Official Zelda Patch and Changes Discussion Thread

[BJN39]

This thread was made to get ahead of the crowd and have something immediately ready for any floods of talk about change finds; this is here to have all the patch talk in one thread instead of multiple threads made solely to note one "discovery" whether it's proved real or not.

With this said PLEASE, do not make a thread here about Zelda changes in the patch! It will be locked! This is here for that.

March 7th: Due to patches being don't according to Sakurai, this thread will now be closed permanently. Should that patching future change, it will be reopened, but we aren't expecting that.

This thread and the Fairy Fountain will still be holding patch notes for Zelda should you ever need them.

Version Update History

[1.0.4] November 17, 2014
Utilt
    all hitboxes
        damage 6.5 -> 7.2
Pivot Grab
        z -18.700001 -> -15.7

[1.0.5] February 9, 2015
Pivot Grab
        visual fix correcting the issue of opponents appearing behind Zelda for a split second when grabbed

[1.0.6] April 15, 2015
Fsmash
    looping hitbox 0
        x 10.0 -> 8.0
    all looping hitboxes
        angle 60/160 -> 25/165
        wkb 60/80 -> 40/50
        size 4.3/5.0 -> 4.2/4.5
    all final hitboxes
        sizes 6.7/5.7 -> 5.5/6.0
        x 16.0/11.0  -> 9.5/16.0
Din's Fire/Flare/Blaze
        sweetspot size 2.7 > 2.1
Phantom Slash
        release animation FAF 54 -> 51
        uncharged animation speed 0.5x for frames 60-70 (10 frames slower)
        middle charge animation speed 0.5x for frames 90-100 (10 frames slower)
        full charge animation speed 0.5x for frames 135-145 (10 frames slower)
        destroyed phantom regeneration timer 6 seconds -> 10 seconds

[1.0.8] June 14, 2015
Usmash
    all looping hitboxes
        wkb 40/50/60/60 -> all 40
        sizes increased by 0.5
        sdi x1.0 -> x0.5
    all final hitboxes
        kbg 190 -> 214
NAir
        hit-box 1 and 0 IDs and damages (1.0/2.0) swapped
        landing lag 22 -> 19
UAir
        landing lag 22 -> 19
DAir
        landing lag 21 -> 18

[1.1.0] July 31, 2015
Jab
    all looping hitboxes
        bone 14/17/0 –> all 0
        damage 2.0 –> 2.5
        angle 361/361/80 –> 361/140/140
        wkb 40/30/7 –> 40/40/30
        size 2.5/3.0/4.0 –> 3.2/3.2/4.0
        z 3.0/0.0/0.0 –> all 0.0
        y 0.0/0.0/12.5 –> all 12.5
        x 0.0/0.0/0.0 –> 5.5/9.5/13.0
    all final hitboxes
        bone 0/17/14 –> all 0
        damage 2.0 –> 3.0
        bkb 24 –> 35
        kbg 150 –> 130
        size 6.0/3.0/2.5 –> 6.0/3.6/3.6
        z 0.0/0.0/3.0 –> all 0.0
        y 12.5/0.0/0.0 –> all 12.5
        x 0.0/0.0/0.0 –> 13.0/5.5/9.5
Dtilt
        damage 4.5 –> 5.5
Utilt
        FAF 33 –> 30
Phantom Slash
        Release animation FAF 52 –> 47
Minimum charge
    windbox
        wkb 0 -> 40
        kbg 0 -> 100
    hitbox
        x 14.0 - 20.0 -> 10.0 - 20.0
Medium charge
    windbox 1
        wkb 0 -> 55
        kbg 0 -> 100
    windbox 2/3
        wkb 20/9 -> 40/30
        x both 10.0 -> both 9.0 - 14.0 (stretchy hitbox)
    hitbox
        x 16.0 - 23.0 -> 12.0 - 23.0
Maximum charge
    windbox 1
        wkb 0 -> 60
        kbg 0 -> 100
    windbox 2/3
        wkb 25/12 -> 60/50
        x both 10.0 -> both 9.0 - 14.0 (stretchy hitbox)
        re-hit rate 5F -> 4F
    hit 1 hitbox
        x 2.0 - 15.0 -> -4.0 - 15.0
Phantom Breaker
        Release animation FAF 55 –> 50
Minimum charge
    windbox
        wkb 0 -> 40
        kbg 0 -> 100
    hitbox
        x 14.0 - 20.0 -> 10.0 - 20.0
Medium charge
    windbox 1
        wkb 0 -> 55
        kbg 0 -> 100
    windbox 2/3
        wkb 20/9 -> 40/30
        x both 10.0 -> both 14.0
    hitbox
        x 16.0 - 23.0 -> 12.0 - 23.0
Maximum charge
    windbox 1
        wkb 0 -> 60
        kbg 0 -> 100
    windbox 2/3
        wkb 25/12 -> 60/50
        x both 10.0 -> both 14.0
        re-hit rate 5F -> 4F
    hit 1 hitbox
        x 2.0 - 15.0 -> -4.0 - 15.0
Phantom Strike
        Release animation FAF 55 –> 50
Minimum charge
    windbox
        wkb 0 -> 40
        kbg 0 -> 100
    hitbox
        x 14.0 - 20.0 -> 10.0 - 20.0
Medium charge
    windbox 1
        wkb 0 -> 55
        kbg 0 -> 100
    windbox 2/3
        x both 10.0 -> both 14.0
    hitbox
        x 16.0 - 23.0 -> 12.0 - 23.0
Maximum charge
    windbox 1
        wkb 0 -> 60
        kbg 0 -> 100
    windbox 2/3
        x both 10.0 -> both 14.0
        re-hit rate 5F -> 4F
    hit 1 hitbox
        x 2.0 - 15.0 -> -4.0 - 15.0

