  • Zelda's jab is now a flurry type attack like Palutena's. Simply tapping A has her use her old jab.
  • Din's Fire no longer puts Zelda into free-fall (BLESSED)
  • Farore's Wind now seems to travel quicker. The aerial endlag has also been massively reduced, now Zelda can immediately drift left or right after re-appearing. The elevator is back, though it's unclear if it's still as powerful.
  • Phantom Slash assembles piece by piece from the sky behind her before it shoots forwards. At full charge the Phantom is now delayed for a second before flying off. Zelda is free to move the moment it is done charging, meaning they can attack in tandem.
  • Zelda has multiple new animations and stances, likely due to her updated design. Her idle stance, grab, and one of her taunts is completely new.
  • She has all new victory poses. The first is swishing around the magic ribbon from her up smash and new taunt before posing with her two fingers pointing just to the left of the camera, the second is her swishing around a fiery wisp on her finger, and the third is forming the phantom behind her before posing with one hand on her hip.
  • Zelda also has a new voice.
  • Completely new Final Smash: Triforce of Wisdom. Seems to have taken inspiration from her Power of Sealing in Breath of the Wild as a Black Hole type attack directly in front of her.
 
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Quillion

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#2
What I think they should do:

Make the Lightning Kicks have a full hitbox instead of a sweetspot.

Switch Din's Fire and the Light Arrow; Light Arrow would be her side-B, Din's Fire would be the massive explosion as seen in OoT.

Maybe give her a rapier for more range a la TP. Heck, just give her more range on her moves regardless.

Now she's the threatening Glass Cannon that she's meant to be.
 

Quillion

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#4
For the love of all that is holy PLEASE BUFF THE **** OUT OF HER.

No character deserves to be so bad so consistently. Even Dan Hibiki has been good in some games.
:061:
Well, they managed to make Mewtwo good, and he's of the same lightweight, magic/psychic-using archetype as Zelda is. Anything is possible.

Oh! Maybe they can change Zelda's run from a sluggish speedwalk to a speedy float like Mewtwo.
 

DNeon

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#5
I can see a lot changing this iteration. I'm usually pretty down to earth with saying things are gonna be the same but with BotW being such a massive success I think that Zelda might be getting a few changes. Firstly I think Phantom Slash is gone (which sucks, I actualy quite liked the concept, if not the execution, why not let charge be stored?), and I agree that Power of Sealing is a likely replacement.

Secondly I can see potential for her spells to be updated to reflect the Champion abilities since Link isn't likely to be entirely overhauled to make use of them. Her sweet spots or smash attacks might end up being more reflective of Urbosa's Fury, Nayru's Love will probably be replaced by Daruk's Protection. Farore's Wind replaced with Revali's Gale obviously, perhaps functioning like Megaman's custom Tornado Hold. Where it get's complicated is Mipha's Grace, as a healing component like WFT's down B doesn't work without ranged pressure and we're running out of specials, so Light Arrow might be repurposed here as a Side B and Power of Sealing could be the Final Smash.

This does significantly change the character but I think there's enough justification for it.
 

Luminario

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#6
What I think they should do:

Make the Lightning Kicks have a full hitbox instead of a sweetspot.

Switch Din's Fire and the Light Arrow; Light Arrow would be her side-B, Din's Fire would be the massive explosion as seen in OoT.

Maybe give her a rapier for more range a la TP. Heck, just give her more range on her moves regardless.

Now she's the threatening Glass Cannon that she's meant to be.
I dunno, I like Din's Fire the way it is, no other fighter has anything like it.
The other things would make her much more viable, though if she needs range they can just extend the hitboxes and add a few more sparkles to it. That's the beauty of a magic moveset, no actual weapon is required, she can just create a slash of light or a fiery explosion and it's completely fitting.
I can see a lot changing this iteration. I'm usually pretty down to earth with saying things are gonna be the same but with BotW being such a massive success I think that Zelda might be getting a few changes. Firstly I think Phantom Slash is gone (which sucks, I actualy quite liked the concept, if not the execution, why not let charge be stored?), and I agree that Power of Sealing is a likely replacement.

