Why I believe in God.

[bboss]

EDIT: If you are going to contribute to this thread, please state why God can or cannot exist due to scientific reasoning. Do not respond if you are just going to blab about your personal beef with God, this is not what this thread about, this thread is about proving God does or doesn't exist by science.

Hello all.



In this thread I will prove to you that there is a God, or intelligent being, through logic and science.



Let us begin by establishing several things about the universe:



-An object at rest tends to stay at rest unless otherwise moved by an outside force.



-Matter cannot become bigger or smaller, it simply takes on different shapes and goes to different places.

1. So our first problem is with the timespace fabric not existing until after the big bang. So this means that since there is no space, the universe is a vacuum. An all-encompassing vacuum.

Now there’s a little rule of nature that I’m sure you’re probably familiar with: nothing can exist naturally in a vacuum, there has to be a third party to put it there. So the ‘matter’ cannot exist as the universe is a vacuum and matter cannot exist naturally in a vacuum.

1. e=mc2. This law, stating that matter cannot be destroyed, it only changes forms, is a huge problem for evolution. Why? Because even if an object exists before time, it cannot exist naturally. According to e=mc2, matter is conserved, so it eventually has to come from somewhere. It didn’t just end up there on its own.
2. No space. Of course you know by now that the timespace fabric didn’t come into existence until after the big bang. (I sort of covered this topic in #1 but this is a bit more advanced.) So there is no space, the universe is just a vacuum, right? The problem with this is that everyone and everything renders life in three dimensions, space. This concept is sort of hard to comprehend, that a vacuum universe is non-dimensional, but it makes perfect sense.

So! Since there is no space yet, nothing can reach, trigger, or touch the big bang.

1. My fourth point is with time not existing yet. This is very simple. If time does not exist, and you go back in time and try to trigger the big bang, nothing happens. Why? Simply because there is no time. The big bang needs time to exist for it to work, and it doesn’t have time. Therefore, if the big bang had happened before time (which is a little hard to comprehend), it would be a dud. Nothing would happen.
2. “An object at rest tends to stay at rest unless motivated by an outside force.” So the big bang has to be triggered by something else. As hard as evolution tries to point away from God, it points right back to God.

Now! We all know that the universe is finite. It is not eternal. It had a beginning. (This is proven by the sun and the moon, if we had been around too long the sun would have burnt us). We can also assume that the earth is, at the very oldest, 37 million years old. Why? Because of the moon’s orbit, which gets closer to the earth by 2 inches every year (which means it will crash in less than 37,000,000 years).

Since the universe is finite, and the big bang is impossible, would it be logical for me to assume that there is something that created us? Absolutely. If men and women ultimately came from one woman and one man, is it logical to believe that they existed forever or evolved from tiny bacteria over millions of years, or is it logical to believe that something created them for each other?



Regards,



bboss

 

[Ten of Nine]

Well then who created God? Who created your Creator? Who created the Creator's Creator? The Creator's Creator's Creator?

Are you sure there aren't multiple Gods? Millions of God?

Under this circular logic with no need to prove anything I can easily say that Humans created themselves. Humans are God. If a God can just poof into existence then a human male and female could as well and they just started having children on a planet. I could then claim that Humans aren't even unique and that across the universe the same exact thing happened on planets in galaxies millions of light-years apart.

Honestly I don't think anyone intelligent will waste their time arguing that there isn't a God since it's not provable either way, by extension it would just be a waste of time in general. Nothing productive, meaningful, or interesting can come from the conversation and there are far more important things to figure out right now in real life.

But there is however overwhelming evidence that pretty much every single major organized religion has had a negative systemic impact on humanity as far back as history can record. Also there are countless examples of man-made organized religions and scriptures being categorically and morally wrong so much we've all lost count (and they've all conveniently forgotten).

The mistake begins when people think they know what God actually is, how they think the Earth and humans were "created", and supposedly they know the actual word of God and other religions are wrong. Then the mistake continues in those words (which have no proof or truth to start with) being mistranslated over and over in one big game of telephone across many languages to the point where a singular man-made scripture can actually be interpreted 1000 different ways to create a 1000 different opposing religions/sects.

I'm not even going to go into Intelligent Design since it gets kinda hilarious. Ranging from "Banana fits in your hand" to "OMG whoa the human eye is crazy complicated, must be God". There are so many inefficient and poorly "designed" things in nature and almost every single animal (many with organs and functions they don't ever use).
There are clear examples of micro-evolution and macro evolution going on currently if you care to read up on them. Your early paragraph about speech and apes is so misguided and understudied I actually initially thought you were trolling at first.