 

[PUK]

I hope zelda's running and walking speed will be fixed.

 

[evmaxy54]

I hope zelda's running and walking speed will be fixed.

Her movement speed is perfectly fine as it is.

Everything else about her isn't

 

[DoctorDub]

I'm still waiting for the day Din's doesn't put us into free-fall



Like, Sakurai... Just give me that and a storable phantom and I will ask for no more.

 

[Macchiato]

Is this just me? because I can't Love Boost. I did this so easily pre-patch.

 

[Re4gNarsil]

All her attacks seem the same to me, except maybe one or two tiny things.

 

[Macchiato]

Usmash is MUCH MUCH MUCH stronger and Nair does 2% in the front and 1% in the back. Nair also had some kind of KB increase

 

[evmaxy54]

Uair & Dair may have less landing lag but this could be placebo.

 

[BJN39]

So I'll be adding three things to the OP, the Nair, Usmash, and Nayru changes! :D I'm taking a little break from comparing, but I'll be looking for more later.

 

[DoctorDub]

Usmash is MUCH MUCH MUCH stronger and Nair does 2% in the front and 1% in the back. Nair also had some kind of KB increase

What do you mean by stronger?
More range?
More kill power?
What?

 

[Macchiato]

What do you mean by stronger?
More range?
More kill power?
What?

Kill Power

 

[Meek Moths]

im not sure if usmash is stronger.

last time we got a patch, i also thought it was stronger but it turned out to be false. but if it really is better kill option now, im a very happy zelda.

nair change is a bit of nerf and buff. when you do dthrow to nair, usuallythe back hit of nair connects, but now that they switched the hitbox placement, the combo will only do 13 damage, which is just 1 more than simply doing a fthrow or bthrow. Of course, you can sometimes get a back toe after the nair but only on few characters.

nair also has like lower sdi on the back hit, so sometimes they can fall out of it or they will actually get sent to the front part of nair. oh well.

 

[Rickster]

This thread was made to get ahead of the crowd and have something immediately ready for any floods of talk about change finds; this is here to have all the patch talk in one thread instead of multiple threads made solely to note one "discovery" whether it's proved real or not.

With this said PLEASE, do not make a thread here about Zelda changes in the patch! It will be locked! This is here for that.

Anything that can be substantiated before data dumps will be put in this post. I will actually be doing a thorough search of my own of Zelda using two 3DSs side-by-side with the different versions.


Patch is out now!



CURRENTLY CONFIRMED CHANGE LIST

Up Smash​

[+] The BKB of the final hit was increased slightly. As a result the move KOs roughly 20% earlier.

Neutral Aerial​

[=] The damage numbers for the loop hits were switched; the front loop hits do 2% each now, and the back ones do 1% each.

Nayru's Love [Neutral B]​

[-] The ability to get an aerial momentum boosted Nayru by running off an edge and using Nayru's at the right moment has been removed. Zelda now either only sticks to the edge or floats at normal momentum.

These are for real?!