Secondly I can see potential for her spells to be updated to reflect the Champion abilities since Link isn't likely to be entirely overhauled to make use of them. Her sweet spots or smash attacks might end up being more reflective of Urbosa's Fury, Nayru's Love will probably be replaced by Daruk's Protection. Farore's Wind replaced with Revali's Gale obviously, perhaps functioning like Megaman's custom Tornado Hold. Where it get's complicated is Mipha's Grace, as a healing component like WFT's down B doesn't work without ranged pressure and we're running out of specials, so Light Arrow might be repurposed here as a Side B and Power of Sealing could be the Final Smash.

This does significantly change the character but I think there's enough justification for it.
I feel like Zelda suits a teleport more, but if Revali's Gale is added to be this grand flashy tornado then I really won't complain. All Champion abilities but Mipha's Grace are able to fit nicely into her specials, with the Power of Sealing being a new down B, so maybe Mipha could pop up elsewhere, if not a fighter then what about an assist trophy? Hers is the hardest ability to place in a moveset anyway. Light Arrow works too well as an easy FS for me to see the devs change it.
 
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#8
I honestly don't want her changed too much in terms of specials, but I feel like her frame lag needs to worked on drastically. That's her main downfall as a character. Farore's Wind I think is the biggest letdown in terms of lag.
 

CaptainAmerica

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#9
Love playing Zelda. She's definitely my number 2.

I would hope she comes in with one of her ceremonial dresses as an option. Her royal gown was beautiful, and so underused in BotW.


If they still had transformations in, it'd be intsresting if that Zelda costume went to 'Shiek' wearing the BotW adventuring outfit.

I don't think I'd like too many changes to her moveset, but maybe the BotW powers could replace or be alternate moves for her specials. Daruk's Protection would be an easy color swap of Nayru's Love, Urbosa's Fury would be a lightning-based Din's Fire, and the only difference between Farore's Wind and Revali's Gale would be that you can see her and it has a windbox. Mipha's Grace is a bit harder, unless they wanted to give her a healing down-special like WFT.

I am tired of seeing her at the bottom of the tier list though.
 
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#10
Zelda with Champion Powers. Spirit Forms appear during moves.

B Mipha's Grace: A counter that cancels damage from the delivered attack and makes a shield (similar looking to Nayru's Love) with hit points totaling half of the negated damage. Cannot be used again until broken.

Down B Urbosa's Fury: Same as the Phantom except with Urbosa's spirit

Up B Revali's Gale: Same as Farore's Wind; spirit of Revali appears near Zelda

Side B Daruk's Protection: Navigated Orange ball similar to Din's Fire, except when activated appears to be a smaller shape of Daruk's magic polygon shield. Acts as a Mine. Explodes when touched. Can be exploded with Side B.
 

Luminario

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#11
Zelda with Champion Powers. Spirit Forms appear during moves.

B Mipha's Grace: A counter that cancels damage from the delivered attack and makes a shield (similar looking to Nayru's Love) with hit points totaling half of the negated damage. Cannot be used again until broken.

Down B Urbosa's Fury: Same as the Phantom except with Urbosa's spirit

Up B Revali's Gale: Same as Farore's Wind; spirit of Revali appears near Zelda

Side B Daruk's Protection: Navigated Orange ball similar to Din's Fire, except when activated appears to be a smaller shape of Daruk's magic polygon shield. Acts as a Mine. Explodes when touched. Can be exploded with Side B.
But that's so off concept for all the Champion abilities though. Daruk's Protection is BotW's Nayru's Love, Urbosa's Fury is Din's Fire, Revali only creates an updraft instead of teleporting, and Mipha's Grace could be implemented as a counter type ability but it's concept is healing as opposed to any offensive or defensive ability.
 