Believe in God....cool, no one cares anymore. But don't use it to start a religion that in any way has an impact on others or tells others how to live. If you don't want to adhere to that, at least don't brainwash kids that are so young they have no choice. You can bring up a kid to believe in anything especially when you tie it to family and friends and a fear of being excluded from a community for not believing. You can bring up a kid to be a Nazi, you can raise them to believe that Harry Potter was a historical series of non-fiction books, you can bring them up to believe that people who aren't the same race as them are the enemy, that females are vastly inferior, that homosexuality is a curable disease, etc

 

[bboss]

Well then who created God? Who created your Creator? Who created the Creator's Creator? The Creator's Creator's Creator?

That's the point. The only way that there is a god is that he is eternal and always has been there. Nobody has created God, God has existed before time because he is outside of time.

But there is however overwhelming evidence that pretty much every single major organized religion has had a negative systemic impact on humanity as far back as history can record. Also there are countless examples of man-made organized religions and scriptures being categorically and morally wrong so much we've all lost count (and they've all conveniently forgotten).

A negative impact? So like all of the people who have found happiness in religion, all of the poor people given homes, all of the refugees welcomed and saved from death, is a negative systemic impact?

You still haven't given a point on why there isn't a god. Do you believe in God?

I'm not even going to go into Intelligent Design since it gets kinda hilarious. Ranging from "Banana fits in your hand" to "OMG whoa the human eye is crazy complicated, must be God". There are so many inefficient and poorly "designed" things in nature and almost every single animal (many with organs and functions they don't ever use).

Name one example.

There are clear examples of micro-evolution and macro evolution going on currently if you care to read up on them. Your early paragraph about speech and apes is so misguided and understudied I actually initially thought you were trolling at first

Name one example of evolution.

Misguided and understudied? In what way? In that I am intelligent enough to understand that the concept of speech is too difficult for an ape to even come close to mentally comprehending?

You haven't given one example of why there isn't a god. Please, go ahead. There isn't one single piece of evidence in your post.

Well then who created the humans? I can use the same argument you did at the beginning of your post and it makes more sense on my side because humans could have never created themselves. It's not turtles all the way down. Please, explain your theory on who created humans?

EDIT: More evidence for Creation.

The human and chimpanzee Y chromosomes are hugely different. Half of the chimpanzee Y chromosome is missing and the rest is only "70 similar to human".

There are about 35 million letter differences between our two species, a huge, huge number of short insertions and deletions, and thousands of genomic rearrangements.

If you randomly take sections of chimpanzee DNA and try to find matches in the human genome, and vice versa, you will find less than 90% similarity. Plus many of the chimpanzee genomes simply do not exist in humans.

How do evolutionists explain planation surfaces, created by massive receding waters? This can only be explained by the Flood. No planation surfaces form today. And here's some more evidence for the Flood: the Cypress Hills, in southeast Alberta and southwestern Saskatchewan, Canada. At the site is a large amount of quartzite gravel. The closest source for this material? 650 kilometres away, in Central Idaho, on the other side of the continental divide!

If evolution really happened all over our universe, then where is everybody?

How can evolutionists explain how seahorse males have the babies?

Oh, and so long for evolution. Recently, scientists found, in the Caribbean, lizards preserved in Amber that are "20 million years old". These lizards are identical to the ones seen today. This means one of two things are true: either carbon dating is wrong, evolution is wrong, or both.

Now for a historical proof. Goliath's city gate has been found. Archeologists have uncovered the gate of Garth, an ancient philistine city in Israel.

 

[Ten of Nine]

I do believe in God but he is literally a bowl of soup.

He (the soup) doesn't require my worship or constant selfish requests. He doesn't need me to make up fictional stories about what I think happened.

If I was a Catholic Priest that used my "Holy" position to get close to little kids then molest them he don't care.

If I was a extremist Muslim that used his existence to justify crashing planes into the twin towers he don't care. He also don't give those people 72 virgins in heaven for a job supposedly well done in his name.

If I was a womanizing rapper that has sexually assaulted and murdered people he don't care that I thank him when I win a Grammy and say "I owe it all to God"

He simply created the "Earth" and "Humans" and then moved on to the next galaxy to make more Sims to watch act like idiots for his amusement.

The problem bboss is that you think you actually brought up good points in your first post. You didn't, you simply said I don't think this is true or this is true...therefore God. Proof by omission is the worst form of evidence, would be insulting to call it research or conclusive. The absence of understanding or knowing what actually happened and how we came to be doesn't warrant an imaginary placeholder. If you want to try to make an actual first post with actual proof of some God that would be nice before you demand something multiple times that you have yet to do in your own thread.

