Why don't Falco players use pivot up-tilt more?

L33thal

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
126
Location
Monterey Park, CA
#1
I've been thinking a lot about Falco's footsies/ground game and it seems like the only viable things so far are to mix up lasers, empty SHs, DDing, and bairs/nairs/dairs (and maybe grabs). Other stuff like zoning with f-tilt just seems pointless and don't have a huge reward.

So commonly people move around a lot against Falco so that they can find an opportunity to attack and get in. But for a while now I've been wondering, isn't pivot up-tilt really good at neutralizing people's offense? You can position yourself with DDing and up-tilt will outrange and outprioritize a lot of stuff. It also leads to good reward because you can follow up once you get a hit. It also comes out pretty fast and can put on a lot of pressure, either on shield or on stage position.

I don't think it would that hard to execute, seeing as how everyone has 20XX tech skill and Westballz pressure now.

Any thoughts?
 

`Rival

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 12, 2015
Messages
32
#3
yep pivot uptilt is an amazing tool to intercept your opponent if you know they are going to come at you, and if you have good timing. i've been trying to get that into my play for the past few weeks now. and actually, using ftilt is really good when your opponent is at a percent where they get pushed back far enough/knocked down
 
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1000g2g3g4g800999

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 21, 2012
Messages
368
Location
Earth
#4
Uptilt's probably the hardest move to do out of a pivot for most people. It's probably also less interesting for most people to practice. While it's amazing, It's not very good vs shields if the opponent has good timing. Ftilt is fine if the opponent is focused on moving, is airborne, or at a higher percent.
 

TyroKith

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 27, 2017
Messages
44
Location
Charlotte, NC
#7
I know I necro'd this thread accidentally before, but seeing how it's still here...

Can I have some advice on how to optimally up til? I find it very difficult to place an up til in a combo simply because of how often I end up jumping or up smashing.

Thanks!
 
Joined
Mar 24, 2009
Messages
1,647
Location
Lowell, MA
#8
It's very hard to do and very few people can do it. That's the only reason.

It is way better than pivot ftilt because it sets up for combos and is an anti air. It's easily falco's best grounded pivot.
 

GatGoat

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 2, 2018
Messages
52
Location
Boston, Ma
#9
Because its a little difficult compared to his normal approaches and since falco has so many options it gets pushed back on the list of priorities. youre absolutely right tho its a great mixup... pivot sh bair is good as well. and something NEXT level that ive been working on is pivot sh drift back late reverse nair double shine sh bair out for ultimate shield pressure swag
 

Illuminus

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 20, 2017
Messages
6
#10
I know I necro'd this thread accidentally before, but seeing how it's still here...

Can I have some advice on how to optimally up til? I find it very difficult to place an up til in a combo simply because of how often I end up jumping or up smashing.

Thanks!
Actually a good question with a simple answer. You can kinda "buffer" uptilt. So when you do a aerials you cant jump right?
So hold up! When your out of lag no way you can jump! So you can dair -> utilt, same you have like 4 frames out of WD where you cant act i believe so hold up; easy no jump uptilt.
You can even do it out of lasers this way.

If you use the control stick in the right way you can now turnaround uptilt without moving (I personally do a quarter circle as I land to do my turnarounds).

As far as pivoting the way i understand is acting during frame 1 during a dashback, which is hard but it has its place. I wouldnt super worry about pivots on falco. Get your buffered uptilt and turnaround uptilts consistent then if you feel you need more robust options then maybe its time to learn pivots but honestly top 100 falco almost never do it so i wouldnt worry
 

Scroll

Smash Ace
Premium
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
526
#12
Does anyone know how much slower empty-pivot (aka "perfect pivot") to uptilt is?
Depends only on your own ability to act out of empty pivots. You can make empty pivot -> uptilt as slow as you want.
So to answer your question, it's technically at least 1 frame slower to empty pivot

The reason for this is that you can do any tilts at any frame during both Smash Turn and Tilt Turn animations
 
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