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#12
Smash's Din Fire is not that similar to its Ocarina counterpart. Urbosa's Fury is closer to Smash's Phantom than Smash's Din.

Daruk's Protection is more intuitively the same as Nayru's Love. True. I was trying to give each Champion a special, and Daruk's Protection seemed like the best fit for a guidable stage control projectile. Healing is a defensive move, but I thought more useful would be shield to absorb future hits, furthering Zelda's role as a defensive mage.
 
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Morbi

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#13
Honestly, I do not care about her tier, but once it makes the character unfun, we have a problem. I used to enjoy her in melee and I vaguely used her in Brawl; however, I do not even touch her in this game. I love BowserLick's idea of reworking her specials to reflect Breath of the Wild and hope to the goddesses that she actually gets redesigned aesthetically.
 

Luminario

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#14
Smash's Din Fire is not that similar to its Ocarina counterpart. Urbosa's Fury is closer to Smash's Phantom than Smash's Din.

Daruk's Protection is more intuitively the same as Nayru's Love. True. I was trying to give each Champion a special, and Daruk's Protection seemed like the best fit for a guidable stage control projectile. Healing is a defensive move, but I thought more useful would be shield to absorb future hits, furthering Zelda's role as a defensive mage.
I meant Urbosa's Fury is more similar to OoT's Din's Fire, as a large dome attack that severely damages any enemy in range. This could then carry over to Smash to let Zelda throw out a small yellow wisp as opposed to the small fiery wisp of Din's Fire, so we keep the same basic concept for the attack only it's electrical instead of fiery.
Like, I get what you were going for, but they'd probably try to stick to how the powers work in the game and how they fit into Zelda's current moveset. Sakurai never likes to stray too far from established movesets.
I'll say it's an inventive use of Mipha's Grace though, I never would have come up with it. the way you implement it does make sense I guess, as Mipha saves your *** when you **** up in both games then.
 

Morbi

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#15
I meant Urbosa's Fury is more similar to OoT's Din's Fire, as a large dome attack that severely damages any enemy in range. This could then carry over to Smash to let Zelda throw out a small yellow wisp as opposed to the small fiery wisp of Din's Fire, so we keep the same basic concept for the attack only it's electrical instead of fiery.
Like, I get what you were going for, but they'd probably try to stick to how the powers work in the game and how they fit into Zelda's current moveset. Sakurai never likes to stray too far from established movesets.
I'll say it's an inventive use of Mipha's Grace though, I never would have come up with it. the way you implement it does make sense I guess, as Mipha saves your *** when you **** up in both games then.
I could even see them saving Mipha's Grace as a Final Smash to be honest. Similar to Peach.
 
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#16
I think revamping Zelda's magic sparkles into magic sparkly Eastern-style dragons (like the ones in BotW) would be a visual improvement and further highlight Zelda's elegance (even in battle).

Example: Neutral aerial is a serpentine, transparent energy dragon spiraling around her body.
 
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Cazzone

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#18
The only thing that concerns me about Zelda is if they’re going to redesign her or not. Botw Zelda is beautiful and keeping Zelda in her TP outfit three games in a row is pretty stagnant, so...Let’s keep our fingers crossed guys!
 

McKnightlíght

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#19
The only thing that concerns me about Zelda is if they’re going to redesign her or not. Botw Zelda is beautiful and keeping Zelda in her TP outfit three games in a row is pretty stagnant, so...Let’s keep our fingers crossed guys!
 
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#22
Personally, I would love for Zelda to be updated to reflect her Breath of the Wild Design - its probably my favourite incarnation of Zelda so far. If she were changed to this design, with a refreshed moveset, I would have a much greater desire to play as her.

I've posted this elsewhere, but I definitely agree that the best approach to her moveset would be to incorporate the champion abilities into her specials. This would be a good way to represent the champions, while still keeping room in BOTW Link's moveset for other elements of the game (runes, weapons, etc). Though she did not use these moves in-game, it can be justified similar to how Melee Zelda made use of the three goddess' spells from Ocarina of Time. It is thematically fitting considering that Zelda led the champions, and they were tasked to protect her - it makes sense that their spirits would aid her in battle.