Here I'll give you a freebie - God if you really do exist change this site to Shaq Boards as they did previously. And make it permanent this time.

 

[bboss]

He (the soup) doesn't require my worship

Have you ever met God? You said you believed in him, but you have never met or spoken to him. So how do you know that he doesn't want you to worship him?

The problem bboss is that you think you actually brought up good points in your first post. You didn't, you simply said I don't think this is true or this is true...therefore God.

Well I stated facts. Facts which you have neither tried to rebut or discuss. So I think I did a pretty good job if my facts are so concrete that no one challenges them.

So far you have not told us why we shouldn't believe in God by science, just why there is no need to believe in God.

You have not stated a single counter-proposal to my points or even made a scientific point yourself. This thread is about proven God is real. I think that we both believe in God so at least I've done what I'm trying to so far.

Here I'll give you a freebie - God if you really do exist change this site to Shaq Boards as they did previously. And make it permanent this time.

God does not have to prove himself to you. You have to prove yourself to God.

If we both agree that there is a God, do you not think that he knows who you are? Maybe he cares about you. If you are going to consider all the angles then you must consider this one.

If I was a extremist Muslim that used his existence to justify crashing planes into the twin towers he don't care. He also don't give those people 72 virgins in heaven for a job supposedly well done in his name.

That's because I don't believe in the same god as the Muslims. That's one of the common misconceptions about God, that the same God is worshipped by Jews, Christians and Muslims alike. God would never command the deaths of thousands in the twin towers. Only sick extremists would believe this. Allah and God are not one and the same.

 

[bboss]

You still haven't named one example of evolution or poor nature. By all means, go ahead. You avoided the question by talking about the morality of God. (Which is fine, but please answer the question).

 

[Ten of Nine]

That's because I don't believe in the same god as the Muslims. That's one of the common misconceptions about God, that the same God is worshipped by Jews, Christians and Muslims alike. God would never command the deaths of thousands in the twin towers. Only sick extremists would believe this. Allah and God are not one and the same.

You might never understand...but objectively you are mistaken.

The mere existence of God or the delusion of the belief in a God allows all of this behavior.

It is a motive for anyone to claim they do things in his name, and it is an excuse for any behavior in the name of some higher power that can't be questioned (or if you do question it you will die).

Humans are capable of terrible things as it is, anyone can do anything to anyone at anytime. Adding in some imaginary being that justifies the most evil behavior is what religions have been doing for 1000s of years. They are very good at it.

Again read your first post and tell me how any of that proves there is a God. You still don't see how fallacious your whole novel of an opener was...It was the equivalent of me saying "I beat 3 of the best smash players locally, I think they are just as good as the top 3 players in the world, therefore I must be the best. I have just proven that I am the best smash player. You disagree? Prove me wrong, but I don't have to prove that I am the best though. I don't even have to prove I play any smash games"

I don't want proof by omission or comparison or by you thinking you've debunked 3 scientific facts and actual professional corroborated research. Stand alone on the topic of the proof that there is a God. Have YOU actually seen and talked to God. Just because you don't believe in 2 or 3 scientific things isn't convincing at all and isn't worthy of such a pretentious and arrogant closing statement. It comes off as more humorous than serious and worthy of debate. It's a circular argument.

 

[bboss]

You might never understand...but objectively you are mistaken.

That's not an argument. I can say the exact same thing to you. "oh, you might never understand.. you don't understand..."

he mere existence of God or the delusion of the belief in a God allows all of this behavior.

Humans are capable of terrible things as it is, anyone can do anything to anyone at anytime.

Hmm, funny.
Name one religion other than Islam that uses the name of God for evil.

Again read your first post and tell me how any of that proves there is a God.

Just read it. It plainly states that because the big bang couldn't have happened, and since you haven't given a proper response for why we are all here, that I believe in God because it is the most feasible option. And will continue to do so until proven wrong.

I don't want proof by omission or comparison or by you thinking you've debunked 3 scientific facts and actual professional corroborated research

Proof by omission? How about the fact that you can't find one single piece of evidence for evolution and poor creation?

How do you know I'm not a scientist? "Actual professional research?" What do you think i consulted to state my thesis?
There are "actual professional" scientists who don't believe in the big bang. Many of them. Go to CMI.com if you don't believe me. You can find all sorts of evidence for God there.

Stand alone on the topic of the proof that there is a God. Have YOU actually seen and talked to God. Just because you don't believe in 2 or 3 scientific things isn't convincing at all and isn't worthy of such a pretentious and arrogant closing statement. It comes off as more humorous than serious and worthy of debate. It's a circular argument.