I'm really happy right now. Like really happy. I like waking up to nice things.

 

[ZombieBran]

Now we have two Smash attacks!

Nowhere near enough for Zelda though, lmao

 

[Rickster]

The name tho. THE NAME.
-----
I saw a post on the patch thread asking if Nair has more stun. They posted a gif of Zelda and Marth on the Miiverse stage at 80%. They did a falling Nair into Farore's for a true combo KO.

Was this always possible? Or is it just because of the swapped hitboxes? Regardless, it's pretty neat that we *kinda* have a hit confirm KO setup.

 

[Meek Moths]

im not sure if usmash is stronger.

last time we got a patch, i also thought it was stronger but it turned out to be false. but if it really is better kill option now, im a very happy zelda.

ok, usmash really does kill 18 earlier!

Was this always possible? Or is it just because of the swapped hitboxes? Regardless, it's pretty neat that we *kinda* have a hit confirm KO setup.

it was always possible but it's character and di specific. i believe fast fallers like falco can shield before you can follow up.

or maybe they lowered nair landing lag now, who knows

 

[MOI-ARI]

The name tho. THE NAME.
-----
I saw a post on the patch thread asking if Nair has more stun. They posted a gif of Zelda and Marth on the Miiverse stage at 80%. They did a falling Nair into Farore's for a true combo KO.

Was this always possible? Or is it just because of the swapped hitboxes? Regardless, it's pretty neat that we *kinda* have a hit confirm KO setup.

Yeah this was possible to do before but it seems its -- much easier--- now with swapped properties of Front nair

 

[Katy Parry]

How is anyone else not notciing that up Smash is FASTER, the hit lag between the moves seems a lot less. I have been able to catch people so much more easily with upsmash. Can anyone confirm this?

 

[MOI-ARI]

How is anyone else not notciing that up Smash is FASTER, the hit lag between the moves seems a lot less. I have been able to catch people so much more easily with upsmash. Can anyone confirm this?

Honestly seems the same to me.

 

[Rickster]

ok, usmash really does kill 18 earlier!



it was always possible but it's character and di specific. i believe fast fallers like falco can shield before you can follow up.

or maybe they lowered nair landing lag now, who knows

Yeah this was possible to do before but it seems its -- much easier--- now with swapped properties of Front nair

Ah ok. I never really tried Nair>Farore before since I just assumed it wouldn't work (my logic: dtilt didn't work right so there's NO WAY Farore's would work.)

 

[BJN39]

How is anyone else not notciing that up Smash is FASTER, the hit lag between the moves seems a lot less. I have been able to catch people so much more easily with upsmash. Can anyone confirm this?

I'm pretty sure its hit-lag is unchanged, (Guessing slightly from earlier testing between the two versions.) But I'll make sure.

 

[MOI-ARI]

Ah ok. I never really tried Nair>Farore before since I just assumed it wouldn't work (my logic: dtilt didn't work right so there's NO WAY Farore's would work.)

Dtilt worked too 'xD You just needed to FastFall Nair to the ground (on the last couple of frames i think) and yeah.
Now i i can actually get two hits before i hit the ground and do a true followup ;3 easier that is.

 

[Katy Parry]

I'm pretty sure its hit-lag is unchanged, (Guessing slightly from earlier testing between the two versions.) But I'll make sure.

Well since the hit lag is less I feel like I'm comobing with it like crazy

AND OOS

 

[Rickster]

Ahhhhah I KO'd a training dummy Mario at 105%!

I haven't done that in a long time...

EDIT:

Dtilt worked too 'xD You just needed to FastFall Nair to the ground (on the last couple of frames i think) and yeah.
Now i i can actually get two hits before i hit the ground and do a true followup ;3 easier that is.

I was meaning more that it didn't always true combo. Only on certain characters at certain %s.

 

[MOI-ARI]

Ahhhhah I KO'd a training dummy Mario at 105%!

I haven't done that in a long time...

EDIT:

I was meaning more that it didn't always true combo. Only on certain characters at certain %s.

Oh my mistake..