Here are my ideas. For each special, the champion's spirit would appear and say a line of dialogue.
  • Neutral Special: Mipha's Grace - a swirl of water deals some minor damage to nearby opponents, similar to Nayru's Love. It also has healing properties for Zelda.
  • Side Special: Urbosa's Fury - Zelda spins around and snaps her finger, summoning a bolt of lightning in front of her. The distance the bolt appears is determined by how long the input is held.
  • Up Special: Revali's Gale - Zelda is whisked upward by a gust of air.
  • Down Special: Daruk's Protection - Zelda is surrounded by a translucent orange barrier. She cannot attack in this state, but if she is hit by an opponent, Daruk's spirit will appear and counter-attack.
This version of Zelda also has three great potential costumes - her champion's outift, her fancy dress, and her white gown. I actually did up a set of ten palette swaps using these three outfits:

Click the image for better resolution.

The top row is her champion outfit: the default colours, a palette inspired by Skyward Sword Zelda, a palette inspired by Tetra, and a palette inspired by the Zelda Animated Series (ok, the show was bad but I admittedly kind of liked her design, color-wise at least)
Then there are three swaps inspired by the royal dress: the default, an Ocarina of Time-inspired palette, and a Twilight Princess-inspired palette.
Finally, there are three swaps inspired by her ceremonial gown: the default, one inspired by young Zelda from Ocarina of Time, and one inspired by a Link to the Past.
 
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Luminario

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#25
I think revamping Zelda's magic sparkles into magic sparkly Eastern-style dragons (like the ones in BotW) would be a visual improvement and further highlight Zelda's elegance (even in battle).

Example: Neutral aerial is a serpentine, transparent energy dragon spiraling around her body.
You mean go full-on Hanzo/Genji on everyone? It could work, and it fits with them being the embodiment of the 3 Goddesses that she got her spells from, but using mini-dragons as attacks aren't really what Zelda is known for.
 
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#26
You mean go full-on Hanzo/Genji on everyone? It could work, and it fits with them being the embodiment of the 3 Goddesses that she got her spells from, but using mini-dragons as attacks aren't really what Zelda is known for.
I watched a clip of Hanzo/Genji. Yes. Except much smaller.

Basically, a visual improvement over some of her magical swipes. Largely, based on the dragons near the springs in Breath of the Wild. Creating a mystical snapping dragon jaw for a Smash could be neat (although possibly stepping on Corrin's visuals a bit).
 

DNeon

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#27
Personally, I would love for Zelda to be updated to reflect her Breath of the Wild Design - its probably my favourite incarnation of Zelda so far. If she were changed to this design, with a refreshed moveset, I would have a much greater desire to play as her.

I've posted this elsewhere, but I definitely agree that the best approach to her moveset would be to incorporate the champion abilities into her specials. This would be a good way to represent the champions, while still keeping room in BOTW Link's moveset for other elements of the game (runes, weapons, etc). Though she did not use these moves in-game, it can be justified similar to how Melee Zelda made use of the three goddess' spells from Ocarina of Time. It is thematically fitting considering that Zelda led the champions, and they were tasked to protect her - it makes sense that their spirits would aid her in battle.

Here are my ideas. For each special, the champion's spirit would appear and say a line of dialogue.
  • Neutral Special: Mipha's Grace - a swirl of water deals some minor damage to nearby, similar to Nayru's Love. It also has healing properties for Zelda.
  • Side Special: Urbosa's Fury - Zelda spins around and snaps her finger, summoning a bolt of lightning in front of her. The distance the bolt appears is determined by how long the input is held.
  • Up Special: Revali's Gale - Zelda is whisked upward by a gust of air.
  • Down Special: Daruk's Protection - Zelda is surrounded by a translucent orange barrier. She cannot attack in this state, but if she is hit by an opponent, Daruk's spirit will appear and counter-attack.
This version of Zelda also has three great potential costumes - her champion's outift, her fancy dress, and her white gown. I actually did up a set of ten palette swaps using these three outfits:

Click the image for better resolution.