I have not seen God. Neither have you.

I don't believe much of what scientists say because I use logic.

The only thing that is circular is you refusing to provide any evidence of evolution or poor creation.

 

[Ten of Nine]

Hmm, funny.
Name one religion other than Islam that uses the name of God for evil.

This is is where I'm going to stop.

This question makes it very clear you haven't looked into any of this very far. You REALLY don't know the overwhelming amount of examples that this question can be answered with? I don't believe you are that ignorant or daft.

Every single question you've asked can easily be answered in abundance by simply typing a quick search into google.

"Examples of evolution"

"Wars caused by religion"

"religion atrocities"

"Salem witch trials"

"history in the name of religion" < this neutral search turns up only results about killing, genocide, ****, etc...that in itself should be telling.

"Murder caused by religion"

"Sexual assault religion"

At this point if you are not actually trolling for attention then you aren't equipped to continue this thread. I'm not going to waste more of time explaining very obvious things that are already recorded and researched. I don't doubt that in a few years your mind will have changed about a lot of this, at the very least you will probably cringe at how you used to think (and your above posts).

 

[bboss]

"Salem witch trials"

Actually, the Salem witch trials of 1692 had nothing to do with religion, in fact, they had everything to do with witchcraft and not religion.

This question makes it very clear you haven't looked into any of this very far. You REALLY don't know the overwhelming amount of examples that this question can be answered with? I don't believe you are that ignorant or daft.

Actually, I have put 5-6 years of research into this topic. Not that that makes me automatically know what I'm talking about, but it does give me a head start.

Ten of Nine, we are arguing about two completely different things. You are saying all the "bad" things that religion has done to people, blah blah blah, while I'm trying to prove that there is a God. Completely different.

You have literally done nothing to prove that there is not a God. All you have done is said, in the last five thousand years, that religion messed up a few times. Huh.

How do you explain the fish fossils on the top of mountains? Hmmm... maybe a great Flood?

Every single question you've asked can easily be answered in abundance by simply typing a quick search into google.

Give me one example of evolution or one example of poor design. You simply can't.

 

[bboss]

So far in this thread no one has provided a single piece of evidence that God does not exist, just how religion is stupid.

 

[bboss]

Believe in God in 5 Minutes (Scientific Proof)

Basically all I am saying can be summed up here. Just google the above.

 

[Whia]

So far in this thread no one has provided a single piece of evidence that God does not exist, just how religion is stupid.

Possibly because your OP isn't worth the time.

Like, look at this beautiful, glowing gem here:

If we evolved, how did we evolve so much from apes that we learned to speak? There is logically no way. Have you ever seen an ape, as it matures and grows up, suddenly able to talk? No!

You don't have the vaguest clue about evolution. Your whole post is ****ing embarrassing.

 

[bboss]

Possibly because your OP isn't worth the time.

Like, look at this beautiful, glowing gem here:



You don't have the vaguest clue about evolution. Your whole post is ****ing embarrassing.

I have studied evolution for many years. How about you?
And answer the question, how is the concept of speech imbedded in our brains?

 

[Whia]

I have studied evolution for many years. How about you?
And answer the question, how is the concept of speech imbedded in our brains?

Reading CMI articles does not qualify as research.

If you're actually honest in your pursuit of answers (which we both know you're not), why don't you take your asinine post here: http://www.theleagueofreason.co.uk/viewforum.php?f=8. Talk to people who are actually knowledgeable on the subject, 'cause your OP has more ridiculous dog**** than the average person is willing to unpack. I'm certainly not. But they^ definitely are.

 

[Floor]

I have so much to say about why I'm an atheist that I couldn't possibly post it all here. Instead I would direct you to one of many novels I've come to respect, Richard Dawkins's The God Delusion. It's about 8 to 10 hours on audio book. Should be free on Youtube or you can get a free trial then cancel through Audible (or heaven forbid even pick up the book at a library, whatever suits your fancy).

 

[Scrandrew the Faux Hammer]

Realistically, any belief system is a coping mechanism for life. Life can be hard as hell. Even if you live a life of privilege and opportunity, you must still face your own mind night and day. If you have to prove to other people that your belief system is worth their time, I'd guess you're having doubts that it's worth your time.