 

[Nat Goméz]

Guys, can you try this? Don't know if its new or anything but I've being getting Dtilt to sweetspot fair pretty consistently against marth at 80% for kills in training mode. When I do it the with tip of the dtilt the sweetspot seems a lot easier to connect, with the rest of the dtilt you need to space youself a little better but still doable

 

[Katy Parry]

Guys, can you try this? Don't know if its new or anything but I've being getting Dtilt to sweetspot fair pretty consistently against marth at 80% for kills in training mode. When I do it the with tip of the dtilt the sweetspot seems a lot easier to connect, with the rest of the dtilt you need to space youself a little better but still doable

Nair > Dtilit > fair

Not sure if its true or not but I've hit every time

 

[MewMewZone]

Hello Guys!
I'm not sure, if this is new, but Dthrow to Upair seems like a true combo even at high percent.
Tested it on some Characters in trainingsmode and the combo-counter told me that it's true. On heavier Characters like Ike it seems like it was easier to perform than on Characters like Jigglypuff. On Ike It worked from 100% to 140% with Shorthop Upair. From 140% up to 200% it connects with Doublejump Upair (timing ist a little bit strict).
Couldn't test proper DI, but looked like an reliable Killsetup.

 

[MOI-ARI]

Hello Guys!
I'm not sure, if this is new, but Dthrow to Upair seems like a true combo even at high percent.
Tested it on some Characters in trainingsmode and the combo-counter told me that it's true. On heavier Characters like Ike it seems like it was easier to perform than on Characters like Jigglypuff. On Ike It worked from 100% to 140% with Shorthop Upair. From 140% up to 200% it connects with Doublejump Upair (timing ist a little bit strict).
Couldn't test proper DI, but looked like an reliable Killsetup.

Thats been there.Starting 50%ish it becomes a true combo. It should kill on average at 85%~90% though...
not sure why you were landing it at 200% O_O"

By the way am i the only one iffed that we cant Ledge glide with Nayrus Love?
ugh

 

[ZombieBran]

D-throw to U-air is pretty much my favorite thing lol
It's why I'm not even angry about U-air's nerf from Brawl.

 

[Shirma Akayaku]

The name tho. THE NAME.
-----
I saw a post on the patch thread asking if Nair has more stun. They posted a gif of Zelda and Marth on the Miiverse stage at 80%. They did a falling Nair into Farore's for a true combo KO.

Was this always possible? Or is it just because of the swapped hitboxes? Regardless, it's pretty neat that we *kinda* have a hit confirm KO setup.

I think it's a pretty good KO setup. It looks like it comes out pretty fast and may be difficult to DI. I'd use it as a mixup though so they have a worse chance of DI'ing it.

 

[CNMNE]

Simple question, i pretty much stopped fast fall nair-ing altogether because it was really inconsistent, but do the swapped hotboxes help or hurt that?

 

[Re4gNarsil]

Oh yeah, loving the increased u-smash KO power! Might not say 18 or 20 on everyone, but at least 15. N-air change seems like a potential buff, but not much of a setup tool imo. d-tilt into f-air has always been there to some extent.

 

[Rickster]

Simple question, i pretty much stopped fast fall nair-ing altogether because it was really inconsistent, but do the swapped hotboxes help or hurt that?

If you hit them with the hitboxes in front of Zelda then yes, it helps A TON. At mid % it starts comboing into Dtilt, Utilt, Usmash, and most importantly, Elevator. Heck, there may be even more things it can lead into.

I'm interested if Jab or Grab can ever work...doubt it though.

 

[Brinzy]

Oh

my

goodness

For the first time since Brawl, Zelda is back to having one good aerial!

 

[MOI-ARI]

It seems Nair also can scoop up shorter characters as of now. Though ive only compared Doc Mario between patches, im fairly certain nairs hitbox has changed to that extent. :-D

 

[Re4gNarsil]

It seems Nair also can scoop up shorter characters as of now. Though ive only compared Doc Mario between patches, im fairly certain nairs hitbox has changed to that extent. :-D

I think you're right 8D

 

[Meru.]

The Nair buff is VERY welcome.

Landing Nair > UpB is heaven

 

[Brinzy]

The Nair buff is VERY welcome.

Landing Nair > UpB is heaven

I haven't had a chance to play. Does it still seem to have the same landing lag? Is the hitstun really that dramatic?

 

[Meru.]

I haven't had a chance to play. Does it still seem to have the same landing lag? Is the hitstun really that dramatic?

Apparently it is. I don't really get it either, it still has ages of landing lag but for some reason Nair > Up B is a training mode combo. The timing is a little bit tight but it's not that hard. On top of that, shorthop Nair can actually hit people now.

I don't want to hype people up too much, it's not like she has become that much better but this is definitely a step in the good direction.