The top row is her champion outfit: the default colours, a palette inspired by Skyward Sword Zelda, a palette inspired by Tetra, and a palette inspired by the Zelda Animated Series (ok, the show was bad but I admittedly kind of liked her design, color-wise at least)
Then there are three swaps inspired by the royal dress: the default, an Ocarina of Time-inspired palette, and a Twilight Princess-inspired palette.
Finally, there are three swaps inspired by her ceremonial gown: the default, one inspired by young Zelda from Ocarina of Time, and one inspired by a Link to the Past.
Love the alternates, they're absolutely amazing. Seriously, good work because they're gorgeous.

That said, as far as the moveset goes, I feel like having 2 reactive/defensive specials, 1 utility/recovery special and only 1 damaging special to force an approach leaves her kind of dull and way too static. Zelda in that state would basically only be as good as her side special is, assuming that her normals stay the same.

Although that's not exactly untrue to how she is now...
 
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Danpal65

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#28
Personally, I would love for Zelda to be updated to reflect her Breath of the Wild Design - its probably my favourite incarnation of Zelda so far. If she were changed to this design, with a refreshed moveset, I would have a much greater desire to play as her.

I've posted this elsewhere, but I definitely agree that the best approach to her moveset would be to incorporate the champion abilities into her specials. This would be a good way to represent the champions, while still keeping room in BOTW Link's moveset for other elements of the game (runes, weapons, etc). Though she did not use these moves in-game, it can be justified similar to how Melee Zelda made use of the three goddess' spells from Ocarina of Time. It is thematically fitting considering that Zelda led the champions, and they were tasked to protect her - it makes sense that their spirits would aid her in battle.

Here are my ideas. For each special, the champion's spirit would appear and say a line of dialogue.
  • Neutral Special: Mipha's Grace - a swirl of water deals some minor damage to nearby, similar to Nayru's Love. It also has healing properties for Zelda.
  • Side Special: Urbosa's Fury - Zelda spins around and snaps her finger, summoning a bolt of lightning in front of her. The distance the bolt appears is determined by how long the input is held.
  • Up Special: Revali's Gale - Zelda is whisked upward by a gust of air.
  • Down Special: Daruk's Protection - Zelda is surrounded by a translucent orange barrier. She cannot attack in this state, but if she is hit by an opponent, Daruk's spirit will appear and counter-attack.
This version of Zelda also has three great potential costumes - her champion's outift, her fancy dress, and her white gown. I actually did up a set of ten palette swaps using these three outfits:

Click the image for better resolution.

The top row is her champion outfit: the default colours, a palette inspired by Skyward Sword Zelda, a palette inspired by Tetra, and a palette inspired by the Zelda Animated Series (ok, the show was bad but I admittedly kind of liked her design, color-wise at least)
Then there are three swaps inspired by the royal dress: the default, an Ocarina of Time-inspired palette, and a Twilight Princess-inspired palette.
Finally, there are three swaps inspired by her ceremonial gown: the default, one inspired by young Zelda from Ocarina of Time, and one inspired by a Link to the Past.
I love the idea of BotW Zelda being in this Smash game and your palette and costume ideas really run the idea home. This Zelda design (and hopefully a new moveset) would be more than enough for me to try and main her. Default colours for her champion tunic and royal dress would be my picks for favourite.
 

Guybrush20X6

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#29
My idea for a Zelda Moveset involves her using the Sheikah Slate.

Bomb, Stasis, Magnesis, Cryo, Medival Selfies: there's a lot to choose from.
 

Guybrush20X6

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#31
I kinda expect Link to get that, since the magnesis fits in with his current ranged grab, and he'll keep access to bombs.
True but Zelda's current moveset is based off of techniques Link used in OoT so there's precedent.