I've encountered many people who have superseding scientific reasoning for believing in the christian god. When I was christian I believed there had to be a god because something must have come first to set this universe into being. When you do this you set yourself up for failure. Say what you may about science or scientists, but the fact is that they produce results, and their results have profound effects on our lives. Hundreds of years ago I'm sure people would have made the same argument as you, but rather than evolution, they would have pointed out that only god could move the planets. I don't see you arguing about gravity, because it's presence and properties are now much better understood. In our lifetimes, we will see the fruits of scientists' work beyond what we can imagine now, and their discoveries will narrow your options for an argument for god predicated on lack of scientific efficacy.

To put this another way, long after you are dead (perhaps the year 2217), there will be others just like you; challenging ignorant foes on the internet with their mighty intellect and optically rendered text fields. However, they won't argue about evolution. By that time evolution might be well understood and taught properly in schools, but perhaps the existence of life on other planets or the existence of parallel universes will be the crux of future r/atheism.

My main and final point, however, does not concern philosophy or theology, and is as follows: Get the **** off smash boards with this angsty bull**** and go back to Reddit!

 

[bboss]

Reading CMI articles does not qualify as research.

If you're actually honest in your pursuit of answers (which we both know you're not), why don't you take your asinine post here: http://www.theleagueofreason.co.uk/viewforum.php?f=8. Talk to people who are actually knowledgeable on the subject, 'cause your OP has more ridiculous dog**** than the average person is willing to unpack. I'm certainly not. But they^ definitely are.

I could say the same thing about reading articles by secular, evolution-believing science. Your point makes no sense.

Actually, it makes less than sense. You just said, "Your part of the argument doesn't count because I don't like it." Which is a huge fallacy

 

[bboss]

I have so much to say about why I'm an atheist that I couldn't possibly post it all here. Instead I would direct you to one of many novels I've come to respect, Richard Dawkins's The God Delusion. It's about 8 to 10 hours on audio book. Should be free on Youtube or you can get a free trial then cancel through Audible (or heaven forbid even pick up the book at a library, whatever suits your fancy).

Actually Dawkins has been dissected and debunked, try just googling this: The Greatest Hoax On Earth?

Or watching this: Dr William Lane Craig Debunks Dawkins' God Delusion. It's only a minute long.

Or watching this: God delusion darwinism debunked

I would invite you to read the first comment on the last video, which states: "So if everything comes from a speck of [bacteria] and all the other thousand of other types of animals are from the same offspring and [they're] our cousins why are the only ones that can cook?"

Answer that question. Where did our intelligence go up along the way if we did evolve?

 

[bboss]

In our lifetimes, we will see the fruits of scientists' work beyond what we can imagine now, and their discoveries will narrow your options for an argument for god predicated on lack of scientific efficacy.

A few years ago I sincerely doubted the existence of God and started researching this topic. Then I stumbled onto CMI and it changed my mind completely.
Science has actually proven God during my lifetime.

To put this another way, long after you are dead (perhaps the year 2217), there will be others just like you; challenging ignorant foes on the internet with their mighty intellect and optically rendered text fields

lol

My main and final point, however, does not concern philosophy or theology, and is as follows: Get the **** off smash boards with this angsty bull**** and go back to Reddit!

lol
i havent been on reddit in years
Seriously though. In a book I once read, it stated that atheists will, in arguments:

1. Use ridicule and mockery to label people of faith as intellectual or irrational, without any evidence whatsoever for their cause.

You still don't see how fallacious your whole novel of an opener was...

You don't have the vaguest clue about evolution. Your whole post is ****ing embarrassing.

Reading CMI articles does not qualify as research.

Get the **** off smash boards with this angsty bull**** and go back to Reddit!

Anyone seeing a pattern here?

This actually makes me laugh. Everyone on this site is a stereotypical atheist. I thought that people would actually try to prove that there wasn't a God instead of insulting me for believing in God but I guess not. The only person who has actually come forward with evidence and is actually intelligent is Floor , he actually cares about and knows about science, unlike the rest of the people on this site.

still no one has proven a single point for evolution or even one against God. I love science and that's what got me interested in whether or not there was a God, when I actually sat down to think about the properties of the timespace fabric in relation to the BIg Bang it took me less than twenty minutes to realize it was completely unfeasible, (duing to timespace not existing at the time), that's my main problem with evolution and if God did not create us than I really don't know how we ended up here.

Those of you who are questioning the morality behind God, there's a book that you probably can get at a library entitled God's Not Dead: Evidence for God In An Age of Uncertainty.

 

[Whia]

Hey look at that, I was right about you being too cowardly to take your OP to the League of Reason forum. How unsurprising.

I could say the same thing about reading articles by secular, evolution-believing science. Your point makes no sense.

Actually, it makes less than sense. You just said, "Your part of the argument doesn't count because I don't like it." Which is a huge fallacy

Since you're apparently unfamiliar, I'll just go ahead and copy and paste this, from CMI's own Statement of Faith:

Facts are always subject to interpretation by fallible people who do not possess all information. By definition, therefore, no interpretation of facts in any field, including history and chronology, can be valid if it contradicts the scriptural record.

They openly admit in advance to completely disregard any and all even hypothetical evidence that contradicts their position. So, no, you actually could not say the same thing.

By the way, don't pretend you understand logical fallacies when your entire OP is an argument from ignorance and incredulity.

 

[Floor]

Actually Dawkins has been dissected and debunked, try just googling this: The Greatest Hoax On Earth?

Or watching this: Dr William Lane Craig Debunks Dawkins' God Delusion. It's only a minute long.

Or watching this: God delusion darwinism debunked

I would invite you to read the first comment on the last video, which states: "So if everything comes from a speck of [bacteria] and all the other thousand of other types of animals are from the same offspring and [they're] our cousins why are the only ones that can cook?"

Answer that question. Where did our intelligence go up along the way if we did evolve?

I'll watch those tonight. But my immediate answer is that we can see how the lifeforms closest to us are more intelligent. Apes and monkies are smarter than crabs and bacteria. Dogs are smart and can be trained to sniff out explosives and drugs. But when you stray as far as fish and lizards, they are vastly less-intelligent then are close apes.

Humans evolved from apes. First we learned how to use sticks and rocks to make fire and weapons... then we hunted... invented the wheel... and so on, each invention and discovery coming faster than the last (technology snowballs). According to the theories, it takes hundreds of thousands of years to evolve so it's not surprising to see that humans developed fire and weapons fairly recently and other species may follow suit some time after.

Nevertheless evolution is only part of why I don't believe in God.

 

[Ten of Nine]

C'mon bboss you're starting to sound like a 12 year old in a Youtube comment section.

I can guarantee you that on this site there are more people that believe in a God than don't. However in this forum I think it's much more Agnostic, Atheist, and "Who gives a crap about imaginary stuff". I mean it does say "Intelligent discussion on a variety of issues." so that kind of scares away religious types since they can't back anything they say with proof. Also I have no doubt that many of your believer friends have seen the OP and didn't find anything you wrote worth backing up or corroborating so they left ASAP.




By the way I'm Agnostic. Keep making up things and assuming nonsense...might want stop being a hypocrite, consider thinking about what you say and adhere to your own standards. Otherwise this will get more and more embarrassing for you and you'll regret most of it.

 

[bboss]

I'll watch those tonight. But my immediate answer is that we can see how the lifeforms closest to us are more intelligent. Apes and monkies are smarter than crabs and bacteria. Dogs are smart and can be trained to sniff out explosives and drugs. But when you stray as far as fish and lizards, they are vastly less-intelligent then are close apes.

Humans evolved from apes. First we learned how to use sticks and rocks to make fire and weapons... then we hunted... invented the wheel... and so on, each invention and discovery coming faster than the last (technology snowballs). According to the theories, it takes hundreds of thousands of years to evolve so it's not surprising to see that humans developed fire and weapons fairly recently and other species may follow suit some time after.

I can guarantee you that in a million years apes still won't know how to speak.

Hey look at that, I was right about you being too cowardly to take your OP to the League of Reason forum. How unsurprising.


Since you're apparently unfamiliar, I'll just go ahead and copy and paste this, from CMI's own Statement of Faith:



They openly admit in advance to completely disregard any and all even hypothetical evidence that contradicts their position. So, no, you actually could not say the same thing.

By the way, don't pretend you understand logical fallacies when your entire OP is an argument from ignorance and incredulity.

This is hilarious. Maybe you should've understood this before you went ahead and posted it. It states that since everything is not known to one source except for God, there are no facts to us because we do not know all the variables. You do not know everything. I do not know everything.

Humans evolved from apes.

I would pay you a lot of money to prove this.

Honestly though, you really can't blame me for not believing in evolution considering that the odds of evolution successfully occurring are longer than any number ever calculated.

But my immediate answer is that we can see how the lifeforms closest to us are more intelligent. Apes and monkies are smarter than crabs and bacteria

That's not answering the question, that's simply stating that there are differences between the species, and that some are more intelligent than others. But why are we the only ones who can speak and read and cook? Doesn't it seem a bit strange? If evolution were true, wouldn't dogs be able to speak short sentences as well?

 

[Ten of Nine]

I would pay you a lot of money to prove this.

Honestly though, you really can't blame me for not believing in evolution considering that the odds of evolution successfully occurring are longer than any number ever calculated.