And I remembered another power, amiibo! Basically drops a treasure chest that you can open for an item or use magnesis on.
 
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DNeon

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#32
True but Zelda's current moveset is based off of techniques Link used in OoT
I know, but I think Link's going to keep the slate and Zelda might be getting the Champion abilities. It's closer to their current selves, with Daruk's Protection basically being her current Nayru's Love and Urbosa's Fury fitting in to lightning kicks or smash attacks.
 

Guybrush20X6

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#33
I know, but I think Link's going to keep the slate and Zelda might be getting the Champion abilities. It's closer to their current selves, with Daruk's Protection basically being her current Nayru's Love and Urbosa's Fury fitting in to lightning kicks or smash attacks.
Using Mipha's Grace for a free Stock? Now that would send her up the tier list.

Realistically, I can see Mipha's Grace being a passive ability, fully healing Zelda once per life/match if she reaches a high threshold. Bottle Fairies heal at 100% but I think MG would need to kick in higher for balance.
 
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DNeon

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#34
It would absolutely need to kick in lower for balance, since making it once per match is too iffy for the non-stock game modes (or people playing with a high stock count), and so once per stock would be more likely. In that case the ability to make one stock reset at over 100% is basically granting a free stock. Being able to shrug off the first 30% of a stock is less of a massive swing in the game, but overall it just doesn't seem like a fun mechanic to have. She does seem very difficult to implement outside of a charged heal.

EDIT: This is all just speculation about how a Champion based moveset would work, not that it *should* happen, or that it would be better.
 
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Quillion

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#35
I'd rather that they go for a "change as little as possible" approach.

In addition to what I said earlier:

What I think they should do:

Make the Lightning Kicks have a full hitbox instead of a sweetspot.

Switch Din's Fire and the Light Arrow; Light Arrow would be her side-B, Din's Fire would be the massive explosion as seen in OoT.

Maybe give her a rapier for more range a la TP. Heck, just give her more range on her moves regardless.

Now she's the threatening Glass Cannon that she's meant to be.
I'd give something else:

Make Nayru's Love a "hold" reflector that does damage as it's held.
 

BJN39

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#37
See now I was about to make this thread 2 days ago but then I realized it wasn’t going to be any sort of Zelda appreciation and socializing thread and instead be a thread where people were just going to offer their ‘insights’ on how to buff her.... T



Zelda’s magnificence was not meant to be bound by the general veteran board :secretkpop:

See y’all on Zelda’s char board when she’s official where we can all get to know each other on less “buff Zelda/change Zelda” terms. Thenk yew
 
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Morbi

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#39
I'm actually surprised that more people want Zelda revamped than even Ganondorf at this point.
I guess Ganondorf has a sort of charm that people become attached to (to be fair, he is modeled after Captain Falcon which is basically Smash Incarnate). Zelda just feels really disjointed. I have to imagine that is one of the reasons. Regardless, it still stands as a surprise to me as well.
 
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#40
I love the idea of BotW Zelda being in this Smash game and your palette and costume ideas really run the idea home. This Zelda design (and hopefully a new moveset) would be more than enough for me to try and main her. Default colours for her champion tunic and royal dress would be my picks for favourite.
Love the alternates, they're absolutely amazing. Seriously, good work because they're gorgeous.
Aw thank you, glad you like my palette swap ideas! ^_^

That said, as far as the moveset goes, I feel like having 2 reactive/defensive specials, 1 utility/recovery special and only 1 damaging special to force an approach leaves her kind of dull and way too static. Zelda in that state would basically only be as good as her side special is, assuming that her normals stay the same.

Although that's not exactly untrue to how she is now...
Fair point. Although, there are characters in Smash who rely less on their specials and moreso on their other moves (Mario comes to mind, his up special is the only real viable kill move of his specials). But it probably would be good for her normals be tweaked a bit too - I think incorporating a rapier a-la Hyrule Warriors could be neat.
 
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