So what are the odds of there being an imaginary sky daddy? Is it a little bit less than any number ever calculated.

I'm guessing you based such a air tight calculation on research, observation, and evidence. Religious mathematics. Tide goes in Tide goes out. How do magnets work?

 

[bboss]

So what are the odds of there being an imaginary sky daddy? Is it a little bit less than any number ever calculated.

I'm guessing you based such a air tight calculation on research, observation, and evidence. Religious mathematics. Tide goes in Tide goes out. How do magnets work?

Let's think about it. You believe that the universe exploded from nothing. I believe something really big created the universe. Who's crazier?

 

[Ten of Nine]

Let's think about it. You believe that the universe exploded from nothing. I believe something really big created the universe. Who's crazier?

You believe in an imaginary being that you've never interacted with or seen/heard. Most think they can communicate and hear/see this being.

Crazy people committed to mental institutions believe in imaginary things and beings. They think they can hear/see these beings and talk with them.

Whoa there is like no difference...

Provide even one sentence of proof that a God exists. You can't and never will. That's why you're still deflecting and making no sense.

Science over the past few 1000 years has answered more questions and solved more problems than anyone who believed "a God did it"...it's actually sad that you think you know better. Believing in God has always just filled in the blanks for science to come in and figure it all out. People of your mindset never figure anything out, they just sit and say "God did it, no need to research or try an find proof". People such as yourself would still think the Earth was flat, they wouldn't ever know that the Moons gravity caused tides, they would still think the Earth was the center of the universe, they would still think the Sun revolved around us, would still believe in witches and would think electricity and magnetism were the devil's work...

C'mon use your head bboss. Are you still not smart enough to realize that at least Science constantly tries and succeeds. People like you make no progress ever, are you just gonna keep saying "God dun it" til the end of time? What's the point of that?

 

[bboss]

Provide even one sentence of proof that a God exists. You can't and never will. That's why you're still deflecting and making no sense.

I will. In the Bible it speaks of the city of Jericho's walls being magically inwards down by trumpets. Sounds crazy, right? It did until scientists discovered the ruins of Jericho, with all the walls blown inwards.

People of your mindset never figure anything out, they just sit and say "God did it, no need to research or try an find proof".

lol... where do you think i get my info? As stated before, I have literally spent years researching this.

People such as yourself would still think the Earth was flat, they wouldn't ever know that the Moons gravity caused tides, they would still think the Earth was the center of the universe, they would still think the Sun revolved around us

No to all of this. This is ridiculous and has been proposed & proven (oh, believe or not) by Galileo, who was a Christian. You sort of walked into that. So obviously we wouldn't still think that, if anyone would, it would be you!

In fact most of of the people who uncovered the secrets of the universe did believe in God. (Isaac Newton, Albert Einstein, etc.)

 

[Ten of Nine]

I will. In the Bible it speaks of the city of Jericho's walls being magically inwards down by trumpets. Sounds crazy, right? It did until scientists discovered the ruins of Jericho, with all the walls blown inwards.



lol... where do you think i get my info? As stated before, I have literally spent years researching this.



No to all of this. This is ridiculous and has been proposed & proven (oh, believe or not) by Galileo, who was a Christian. You sort of walked into that. So obviously we wouldn't still think that, if anyone would, it would be you!

In fact most of of the people who uncovered the secrets of the universe did believe in God. (Isaac Newton, Albert Einstein, etc.)

Last part is so ignorant (and again not surprised here) understudied.

Did those people that supposedly believed in God use that as their main thesis for why the scientific facts they proved were happening? The Apple fell cause God, the end. Theory of Relativity.....ummmm...cause God did it. Earth isn't flat.....well, I....erm....cause God?

No, because they weren't charlatans like you. Ohhhoh walked right into dat one rite dere, hur da dur. (GOT EEEEEMM)

Gotta hand it to you though....you are terrific at misquoting and never answering anything asked of you directly.
Cutting quotes is a propoganda technique, keep on avoiding responding to whole thoughts/sentences and no ones going to take you seriously (I already don't).

 

[bboss]

Gotta hand it to you though....you are terrific at misquoting and never answering anything asked of you directly.
Cutting quotes is a propoganda technique, keep on avoiding responding to whole thoughts/sentences and no ones going to take you seriously (I already don't).

Gotta be honest bro i don't take you seriously either.

Last part is so ignorant (and again not surprised here) understudied.

Yeah, that last part is so understudied, Newton and Einstein definitely didn't believe in God.

Gotta hand it to you though....you are terrific at misquoting and never answering anything asked of you directly.

Name one example.

I could sure name a few about you.

If I happened to miss some questions I will gladly answer them now.

 

[Ten of Nine]

In 3 years or so I'd be willing to continue this, as I said previously I think you will be cringing at pretty much everything you've said so far in this thread. I think you need time, and your brain needs to develop a bit more to be open to logic and reason. Right now you aren't making sense and you seem to be forgetting entire conversations and comments that are literally a few posts above the ones you just make. It's like you're reading and typing in a different language from everyone else.

 

[Whia]

This is hilarious. Maybe you should've understood this before you went ahead and posted it. It states that since everything is not known to one source except for God, there are no facts to us because we do not know all the variables. You do not know everything. I do not know everything.

Uh, no. It literally says everything is automatically invalid if it contradicts Young Earth Creationism and will be dismissed out of hand. Try harder.

 

[bboss]

I think you need time, and your brain needs to develop a bit more to be open to logic and reason

Hey Ten of Nine, just because you are an atheist I think your brain needs too develop a bit more to be open to logic and reason kappa.

Uh, no. It literally says everything is automatically invalid if it contradicts Young Earth Creationism and will be dismissed out of hand.

Actually it just states that everything lines up with the Bible (which is true, and if you don't believe me, please, show me some evidence.)

 

[bboss]

EVERYBODY WATCH THIS

https://youtube.com/watch?v+VHeSaUq-HI8

 

[Whia]

Actually it just states that everything lines up with the Bible (which is true, and if you don't believe me, please, show me some evidence.)

No, it states anything contradictory is dismissed out of hand. In order to write for these YEC organizations, their contributors are required to sign those statements of faith, thereby forbidding them to argue any position but the one they've already presupposed. They're literally not allowed to consider any alternative.

If you have an assumed conclusion you refuse to back down from under any circumstances, you're not doing actual science.

But again, keep trying and keep pretending that qualifies as genuine research.

 

[Whia]

Any reason you won't post on the LoR forum by the way? I'll be happy to copy+paste your OP for you if your cowardice persists.

 

[Ten of Nine]

No, it states anything contradictory is dismissed out of hand. In order to write for these YEC organizations, their contributors are required to sign those statements of faith, thereby forbidding them to argue any position but the one they've already presupposed. They're literally not allowed to consider any alternative.

If you have an assumed conclusion you refuse to back down from under any circumstances, you're not doing actual science.

But again, keep trying and keep pretending that qualifies as genuine research.

Yea it's the same as what bboss was posting about earlier. He is blind to everything but his side, like not considering the obvious fact that these scientist and scholars who "believed in God" really didn't have a choice. In older days and even still today in some countries scientist and scholars were hung or beheaded for not believing in God or injecting God in their scientific proposals. Publicly say you don't believe in God or publicly practice reason and logic through blasphemous secular science and you got your head chopped off and were labeled a heathen (or you were tortured). Lots of good stuff comes from believing in a God.

 

[bboss]

Any reason you won't post on the LoR forum by the way? I'll be happy to copy+paste your OP for you if your cowardice persists.

Hey man! No reason to call me a coward just because you don't agree with me.

No, it states anything contradictory is dismissed out of hand. In order to write for these YEC organizations, their contributors are required to sign those statements of faith, thereby forbidding them to argue any position but the one they've already presupposed. They're literally not allowed to consider any alternative.

Apparently you didn't read my last post.

He is blind to everything but his side

Yes, I sure am! But you guys aren't either!

Reading CMI articles does not qualify as research.

By the way, don't pretend you understand logical fallacies when your entire OP is an argument from ignorance and incredulity.

You don't have the vaguest clue about evolution. Your whole post is ****ing embarrassing.

Well then sounds like we're both at fault doesn't it.

If you watched the above video and still believe in evolution than you are really determined.

 

[Ten of Nine]

"Yes, I sure am! But you guys aren't either!"

Nope it's just you kid. Classic thread so far, might be the worst in this forum for a long while.

Most people in the Debate Hall have actually read the Bible and other scriptures, usually most of these so called assumed "Atheists" know religious scripture better than people such as you. In contrast your knowledge and study on logical and scientific things is obviously pretty shaky in comparison. If you actually have spent so many years studying the side opposing your imaginary beliefs, well I seriously think you might just have a bit of a learning or comprehension disability (or perhaps it was too complex for you to understand). Either way it was clearly time wasted.

 

[Whia]

Still waiting for an explanation as to why you won't take your OP to a properly knowledgeable audience.

Err, well, let me rephrase that. I'm still waiting for you to attempt to justify your unwillingness - I already know why, I just want to hear the transparent excuse you come up with.